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3 hours ago, WonderMan3 said:


It’s such a huge risk. Cruise lines have a horrible reputation right now outside of these cruise fan boards. If they start up and cases appear onboard it will damage their image even further, perhaps irrevocably. The one big thing though that the cruise lines have going for them now is the fact that the virus is out of control across most of the country. Since it generally takes at least 4-5 days after exposure for symptoms to manifest and it is also possible for someone to test negative early on after contracting the virus, this means that any passengers who might contract the disease during a cruise won’t find that out until they are back home. Then, since the virus is everywhere, it will be difficult to determine whether the cruise ship was the source since it might also have been the airplane or airport or taxi or at the grocery store upon returning home. This was not the case back in February or March where it was pretty easy to identify when cruise ships were the source of infection. It all just seems like a recipe for disaster. And yes, I know that they are conducting cruises in Europe apparently successfully with these new safety guidelines (so far), but Europe has been in a much, much better place in managing their virus numbers as compared to the States plus they are restricting passengers by nationality. I think sending cruises out here in the States with these new guidelines is something that should be tried but it’s just too soon to be talking about November. Of course seeing the ineptitude of the U.S. government in managing this, and the ignorance of a large segment of the U.S. population in reacting to it, the cruise lines probably fear if they try to wait for the U.S. to have manageable virus numbers before relaunching they will have to wait until fall of 2021 and that might send some of them belly up. So once again, it’s money over lives... Of course no one is being forced to go on a cruise and those who choose to are free to gamble with their health. I just feel bad for the crew who are in a much different situation economically where they may feel they must return to their job in order to feed their families. 

I agree.  As for timing.....  I'm sure each cruise line executive has one date burned in their brain - the date they must either start being cash flow positive or start down the road of bankruptcy. You can only operate on borrowed money for so long.

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"We are debating how comfortable we feel about cruising from the Sunshine State, given the news that the state lifted most restrictions imposed by the COVID-19 pandemic, including mask wearing and social-distancing requirements."

 

For me and my husband, we would feel totally unsafe even going to Florida.  I think the new Florida State decisions regarding Covid safety are just irresponsible and dangerous.  The cruise industry has been turning themselves inside out trying to make things safer on board for all passengers and staff.  Now Florida says, 'who cares, have at it'.  Those ships have to be safe and there needs to be precauctions or they will turn into floating sick bays.  I think the cruise lines should definatley set high safey regulations and kick anyone off who refuses to comply.  Either comply or don't board.  Personally we are from Canada and have been watching with some horror as to how the US has refused to believe there is a problem or comply to logical safety precautions.  As for taking tours just with the ship, that's an excellent idea.  The countries they often cruise to are '3rd world' and anyone finding their own tour  is putting themselves and as a result the entire ship, guests and crew at risk if they come back infected.  Maybe some of you don't realize it but many, many countries don't want anyone from the US to travel to their counties.  Here is Canada we are advise NOT to travel to the US and our border is actually closed to unessesary traffic, including people just wanting to holiday here.  

 

 

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Hello from Central East Coast Florida USA 

 

Here in our part of Florida, schools opened for either online or in-person classes at the end of August (a few weeks later than usual). 
 

Most of the mask-mandates from local jurisdictions are off.  However, individual places still recommend masks and social distancing.  Restaurants are open.  Some people wear masks and some don’t.  Some gathering spots are opening, some are not and a few are closing.  I wear a mask for supermarkets & shopping and keep contacts down in general.

 

A lot of entertainment is outdoors or continues to be socially distant, some venues are still closed.

 

Some stores and Restaurants have closed permanently but not as many as I hear about in New York where I still have friends and family.

 

We cancelled one sailing last June and have done a lift and shift for our Jan 21 to Jan 22.  We wear a mask when practical and/or when required or asked to.  But it would not be a fun vacation to wear a mask in the Caribbean heat and at our age it is uncomfortable to breathe that way so we will wait till 2022 if even then it is safe.
 

As far as the cruise lines stepping up to make cruising possible— well they can do some things that may help such as more disinfecting and mandating masks and cocooning excursions BUT Americans or Floridians are not the only hazard to cruising passengers or the populations on the islands.  The rules are going to be difficult if not impossible to completely enforce.  And mandating tests, when do we get them, the results are not always quick and there is the possibility virus will pop up after boarding.

 

As for the poster who is horrified at the USA has refused to believe there is a problem, perhaps they don’t understand that we are the United States of America.  The States’ Governors make the mandates for their own states as do some localities.  We are not clones of each other in the US, and I have heard from citizens of other countries that they don’t all agree with each other either.  I don’t want masses of infected people flooding our borders either, who would?

 
I loved my visits to Montreal before we moved to Florida but I’m getting a whole different picture of Canadians from this forum.  We had planned a visit to Montreal to celebrate our anniversary just before 9/11/2001.  We called the b&b to postpone our trip to a few weeks after — the b&b rearranged our reservation & made special arrangements for us.  This is the Canada I remember.  I remember the wonderful Canadian people and how they suffered through my high school French and how they helped out my countrymen who were stranded without the airliners.
 

Florida didn’t say, who cares, have at it.  Our Governor as have some others, has declared restaurants and some businesses formerly closed can open.  Cruises are still off for another month.  Do what you please, BC-er, stay away — I am not cruising Or traveling either but don’t put us all in one basket.  I believe that we as adults can make those decisions for themselves if permitted to.  We are getting such conflicting opinions from doctors and scientists— they don’t even agree with each other.

 

People are more alike than different but we all have our own opinions.  There is a toll closed businesses are taking on our economy but also on our people, especially children kept out of school. I try not to judge.

 

 

 

 

Edited by true45
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Did anyone else get the Cruise Critic Weekender e-mail today? Had a definite clickbait subject: How Do Cruise Critic Readers Feel About Cruising from Florida? It worked, and I almost never click on the stories in these emails.

 

With all the talk about safety on the ships and in foreign ports, and admitting I knew Florida had largely loosened most restrictions, but wasn't really paying much attention since I'm not traveling to Florida anytime in the near future, the article had some interesting observations:

 

"Florida's new push to ease restrictions amid the ongoing pandemic is seemingly at odds with what the cruise industry is trying desperately to do: Persuade the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention that its COVID-19 procedures, which include mandatory PCR testing, mask wearing, social distancing, and the requirement that cruisers take only cruise-line sanctioned shore excursions, are robust enough to prevent the spread of coronavirus onboard."

 

and

 

"It is not immediately apparent how a cruise line would force people to wear masks on cruises departing from Florida ports where that mask ban can't seemingly be enforced at the terminal level."

 

"Industry publication Port and Terminal writes..."  "might have "doomed Florida's cruise restart to failure" as the international cruising public -- not just Floridians -- needs to be convinced that safe and healthy cruises can resume from ports of call that are also safe and healthy."

 

The article appears to be under Cruise News. I just found it surprisingly blunt for Cruise Critic, and does nothing to ease concerns expressed on this and similar threads of exposure enroute to the cruise. And there are others quoted in the article that would accept the risk and just vacation in Florida rather than deal with the healthy sail requirements on the ship. Interesting times...

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I think the reopening of Disney World has proven that a big majority of people will simply not vacation where they don't feel safe.  If you haven't followed that news, attendance expectations were a lot lower than predicted, so they're having to lay off thousands of workers.  Same with the other Orlando theme parks.  People are scared & bewildered by the actions of the government at the state level.  Pretending that nothing is wrong is not going to change the situation, so I'm not sure why a certain segment of the population still thinks that's the answer.  The current head-in-the-sand approach is obviously going to have a huge impact on cruise companies' ability to restart operations.  Leadership at the national level could have gone a long way, too, but that isn't going to happen anytime soon.

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20 hours ago, markeb said:

Did anyone else get the Cruise Critic Weekender e-mail today? Had a definite clickbait subject: How Do Cruise Critic Readers Feel About Cruising from Florida? It worked, and I almost never click on the stories in these emails.

 

With all the talk about safety on the ships and in foreign ports, and admitting I knew Florida had largely loosened most restrictions, but wasn't really paying much attention since I'm not traveling to Florida anytime in the near future, the article had some interesting observations:

 

"Florida's new push to ease restrictions amid the ongoing pandemic is seemingly at odds with what the cruise industry is trying desperately to do: Persuade the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention that its COVID-19 procedures, which include mandatory PCR testing, mask wearing, social distancing, and the requirement that cruisers take only cruise-line sanctioned shore excursions, are robust enough to prevent the spread of coronavirus onboard."

 

and

 

"It is not immediately apparent how a cruise line would force people to wear masks on cruises departing from Florida ports where that mask ban can't seemingly be enforced at the terminal level."

 

"Industry publication Port and Terminal writes..."  "might have "doomed Florida's cruise restart to failure" as the international cruising public -- not just Floridians -- needs to be convinced that safe and healthy cruises can resume from ports of call that are also safe and healthy."

 

The article appears to be under Cruise News. I just found it surprisingly blunt for Cruise Critic, and does nothing to ease concerns expressed on this and similar threads of exposure enroute to the cruise. And there are others quoted in the article that would accept the risk and just vacation in Florida rather than deal with the healthy sail requirements on the ship. Interesting times...

If one looks at the areas that have restarted cruising (Germany and Italy) with the US and Florida you get:

 

When they restarted cruising

 

Germany  10 new cases per million per day

Italy   4 new cases per million per day

 

Now new cases are increasing and are currently at

Germany    25 new cases per million per day

Italy     36 new cases per million per day

 

The US on the other hand is at   128 new cases per million per day, down from its peak, but climbing once more

Florida is at 103 new cases per million per day

 

In the next couple of weeks we will know how the easing of restrictions in Florida has worked out.

Edited by nocl
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2 hours ago, bEwAbG said:

I think the reopening of Disney World has proven that a big majority of people will simply not vacation where they don't feel safe.  If you haven't followed that news, attendance expectations were a lot lower than predicted, so they're having to lay off thousands of workers.  Same with the other Orlando theme parks.  People are scared & bewildered by the actions of the government at the state level.  Pretending that nothing is wrong is not going to change the situation, so I'm not sure why a certain segment of the population still thinks that's the answer.  The current head-in-the-sand approach is obviously going to have a huge impact on cruise companies' ability to restart operations.  Leadership at the national level could have gone a long way, too, but that isn't going to happen anytime soon.

From the surveys I have seen only about 30% of the population feels comfortable about traveling.  That would seem to make sense because that is about what the air lines of seeing with their air traffic, about 30% of pre COVID.

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21 hours ago, true45 said:

Hello from Central East Coast Florida USA 

 

Here in our part of Florida, schools opened for either online or in-person classes at the end of August (a few weeks later than usual). 
 

Most of the mask-mandates from local jurisdictions are off.  However, individual places still recommend masks and social distancing.  Restaurants are open.  Some people wear masks and some don’t.  Some gathering spots are opening, some are not and a few are closing.  I wear a mask for supermarkets & shopping and keep contacts down in general.

 

A lot of entertainment is outdoors or continues to be socially distant, some venues are still closed.

 

Some stores and Restaurants have closed permanently but not as many as I hear about in New York where I still have friends and family.

 

We cancelled one sailing last June and have done a lift and shift for our Jan 21 to Jan 22.  We wear a mask when practical and/or when required or asked to.  But it would not be a fun vacation to wear a mask in the Caribbean heat and at our age it is uncomfortable to breathe that way so we will wait till 2022 if even then it is safe.
 

As far as the cruise lines stepping up to make cruising possible— well they can do some things that may help such as more disinfecting and mandating masks and cocooning excursions BUT Americans or Floridians are not the only hazard to cruising passengers or the populations on the islands.  The rules are going to be difficult if not impossible to completely enforce.  And mandating tests, when do we get them, the results are not always quick and there is the possibility virus will pop up after boarding.

 

As for the poster who is horrified at the USA has refused to believe there is a problem, perhaps they don’t understand that we are the United States of America.  The States’ Governors make the mandates for their own states as do some localities.  We are not clones of each other in the US, and I have heard from citizens of other countries that they don’t all agree with each other either.  I don’t want masses of infected people flooding our borders either, who would?

 
I loved my visits to Montreal before we moved to Florida but I’m getting a whole different picture of Canadians from this forum.  We had planned a visit to Montreal to celebrate our anniversary just before 9/11/2001.  We called the b&b to postpone our trip to a few weeks after — the b&b rearranged our reservation & made special arrangements for us.  This is the Canada I remember.  I remember the wonderful Canadian people and how they suffered through my high school French and how they helped out my countrymen who were stranded without the airliners.
 

Florida didn’t say, who cares, have at it.  Our Governor as have some others, has declared restaurants and some businesses formerly closed can open.  Cruises are still off for another month.  Do what you please, BC-er, stay away — I am not cruising Or traveling either but don’t put us all in one basket.  I believe that we as adults can make those decisions for themselves if permitted to.  We are getting such conflicting opinions from doctors and scientists— they don’t even agree with each other.

 

People are more alike than different but we all have our own opinions.  There is a toll closed businesses are taking on our economy but also on our people, especially children kept out of school. I try not to judge.

 

 

 

 

I share your dismay at the way some Canadians on these boards have so arrogantly expressed negative comments about the US, as if we were all the same.  My state has taken a very firm stand against the virus, from full quarantine in the beginning to very carefully considered re-openings based on the science.  We do not all have our heads in the sand.  We currently enforce mask wearing inside, social distancing, reduced capacity for venues allowed to open and on and on.  We have challenges to face that other countries do not, including population size, many huge metropolitan areas, and individual state governments. I’m not saying we have all done a great job, in fact in many cases far from it, but we are not all the insensitive idiots some posters paint us to be either.

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13 minutes ago, phoenix_dream said:

I share your dismay at the way some Canadians on these boards have so arrogantly expressed negative comments about the US, as if we were all the same.  My state has taken a very firm stand against the virus, from full quarantine in the beginning to very carefully considered re-openings based on the science.  We do not all have our heads in the sand.  We currently enforce mask wearing inside, social distancing, reduced capacity for venues allowed to open and on and on.  We have challenges to face that other countries do not, including population size, many huge metropolitan areas, and individual state governments. I’m not saying we have all done a great job, in fact in many cases far from it, but we are not all the insensitive idiots some posters paint us to be either.

Thank you for your comments phoenix_dream.  Agree.
Linda

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1 hour ago, true45 said:

Thank you for your comments phoenix_dream.  Agree.
Linda


I’m going to second this. Dual citizen here with 40 years in Canada and 20 in the US.

 

It’s been my experience that Canadians love to feign superiority, particularly now that the States are in such a mess. But...just as the provinces have had varying degrees of response to COVID, (ie: the Maritimes versus....say Quebec) so too have our states (look at the stringent measures taken by New York and NJ). Yes, some have been more successful than others but please don’t flippantly paint the entire country with one brush. It’s insulting. We are a very populous and diverse nation. 
 

Canadians are known far and wide as being polite. Smugness is unbecoming. I wish you happy cruising! 🙂🇺🇸🇨🇦
 

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17 hours ago, durberville said:


I’m going to second this. Dual citizen here with 40 years in Canada and 20 in the US.

 

It’s been my experience that Canadians love to feign superiority, particularly now that the States are in such a mess. But...just as the provinces have had varying degrees of response to COVID, (ie: the Maritimes versus....say Quebec) so too have our states (look at the stringent measures taken by New York and NJ). Yes, some have been more successful than others but please don’t flippantly paint the entire country with one brush. It’s insulting. We are a very populous and diverse nation. 
 

Canadians are known far and wide as being polite. Smugness is unbecoming. I wish you happy cruising! 🙂🇺🇸🇨🇦
 

 Yep durberville, well said.

 

Canadians have many so called superiorities and smugness not related to any real accomplishments. We have a few provinces all with different approaches and results as you mentioned. The dear USA has 51 states, many more, each with individual needs, profiles and responses. Of course the pattern would be more complicated with 51 vs 10 provinces.

 

I have found that the US federal level response far better than the Canadian federal level which is only focused on dispensing $ like a ATM machine. I really like the arguments, the questions, the challenges at the federal level of the US CDC, scientists etc - so does my PHD scientist spouse. Having an open mind, challenging the status quo, making the status quo prove themselves, is all part of the leadership accountability. I am not being left or right political, I am dealing with leadership responsibilities period.

 

Rock on anyone who is questioning anything! 

 

Managers manage the status quo, leaders question it.

 

 

 

 

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