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No sail order officially extended


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14 hours ago, WpgCruise said:

An interesting article regarding the present health of the few cruise ships in U.S. waters that have to comply with CDC reporting requirements. Ships not in U.S. waters do not have to report to the CDC so who knows their conditions?  

Assuming it is factual, my concern is that if the cruise lines can't keep their ships healthy when only crew are on board, how will they manager to get back to providing a safe environment to passengers?

https://www.axios.com/cdc-covid-19-cruise-ship-thousands-cases-us-7f942f86-a56d-44bd-a010-5b5d52cf6d96.html

 

The CDC data is lacking in detail.

"There have been at least 3,689 COVID-19 or coronavirus-like illness cases on cruise ships in U.S. waters"

From when to when?  And why are they counting 'coronavirus-like' cases?  That suggests that the data is very old and pre-dates effective testing, diagnosis, and treatment.    

 

The order only points to the handful of cases on cruises in Europe and elsewhere that have been well publicized.   

 

Personally, I hope the CDC is overruled into the future as the tone presented in the order suggests that the presence of even a single case on any cruise ship constitutes a widespread threat to public health.  The order reads almost as if they don't realize the virus has been in the US for 6 months.    

 

Here's the actual order for anyone interested: https://www.cdc.gov/quarantine/pdf/CDC-NSO-Third-Extension-09-30-2020-p.pdf

The meat, "Findings and Immediate Action" start on pg 18.   

 

 

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6 hours ago, Ashland said:

Hmmm....Looks like that White House meeting may not take place....per what's happening at the WH right now !!

The meeting was with Pence (tested negative) not with Trump. The meeting will take place, the entire “company” doesn’t shut down because the CEO has caught a bug. 

Edited by not-enough-cruising
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36 minutes ago, not-enough-cruising said:

The meeting was with Pence (tested negative) not with Trump. The meeting will take place, the entire “company” doesn’t shut down because the CEO has caught a bug. 

True, but oddly enough, that's pretty much the approach that the CDC is taking with their "one case is enough to shut down the industry" mentality. 

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9 hours ago, Ashland said:

Hmmm....Looks like that White House meeting may not take place....per what's happening at the WH right now !!

Given the continued seriousness of COVID and the fact that it has struck the White House, I would think that the folks there would understand that something more than FL's electoral votes are at stake.

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1 hour ago, yogimax said:

Given the continued seriousness of COVID and the fact that it has struck the White House, I would think that the folks there would understand that something more than FL's electoral votes are at stake.

You would think so...but...probably not!

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6 hours ago, D C said:

The CDC data is lacking in detail.

"There have been at least 3,689 COVID-19 or coronavirus-like illness cases on cruise ships in U.S. waters"

From when to when?  And why are they counting 'coronavirus-like' cases?  That suggests that the data is very old and pre-dates effective testing, diagnosis, and treatment.    

 

The order only points to the handful of cases on cruises in Europe and elsewhere that have been well publicized.   

 

Personally, I hope the CDC is overruled into the future as the tone presented in the order suggests that the presence of even a single case on any cruise ship constitutes a widespread threat to public health.  The order reads almost as if they don't realize the virus has been in the US for 6 months.    

 

Here's the actual order for anyone interested: https://www.cdc.gov/quarantine/pdf/CDC-NSO-Third-Extension-09-30-2020-p.pdf

The meat, "Findings and Immediate Action" start on pg 18.   

 

 

Corona-like, as in colds?  Sinus infections?  Those shouldn't be included in any count if they're not confirmed cases.  I wonder how many of the 3,689 are just "like" corona and not actually it.  Even if that is old data, it shouldn't be reported out like that.

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3 minutes ago, BND said:

Corona-like, as in colds?  Sinus infections?  Those shouldn't be included in any count if they're not confirmed cases.  I wonder how many of the 3,689 are just "like" corona and not actually it.  Even if that is old data, it shouldn't be reported out like that.

My last visit to my doctor and we discussed this. He confirmed. Anyone that dies that has the virus is counted as a virus death. Weather or not they did die form the virus. So ALL the number of virus caused deaths are actually a lot lower. An example. A person gets hit by a car and dies. They find out he had the virus. He is counted as a virus death.

Once you are tested positive and you die form any cause. You are counted as a virus death.

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7 hours ago, D C said:

The CDC data is lacking in detail.

"There have been at least 3,689 COVID-19 or coronavirus-like illness cases on cruise ships in U.S. waters"

From when to when?  And why are they counting 'coronavirus-like' cases?  That suggests that the data is very old and pre-dates effective testing, diagnosis, and treatment.    

 

The order only points to the handful of cases on cruises in Europe and elsewhere that have been well publicized.   

 

Personally, I hope the CDC is overruled into the future as the tone presented in the order suggests that the presence of even a single case on any cruise ship constitutes a widespread threat to public health.  The order reads almost as if they don't realize the virus has been in the US for 6 months.    

 

Here's the actual order for anyone interested: https://www.cdc.gov/quarantine/pdf/CDC-NSO-Third-Extension-09-30-2020-p.pdf

The meat, "Findings and Immediate Action" start on pg 18.   

 

 

Reading the article, the 3,689 cases are since March 1. Not a surprising number. The question is how many cases now, or last 60 days

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4 minutes ago, Seville2Cabo said:

Reading the article, the 3,689 cases are since March 1. Not a surprising number. The question is how many cases now, or last 60 days

Cased are not the problem. many have the common cold and do not die from it, same with the virus. Rebreathing your expelled air is a problem also.

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1 hour ago, ALWAYS CRUZIN said:

My last visit to my doctor and we discussed this. He confirmed. Anyone that dies that has the virus is counted as a virus death. Weather or not they did die form the virus. So ALL the number of virus caused deaths are actually a lot lower. An example. A person gets hit by a car and dies. They find out he had the virus. He is counted as a virus death.

Once you are tested positive and you die form any cause. You are counted as a virus death.

Many studies place the number that died FROM Covid as opposed to WITH Covid at 6% of the total reported deaths (US numbers only)

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5 minutes ago, not-enough-cruising said:

I have been a healthcare practitioner for over 30 years; and can tell you unequivocally that the point made in this “article” are the exact opposite of what we experience in the field. 

Those deceased in their homes are almost always classified as Covid deaths without a test. At my hospital 100% of deaths with an “inconclusive test” (which is most due to viral load required for a definitive positive) have Covid-19 on the death certificate. 
I have seen certificates of death  from our emergency Room listing COD as Covid-19 for; heart attacks, strokes, heroin overdose, shooting, and MVA. 

 

I have been a nurse for longer than you would imagine but I also have seen a video from a press briefing in Chicago where a coronavirus  health professional said that if you are in a car accident and have tested positive of corona.. you death is classed as a corona death.. how crazy is that !!! You are totally correct. I wish there was an audit team in place and you would amazed.

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14 minutes ago, torpeedo said:

 

I have been a nurse for longer than you would imagine but I also have seen a video from a press briefing in Chicago where a coronavirus  health professional said that if you are in a car accident and have tested positive of corona.. you death is classed as a corona death.. how crazy is that !!! You are totally correct. I wish there was an audit team in place and you would amazed.

 

2 minutes ago, jean87510 said:

Im a nurse also and have family who work as drs and NP in ER. I posted about this months ago. This is absolutely true about deaths being reported as Covid-19.

As long as CMS are paying between $13,000 and $35,000 “bonus” for Covid cases, the numbers will always be high. Always follow the money

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On 10/1/2020 at 1:51 PM, Baron Barracuda said:

Past two days stock market up, cruise line stocks flat to down.  Apparently Wall St doesn't believe re-start is imminent.

Fascinating on how the stock market buyers are inflating cruise stocks for companies that have no income and only growing expenses.  Even when cruises start, the profits will take a huge hit since the ships will not be full and it won't be long until some ship has a major outbreak.  Even the precautions in the White House weren't enough if people don't take it deadly seriously.......................and on cruise ships MANY people are too inconvenienced with rules from our past many experiences from hand washing to use of sanitizer...........toooooo inconvenient for many on "VACATION"

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I saw a blog today who claims technically the no sail order could be claimed to have expired. The wording said old one expires on sept 30, so technically as soon as it hit sept 30 it was expired. It didnt have a time, like at midnight it expires.

 

Cdc waited until later that day and wrote it was extended. He claims a lawyer could argue they have to write a entirely new order as this one expired. 

 

Interesting if nothing else.

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