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36 minutes ago, compman9 said:

Fewer than 500 fit and healthy working age people that were not obese have died of this virus in the UK (population 70+million)

 

There is and never has been any case for locking up anyone other than vulnerable groups, but politicians love nothing more than accumulating vast debts they can blame on something/one else

 

What we are seeing is politics getting in the way of what is best for nations

How do you define fit and healthy?  For example, are you aware that 40% of all people in the UK aged between 50 and 59 years are considered to have a "Pre-existing condition".  Should the deaths of those people not count?

 

Edited by onlyslightlymad
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2 hours ago, compman9 said:

Fewer than 500 fit and healthy working age people that were not obese have died of this virus in the UK (population 70+million)

 

There is and never has been any case for locking up anyone other than vulnerable groups, but politicians love nothing more than accumulating vast debts they can blame on something/one else

 

What we are seeing is politics getting in the way of what is best for nations

 

Why an earth would politicians want to accumulate vast debt? To stay in power, they need to cut taxes and borrowing and spend more. Cant be done, so they tax to spend. 

 

As for lockdowns, there wouldn't be lockdowns if people followed the basic rules of hand washing masks and seperation. I work in the military and have seen very ill people from this. A lot have openly said they wished they paid more attention to the basic rules.........

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1 hour ago, onlyslightlymad said:

How do you define fit and healthy?  For example, are you aware that 40% of all people in the UK aged between 50 and 59 years are considered to have a "Pre-existing condition".  Should the deaths of those people not count?

 

I think you will find that compman9 means fit and healthy working age people with no pre-existing condition of any kind. I'm not sure if this includes people with disabilities like blindness etc.

Edited by Bloodgem
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4 minutes ago, FamilyCruiserUK said:

 

Why an earth would politicians want to accumulate vast debt? To stay in power, they need to cut taxes and borrowing and spend more. Cant be done, so they tax to spend. 

 

As for lockdowns, there wouldn't be lockdowns if people followed the basic rules of hand washing masks and seperation. I work in the military and have seen very ill people from this. A lot have openly said they wished they paid more attention to the basic rules.........

Exactly.

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4 hours ago, Etta1213 said:

I've heard more than once how significant a person's Vitamin D level is. Good reason to get outside more, i guess.

 

 

 

I’ve read that most people are deficient in Vitamin D - especially in winter. Vitamin D supplements are inexpensive.

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I am also amazed at some of the anti vac information going around. Do these people say the same for all the other medicines in use. The same medicines that are regulated by the same group of doctors who studied and regulates the data for covid vaccines. 

 

It would be political and career suicide for any rush jobs as well as a very long jail terms. 

 

I understand that people may not have any kind of jab and thats their right as we are a free country. 

 

Sorry to moan just so frustrated when i see and read such garbage by people who have no clue what is really going on in the covid wards. 

 

 

 

 

 

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7 hours ago, baldilocks said:

We will getting our second Moderna shots on March 5th....we hope. We are willing to wear our masks and keep social distancing when we are out....but not forever. We have been listening to the news and several well respected, well known doctors of virology stated that the USA will reach herd immunity around the end of April....even with the new strains. They also said that all schools should open immediately. Those doctors were verbally attacked by the news media, the teacher's union and the politicians. The 'polys' want to keep us down until Christmas 2021 or longer. I believe the doctors.

 

I cannot for the life of me see why cruising should not begin by August 2021. That should give the cruise lines enough time to get their crews on board, have them vaccinated and do a couple of test cruises and determine open destinations.. If they are held back, it is a political move...not science speaking. As a stockholder in Royal, I would expect Royal to protest to the the highest level....the news media about their situation. 

 

As for us, no masks after April. We want to get back to normal living....not being treated like animals in a zoo.

Life is valuable in my opinion.  I will do whatever is necessary to keep healthy and safe.  Just had my second covid vaccination.  Had side effects- yuk.  I want to cruise asap- but will be responsible.  Keep the mask on.  While less people are dying now- if we let our guards down- we will be on the upswing again.  We just paid for a May cruise- which I do not think will happen, but we can move it to a future cruise.  At the same time, we are giving Royal a loan to stay in business.

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7 hours ago, baldilocks said:

As for us, no masks after April. We want to get back to normal living....not being treated like animals in a zoo.

This attitude is why another uptick is possible in the near future.

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Write to your elected officials.  Even if you didn't vote for them they represent you now. 

 

There is evidence in other parts of the world that cruising can be done safely when public health agencies and governments partner with the cruise industry as opposed to blindly locking it down "out of an abundance of caution" or "just in case".   The CDC is out of control and we need a check of their powers to shutdown an industry and kill jobs and industry in America.  If left unchecked the CDC would have us all in lockdown year after year every winter for the flu.  

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4 hours ago, Bloodgem said:

Manaus in Brazil may provide you with a reason to wear a mask after April.

It was thought that Manaus had already hit herd immunity in October 2020 but in January 2021 they had a massive second wave of Covid. This wave has left doctors questioning if natural herd immunity will work.

Isn't it great how just when things start turning the corner there's a new "deadlier" variant that's found half away across the world......keep people scared. It's losing its effect. 

Edited by Mapleleafforever
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8 hours ago, baldilocks said:

We will getting our second Moderna shots on March 5th....we hope. We are willing to wear our masks and keep social distancing when we are out....but not forever. We have been listening to the news and several well respected, well known doctors of virology stated that the USA will reach herd immunity around the end of April....even with the new strains. They also said that all schools should open immediately. Those doctors were verbally attacked by the news media, the teacher's union and the politicians. The 'polys' want to keep us down until Christmas 2021 or longer. I believe the doctors.

 

I cannot for the life of me see why cruising should not begin by August 2021. That should give the cruise lines enough time to get their crews on board, have them vaccinated and do a couple of test cruises and determine open destinations.. If they are held back, it is a political move...not science speaking. As a stockholder in Royal, I would expect Royal to protest to the the highest level....the news media about their situation. 

 

As for us, no masks after April. We want to get back to normal living....not being treated like animals in a zoo.

 

So what are your destinations on your cruise?  Why you all of the other countries open up their ports to visitors when their population hasn't been vaccinated.

 

BTW science isn't absolute.  Science is making the best educated guess based on all of the available data.  The guesses from the scientists today will be different tomorrow because there will be more data.  If I'm in charge of a poor Caribbean island, I'm not sure I open up my island to visitors before I can vaccinate the vulnerable population on my island.

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28 minutes ago, ipeeinthepool said:

BTW science isn't absolute.  Science is making the best educated guess based on all of the available data.  The guesses from the scientists today will be different tomorrow because there will be more data.  If I'm in charge of a poor Caribbean island, I'm not sure I open up my island to visitors before I can vaccinate the vulnerable population on my island.

 

I tend to agree but...

 

Many Caribbean nations lack a deep bench of scientists and doctors in the fields applicable to a pandemic so a portion of their decision making will come from perceived institutes of knowledge such as the CDC.    The CDC has proven it is not a purely scientific body.  Much of what it produces is influenced by politics and directed by politicians past, present and future.  As other nations look to the CDC for guidance they are unknowingly subscribing to the political doctrine of the CDC and not the science they perceive to be it's foundation.

 

The key to moving forward and restarting cruising lies in correcting the behaviour of the CDC as it applies to it's unscientific lockdown of the cruise industry.

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2 hours ago, twangster said:

Write to your elected officials.  Even if you didn't vote for them they represent you now. 

 

There is evidence in other parts of the world that cruising can be done safely when public health agencies and governments partner with the cruise industry as opposed to blindly locking it down "out of an abundance of caution" or "just in case".   The CDC is out of control and we need a check of their powers to shutdown an industry and kill jobs and industry in America.  If left unchecked the CDC would have us all in lockdown year after year every winter for the flu.  

Who's in lock down?

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7 hours ago, baldilocks said:

 

Yes. That was one of the factors that was tested. BUN was another, but I have no idea what that is.

BUN= Blood Urea Nitrogen. One if the tests we look at to ascertain kidney function, volume depletion, upper GI tract bleeding, etc.

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6 hours ago, compman9 said:

Fewer than 500 fit and healthy working age people that were not obese have died of this virus in the UK (population 70+million)

 

There is and never has been any case for locking up anyone other than vulnerable groups, but politicians love nothing more than accumulating vast debts they can blame on something/one else

 

What we are seeing is politics getting in the way of what is best for nations

Never let a good crisis go to waste....

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4 hours ago, FamilyCruiserUK said:

 

Why an earth would politicians want to accumulate vast debt? 

 

I don't know about you but a 26 trillion dollar national debt meets my definition of "vast".

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11 minutes ago, cruisinfanatic said:

Who's in lock down?

Cruising from the U.S.A. maybe ?

We must always remember that Cruising and people who enjoy cruising have almost NEVER had any news coverage aside from that which is NEGATIVE.

 

Schools closed and hospitals infected with Noro and front page news is "Cruise passengers decimated by Noro outbreak" after ten passengers are affected..

 

Drunk climbs over railing and onto life boat then jumps into the ocean. Front page news "PASSENGER FALLS TO HIS DEATH FROM CRUISE SHIP". Senators and Congress call for investigation and new safety LAWS.

 

If all crew and  all passengers have been vaccinated and sail from Jersey or NYC what is the C.D.C.'s argument ?

 

.  

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4 hours ago, FamilyCruiserUK said:

 

Why an earth would politicians want to accumulate vast debt? To stay in power, they need to cut taxes and borrowing and spend more. Cant be done, so they tax to spend. 

 

As for lockdowns, there wouldn't be lockdowns if people followed the basic rules of hand washing masks and separation. I work in the military and have seen very ill people from this. A lot have openly said they wished they paid more attention to the basic rules.........

The issue is that a year later they are still convinced that this is a hoax or not as serious as the media makes it out to be and the death numbers are skewed, so there is no reason to follow the basic protocol. Add to that those who are letting their guard down due to covid fatigue.

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9 hours ago, baldilocks said:

The report is freely available for people to sign it. That means that anyone with a 'junk' name could sign it. I tend to believe the Wall Street Journal than the major news media and the politicians.

 

I think that Australia is a fine country with many fine people, but your lock downs have been extreme is some cases. As I remember, there have been some protest about it. We hope to one day to return to Australia as it found it a wonderful land.

Their lock downs caused the country to have less than 1000 deaths since March. The USA, where so many do as they please has, that and more every day. I guess you'll have to lose someone close until you get it.

If someone says herd immunity by April it has to be true because you want to believe it so much

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3 hours ago, twangster said:

Write to your elected officials.  Even if you didn't vote for them they represent you now. 

 

There is evidence in other parts of the world that cruising can be done safely when public health agencies and governments partner with the cruise industry as opposed to blindly locking it down "out of an abundance of caution" or "just in case".   The CDC is out of control and we need a check of their powers to shutdown an industry and kill jobs and industry in America.  If left unchecked the CDC would have us all in lockdown year after year every winter for the flu.  

 

There was a covid case just last week on the MSC Grandiosa out of Italy.    I'm surprised the U.S. media hasn't pounced on it like a lion.

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20 minutes ago, Iamcruzin said:

The issue is that a year later they are still convinced that this is a hoax or not as serious as the media makes it out to be and the death numbers are skewed, so there is no reason to follow the basic protocol. Add to that those who are letting their guard down due to covid fatigue.

That may be part of it. But I also think it is human nature to get frustrated when you are constantly hearing changing and contradictory information as well as having the goals changed and the goal posts being pushed father away. Couple that with a healthy distrust of anything that comes out of a politician's mouth and here we are.

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40 minutes ago, Iamcruzin said:

The issue is that a year later they are still convinced that this is a hoax or not as serious as the media makes it out to be and the death numbers are skewed, so there is no reason to follow the basic protocol.

 

It won't be long before someone posts that the flu is more deadly 🙄

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20 minutes ago, Ocean Boy said:

That may be part of it. But I also think it is human nature to get frustrated when you are constantly hearing changing and contradictory information as well as having the goals changed and the goal posts being pushed father away. Couple that with a healthy distrust of anything that comes out of a politician's mouth and here we are.

That doesn't excuse basic daily hygiene that should be practiced every day good times or bad.  Have you ever noticed how many walk past the sinks when directed to wash their hands before entering the buffet?  I never thought twice about it before they had sinks available in the buffet. Now I'm disturbed about it.

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Just now, Iamcruzin said:

That doesn't excuse basic daily hygiene that should be practiced every day good times or bad.  Have you ever noticed how many walk past the sinks when directed to wash their hands before entering the buffet?  I never thought twice about it before they had sinks available in the buffet. Now I'm disturbed about it.

I agree. I was not talking about the proper behaviors that our mothers taught us when we were two years old.

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