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NCL is making prices 50% higher due to Corona


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1 minute ago, mtrancher said:

Certainly agree the laws of supply and demand will dictate prices. Totally understand not booking now or until cruises begin but with the pent up desire from Cruisers to cruise again, what makes you predict prices to drop significantly? Also, if prices do drop don't most cruise lines allow re-booking at the lower price? Now, of course that wouldn't matter if they go out of business, so I still understand the not booking now. And for the record I'm not trying to challenge your position, just trying to understand your reasoning for a significant price drop.


Many of us (myself included) tend to use CruiseCritic as a barometer of how much pent up demand there is for wanting to book cruises. There is a much larger cruising population out there that have never been to or even know about CruiseCritic (I know personally many people like this) The feedback I have been getting is that many of these people probably will not use cruising again as a vacation choice. They have possibly been scared off for good. While my choice will be to cruise again when/if it can safely be done again...but sadly many others may not. Once cruising can start I don't believe any of the cruise lines will as easily be able to fill the ships as they were pre-pandemic. My guess is if they can't they will need to lower prices to try and entice more people to give it a go! Just the jingling of my $.02 😉

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50 minutes ago, Red-Sol said:


Many of us (myself included) tend to use CruiseCritic as a barometer of how much pent up demand there is for wanting to book cruises. There is a much larger cruising population out there that have never been to or even know about CruiseCritic (I know personally many people like this) The feedback I have been getting is that many of these people probably will not use cruising again as a vacation choice. They have possibly been scared off for good. While my choice will be to cruise again when/if it can safely be done again...but sadly many others may not. Once cruising can start I don't believe any of the cruise lines will as easily be able to fill the ships as they were pre-pandemic. My guess is if they can't they will need to lower prices to try and entice more people to give it a go! Just the jingling of my $.02 😉

How do you get feedback from the non Cruise Critic population? I agree there is a large group that does not participate on Cruise Critic, but reaching them them with any reliability of a good cross section appears pretty daunting.

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30 minutes ago, mtrancher said:

How do you get feedback from the non Cruise Critic population? I agree there is a large group that does not participate on Cruise Critic, but reaching them them with any reliability of a good cross section appears pretty daunting.

 

Various other forms of Social Media and just every day types conversation with different people, groups, etc. Nothing at all scientific by any means but still many replies from people saying they are afraid and don't think they will venture out on a cruise ship any time soon.

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2 minutes ago, Red-Sol said:

 

Various other forms of Social Media and just every day types conversation with different people, groups, etc. Nothing at all scientific by any means but still many replies from people saying they are afraid and don't think they will venture out on a cruise ship any time soon.

Well the good news is time will tell. It'll be fun to see how it all turns out!

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On 2/10/2021 at 11:08 AM, DCGuy64 said:

Exactly, and what kind of bailout did the cruise lines get? My point exactly, a big, fat $0. I bet the cruise lines would be thrilled to be able to operate at the reduced capacity of the airline industry, along with a hefty $billion shot in the arm from Uncle Sam.

Are you joking?  Why would the United States tax payers bail out companies who flag their ships on foreign countries to avoid United States taxes and wage policies.  If anyone gets a bail out, how about a company who pays taxes.  Americans are out of work.  No one is going to even suggest what you just did.

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I think for the argument sake, people needs to remember none of the lower level employee of cruise line gets paid at all when ship is not operational. Because many crew are on temporary contract. No cruise no salary. Whereas airline is very different. Even if the crew were not flying, airlines still has to pay a base salary as well as pension contributions.

 

Also for those do not understand airline industry, on average about one third to a half of the airline fleet is on lease. Whether the airline is flying the plane or not, there are monthly lease payment and parking fees. If the aircraft did not fly enough hours, there are even penalties for that. Airline is not back to full utilisation of the capacity it means hefty parking fees, salaries and mandatory lease payment as well as airline fuel payment. Yes, airline operating during the pandemic can loose more money than cruise line not operating. It is simply due to the very expensive aircraft parking and airport fees, as well as the salary and taxes social benefits airlines still need to pay whereas cruise line do not need to worry about.

Edited by ChC
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On 2/10/2021 at 10:35 AM, RocketMan275 said:

It would seem reasonable for the cruise lines to raise prices when they have to sail at reduced capacity.  

Here's the thing, they are only raising the prices for those with FCC. If you are a new cruiser, why are you booking now with no confirmed sailing date when rates are so high? You are not unless you are a moron. You would wait until the price drops later to get you on the boat.

Edited by Waquoit
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On 2/15/2021 at 6:10 AM, david_sobe said:

Are you joking?  Why would the United States tax payers bail out companies who flag their ships on foreign countries to avoid United States taxes and wage policies.  If anyone gets a bail out, how about a company who pays taxes.  Americans are out of work.  No one is going to even suggest what you just did.

Why not? Because of this. You're a frequent contributor to these boards, so I'm surprised you didn't know that Florida's economy depends heavily on those dirty foreigners and their tax-dodging ships.

 

https://www.cruisemapper.com/news/7791-cruise-industry-pause-results-23-billion-loss-florida-economy

 

And by the way, this article is from last August, so the devastation to Florida's economy is even worse by now. We really need to get away from this jingoistic notion of "us vs them." The only reason so many cruise companies choose to flag their ships overseas is that taxes and regulation in the US make it impossible to turn a profit if flagged here. You can blame politicians for that. A better idea would be to incentivize them to make their ships US--flagged. Also, I refuse to be lectured by anyone (on Cruise Critic or elsewhere) who complains about how many $billions the cruise lines make and yet their retirement savings are at least partially invested in those same companies. Lots of people on this forum are investors in Carnival, RCI, NCL, etc. Cruise stocks are good business, so let's not destroy their business model by scolding them for having their headquarters overseas.

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Getting back to prices on NCL without FCC. I was pricing Alaska, Sept. 2022 on NCL, Princess, and HAL. Both Princess and HAL have specials with drinks, wi-fi, and Grats included. This is for a regular balcony, non obstructed. Princess on the Discovery ( new ship) was $3686. , HAL $4600. , and I don't remember the exact figure but it was on the north side of $5200. on the Bliss. I see no rational explaination why NCL was so much higher than the other lines for the same itinerary, same dates, comparable ships as far as age goes, and basically the same perks. I forgot, that on both other lines, a specialty dinner is also included. NCL's pricing also included the Free at Sea promo.

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23 minutes ago, deliver42 said:

I see no rational explaination why NCL was so much higher than the other lines for the same itinerary, same dates, comparable ships as far as age goes, and basically the same perks. 

The rational explanation is they raised their prices to cover all the FCC out there, since FCC holders are the only folks booking right now.

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I booked my September 2021 Mediterranean cruise with two FCC that were about to expire, with the balance of the deposit on Amex, I have to July 4th to pay balance.

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8 hours ago, DCGuy64 said:

Why not? Because of this. You're a frequent contributor to these boards, so I'm surprised you didn't know that Florida's economy depends heavily on those dirty foreigners and their tax-dodging ships.

 

https://www.cruisemapper.com/news/7791-cruise-industry-pause-results-23-billion-loss-florida-economy

 

And by the way, this article is from last August, so the devastation to Florida's economy is even worse by now. We really need to get away from this jingoistic notion of "us vs them." The only reason so many cruise companies choose to flag their ships overseas is that taxes and regulation in the US make it impossible to turn a profit if flagged here. You can blame politicians for that. A better idea would be to incentivize them to make their ships US--flagged. Also, I refuse to be lectured by anyone (on Cruise Critic or elsewhere) who complains about how many $billions the cruise lines make and yet their retirement savings are at least partially invested in those same companies. Lots of people on this forum are investors in Carnival, RCI, NCL, etc. Cruise stocks are good business, so let's not destroy their business model by scolding them for having their headquarters overseas.

LOL.  You still did not defend the indefensible. Of course Florida's economy relies on tourism. Cruising is only a part of that.  No one would ever bail out companies who purposely dodge US Taxes.   The cruise lines did extremely well before Covid and will do the same after Covid.   I am not lecturing anyone but your response sounds like a lecture.  I think Americans would rather bail out American companies who don't dodge US taxes.  But this actually is not unique to the U.S.  No country on planet earth would do it either.  

Edited by david_sobe
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11 hours ago, deliver42 said:

The other lines also have a lot of FCC's, so that's no excuse.

I don't know who has the most FCC's out there. I would guess that the big 3 mass market cruise lines, NCL, RC and Carnival would be around the same amount. However, I do know some cruise lines, when offering the FCC option, the FCC was given on the cruise fare. People were refunded port taxes, shore excursions, drink/dinning packages etc. When NCL offered the FCC option it was on the whole amount that was paid, they kept money that was not technically theirs to keep.  So I would think NCL would have a higher dollar amount of FCC's. Totally my opinion. 

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On 2/14/2021 at 12:47 PM, mtrancher said:

No Idea where you are flying. We have experienced plenty of increased fares. In addition flight cancellations of one booked leg and refunds in credits rather than cash refunds. We have hundreds of dollars of credits we very well might be able to use on a certainly airline.

Every business is scrambling and trying to figure out business in this completely unpredictable environment.

Blanket, generalized statements don't contribute to informed discussions.

 

It's not about where i've been flying. It's about cold hard facts.

 

https://www2.arccorp.com/articles-trends/the-latest/coronavirus/

 

Average ticket prices are down 25-30% compared to pre-covid times.

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I have the Epic transatlantic booked for April, 2022, sailaway balcony $1623pp.  Same cruise April 2023 is $2190pp, 35% higher.  8 night Getaway NY to Bahamas Feb. 19, 2022 $1182pp.  Same cruise, same ship Feb. 18, 2023 $1567pp, 33% higher.  2023 cruise prices on NCL are crazy.

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59 minutes ago, EllieinNJ said:

I have the Epic transatlantic booked for April, 2022, sailaway balcony $1623pp.  Same cruise April 2023 is $2190pp, 35% higher.  8 night Getaway NY to Bahamas Feb. 19, 2022 $1182pp.  Same cruise, same ship Feb. 18, 2023 $1567pp, 33% higher.  2023 cruise prices on NCL are crazy.

Are you using up FCC? Those are horrible prices. Can get a much better deal on RCL or Celebrity.

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We had FCC from last years cancelled cruise we upgraded and had 1,780. OBC for this May's trip. It was a good deal. Canceled  May of course so rebooked in Oct. same cabin not the height of the season and owe 127.00 after they took the OBC. Still trying to sail and only 127. out of pocket but without the FCC (use it or lose it) we would have had to come up with a lot of extra money for the same trip & cabin just a different month.

I really miss our family vacation.

Good luck folk's and stay safe.

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5 hours ago, DaCruiseBug said:

Are you using up FCC? Those are horrible prices. Can get a much better deal on RCL or Celebrity.

Yes they are.  I'm just booked on the Epic because I had to use CNs that were expiring.

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On 2/10/2021 at 1:57 PM, JamieLogical said:

Shocking everyone, companies that are in the business of making money (hint, that is ALL companies), will charge precisely what the market will bear! Pent up demand is HIGH! No one has been able to cruise for a year. Cruise lines lost billions while cruising was shut down and need to try to recoup revenue. Lots and lots of people have unspent FCC from canceled cruises. All of this adds up to higher prices when cruises sail again. It's simple economics.

When Oceania open sales for it's 180-day world cruise a couple of weeks ago, it sold out in hours. Over a third of the bookings were from first-time Oceania customers (people paying cash, not FCC). There is demand that will pay the current prices. 

Edited by BirdTravels
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On 2/10/2021 at 10:17 AM, tallnthensome said:

Welcome to a reality that most knew about long ago. Trick people into accepting a 25% FCC then raise the prices 50%. Everyone should have realized this would happen .... why I grabbed my cash and ran. This has already been discussed extensively. People who chose a FCC over a cash refund chose poorly. Sad truth ..... You will never get your money back .

I am one of those optimist that took the FCC; but, one difference between me and a lot of others who did the same is that I wont cry about it because I knew I was taking a chance when I opted for the FCC. So, if the company eventually declares bankruptcy I still wont cry about it. Just another lesson learned.

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9 hours ago, BirdTravels said:

 There is demand that will pay the current prices. 

You say that based on one, unique cruise with only 35% or so of new money. That is a reach, to say the least.

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