Will U.S. Passengers Comply with the Covid Requirements On Board?

[sverigecruiser]

58 minutes ago, navybankerteacher said:

What is needed is a real understanding of “mandatory”.  Saying masks are required is one thing,  ensuring that masks are worn 100% is totally different.    Because many cruise line passengers traditionally act as though the rules do not apply to them, and cruise lines traditionally fail to effectively enforce their rules (be they dress code, no chair-hogging, whatever), there is no rational expectation that masks will be worn.

 

I absolutely agree with you.

 

If masks are required, that shall be enforced. I think that people refusing to wear masks,  if masks are required, shall get ONE warning and after that they shall be forced to leave the ship if that is possible. If it's not possible to make them leave they shall be locked in for the rest of the cruise. 

[donaldsc]

2 hours ago, ontheweb said:

What standard of compliance would you find acceptable realizing 100% is a goal, but unrealistic to be reached. 50% like some say is acceptable for a vaccine to be approved? 75%? 90%?

 

There is a way to greatly increase the percentage of mask wearers.  You provide OBC to people who report other people who are not wearing masks.  In other words, the ships makes it worth it for people to report people who are not following the rules. 

 

All the person has to do is take a picture of the non-wearer and turn it into the customer service desk.  

 

I will bet that several people are kicked off, the rest of people who would prefer not to wear a mask would figure that it might be a good idea if they did wear them. 

 

DON

Edited October 24, 2020 by donaldsc

[cruisemom42]

5 minutes ago, donaldsc said:

 

There is a way to greatly increase the percentage of mask wearers.  You provide OBC to people who report other people who are not wearing masks.  In other words, the ships makes it worth it for people to report people who are not following the rules. 

 

All the person has to do is take a picture of the non-wearer and turn it into the customer service desk.  

 

 

Who knew that the start-up of cruising would come to resemble a reality TV show? 

[Hlitner]

24 minutes ago, donaldsc said:

 

There is a way to greatly increase the percentage of mask wearers.  You provide OBC to people who report other people who are not wearing masks.  In other words, the ships makes it worth it for people to report people who are not following the rules. 

 

All the person has to do is take a picture of the non-wearer and turn it into the customer service desk.  

 

I will bet that several people are kicked off, the rest of people who would prefer not to wear a mask would figure that it might be a good idea if they did wear them. 

 

DON

Perhaps that is the atmosphere that would attract you to cruising but it is not my style.  As I have said in some other posts, we love to travel and love cruising but it is all about fun.  Having a thousand plus passengers and crew all acting like cops, taking pictures of everyone's offenses, likely getting into real physical action as some object to folks spying on their neighbors and taking their pictures....all makes cruising sound like something they would need to pay me to do rather then the other way around.  I can just see it now....a person takes off their mask to have a drink and fifty other folks are taking pictures and complaining that they did not put the drink to their lips within 11.5 seconds.  In such an atmosphere I think the real victims would be the crew members charged with the responsibility of being the referees.   All you need to do is look at the almost daily videos of "disagreements" that have been happening on commercial planes to get some idea of what would likely happen under your scenario.  And consider on some lines that attract older passengers (I am also a senior) where folks will start running people down with their electric scooters, folks will be swinging their canes, walkers, etc.  OMG.

 

Hank

[donaldsc]

21 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

Perhaps that is the atmosphere that would attract you to cruising but it is not my style.  As I have said in some other posts, we love to travel and love cruising but it is all about fun.  Having a thousand plus passengers and crew all acting like cops, taking pictures of everyone's offenses, likely getting into real physical action as some object to folks spying on their neighbors and taking their pictures....all makes cruising sound like something they would need to pay me to do rather then the other way around.  I can just see it now....a person takes off their mask to have a drink and fifty other folks are taking pictures and complaining that they did not put the drink to their lips within 11.5 seconds.  In such an atmosphere I think the real victims would be the crew members charged with the responsibility of being the referees.   All you need to do is look at the almost daily videos of "disagreements" that have been happening on commercial planes to get some idea of what would likely happen under your scenario.  And consider on some lines that attract older passengers (I am also a senior) where folks will start running people down with their electric scooters, folks will be swinging their canes, walkers, etc.  OMG.

 

Hank

 

I would never cruise under such circumstances and I never said that I would.  I just pointed out one way to encourage people on the ship to follow the rules they agreed to when they boarded the ship and wear the masks.  Personally, I don't plan to cruise for a long while or perhaps forever.

 

DON

[MamaFej]

The United States used to be the country of people planting Victory Gardens and holding scrap metal and rubber drives for the greater good. None of these were considered an assault on freedom, indeed they were efforts made to preserve freedom. People understood that with freedom comes responsibility. 

 

We'd all have the freedom to cruise and get back to other activities beneficial for our economies sooner if more people would take mitigation efforts seriously. Unfortunately, there is a significant portion of the population who believe their freedom to be asymptomatic super-spreaders is more important than everyone else's freedom to live in a healthier world. 

[SelectSys]

On 10/22/2020 at 7:36 PM, cruizergal70 said:

That AIDA was from Italy. Americans are a different breed.

 

This is true.  Previously we Americans were mostly mutts of European and African descent with a smattering of Asia & Mexico mixed in.  Now we are increasingly mutts with additional backgrounds and races added including much more from all over Latin America, Asia and the Indian subcontinent. 

 

What's not to love about a mutt?

 

Edited October 24, 2020 by SelectSys

[sanger727]

2 hours ago, donaldsc said:

 

There is a way to greatly increase the percentage of mask wearers.  You provide OBC to people who report other people who are not wearing masks.  In other words, the ships makes it worth it for people to report people who are not following the rules. 

 

All the person has to do is take a picture of the non-wearer and turn it into the customer service desk.  

 

I will bet that several people are kicked off, the rest of people who would prefer not to wear a mask would figure that it might be a good idea if they did wear them. 

 

DON

All that will do is turn into brawls. People get quite offended when random strangers record them or try and take their picture. Then they try and take the camera and the fight is on. There’s already been enough brawls and assaults over masks. We don’t need more.

[sanger727]

3 hours ago, sverigecruiser said:

 

I absolutely agree with you.

 

If masks are required, that shall be enforced. I think that people refusing to wear masks,  if masks are required, shall get ONE warning and after that they shall be forced to leave the ship if that is possible. If it's not possible to make them leave they shall be locked in for the rest of the cruise. 

but it’s not that simple. I don’t think there will be any problem with people flat out not having a mask ‘on’. But some people insist on wearing masks with valves or face shields instead, which the CDC says doesn’t provide the same protection to others. People wear ones that don’t fit properly and keep dropping below their nose or barely covering their mouths. People take them down/off to eat or drink. That’s where it becomes difficult to enforce.

[ontheweb]

4 hours ago, navybankerteacher said:

Acceptable percentage of vaccine effectiveness is one thing - practical reality makes a 50% effectiveness rate acceptable to gain the real benefits because 100% is simply not achievable.    Compliance with requirements is completely different because only human selfishness/ignorance makes 100% difficult to achieve without harsh procedures.

Well we know from experience that 100% compliance is not going to happen; that is why I asked the question.

 

And it is not only selfishness or ignorance. There are people who cannot wear a mask for medical reasons. I know early on in this whole mess, I ran across a former neighbor who immediately apologized for not wearing a mask. I knew she had medical problems that precluded her from wearing a mask so I had no problem with it. We stood apart as we spoke to each other.

[ontheweb]

3 hours ago, donaldsc said:

 

There is a way to greatly increase the percentage of mask wearers.  You provide OBC to people who report other people who are not wearing masks.  In other words, the ships makes it worth it for people to report people who are not following the rules. 

 

All the person has to do is take a picture of the non-wearer and turn it into the customer service desk.  

 

I will bet that several people are kicked off, the rest of people who would prefer not to wear a mask would figure that it might be a good idea if they did wear them. 

 

DON

You know that is never happening.

 

As others have pointed out, that is probably a better way of increasing violence.

[Mary229]

Answering the original question, cruise lines expect us to follow rules at all times, there is even an extensive contract passengers sign.  I have no reason to believe most pax will abide by the COVID rules in the same large percentages as they follow all other rules.  My experience is cruise lines are more than willing to disembark violators. I have seen a few people disembarked over the years. I have no issue with masks, reservations or following the shore excursions guidelines, it is better than staying at home. 

[smi889]

Wearing a mask being mandatory outside your cabin is like talking about smoking onboard. I don't think we have gotten a definitive answer on the effectiveness of wearing a mask for the Chinese Flu. Since the whole thing started we have been lied to, been scare mongered, and seen so many in the Health Institutions disagreeing with each other, you wonder if anyone knows anything. All I believe is if you get it, get treated early, don't wait to go on a ventilator. That is a death warrant. I believe the Medical Team onboard should have the supplies to treat it. Just my thoughts. I would not cruise if it is mandatory to wear a mask when outside my cabin.

[d9704011]

2 minutes ago, smi889 said:

I would not cruise if it is mandatory to wear a mask when outside my cabin.

Best for everybody, thank you.

[sverigecruiser]

11 hours ago, sanger727 said:

but it’s not that simple. I don’t think there will be any problem with people flat out not having a mask ‘on’. But some people insist on wearing masks with valves or face shields instead, which the CDC says doesn’t provide the same protection to others. People wear ones that don’t fit properly and keep dropping below their nose or barely covering their mouths. People take them down/off to eat or drink. That’s where it becomes difficult to enforce.

 

I absolutely understand what you say but I really think that it is that simple.

 

Tell the passengers which mask they shall use, perhaps only masks provided by the cruiseline. Tell them how they shall wear them. Tell them when they are allowed to take off their masks. Tell them what will happen if they don't follow the rules.

 

Enforce the rules.

 

 

[sanger727]

1 hour ago, sverigecruiser said:

 

I absolutely understand what you say but I really think that it is that simple.

 

Tell the passengers which mask they shall use, perhaps only masks provided by the cruiseline. Tell them how they shall wear them. Tell them when they are allowed to take off their masks. Tell them what will happen if they don't follow the rules.

 

Enforce the rules.

 

 

I think that’s a lot easier to say when you live in an area that doesn’t encourage mask wearing and you don’t wear a mask regularly. I believe in masks and do my best to be in compliance, and I can’t even claim to be 100%. That mask that fits well the first time you put it on fits less well hours later after repeatedly pulling it down to sip a drink. Now suddenly it keeps sliding over your nose and you have to pull it back up. In the middle of dinner, especially after having a couple drinks, I’m guilty of occasionally forgetting to put my mask on to run to the restroom. And I believe in masks and encourage coworkers and friends/family to wear them. People who don’t believe in masks and only wear them when required are even less motivated to do things correctly. You can imagine that it will all be 100% compliance, but that simply isn’t the reality of the world we live in. If you kick everyone off for things like that, you’ll return to port with an empty ship.

[sverigecruiser]

6 minutes ago, sanger727 said:

That mask that fits well the first time you put it on fits less well hours later after repeatedly pulling it down to sip a drink. Now suddenly it keeps sliding over your nose and you have to pull it back up. 

 

I thought that masks were supposed to be changed more often than that. I understand that can be a problem but maybe that means that mandatory maskwearing on cruises is not a good option.

[sverigecruiser]

10 minutes ago, sanger727 said:

 If you kick everyone off for things like that, you’ll return to port with an empty ship.

 

Then mandatory maskwearing may not be a possibility. Mandatory maskwearing without enforcing it is useless, I think.

[sanger727]

Just now, sverigecruiser said:

 

Then mandatory maskwearing may not be a possibility. Mandatory maskwearing without enforcing it is useless, I think.

I wear reusable cloth masks. I don’t change them more than once a day. The point of the masks is to keep your germs in. So the mask doesn’t go bad throughout the day. My germs are on the inside from the first breath. Main reason to change it daily is because it gets sweaty by the end of the day (they are hot). I don’t think the answer is not to have mandatory mask wearing. If the achieve 90% compliance, that’s still potentially 90% less spread than not having masks. But saying that you should get tossed off when you are caught with your nose uncovered, or pulling it down to sip a drink or much a snack, or if you have one with you at the pool but you forget to put it on one time when you go in the restroom; Is unreasonable 

[sverigecruiser]

16 minutes ago, sanger727 said:

I wear reusable cloth masks. I don’t change them more than once a day. The point of the masks is to keep your germs in. So the mask doesn’t go bad throughout the day. My germs are on the inside from the first breath. Main reason to change it daily is because it gets sweaty by the end of the day (they are hot). I don’t think the answer is not to have mandatory mask wearing. If the achieve 90% compliance, that’s still potentially 90% less spread than not having masks. But saying that you should get tossed off when you are caught with your nose uncovered, or pulling it down to sip a drink or much a snack, or if you have one with you at the pool but you forget to put it on one time when you go in the restroom; Is unreasonable 

 

But are they really okay to wear the whole day if they doesn't fit after a few hours?

 

I agree that 90% compliance is better than 0% but shall the 10% refusing to follow rules get away with it? Maybe a $100 fine every time someone is found not following the rules is better than forcing them to leave the ship. You said that you will return to port with an empty ship but why if 90% follow the rules? 

[sanger727]

8 minutes ago, sverigecruiser said:

 

But are they really okay to wear the whole day if they doesn't fit after a few hours?

 

I agree that 90% compliance is better than 0% but shall the 10% refusing to follow rules get away with it? Maybe a $100 fine every time someone is found not following the rules is better than forcing them to leave the ship. You said that you will return to port with an empty ship but why if 90% follow the rules? 

I’m not saying 10% will refuse to follow the rules. I’m saying that 100% will agree to follow the rules; but in reality, 10% of times the rules will get violated due to mistakes, forgetfulness, or simply not being motivated and caring. So person A who doesn’t believe in masks agrees to wear it. Keeps it with them most of the time, wears it most of the time. But if it slips below their nose they don’t fix it. Or if they are having an afternoon at the pool and run inside for a few minutes don’t bother putting it on. And person B believes in masks and agrees to wear one. But at the end of the night after a couple cocktails forgets to put it on. Or after climbing up 5 flights of stairs pulls it down for a minute to catch their breath.

[sverigecruiser]

1 hour ago, sanger727 said:

10% of times the rules will get violated due to mistakes, forgetfulness, or simply not being motivated and caring. 

 

All thoose examples are examples of "not following the rules", on purpose or by mistake. 

 

This thread is about if U.S. passengers will follow the rules and according to you some people will not follow the rules and we shall not expect them to be punished for it. I don't know if you are talking about U.S. passengers or not. 

 

For me personally a maskwearing rule on a cruiseship can be followed or not, I don't care because I won't cruise if masks are mandatory. 

Edited October 25, 2020 by sverigecruiser

[sanger727]

59 minutes ago, sverigecruiser said:

 

This thread is about if U.S. passengers will follow the rules and according to you some people will not follow the rules and we shall not expect them to be punished for it. I don't know if you are talking about U.S. passengers or not. 

 

I think this applies to all cruisers, including but not just US cruisers. I think it’s unfair to say the rest of the world is doing this except the US when a cruiser reported on MSC (for a a cruise open only to Italians) that mask wearing wasn’t strictly adhered to and the Pringle’s guy was from the UK. I think all cruisers will agree to wear the mask. I think a majority will do their best but have occasional slips because we are human and therefore imperfect and mask wearing is still a very new thing to most people. I think a handful will do everything they can to skirt the rules but since their excuses are the same as the majority who are trying to abide by the rules, there will be no consequence.

[mnocket]

23 hours ago, sanger727 said:

but it’s not that simple. I don’t think there will be any problem with people flat out not having a mask ‘on’. But some people insist on wearing masks with valves or face shields instead, which the CDC says doesn’t provide the same protection to others. People wear ones that don’t fit properly and keep dropping below their nose or barely covering their mouths. People take them down/off to eat or drink. That’s where it becomes difficult to enforce.

Truth be told, I suspect you'll find a lot of people whose masks "accidently" slipped down below their nose.

[cruisemom42]

35 minutes ago, mnocket said:

Truth be told, I suspect you'll find a lot of people whose masks "accidently" slipped down below their nose.

 

Agree. Well-fitting masks, or even middling ones, generally do not slip down below the nose on their own.  And ill-fitting ones should not be allowed as they are clearly not serving their protective purpose.

Edited October 25, 2020 by cruisemom42