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I read this post the first day it was posted and have thought a lot about it. While I thoroughly detest discussion politics or religion on a cruise/vacation, I have decided that from now on I will call out open racism. It makes me sad and ashamed that I have not done this before. 

 

On our first X cruise in 2004 we were seated at a table (early seating not anytime) with a couple who kept insisting for the entire cruise that black people were stronger physically but less intelligent than Caucasians. We just shut up and said nothing and tried to change the subject. Since then I have learned a lot and I will no longer stay quiet. If you come across as racist, I will call you out.

 

Jim

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The answer, just stay away from politics.

 

We have a great group of 12-13 persons that have cruised together (not always the entire group) for 3-4 cruises since 2017.   We have a good mix of political views, but generally stay away from such discussions.   

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6 minutes ago, 4774Papa said:

The answer, just stay away from politics.

 

We have a great group of 12-13 persons that have cruised together (not always the entire group) for 3-4 cruises since 2017.   We have a good mix of political views, but generally stay away from such discussions.   

Correct, there are some conversations that are better off avoided....

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11 minutes ago, 4774Papa said:

The answer, just stay away from politics.

 

We have a great group of 12-13 persons that have cruised together (not always the entire group) for 3-4 cruises since 2017.   We have a good mix of political views, but generally stay away from such discussions.   

Always sound advice.

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33 minutes ago, 4774Papa said:

The answer, just stay away from politics.

 

We have a great group of 12-13 persons that have cruised together (not always the entire group) for 3-4 cruises since 2017.   We have a good mix of political views, but generally stay away from such discussions.   

While I agree that political discussions are best avoided while cruising, I’m a bit surprised to see the OP’s question about cruising with overt racists and bigots answered with, “stay away from politics.”

 

I suppose it’s a form of proof of the fact that some people’s politics are rooted in racism and bigotry. To be clear: I am absolutely not saying that is the case with 4774Papa. I do not know his politics (nor should I). 
 

I am afraid that Twain was a bit too optimistic. I too, have seen blatant racism and bigotry on this forum for travelers. 
 

I hope the OP finds a way to cruise with people of varying opinions, and also calls out bigotry when encountered. 

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On 12/3/2020 at 3:37 AM, iamaqt2 said:

  
How will people be able to move forward from their differences of opinions and just enjoy cruising and meeting other people after this?

The same way that we've done it in the past. Once the dust settles a bit, people will remember how to coexist in real life with all of our differences, and not only on a cruise. So many topics have become polarizing during the last few years, and made worse by everything that has happened in 2020. But we've all learned to steer clear of certain topics with friends and coworkers who think differently.

 

Not entertaining controversial topics when they are brought up is probably the best way to send a message that you don't want to talk about that (like, literally, don't give them the tiniest acknowledgement that you heard what they said). You can then take the conversation to something with more substance, like favorite drinks at the bar.  

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On 12/3/2020 at 3:37 AM, iamaqt2 said:

I'm hoping my July Alaska cruise on the Solstice survives, having already cancelled 3 cruises.  The hardest thing I'm struggling with though, is dealing with patently different idealogies going forward.  Even on roll calls of cancelled cruises, I've had people calling this the China virus, or the Wuhan Flu.  
There's a very different set of values between me and the people who say those things.  And they will also be cruising and wanting to join the meet and greets.  
How will people be able to move forward from their differences of opinions and just enjoy cruising and meeting other people after this?

One moves forward by not being judgemental, I think.

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2 hours ago, DrKoob said:

I read this post the first day it was posted and have thought a lot about it. While I thoroughly detest discussion politics or religion on a cruise/vacation, I have decided that from now on I will call out open racism. It makes me sad and ashamed that I have not done this before. 

 

On our first X cruise in 2004 we were seated at a table (early seating not anytime) with a couple who kept insisting for the entire cruise that black people were stronger physically but less intelligent than Caucasians. We just shut up and said nothing and tried to change the subject. Since then I have learned a lot and I will no longer stay quiet. If you come across as racist, I will call you out.

 

Jim

 

1 hour ago, MamaFej said:

While I agree that political discussions are best avoided while cruising, I’m a bit surprised to see the OP’s question about cruising with overt racists and bigots answered with, “stay away from politics.”

 

I suppose it’s a form of proof of the fact that some people’s politics are rooted in racism and bigotry. To be clear: I am absolutely not saying that is the case with 4774Papa. I do not know his politics (nor should I). 
 

I am afraid that Twain was a bit too optimistic. I too, have seen blatant racism and bigotry on this forum for travelers. 
 

I hope the OP finds a way to cruise with people of varying opinions, and also calls out bigotry when encountered. 

I couldn't agree more. To keep silent in the face of racism is to give tacit approval.

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1 hour ago, MamaFej said:

While I agree that political discussions are best avoided while cruising, I’m a bit surprised to see the OP’s question about cruising with overt racists and bigots answered with, “stay away from politics.”

 

I suppose it’s a form of proof of the fact that some people’s politics are rooted in racism and bigotry. To be clear: I am absolutely not saying that is the case with 4774Papa. I do not know his politics (nor should I). 
 

I am afraid that Twain was a bit too optimistic. I too, have seen blatant racism and bigotry on this forum for travelers. 
 

I hope the OP finds a way to cruise with people of varying opinions, and also calls out bigotry when encountered. 

I have yet to see any racism on cruises or even on these boards.    That word is thrown around way more than it should be.  Needless to say, were I to encounter racism among cruisers, I would condemn it and avoid any at its source.

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10 minutes ago, 4774Papa said:

I have yet to see any racism on cruises or even on these boards.    That word is thrown around way more than it should be.  Needless to say, were I to encounter racism among cruisers, I would condemn it and avoid any at its source.

 

I have to disagree on this.  I have definitely seen racism exhibited on cruises and on these boards.  Racism isn't always expressed in a nasty way, but can include the sometimes rude ways people refer to locals at the destinations or the condescending tone and words used to or about crew members, their circumstances and/or homeland.

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2 minutes ago, drew69 said:

 

I have to disagree on this.  I have definitely seen racism exhibited on cruises and on these boards.  Racism isn't always expressed in a nasty way, but can include the sometimes rude ways people refer to locals at the destinations or the condescending tone and words used to or about crew members, their circumstances and/or homeland.

I agree with you totally. Unfortunately, some people don't seem to recognize racism unless it is truly. blatant.

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19 minutes ago, 4774Papa said:

I have yet to see any racism on cruises or even on these boards.    That word is thrown around way more than it should be.  Needless to say, were I to encounter racism among cruisers, I would condemn it and avoid any at its source.

You are very fortunate, indeed. I am glad to hear that you would condemn racism when you recognize it. 

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2 minutes ago, Fouremco said:

I agree with you totally. Unfortunately, some people don't seem to recognize racism unless it is truly. blatant.

That's true. If you were to ask my mom, she would tell you that she is not at all racist, and I think she truly believes that she is not. However, she has many internalized attitudes as a result of her upbringing and experiences that lead to to unconsciously perform micro-aggressions. When I call her out, she says she didn't realize what she was doing.

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Through the C19 pandemic we have all experienced an intuitive grasp of reality. The angst and unpleasantness of isolation, uncertainty, deprivation and indignation has forced us to modify behavior, in some cases to the extreme. The longer these unpleasantries linger, the longer our inability to vent and express ourselves face-to-face within truly open venues, unencumbered and unregulated. That is a healthy exercise. We seek an unshackling from the virus, only when the time is right.

 

But I wonder, while certainly understanding the disquiet demeanor of the OP’s opening post is there not some kind of latitude we can give each other - within reason of course – when once again we descend on to common ground, or ocean? Is it sagacious to think that once this liberation occurs it will be without cathartic necessity for many?

 

I cannot believe that what this world will have been through, the start of a new season will be void of any Corona virus discussion, as well as all associated sub-topics. Civil rhetoric without the diatribe is necessary to the healing process. Most definitely, it will not occupy all of my cruising experience. I do feel it is important enough to warrant conversation among intelligent peoples of the world. This commonality links us all, without exception.

 

In our ardent fervor to again sail headfirst into the sea breeze, let’s all try to give each other some leeway and understanding.

 

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On 12/3/2020 at 2:37 AM, iamaqt2 said:

I'm hoping my July Alaska cruise on the Solstice survives, having already cancelled 3 cruises.  The hardest thing I'm struggling with though, is dealing with patently different idealogies going forward.  Even on roll calls of cancelled cruises, I've had people calling this the China virus, or the Wuhan Flu.  
There's a very different set of values between me and the people who say those things.  And they will also be cruising and wanting to join the meet and greets.  
How will people be able to move forward from their differences of opinions and just enjoy cruising and meeting other people after this?

 

It's simple:  Ignore the idiots and control only what you can control.  It's a shame that life isn't like a message board where you can put someone on ignore and you'd never see or hear their opinion again!  :classic_laugh:

 

Regardless of ideologies, as long as someone respects me, I'll respect them.  I'm pretty easy going for the most part, but I have my "triggers" and I'll walk away if anyone "hits" them.  I refuse to sink down to their level and argue.  To quote:  “Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference.” ― Mark Twain.

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8 hours ago, 4774Papa said:

I have yet to see any racism on cruises or even on these boards.    That word is thrown around way more than it should be.  Needless to say, were I to encounter racism among cruisers, I would condemn it and avoid any at its source.

 

I, unfortunately, have.  I could not just avoid it at the moment that it reared its ugly head since it was during dinner.  I won't go into details, but one person used a very derogatory term in describing a person of Mexican descent.  Myself and others told him and his wife that they would not be welcome back to the table for the remainder of the cruise, and I knew I used a few words that might even shock a sailor.  (The table sat 8 people, by the way.)  But to make sure they wouldn't come back, the 6 of us went to the Maître D' after dinner and explained it.  He said he'd take care of it and he did.  I never saw that asshat the rest of the cruise thankfully.

 

Anyway, I apologize for the thread drift, but racism or prejudice of any kind is something I never tolerate.

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9 hours ago, drew69 said:

 

I have to disagree on this.  I have definitely seen racism exhibited on cruises and on these boards.  Racism isn't always expressed in a nasty way, but can include the sometimes rude ways people refer to locals at the destinations or the condescending tone and words used to or about crew members, their circumstances and/or homeland.

Amen to this. Seen it, heard it and will no longer put up with it. 

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11 hours ago, 4774Papa said:

The answer, just stay away from politics.

 

We have a great group of 12-13 persons that have cruised together (not always the entire group) for 3-4 cruises since 2017.   We have a good mix of political views, but generally stay away from such discussions.   

Stay away from politics, religion and which is better Apple vs Android.

 

All of them have their believers, devotees and zealots.

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