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Will Princess Cruises follow????


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4 minutes ago, scottca075 said:

 

But you are okay with unvaccinated crew members?

 

 

There isn't a nationwide database for everyone's health records and then you have the issue of HIPPA laws.

HIPPA laws are not a problem.  An individual can release their medical information to anyone they want, including cruise lines.  If someone chooses not to release or provide the information they do not cruise.

 

Cruise lines cannot force someone to release the information, but they can deny them boarding if they do not provide proof of vaccination.

 

As far as crew members go, there are what maybe 100,000 crew members on board ships of the CCL, RCL and NCLH owned companies.  By the time the cruise lines even get ready to sail again mid summer at best, they will be able to get that many vaccinated.  

 

Also keep in mind that the CDC crew exchange guidelines do require quarantine and testing for joining crew members so they could get vaccinated at the start of that period. Especially if the single shot J&J vaccine is available.

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19 minutes ago, nocl said:

Especially if the single shot J&J vaccine is available.

Updates today on Pfizer: it can be stored in any freezer & a single shot is 85% effective so only need 1 shot. 2 is better but 1 will do

 

https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-detail/pfizer-and-biontech-submit-covid-19-vaccine-stability-data

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.wsj.com/amp/articles/single-dose-of-pfizer-vaccine-is-85-effective-israeli-study-shows-11613723218

 

Edited by Ombud
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10 minutes ago, nocl said:

As far as crew members go, there are what maybe 100,000 crew members on board ships of the CCL, RCL and NCLH owned companies.  By the time the cruise lines even get ready to sail again mid summer at best, they will be able to get that many vaccinated.  

 

Also keep in mind that the CDC crew exchange guidelines do require quarantine and testing for joining crew members so they could get vaccinated at the start of that period. Especially if the single shot J&J vaccine is available.

 

Perhaps you did not read the Crystal statement, I'll quote it again:

 

"Crystal will also seek to ensure its crew are vaccinated but noted that endeavor may be harder as they come from dozens of countries around the world with different vaccine policies and availability."

 

So not as simple as you make it sound.

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1 hour ago, wowzz said:

I'm a long, long way away from IL. I'm in Lincolnshire in the UK!

Insurance companies can access your medical records in the UK, but only if you make a claim, and you agree to them having access to your files.  No claim, no access.

I missed the UK part.  It does not work that way in the US.

46 minutes ago, scottca075 said:

 

But you are okay with unvaccinated crew members?

 

 

There isn't a nationwide database for everyone's health records and then you have the issue of HIPPA laws.

Yes, I know.  A standardized method for determining who is vaccinated would be a challenge in the US and around the world. 
In the US we cannot seem to get the Real ID implemented, but it is probably political.

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I don't have a real ID. During shutdown I was able to renew my license but not upgrade to real ID. Nothing political, office was just closed and I have a valid passport so no need to rush in

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20 minutes ago, Ombud said:

I don't have a real ID. During shutdown I was able to renew my license but not upgrade to real ID. Nothing political, office was just closed and I have a valid passport so no need to rush in

When my license expired, the DMV was closed. They finally opened up by appointment and for county residents only. I was asked if I wanted the enhance license. When I said I had a passport that was still valid for 9 years, I was told that there was no need to pay an extra fee to have my license enhanced to real id.

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2 hours ago, scottca075 said:

 

Perhaps you did not read the Crystal statement, I'll quote it again:

 

"Crystal will also seek to ensure its crew are vaccinated but noted that endeavor may be harder as they come from dozens of countries around the world with different vaccine policies and availability."

 

So not as simple as you make it sound.

Crystal is also not one of the Mainstream lines with HQs in the US.

 

Also note the reference to CDC requirements which also applies to cruises out of the US.

 

The Crystal post by nature has to cover all of their ships anywhere in the world where countries including the EU and for that matter Hong Kong the home location of the company that owns Crystal is based, are lagging.

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2 hours ago, Ombud said:

While that is a nice study on the 1 shot, that data is not sufficient for the FDA to approve a single shot protocol for the Pfizer vaccine. Until such a protocol has been fully tested and approved people should get both shots.

 

Unfortunately articles like this might encourage people to skip the second shot. The lower efficacy means more opportunity for virus mutation than the higher efficacy. 

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12 minutes ago, nocl said:

While that is a nice study on the 1 shot, that data is not sufficient for the FDA to approve a single shot protocol for the Pfizer vaccine. Until such a protocol has been fully tested and approved people should get both shots.

 

Unfortunately articles like this might encourage people to skip the second shot. The lower efficacy means more opportunity for virus mutation than the higher efficacy. 

Couldn't the CDC or FDA say that's sufficent for Crew?

 

Edited by Ombud
typo
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1 minute ago, By The Bay said:

Genting Hong Kong is the parent company of Crystal Cruises.

 

nocl said, "Crystal Cruises doesn't have it's HQ in the U.S." It does. Who the parent company is and where they are is irrelevant. Jack Anderson, President & CEO of Crystal is in Miami, FL USA.

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My husband and I have received our first shot and will get the 2nd in 12 days.  We one cruise booked for April 2022 and I would like everyone, passengers and crew all vaccinated before the ship leaves port.  I want to cruise, but I want to be safe.

 

I don't have a problem wearing a mask either, if that is the rule.

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6 hours ago, Ombud said:

Shows that the UK strategy of two injections, 12 weeks apart, is correct!  

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3 hours ago, nocl said:

Unfortunately articles like this might encourage people to skip the second shot. The lower efficacy means more opportunity for virus mutation than the higher efficacy. 

No, what it means is that two shots are required, but that the second shot, as per the Israeli study, is more efficacious if administered 12 weeks after the first shot. 

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1 hour ago, scottca075 said:

 

Crystal Cruises
1501 Biscayne Blvd., Suite 501 
Miami, FL USA 33132
+1 (786) 971-1000 

 

Crystal is still not a mainstream line that I referred to in my post.

 

Their posting also referred to their river cruise ships which will never return to the US.  Whose crew does not transit to the US and is mostly European, which as I mentioned is one of the areas that is clearly lagging.  

 

On the other hand the mainstream lines, subject to the CDC restriction would be ships all leaving from the US which should have plenty of vaccine available by summer.

 

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22 minutes ago, wowzz said:

No, what it means is that two shots are required, but that the second shot, as per the Israeli study, is more efficacious if administered 12 weeks after the first shot. 

I was referring to the the other point in the article that it does show efficacy with only one shot.  Which is the person I responded to was referencing in terms of making it easier for the crew. 

 

Some people may take that to be "good enough" and chose to skip the second shot (with often causes more side effect than the first).  Everyone should be encouraged to get both shots.

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2 minutes ago, nocl said:

I was referring to the the other point in the article that it does show efficacy with only one shot.  Which is the person I responded to was referencing in terms of making it easier for the crew. 

 

Some people may take that to be "good enough" and chose to skip the second shot (with often causes more side effect than the first).  Everyone should be encouraged to get both shots.

Sorry if I caused confusion. 

Yes, of course, two vaccinations should be administered, so as to gain maximum protection. 

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1 hour ago, Ombud said:

@noclThe 1 dose efficacy with Pfizer is about the same as the J&J efficacy so does that mean FDA won't approve J&J?

No it does not mean that at all.

 

The J&J data comes from a large phase trial designed explicitly to determine the efficacy of the drug. It would have been based upon discussions with the FDA about what the trial design would be needed to support approval.  The J&J vaccine gives good efficacy, is single shot and has better storage requirements.

In the environment we are in it certainly (unless there is something undisclosed in the data) meets an unmet medical need, the basic requirement for an EUA.

 

The data on the single shot of Pfizer comes from an Israeli study of health care workers examining the their infection rates at various time periods related to their getting vaccinated.  While it is an interesting study and gives worthwhile scientific information, it is not a study designed and executed for the purpose of drug approval or for driving a change of label(a one shot protocol approval would be a change of label ).  Basically that study does not give sufficient data and controls for FDA to accept the data as sufficient to make such a change in protocol.  The information might prod  Pfizer  to go forward with discussions with the agency about running the necessary study for such a change.  But I doubt it because 1. the efficacy is lower than the current protocol and 2. by the time that work would be done we would be beyond the initial vaccination rush in the US and the focus here would shift to boosters and variants.

Edited by nocl
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On 2/19/2021 at 7:36 PM, Shaver John said:

Just read that Crystal Cruises will require a vaccination for COVID 19 at least 14 days before sailing.  Do you think Princess will follow? 

I certainly hope so.  After all the bad press from last year, they need to show they're the safest way to go at least during the ramp up to normal cruising.  I'm not sure that they would be as worried about not allowing unvaccinated minors to sail as they don't really spend a lot of money onboard.  I think allowing unvaccinated minors to cruise (initially) would put off the vaccinated seniors and for the initial startup, they're the demographic they need to attract.  Just my 2 cents...

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21 minutes ago, Daniel A said:

I certainly hope so.  After all the bad press from last year, they need to show they're the safest way to go at least during the ramp up to normal cruising.  I'm not sure that they would be as worried about not allowing unvaccinated minors to sail as they don't really spend a lot of money onboard.  I think allowing unvaccinated minors to cruise (initially) would put off the vaccinated seniors and for the initial startup, they're the demographic they need to attract.  Just my 2 cents...

Considering that at this point no age is sailing I believe that they would be willing to give up the under 18 demographic in order to get their ships sailing with minimal chance of having another Diamond or Ruby situation.

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3 hours ago, Daniel A said:

  I'm not sure that they would be as worried about not allowing unvaccinated minors to sail as they don't really spend a lot of money onboard. 

 

But their parents do. Not allowing kids will mean the family will choose a land vacation.

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6 hours ago, nocl said:

 

The J&J vaccine gives good efficacy, is single shot and has better storage requirements.

In the environment we are in it certainly (unless there is something undisclosed in the data) meets an unmet medical need, the basic requirement for an EUA.

 

 

J&J is running trials with two doses:

 

https://www.wbtv.com/2021/02/15/behind-scenes-johnson-johnson-two-dose-covid-vaccine-trial-south-charlotte/

 

https://www.clickondetroit.com/news/local/2021/02/16/henry-ford-health-system-begins-enrollment-for-2-dose-trial-of-j-js-covid-19-vaccine/

 

If they believe one dose is effective enough, who would they do this?

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