Jump to content

Deposit Deadline and Grace Period


Recommended Posts

Hang on folks - if everyone had the same view on these boards it would quickly be boring and pointless. 

We need contrary views, we need debate (of the intelligent and thoughtful sort) so please let's not discourage anyone to post.

Adrian

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Noggins said:

Hang on folks - if everyone had the same view on these boards it would quickly be boring and pointless. 

We need contrary views, we need debate (of the intelligent and thoughtful sort) so please let's not discourage anyone to post.

Adrian


I think everyone here supports polite debate — I post contrarian messages all the time in the interest of discussion...  I think the reaction was to the part where I was called a liar in plain terms without any specifics to back that up.  That wasn’t intelligent or thoughtful.  Oh well, I made my point.

 

 Vince

Link to post
Share on other sites
15 hours ago, Merry Twinkletoes said:

Crystal Confidence 3.0 is valid through December 2021.

 

Crystal has relaxed Cancellation terms of 60 days prior to First Day of Service.

 

If you purchase an Air or Hotel reservation from Crystal, this is your First Day of Service.

 

9 hours ago, Keith1010 said:

I would add to Merry Twinkletoes earlier comments:

 

If you cancel between 60 and 31 days days prior to the start of the cruise you get 75% back,  and if you cancel between 29 days and eight days before the start of the cruise or the start of air, etc. you get 50% of your payment back.

 

This information will be shown on your Crystal Booking Reservations so they have tried to make this more flexible than I can ever remember in terms of getting some amount of money back.

 

Keith

 

Thanks for pointing this out.  I was not aware of the relaxed cancellation policies.  I am personally going to sit out the early cruises, and see how things work out.  If they are successful, hopefully there will be more cruises available soon.

 

Crystal is requiring all passengers to be vaccinated.  Celebrity is allowing those under 18 to not be vaccinated.  It will be interesting to see if there are significant differences in COVID issues with these different approaches.   

Link to post
Share on other sites
58 minutes ago, cruiserchuck said:

 

 

Thanks for pointing this out.  I was not aware of the relaxed cancellation policies.  I am personally going to sit out the early cruises, and see how things work out.  If they are successful, hopefully there will be more cruises available soon.

 

Crystal is requiring all passengers to be vaccinated.  Celebrity is allowing those under 18 to not be vaccinated.  It will be interesting to see if there are significant differences in COVID issues with these different approaches.   

You are very welcome.

 

I hope neither cruise line has issues but I do think being more cautious is the way to go.  Children do get COVID-19.  One of my good friends grandchildren who were in single digits in terms of age both got it.  I realize often there are very little symptoms but again I think caution is a good approach.

 

Keith

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/25/2021 at 11:55 PM, Keith1010 said:

I would add to Merry Twinkletoes earlier comments:

 

If you cancel between 60 and 31 days days prior to the start of the cruise you get 75% back,  and if you cancel between 29 days and eight days before the start of the cruise or the start of air, etc. you get 50% of your payment back.

 

This information will be shown on your Crystal Booking Reservations so they have tried to make this more flexible than I can ever remember in terms of getting some amount of money back.

 

Keith

So if the deposits are being held in a non-operating reserve account, why does Crystal still want fares paid earlier than 60 days prior to sailing?  Why not make fares due in full 60 days in advance?  Getting the money earlier and holding it in a non-operating reserve account doesn't seem to offer Crystal any advantage since they can't use the money. Why not let their customers keep their money until the 60 day mark?

Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, mnocket said:

So if the deposits are being held in a non-operating reserve account, why does Crystal still want fares paid earlier than 60 days prior to sailing?  Why not make fares due in full 60 days in advance?  Getting the money earlier and holding it in a non-operating reserve account doesn't seem to offer Crystal any advantage since they can't use the money. Why not let their customers keep their money until the 60 day mark?

 

I can answer this one from experience...  

 

Since there is really no measurable interest paid on these accounts anymore, the main benefit for a cruise line is to reduce spoilage on the bookings.  Reservations under full payment are significantly less likely to cancel than reservations under partial deposit, both because people are less likely to hold them on spec and because people often second guess their decision before they fork over that payment.  There are often a pulse of cancellations around that payment deadline.

 

The closer you get to departure the harder it is to resell the cabin, and after 120 days it starts getting risky.  The longer the cruise, that resale gets even harder, since people are less likely to book a long cruise on shorter notice.  The longer the voyage, the further out the need to start vetting the reservations to smoke out that churn, if they have any hope to resell most of those reservations that drop at the payment deadline -- hence the graduated deadline ladder.

 

Vince

Link to post
Share on other sites

Vince, is spot on.  There are rooms categories fully booked and should they become available because people don't make a deposit I suspect others will book them.  For the first sailing of July 3 the deposit isn't due until April 4 and there is a ten day grace period taking them to April 14 which is about 80 days out from the first sailing.

 

Keith

Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Keith1010 said:

For the first sailing of July 3 the deposit isn't due until April 4 and there is a ten day grace period taking them to April 14 which is about 80 days out from the first sailing.


You’re actually a day early with those deadlines - it’s 5 April (in the US) and the 15th with the grace period 

 

Of course if you’re in Australia we could push it out to 6 and 16 using the Australian time zone and paying in the US

Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, Stickman1990 said:


You’re actually a day early with those deadlines - it’s 5 April (in the US) and the 15th with the grace period 

 

Of course if you’re in Australia we could push it out to 6 and 16 using the Australian time zone and paying in the US

Yes you are right.

 

But that is the story of my life.


Early, never late and on time seems late.

 

Remember early to bed and early to rise.  And how can we forget the early bird gets the worm. 

 

LOL.  😃

 

Keith

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/25/2021 at 7:01 PM, Merry Twinkletoes said:

Crystal Confidence 3.0 is valid through December 2021.

 

Crystal has relaxed Cancellation terms of 60 days prior to First Day of Service.

 

If you purchase an Air or Hotel reservation from Crystal, this is your First Day of Service.

Thank you for this! You have answered my question which is why my penalty cancellation period starts days before my final payment due date. Third item explains it's the nights at Crystal Hotel.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Keith1010 said:

 And how can we forget the early bird gets the worm. 

 

LOL.  😃

 

Keith

True, but the second mouse gets the cheese!!!😁😁

Link to post
Share on other sites
21 hours ago, BWIVince said:

 

I can answer this one from experience...  

 

Since there is really no measurable interest paid on these accounts anymore, the main benefit for a cruise line is to reduce spoilage on the bookings.  Reservations under full payment are significantly less likely to cancel than reservations under partial deposit, both because people are less likely to hold them on spec and because people often second guess their decision before they fork over that payment.  There are often a pulse of cancellations around that payment deadline.

 

The closer you get to departure the harder it is to resell the cabin, and after 120 days it starts getting risky.  The longer the cruise, that resale gets even harder, since people are less likely to book a long cruise on shorter notice.  The longer the voyage, the further out the need to start vetting the reservations to smoke out that churn, if they have any hope to resell most of those reservations that drop at the payment deadline -- hence the graduated deadline ladder.

 

Vince

Hadn't thought about that.  Makes perfect sense.  Thanks for the thoughtful answer👍

Link to post
Share on other sites


I am sure there are many others debating their next steps regarding the April 5-15 window to pay their deposits on already-booked “no deposit”cruises. 
 

At the risk of sounding negative, who actually controls the “secure  non-operating reserve accounts“?  Is it Crystal or a third party?    Is it like an escrow account?  It is little secret that GentingHK has debts in excess of their assets and are in the process of restructuring. What prevents GentingHK  accessing the “secure non-operating reserve accounts” to pay down their debts?

 

For your confidence during these transitionary times in travel, Crystal has established secure, non-operating reserve accounts with our financial partners to hold all refundable* payments, allowing us to process refunds in a timely manner. Refundable payments will be deposited in these new reserve accounts, and, along with additional channels of available funds and credit, will ensure 100 percent coverage of all refundable payments received should a guest need to cancel.
 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, Cancun01 said:

What prevents GentingHK  accessing the “secure non-operating reserve accounts” to pay down their debts?

 

Generally accepted accounting principles, and to some degree the law.  In fairness, this is how the travel industry pretty much operates, and has for at least for my career.  

 

The problem isn't usually companies stealing the refundable deposits out of escrow, unless someone wants to go to jail, the issue is the non-refundable deposits.  The pickle the industry got in last year is what happens when you have to refund weeks and months of the NON-REFUNDABLE deposits for every cabin on every sailing that the funds were already disbursed for.  I think what we're seeing here is a better definition around their deposits, and isolating them from things like chargebacks where non-refundable debits may have come from refundable funds.

 

This isn't foolproof.  Make sure you understand your credit card company's dispute limits and keep in mind how they overlay the life cycle of your fare charge.

 

Vince

Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you Vince for your prompt response.
 

 Here in Ontario we do have TICO (Travel Industry Council of Ontario) which provides consumer protection of “last resort” if a provider runs into difficulty — albeit (my understanding)  limited to a maximum - equally divided by all claimants so not necessarily the full amount paid. One would have to exhaust all other avenues such as credit card dispute first so best, as you advise, to be aware of the relevant cc terms and conditions.

Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, Cancun01 said:

Thank you Vince for your prompt response.
 

 Here in Ontario we do have TICO (Travel Industry Council of Ontario) which provides consumer protection of “last resort” if a provider runs into difficulty — albeit (my understanding)  limited to a maximum - equally divided by all claimants so not necessarily the full amount paid. One would have to exhaust all other avenues such as credit card dispute first so best, as you advise, to be aware of the relevant cc terms and conditions.

 

That's a nice perk -- I believe Larry has referenced that before.  Do other provinces provide something similar?

 

When I was a retail travel agent back in the dark ages, California passed similar legislation.  The point in CA's case I think was more to cover the money before it got disbursed to the supplier, and had lots of limitations on it (both the consumer and the agency had to be in CA, and had to include either air or cruise fare as part of the transaction, for example IIRC.)

 

I think in CA's case, if the cruise line processed the payment directly and the agency wasn't part of the loss then then the next step is the Federal Maritime Commission's coverage (which we've talked about on the board before).  I don't believe the FMC covers voyages that don't involve US ports though (even if the tickets are sold in the US), so this wouldn't help with any of the new cruises being proposed for 2021 at this point.

 

That's why I mention the credit cards -- that's really the first line of defense on getting your money back.  Even travel insurance that covers supplier failures requires the cruise line to actually fail, and even then you usually have to work through the credit card avenue first, just like in Ontario's case.

 

Vince

Link to post
Share on other sites

If I am not mistaken I believe that British Columbia and Quebec have similar  consumer protection if providers fail but I do not know the specifics.  When we first booked our current cruises I asked our TA about TICO.  After explaining how it worked, she also advised that credit cards were the best initial recourse.   
 

Thanks again for the info Vince!

Link to post
Share on other sites

Have any Canadians who are planning on going on one of the cruises found insurance that will provide coverage?  I have not found any insurance that will cover Trip Cancellation, Trip Interruption, or Emergency Medical.  I have been told by my credit card providers, and the insurance agents whom I contacted that it is not possible to be insured on a cruise at this time because of the Canadian government's travel advisory.   As well, it is also not possible to purchase insurance for land travel to a variety of countries due to the Canadian government's travel advisory for those countries (although, there are policies that are available for travel to the USA).  However, as others have stated, travelling to the USA still has the quarantine requirements in place and one would have to be prepared to follow whatever rules the government has in place at the time of the trip.  

 

Does Crystal offer insurance that would provide enough Emergency Medical coverage for Canadians?

Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, Cancun01 said:

If I am not mistaken I believe that British Columbia and Quebec have similar  consumer protection if providers fail but I do not know the specifics.  When we first booked our current cruises I asked our TA about TICO.  After explaining how it worked, she also advised that credit cards were the best initial recourse.   
 

Thanks again for the info Vince!

Keep in mind TICO only covers "end supplier failure" for airlines and cruise lines. It is not blanket coverage.

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, mariners said:

Have any Canadians who are planning on going on one of the cruises found insurance that will provide coverage?  I have not found any insurance that will cover Trip Cancellation, Trip Interruption, or Emergency Medical.  I have been told by my credit card providers, and the insurance agents whom I contacted that it is not possible to be insured on a cruise at this time because of the Canadian government's travel advisory.   As well, it is also not possible to purchase insurance for land travel to a variety of countries due to the Canadian government's travel advisory for those countries (although, there are policies that are available for travel to the USA).  However, as others have stated, travelling to the USA still has the quarantine requirements in place and one would have to be prepared to follow whatever rules the government has in place at the time of the trip.  

 

Does Crystal offer insurance that would provide enough Emergency Medical coverage for Canadians?

 

Until such time as the federal government rescinds the "no travel" and "no cruise" advisories, no Canadian supplier is providing coverage for out of country or cancellation. It's "self-insure", or stay home. We have a final payment in July for a September Endeavor sailing, and if the advisories are still in place, we won't be making that payment.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks, Roland4.  We have often used  "self-insure" for trip cancellation and interruption; however, we always ensure that we have Emergency Medical as well as MedJet Assist.

 

As we don't get our first vaccine until later this month, and then have to wait until whenever to get the second dose, I guess we will spend time exploring our beautiful province (those parts where we are permitted to travel depending upon COVID and, also, the fire/travel restrictions that have just been put in place).

 

Thankfully, Crystal cruisers are generous and provide "virtual sailings" to those of us who cannot join them onboard.  

 

I hope that everything will work out for your September Endeavor sailing.    

Link to post
Share on other sites
49 minutes ago, mariners said:

Thanks, Roland4.  We have often used  "self-insure" for trip cancellation and interruption; however, we always ensure that we have Emergency Medical as well as MedJet Assist.

 

As we don't get our first vaccine until later this month, and then have to wait until whenever to get the second dose, I guess we will spend time exploring our beautiful province (those parts where we are permitted to travel depending upon COVID and, also, the fire/travel restrictions that have just been put in place).

 

Thankfully, Crystal cruisers are generous and provide "virtual sailings" to those of us who cannot join them onboard.  

 

I hope that everything will work out for your September Endeavor sailing.    

Thanks! I get my first shot tomorrow, and the second was automatically scheduled for July. My Better Half is waiting for the next drop in the age bracket here in York Region, which I hope will be this week, to get her first shot. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Roland4 said:

Keep in mind TICO only covers "end supplier failure" for airlines and cruise lines. It is not blanket coverage.

Thank you! I was aware but it never hurts to have clarification.  

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Forum Jump
    • Categories
      • Thank You for 25 Years - Click for Fun Stuff!
      • Forum Assistance
      • ANNOUNCEMENT: American Queen Steamboat Company
      • ICYM Our Cruise Critic Live Special Event: Explore the Remote World with Hurtigruten!
      • New Cruisers
      • Cruise Lines “A – O”
      • Cruise Lines “P – Z”
      • River Cruising
      • ROLL CALLS
      • Digital Photography & Cruise Technology
      • Special Interest Cruising
      • Cruise Discussion Topics
      • UK Cruising
      • Australia & New Zealand Cruisers
      • Canadian Cruisers
      • North American Homeports
      • Ports of Call
      • Cruise Conversations
×
×
  • Create New...