Next announcement of cancellations

[wowzz]

9 minutes ago, Adawn47 said:

Every other authority has seen cases double,

Which is meaningless unless you look at the actual numbers involved, and the number of tests carried out. 

There was a recent outbreak in Lincoln - cases trebled.  But the actual number was only 30, with no deaths and no hospital admissions.

[No pager thank you]

8 minutes ago, wowzz said:

Let's take Dorset.  Infection rate of 8.7 per 100,000. 

 Someone explain why this "rule of 6" is being applied to an area where it is manifestly not required.

At the moment, the majority of the areas with larger infection rates are in the North West of England.  They can be subjected to the measures...

 

The real issue is that two of the London Boroughs now have increasing cases - Hounslow and Kensington and Chelsea, although neither are quite at the tipping point yet of 40+ cases per 100k people.

 

As in the case of the first wave, once a spike in cases appears in the capital, the rest of the nation must follow, as this is what the Government sees and responds to.  Hence the "rule of six." If you want to see what is happening next, check out Bolton for a clue, last orders at 10, take out service only etc.  Just a slightly cynical view to contribute to the debate!

 

The fallout from this will go on.  The chances of cruise ship travel in 2020 pretty much gone I would say.

[wowzz]

1 minute ago, No pager thank you said:

At the moment, the majority of the areas with larger infection rates are in the North West of England.  They can be subjected to the measures...

 

The real issue is that two of the London Boroughs now have increasing cases - Hounslow and Kensington and Chelsea, although neither are quite at the tipping point yet of 40+ cases per 100k people.

 

As in the case of the first wave, once a spike in cases appears in the capital, the rest of the nation must follow, as this is what the Government sees and responds to.  Hence the "rule of six." If you want to see what is happening next, check out Bolton for a clue, last orders at 10, take out service only etc.  Just a slightly cynical view to contribute to the debate!

 

The fallout from this will go on.  The chances of cruise ship travel in 2020 pretty much gone I would say.

I totally understand the need for restrictions in certain areas. Where I have an issue, is the imposition of  draconian legislation in areas where it is not needed.

However, this thread has drifted well off course, so I'll hold my counsel from now on.

[yamanid]

3 hours ago, grapau27 said:

You are right to ring again this afternoon.

I learned while waiting for our March refund it was a fob off saying they will ring you back.

Graham.

 

Finally spoke to someone and have allowed a 2 week extension to our final balance payment.  So if no further announcements before 26th then it will be back to holding on the phone again.  Good news for now though. Obviously would far rather be going on our Cruise but under the current circumstances, NO.  Take care everyone. keep SAFE.

May 😎

[No pager thank you]

5 minutes ago, wowzz said:

I totally understand the need for restrictions in certain areas. Where I have an issue, is the imposition of  draconian legislation in areas where it is not needed.

However, this thread has drifted well off course, so I'll hold my counsel from now on.

I do agree that compliance will wane if people do not see the need and producing ever more local datasets merely proves healthy skepticism: 

 

not in my town...not in my street...not in my age group...not affecting people like me...I'm not one of the young ones getting hammered every night... 

 

To be honest I was being a bit tongue in cheek as you gathered, but a lot of the policy making is London-centric IMHO.  I'll also keep schtum as we await the next round of cancellations, no doubt being mulled over in Carnival House...😉

[Adawn47]

17 minutes ago, wowzz said:

Which is meaningless unless you look at the actual numbers involved, and the number of tests carried out. 

There was a recent outbreak in Lincoln - cases trebled.  But the actual number was only 30, with no deaths and no hospital admissions.

 A lot more than 30 here. Yesterday's count was 43, today, another 76. When we've been used to single digits for the past two weeks then it's a tad worrying to say the least. I'm not hiding inside , I refuse to put my life on hold again, but I shall be extra cautious.😷

Avril

[No pager thank you]

2 minutes ago, yamanid said:

 

Finally spoke to someone and have allowed a 2 week extension to our final balance payment.  So if no further announcements before 26th then it will be back to holding on the phone again.  Good news for now though. Obviously would far rather be going on our Cruise but under the current circumstances, NO.  Take care everyone. keep SAFE.

May 😎

That's very helpful.  I would suggest that adds weight to the idea that the cruise will be cancelled by P&O within the next two weeks.

 

From my experiences back in March, it may be a good idea to email them to "confirm your understanding."

[Bazrat]

I would be very much surprised to see P&O restart this year but as we have a cruise booked in November we live in hope.

[grapau27]

20 minutes ago, yamanid said:

 

Finally spoke to someone and have allowed a 2 week extension to our final balance payment.  So if no further announcements before 26th then it will be back to holding on the phone again.  Good news for now though. Obviously would far rather be going on our Cruise but under the current circumstances, NO.  Take care everyone. keep SAFE.

May 😎

Good news,a little breathing space and hopefully more time for P&O to decide if your cruise goes ahead.

Graham.

[Manx buoy]

1 hour ago, yamanid said:

 

Finally spoke to someone and have allowed a 2 week extension to our final balance payment.  So if no further announcements before 26th then it will be back to holding on the phone again.  Good news for now though. Obviously would far rather be going on our Cruise but under the current circumstances, NO.  Take care everyone. keep SAFE.

May 😎

Like No Pager said I’d get it in writing that they’re extending your balance due date because a poster on FB has asked the same question and they’ve answered nothing has changed 

[yamanid]

1 hour ago, No pager thank you said:

That's very helpful.  I would suggest that adds weight to the idea that the cruise will be cancelled by P&O within the next two weeks.

 

From my experiences back in March, it may be a good idea to email them to "confirm your understanding."

 

They have already said that there would be an announcement soon and we would find out then what will be happening to the forthcoming xmas/new year cruises. 

[yamanid]

1 hour ago, grapau27 said:

Good news,a little breathing space and hopefully more time for P&O to decide if your cruise goes ahead.

Graham.

 

Certainly is Graham, although I think we all know that there is no way the Cruise or other Cruises this year will be going ahead.  They don't even have flights organised!!!!!! from the UK to the Caribbean!!! and probably other places too.

Thank you for your input and help. Watch this space lol

May 😎

[ann141]

2 hours ago, yamanid said:

 

Finally spoke to someone and have allowed a 2 week extension to our final balance payment.  So if no further announcements before 26th then it will be back to holding on the phone again.  Good news for now though. Obviously would far rather be going on our Cruise but under the current circumstances, NO.  Take care everyone. keep SAFE.

May 😎

Glad you have managed to extend the final payment date.As others have suggested it might be an idea to phone again to ask for something in writing or to email them stating that you are pleased that after your phone conversation today an extension date has been agreed so at least you have something in writing.(I expect all phone calls are recorded so if necessary you could probably rely on that for confirmation)

[molecrochip]

I believe some decisions have been taken but there are actions that need to happen before announcements can be made.

 

I expect some more cancellations, and possibly still no news on Christmas for the bigger ships. Its now not a case of IF or WHEN for the bigger ships, but WHERE do they sail. That appears to be the final piece of the jigsaw. Until they sort that out, the cannot announce a restart.

 

Cruising like any activity won't be 100% covid free but Costa and MSC are showing it can be done. They will shortly be joined by Aida. Please remember Aida did not delay its restart because of the crew who were Covid positive, but because they were waiting Italy to sign-off their new protocols.

[grapau27]

1 hour ago, yamanid said:

 

Certainly is Graham, although I think we all know that there is no way the Cruise or other Cruises this year will be going ahead.  They don't even have flights organised!!!!!! from the UK to the Caribbean!!! and probably other places too.

Thank you for your input and help. Watch this space lol

May 😎

👍

[No pager thank you]

1 minute ago, molecrochip said:

I believe some decisions have been taken but there are actions that need to happen before announcements can be made.

 

I expect some more cancellations, and possibly still no news on Christmas for the bigger ships. Its now not a case of IF or WHEN for the bigger ships, but WHERE do they sail. That appears to be the final piece of the jigsaw. Until they sort that out, the cannot announce a restart.

 

Cruising like any activity won't be 100% covid free but Costa and MSC are showing it can be done. They will shortly be joined by Aida. Please remember Aida did not delay its restart because of the crew who were Covid positive, but because they were waiting Italy to sign-off their new protocols.

Thank you for this.  It does appear from what you say that P&O is still intent on "chancing its arm" - reluctant to lose the Christmas cash cow, for understandable commercial reasons, taking its lead from the lines you suggest.

 

I know that there is a limit around what can be said, fact versus rumour etc, but is the general plan do you think to have the larger ships transverse the British Isles as a "home away from home" traditional cruise?

 

I just don't think that travel insurances will allow that - confused 🤯

[grapau27]

19 minutes ago, ann141 said:

Glad you have managed to extend the final payment date.As others have suggested it might be an idea to phone again to ask for something in writing or to email them stating that you are pleased that after your phone conversation today an extension date has been agreed so at least you have something in writing.(I expect all phone calls are recorded so if necessary you could probably rely on that for confirmation)

I also always ask for the person's name and record the time and date in case there is a dispute on what was promised.

[molecrochip]

34 minutes ago, No pager thank you said:

Thank you for this.  It does appear from what you say that P&O is still intent on "chancing its arm" - reluctant to lose the Christmas cash cow, for understandable commercial reasons, taking its lead from the lines you suggest.

 

I know that there is a limit around what can be said, fact versus rumour etc, but is the general plan do you think to have the larger ships transverse the British Isles as a "home away from home" traditional cruise?

 

I just don't think that travel insurances will allow that - confused 🤯

Not chancing its arm. Its doing its research. Passengers want to cruise. Not all but a fair few.

 

British Isles works for 7 night cruises - not really for the 14 night ones scheduled. They are also NOT against FCO guidance so travel insurance should not be an issue. I expect P&O to 'take the hit' for Covid on board ships during the restart phase.

[Son of Anarchy]

42 minutes ago, molecrochip said:

I believe some decisions have been taken but there are actions that need to happen before announcements can be made.

 

I expect some more cancellations, and possibly still no news on Christmas for the bigger ships. Its now not a case of IF or WHEN for the bigger ships, but WHERE do they sail. That appears to be the final piece of the jigsaw. Until they sort that out, the cannot announce a restart.

 

Cruising like any activity won't be 100% covid free but Costa and MSC are showing it can be done. They will shortly be joined by Aida. Please remember Aida did not delay its restart because of the crew who were Covid positive, but because they were waiting Italy to sign-off their new protocols.

I read your earlier post regarding the reminding of the FCO's cruise advice and international travel.  And started to have a theory regarding our maybe Iona Christmas & New Year cruise.

 

This post appears to support my theory:

 

Very slow sea days within UK territorial waters.

Christmas Eve, port day in Greenock (spend the day with the outlaws)

Sea days 

Hogamany in Edinburgh (tender probably required)

High speed sea days along the East coast of the UK (Graham & Pauline can take some photos as we speed by)

Disembark Soton

 

Seriously though, thanks for the info.

[Dermotsgirl]

9 minutes ago, molecrochip said:

Not chancing its arm. Its doing its research. Passengers want to cruise. Not all but a fair few.

 

British Isles works for 7 night cruises - not really for the 14 night ones scheduled. They are also NOT against FCO guidance so travel insurance should not be an issue. I expect P&O to 'take the hit' for Covid on board ships during the restart phase.

I hate to say it, but this smacks of P&O trying to get round the FCO guidance..

 

The cruise ship guidance exists because cruise ships are an ideal environment for viruses to spread. With virus cases spiking upwards, I’m struggling to understand why P&O appear to think that this is the right time to re-start cruising.

 

It doesn’t seem right to me🤷‍♀️
 

 

[Adawn47]

2 hours ago, Manx buoy said:

Like No Pager said I’d get it in writing that they’re extending your balance due date because a poster on FB has asked the same question and they’ve answered nothing has changed 

The same  thing happened  in July?.Bobupandown was booked on the same  November cruise we were, and when he phoned P&O they allowed him an extension on his balance date. Both Annie  and myself were refused when we asked. 

Avril

[grapau27]

10 minutes ago, Dermotsgirl said:

I hate to say it, but this smacks of P&O trying to get round the FCO guidance..

 

The cruise ship guidance exists because cruise ships are an ideal environment for viruses to spread. With virus cases spiking upwards, I’m struggling to understand why P&O appear to think that this is the right time to re-start cruising.

 

It doesn’t seem right to me🤷‍♀️
 

 

Unfortunately they are a business in danger of collapse if cruising doesn't start by next Spring.

Edinburgh, Greenock, Belfast, Liverpool, Newcastle and Southampton would be a nice 7 night itinerary.

If acceptable measures were in place,FCO permission with no port restrictions and a maximum of 70% passenger capacity we would be tempted for next Spring but not before then.

Graham.

[No pager thank you]

37 minutes ago, molecrochip said:

Not chancing its arm. Its doing its research. Passengers want to cruise. Not all but a fair few.

 

British Isles works for 7 night cruises - not really for the 14 night ones scheduled. They are also NOT against FCO guidance so travel insurance should not be an issue. I expect P&O to 'take the hit' for Covid on board ships during the restart phase.

If P&O are prepared to take the hit for the private medical costs incurred on board (if any) due to Covid-19, including repatriation costs by emergency evacuation (in extremis) then that does change things from an insurance point of view, I agree with you on that.

 

It's worth pointing out though, for balance, that as there is no precedent yet for cruise ship travel, to and from the UK, travelling in to international waters, then the travel insurance/underwriting situation cannot be said to be definitive.  This is unless P&O essentially varies it's normal conditions of carriage and indemnifies the passengers from all these risks at its own expense. 

 

Travel insurance providers would be considering age, pre-existing medical conditions and other points in terms of underwriting costs.  There is a possible difference between P&Os interpretation of FCO guidance and those of underwriters.

 

Clearly P&O won't share its market research with passengers, but I would be surprised if needing certainty on this point would be a pre-requisite for those passengers who want to cruise?

 

I must admit I don't see this as a serious proposition just yet; this would definitely classify as a major change to travel, so P&O would be forced to offer full refunds to passengers not wanting to travel. However it is an interesting idea thanks.

Edited September 10, 2020 by No pager thank you
Typo

[No pager thank you]

11 minutes ago, grapau27 said:

Unfortunately they are a business in danger of collapse if cruising doesn't start by next Spring.

Edinburgh, Greenock, Belfast, Liverpool, Newcastle and Southampton would be a nice 7 night itinerary.

If acceptable measures were in place,FCO permission with no port restrictions and a maximum of 70% passenger capacity we would be tempted for next Spring but not before then.

Graham.

Probably needs its own thread, but if we are looking at cruising around the British Isles, then I imagine the Channel Islands, Isles of Scilly, Isle of Man, Holyhead, Mainland Scottish islands, and even places like Tilbury, Great Yarmouth, and a Lakes call would be possible candidates as tender ports?  The tender operation would be pretty tough to pull off mind in the bleak midwinter!

 

The other interesting quirk is if P&O can use the Common Travel Area somehow under the same framework, bringing the Irish ports in to play, via some sort of travel corridor.  I understand, if you so wish, that the Irish quarantine arrangements can be bypassed by traveling in to Northern Ireland and continuing the journey in to the Republic.  Why not for cruise ship passengers (breaking the rules in a very limited and specific way🤣)

 

Strangely, if that's the thinking, then I don't see why a seven night cruise would be the limit.  Still think it's pretty optimistic to see that happening at Christmas mind, given the projected public health climate.  Spring possibly.

[cruisenewbie1976]

44 minutes ago, Dermotsgirl said:

I hate to say it, but this smacks of P&O trying to get round the FCO guidance..

 

The cruise ship guidance exists because cruise ships are an ideal environment for viruses to spread. With virus cases spiking upwards, I’m struggling to understand why P&O appear to think that this is the right time to re-start cruising.

 

It doesn’t seem right to me🤷‍♀️
 

 

Surely, as adults, we're able to make our own decisions? If people think it's too much of a risk, they don't have to go. P&O isn't forcing anyone to go (at least, I hope that's not the plan). You can't blame them if they want to take advantage of any interest in such cruises.