The two faces of the CDC: Wednesday vs. Thursday

[ramja96]

I realize this topic has the potential (or likelihood) to turn volatile, so I ask everyone to keep comments civil and respect others' opinions.

 

I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around the 180 degree turn the CDC did between Wednesday's cruising guidelines, and their announcement the very next day for the general public.  Their requirements that must be followed in order to reopen cruises in the USA are (in my opinion) nearly impossible to follow in some instances: requiring people - vaccinated AND unvaccinated - to keep their masks on while eating and drinking, dropping them only to take a bite/sip, and promptly putting them back in place is the first rule that comes to mind - good luck if you ordered soup for your appetizer. But also saying that vaccinated passengers don't need masks outside unless in a crowded area (apparently, they've never been on a cruise ship😂). Then, the very next day they come out saying that "anyone who is fully vaccinated can participate in indoor and outdoor activities -- large or small -- without wearing a mask or physical distancing."  So, what changed in 24 hours? Can we expect the CDC to change their requirements to the cruise industry later today? I'm confused.

[ticketsunlimited]

C- Cant

D- Decide

C- comeback later

[cruzsnooze]

Data gets analyzed daily and competent people re evaluate based on the new data. Science changes and scientists revise the need for restrictions. Thank goodness we have a CDC. A BIG thank you to  knowledgeable epidemiologist as Dr Fauci who follows the science not the politics. 

Edited May 14, 2021 by cruzsnooze

[boatseller]

Just now, cruzsnooze said:

Data gets analyzed daily and competent people re evaluate based on the new data. Science changes and scientists revise the need for restrictions. Thank goodness we have a CDC. 

Examples?  Florida and other States made data based policy months before the CDC even recogized the possibility.  Their 'science' is waiting on smarter people to prove something then try to take the credit.  Sorry, not going to happen.

[ramja96]

6 minutes ago, cruzsnooze said:

A BIG thank you to  knowledgeable epidemiologist as Dr Fauci who follows the science not the politics. 

 

Thank you for your point of view - but I respectfully disagree.  I think Fauci has changed his advice more than the wind changes direction, and has created a LOT of confusion over the past 1+ year. Just my opinion.

[ONECRUISER]

6 minutes ago, boatseller said:

Examples?  Florida and other States made data based policy months before the CDC even recogized the possibility.  Their 'science' is waiting on smarter people to prove something then try to take the credit.  Sorry, not going to happen.

Agree Much of Reports/Science CDC used to make changes were out the 1st week of April and some info about outdoors safety was available in 2020 and never changed. Good People work there but like everywhere all is now Political. 

Edited May 14, 2021 by ONECRUISER

[cruzsnooze]

https://www.aol.com/lifestyle/science-convinced-cdc-lift-mask-230753083.html

[boatseller]

2 minutes ago, cruzsnooze said:

https://www.aol.com/lifestyle/science-convinced-cdc-lift-mask-230753083.html

Thank you for that great example of reactive retro-guidance.  Now that Florida, Texas and other States have proven face coverings are...ineffective, the CDC declare the same without risk of embarrassing themselves even further.  Exactly how I said it worked.

[smokeybandit]

31 minutes ago, cruzsnooze said:

Data gets analyzed daily and competent people re evaluate based on the new data. Science changes and scientists revise the need for restrictions. Thank goodness we have a CDC. A BIG thank you to  knowledgeable epidemiologist as Dr Fauci who follows the science not the politics. 

The "new data" these changes are being based on is months old.

[ramja96]

Just now, smokeybandit said:

The "new data" these changes are being based on is months old.

 

BINGO!!

[Ubiquitous Cruiser]

To the question of the OP, the revised mask(less) guidelines for vaccinated people excludes those in congregant settings (shelters, hospitals, prisons, etc.) & IMO the CDC considers cruise ships a congregant setting, which means the mask(less) guidelines do not apply to cruise ships.

 

Not that I agree with such a designation ... 

[MommaBear55]

35 minutes ago, boatseller said:

Thank you for that great example of reactive retro-guidance.  Now that Florida, Texas and other States have proven face coverings are...ineffective, the CDC declare the same without risk of embarrassing themselves even further.  Exactly how I said it worked.

Please explain to me how Texas and Florida are consistently in the top 5 for new cases over the last month. 

[Tolkmit]

53 minutes ago, cruzsnooze said:

Data gets analyzed daily and competent people re evaluate based on the new data. Science changes and scientists revise the need for restrictions. Thank goodness we have a CDC. A BIG thank you to  knowledgeable epidemiologist as Dr Fauci who follows the science not the politics. 

 

Fauci has openly admitted to basing some decisions on public opinion, aka politics, not science. 

 

The CDC defended it's position in court on cruising AFTER scheduling the press conference where they announced the change in policy for non-cruising. This was not based on new data.

[smokeybandit]

1 minute ago, MommaBear55 said:

Please explain to me how Texas and Florida are consistently in the top 5 for new cases over the last month. 

Because they're in the top 5 for population? Just a guess.

[ramja96]

4 minutes ago, MommaBear55 said:

Please explain to me how Texas and Florida are consistently in the top 5 for new cases over the last month. 

 

Possibly because they are among the most populated states? Are their numbers calculated based on per capita figures, or straight figures. Big difference.

Edited May 14, 2021 by ramja96

[boatseller]

1 minute ago, MommaBear55 said:

Please explain to me how Texas and Florida are consistently in the top 5 for new cases over the last month. 

Number of cases has always been an irrelevant statistic because it does not indicate prevalance or outcome.

 

There are numerous reports on how Texas' case count dropped after ending the mask mandate.  Florida's theme parks have been open for almost a year with no correlated increase in cases.  Texas and Florida are also #2 & 3 in population so a higher case count is expected.

[xpcdoojk]

1 hour ago, MommaBear55 said:

Please explain to me how Texas and Florida are consistently in the top 5 for new cases over the last month. 

Um.... two of the 5 largest states by population.  According to “The Google”.  California is 1, Texas is 2, Florida is 3, New York is 4, Pennsylvania is 5, and is less than half as populous as is Texas.  So, it would be absolutely shocking if they were not in the top 5.  

 

Step away from the TV the voices coming from it are dangerous. 😉

[jean87510]

Hey as long as 1. my next cruise on grandeur in Feb 2022 out of Barbados goes, 2.  no masks onboard and 3. no mandatory ship excursions, I personally don't give a rats ---- what the CDC says.  I personally have not kept up with their mandates ever since the double mask nonsense and "I predict masks until next year..." moving goal posts Dr. Fauci.  I am an adult and do not need to be herded by the CDC.

[jstraw20]

Other than stirring the pot I see absolutely no point to this thread.

[crazyank]

3 hours ago, boatseller said:

It's very simple.  The Center for Dumb Cruise Protocols is comprised of generally incompetent bureaucrats that are basically making it up as they go.

 

3 hours ago, boatseller said:

They have been reactivly relenting on every front because their biggest fear is no one will believe them the next time*.  Every bit of new guidance is basically what everyone is already doing.  

 

3 hours ago, boatseller said:

The reason cruising is being treated differently is because they are callous power mongers with only cruising to lord themselves over.  The worst kinds of people to have any power.

 

There is no data or even 'science' behind their actions.  It's just personal pettyness and ignorance.

 

Cruising has been happing for months other places and nothing.  They don't care.

Florida has pretty much ignored them and nothing.  They don't care.

Peoples livelihoods are shattered to nothing.  They don't care.

They all have their jobs, they're all getting paid and as long as the 'pandemic' exists, they're in the spotlight.  That's what they care about.

Best description of the CDC I've seen yet.

[DirtyDawg]

Man, I hope we get back to cruising soon. All these CDC threads with all the amateur internet arm chair virologists yapping away ad infinitum really makes me miss those amateur internet arm chair lawyer threads of the past. 😉

 

[Pratique]

10 minutes ago, DirtyDawg said:

Man, I hope we get back to cruising soon. All these CDC threads with all the amateur internet arm chair virologists yapping away ad infinitum really makes me miss those amateur internet arm chair lawyer threads of the past. 😉

 

Well I'm sure once cruising resumes the critics will start complaining about how the cruise lines are running their ships.

[Joebucks]

4 hours ago, cruzsnooze said:

Data gets analyzed daily and competent people re evaluate based on the new data. Science changes and scientists revise the need for restrictions. Thank goodness we have a CDC. A BIG thank you to  knowledgeable epidemiologist as Dr Fauci who follows the science not the politics. 

 

What is this scientific data that got analyzed and overnight changed the consensus from "masking unless outside and by yourself" to "no masking?"

 

For the record, we went over a year being told to fear water droplets and surfaces. When the latest update is that the virus is mostly spread through aerosol, making both claims obsolete, hence the removal of masks. You don't get to claim "science" and suddenly, the old claims are factual on that basis. 

 

I'm not implying that the CDC intentionally deceived. At worst, I believe they are just overcautious and threw out every mitigation method they knew. Because after all, their job is not enjoyment. It's not mental health. It's not the economy. It's disease control. 

[Joebucks]

30 minutes ago, Pratique said:

Well I'm sure once cruising resumes the critics will start complaining about how the cruise lines are running their ships.

 

Has this ever not been a thing?

[Pratique]

8 minutes ago, Joebucks said:

 

Has this ever not been a thing?

No but it will be a change from the present.