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Antigua, Bahamas, and Greece to be put on State Department


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4 hours ago, bitob said:

I wonder if Crystal is now getting cancellations

 

So how and when will you make your decision on whether or not to proceed?

At least this has become an issue with the CDC advisory before the cancellation penalties kick in

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5 hours ago, BWIVince said:


Since when?  Mild and moderate infections are still possible with most vaccines, especially with the Brazilian and South African variants circulating in the US and other countries.

 

Vince

I’m speaking to risk of COVID, which is the illness caused by the virus.  With vaccines, it is reduced to the equivalent of the common cold. And that’s with the variants too. 
 

Our biggest issue ahead is vaccine hesitancy and I can’t think of anything more effective at keeping it way high than this persistent message of “but we can’t be 100% certain vaccines really protect in all cases, under all circumstances”. 

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12 hours ago, bitob said:

We are somewhat fearless

But this is really scary

 

What is it about the Bahamas that makes it a level 4 (like India?)

It is only because Crystal is going to sail there?


How about Royal Caribbean? Way more people!

 

But now that we see 80% of the world’s countries, we get the broader picture.

 

I wonder how this affects trip insurance.

 

And how much it has to do with the potential for variants.

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Per the State Department's April 19 travel advisory update found here (https://travel.state.gov/content/dam/NEWTravelAssets/pdfs/Travel%20Advisory%20Update%20-%20%20Frequently%20Asked%20Questions_.pdf)

 

"After this update, approximately 80% of countries will have a Travel Advisory Level of 4: Do Not Travel. This does not necessarily indicate a change to the current health situation in a given country. It reflects an adjustment in our system to give more weight to CDC's existing assessments.

 

Soooo, is anyone else less than convinced this means ANYTHING coming shortly after the pressure on the CDC not to kill the cruise industry in the US?  

 

To me, and granted I'm just guessing here, this says "We, the CDC, don't want to be hung out to dry alone on killing the cruise industry (not to mention having given conflicting information for a year). We're going to get other governmental agencies to mimic our position to make it look like it's not just us, but really it's just them piling on to what we say." 

 

 

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I immediately see some anomalies in the CDC list that Keith posted. Why is Israel, with 2 cases per 100,000, at a Level 4 while the BVI’s are a Level 1, with 4 cases per 100,000.

 

Interesting too, South Africa with its dreaded variant, currently has 2 cases per 100,000. What happened there?  It wasn’t vaccines. 

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And for what it's worth, I never felt that the vaccines were 100% guaranteed to prevent Covid. I think anyone who did was not paying attention.  They do reduce the chances of getting it, and reduce the severity of the illness in most people if they do catch it.

 

I believe that if we look at the stats on Covid for the last few weeks (and we have to look at statistics on a rolling basis, combining them with pre-vaccination stats is misleading, but what many news outlets are doing), and then think about how we, the CDC and the government at large would respond to a new strain of flu with those stats  - we would, at best see a report on an inner page of a newspaper saying "New but mild strain of flu out. Drug companies promise it will be included in the 2021 fall flu shots."  The "if it bleeds, it leads" type papers wouldn't even report on it. 

 

People have always died from the various flu varieties. 

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This is the issue with this virus and the world today - things are and will change. Better to be informed than for government and others to hide anything and suffer the results.

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Posted (edited)
29 minutes ago, SuitCaseBears said:

And for what it's worth, I never felt that the vaccines were 100% guaranteed to prevent Covid. I think anyone who did was not paying attention.  They do reduce the chances of getting it, and reduce the severity of the illness in most people if they do catch it.

 

I believe that if we look at the stats on Covid for the last few weeks (and we have to look at statistics on a rolling basis, combining them with pre-vaccination stats is misleading, but what many news outlets are doing), and then think about how we, the CDC and the government at large would respond to a new strain of flu with those stats  - we would, at best see a report on an inner page of a newspaper saying "New but mild strain of flu out. Drug companies promise it will be included in the 2021 fall flu shots."  The "if it bleeds, it leads" type papers wouldn't even report on it. 

 

People have always died from the various flu varieties. 

The vaccines have far exceeded my expectations, in terms of efficacy (including against variants). Truly miraculous. That said, they are also a brand new vaccine, and still under a EUA. That’s going to give a lot of people pause to get it, especially certain populations. I have one example in my own family. We have all been fully vaccinated, including my mid 30’s sons and DIL’s. My daughter is 27, and she has natural immunity, having had COVID already. Fortunately, her case consisted of the sniffles. Milder than a mild cold. She’s worried about long term effects on fertility. And of course science has no answers for this, because they can’t know the long term effects yet. She doesn’t want to get the vaccine as the risk outweighs any benefit. 
 

I think because we had such enormous pent up demand for these miraculous vaccines, we haven’t had to truly face the hesitancy yet. But we are going to very quickly find out that the next phase of vaccine roll out is going to be difficult, and the public health messaging has created a mess. 

Edited by sierrafloridacruiser
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5 hours ago, bitob said:

I wonder if Crystal is now getting cancellations 

 

I am concerned about the statistics I am seeing in the Bahamas 

Today in the Bahamas there is 1 new case out of every 2480 people. That's higher than even here in FL where today it's 1 new case out of every 4237 people. 

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1 hour ago, FlyerTalker said:

 

With a survival rate of over 99.5%.

 

Enough with the hyperbole. 

 

 

And what about the 1/3 to 1/2 of the people who had covid and now have chronic conditions related to covid? Or don't those people count?

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1 hour ago, Stickman1990 said:

 

So how and when will you make your decision on whether or not to proceed?

At least this has become an issue with the CDC advisory before the cancellation penalties kick in

I am considering cancelling.  I just do not know.  I am on the July 10/17 voyages.  I have a little time.  Not worth the risk for place I really have no interest in going to

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59 minutes ago, sierrafloridacruiser said:

I immediately see some anomalies in the CDC list that Keith posted. Why is Israel, with 2 cases per 100,000, at a Level 4 while the BVI’s are a Level 1, with 4 cases per 100,000.

 

Interesting too, South Africa with its dreaded variant, currently has 2 cases per 100,000. What happened there?  It wasn’t vaccines. 

Remember the CDC is presently in the process this week of updating this list so I expect you will see changes.

 

Keith

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The biggest issue right now is getting as many people vaccinated as possible.  Right now the USA is at around 50% 18 or older with one vaccination about only one third who are fully vaccinated.  This is the latest from the CDC which I look at daily,

 

https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#vaccinations

 

The challenge is in certain locations vaccine availability is great than demand and that is a problem.  We need as many people to get the vaccine as possible.

 

As to the vaccine, the chance of getting severe symptoms, ending up in the hospital or worse yet dying is very low with the vaccine.  In fact, if you get the vaccine the chance of being hospitalized or dying is very low as the statistics point out.  So that is the good news.

 

However, we have a lot of people in the USA and a lot more in the rest of the world who have not been vaccinated.  This is a pandemic and we won't get out of it until people get vaccinated and even when they do get vaccinated for the time being wearing masks indoors and socially distancing and washing hands often and thoroughly until the CDC says otherwise.

 

I am sure many of you see first hand people not doing these things whether not wearing a mask when they should or some (not a lot but some) wearing the mask incorrectly.  I don't get this wearing the mask below your nose. When you get the COVID-19 test they swab your nose. Why?  Because that is where the germs hang out so wearing you mask below your nose is just stupid.  I get it.  Some don't want to wear the mask and some have trouble breathing but with all do respect if you have trouble breathing than don't go to the store.  Get delivery.

 

Anyway, COVID-19 and its spread is not stagnant nor will the travel advisories and other such things be stagnant.  

 

Keith

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16 minutes ago, sierrafloridacruiser said:

It says updated April 19th. 

I know but it has been reported updates will continue this week and of course this is not stagnant.

 

Keith

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2 minutes ago, Keith1010 said:

I know but it has been reported updates will continue this week and of course this is not stagnant.

 

Keith

The updates are to the State Department site; the first batch of updates were just posted.

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Posted (edited)

It is amazing that every place the cruises are trying to use to "restart" cruising is at Level 4.

It's almost as if they want to put the cruise lines out of business forever.

 

I think this will have a big impact on bookings -- if I, who wanted to go ANYWHERE, am thinking of cancelling, anyone on the fence is there too.  Those of us who are older and more at risk have to think twice.

 

A 21 day cruise to nowhere would have been ideal.  Surely the US Gov cannot put the ocean at Level 4

 

 

Edited by bitob
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1 hour ago, sierrafloridacruiser said:

The vaccines have far exceeded my expectations, in terms of efficacy (including against variants). Truly miraculous. That said, they are also a brand new vaccine, and still under a EUA. That’s going to give a lot of people pause to get it, especially certain populations. I have one example in my own family. We have all been fully vaccinated, including my mid 30’s sons and DIL’s. My daughter is 27, and she has natural immunity, having had COVID already. Fortunately, her case consisted of the sniffles. Milder than a mild cold. She’s worried about long term effects on fertility. And of course science has no answers for this, because they can’t know the long term effects yet. She doesn’t want to get the vaccine as the risk outweighs any benefit. 
 

I think because we had such enormous pent up demand for these miraculous vaccines, we haven’t had to truly face the hesitancy yet. But we are going to very quickly find out that the next phase of vaccine roll out is going to be difficult, and the public health messaging has created a mess. 

Interesting that natural,(or acquired) immunity is discounted. New study on victims of SARS shows that the natural immunity is still in effect after 17 years. It's the same virus (SARS COV-2) and should qualify as well as "vaccinated". 

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18 minutes ago, suzeluvscruz said:

Interesting that natural,(or acquired) immunity is discounted. New study on victims of SARS shows that the natural immunity is still in effect after 17 years. It's the same virus (SARS COV-2) and should qualify as well as "vaccinated". 

It’s been bizarre to see our public health officials greatly downplay acquired immunity, to the point of prioritizing vaccines for those with acquired immunity over those without any immunity. 

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12 minutes ago, sierrafloridacruiser said:

It’s been bizarre to see our public health officials greatly downplay acquired immunity, to the point of prioritizing vaccines for those with acquired immunity over those without any immunity. 

 

...which could be dangerous for those who already have immunity!

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