Do you feel cruising right now is worth it?!

[navybankerteacher]

2 hours ago, Hlitner said:

No question that traveling or cruising these days involves an extra element of risk.  We had similar conversations a year ago, a few months ago (before our resumption of cruising) and we will likely have the same conversation a year from now, two years from now, etc.  The obvious solution for your kind of thinking is to forget ever cruising again and look for some safe alternatives such as camping out alone in the woods.  You could also do what many have done and buy a nice RV, fill up the tank with hundreds of dollars of fuel, and drive around the country.  But do not go inside any buildings, restaurants, attractions, etc.  Spend your days camping out (by yourself at substantial distance from other humans) and enjoying the beautiful outdoors.   We actually know a couple that has adopted that lifestyle and they have told us they are having a great time.

 

Hank

You keep missing the point - perhaps because the only recreational travel you seem to be able to consider is on cruise ships.  There ARE alternatives to cruising which do not require isolating in an RV or hiding out in the woods. Yes, they involve some interaction and some slight risk of infection - which are acceptable if one is vaccinated and boosted.  The problem with cruising now is the existence of protocols which remove the interaction which was a significant part of the value of cruising, the virtually continuous masking, etc   — but primarily the risk of last minute complete cancellation of itineraries and the modification/termination of existing itinerary and increased risk of quarantining.  Right now much of the enjoyment of cruising has been withdrawn and tangential downsides - which do not exist in connection with other sorts of travel - have been added.

 

I do not believe the situation will last forever - but at present there are preferable options.

[Hlitner]

5 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

Yes, I guess it was rhetorical and I did not expect a real answer. Thank you for your best wishes for my brother in law.

 

Actually DW is not crying at the moment as she is painting and concentrating on that.

 

I listen to stuff like this to help with anxiety. (Lots of good ones on playing for change, but this particular one has cruise ships,)

 

(Sittin' On) The Dock of the Bay feat. Jack Johnson | Otis Redding 50th Anniversary - YouTube

 

Do we suffer COVID Anxiety?  Lets put it this way.  When DW and I decided to spend last winter in Puerto Vallarta (where COVID was a big problem) we "had no worries" but did purchase a special million dollar medical policy for that trip :).  I think you could say we were hedging our bet :).  On the other hand, DW and I did not lose much sleep over our decision (i.e. risk tolerance).  If one of us had become very ill (or even died) in Mexico there were plenty of folks waiting to say "I told you so."   All of us are making tough decisions every day when even going to the Supermarket can be risking one's life.  

 

Hank

[Flatbush Flyer]

Want a safe land trip? Island of Kauai (stay at the Grand Hyatt- Poipu) + fly United. We were there in September - extreme pre-trip requirements and restrictions while there. But mere inconveniences when faced with the alternative of yet another staycation.

TICK TICK TICK.....

[Hlitner]

4 minutes ago, navybankerteacher said:

You keep missing the point - perhaps because the only recreational travel you seem to be able to consider is on cruise ships.  There ARE alternatives to cruising which do not require isolating in an RV or hiding out in the woods. Yes, they involve some interaction and some slight risk of infection - which are acceptable if one is vaccinated and boosted.  The problem with cruising now is the existence of protocols which remove the interaction which was a significant part of the value of cruising, the virtually continuous masking, etc   — but primarily the risk of last minute complete cancellation of itineraries and the modification/termination of existing itinerary and increased risk of quarantining.  Right now much of the enjoyment of cruising has been withdrawn and tangential downsides - which do not exist in connection with other sorts of travel - have been added.

 

I do not believe the situation will last forever - but at present there are preferable options.

My goodness do you have that wrong.  In fact we will soon be off to our winter home in Mexico where we stay 10 weeks.  Soon thereafter we hope to take a transatlantic cruise to Europe where we hope to spend at least 3 weeks on land (using air, rail, and rental car) to explore several countries.   We are certainly avid and addicted world travelers, but while cruising is one important facet it generally represents less than half our International travel days.  

 

I will disagree with your comment about "much of the enjoyment of cruising" being withdrawn.  That does seem to represent your attitude and the attitude of many folks.  But there are also many other folks who have been traveling and cruising and enjoying themselves.  We make no secret that we have cruised 48 days since August and loved every day!  All the other passengers we met seemed to share that same general feeling as did the crew.  In 2021 we also spent land time in Greece, Barbados, and South Carolina and enjoyed every day of every trip.  No question that there are some downsides to travel/cruising today, but we have found the upside to be far more prevalent. 

 

Hank

[George C]

We done two cruises this year and have two scheduled next year, I love being on a cruise ship , if a port is canceled, fine, I love sea days. We book suites and love to be spoiled, love all the entertainment in one area , no driving, we have had our Covid shots and booster and we are ready to sail. 

[lenquixote66]

4 hours ago, ontheweb said:

Please help me explain to DW why she should not be anxious.

 

Last Friday we learned that her younger brother, 6 days after his booster shot, was in the ICU with Covid pneumonia. Last night we learned that he has taken a turn for the worse. 

 

How do I get her to not cry constantly?

So sorry to read this.Wishing your BIL a complete recovery.

[K32682]

A cruise where you are not allowed port visits is just a nicer version of quarantine. No thanks. 

[Mary229]

I have done land travel both in 2020 and 2021.  Many of the same precautions people mention about cruising are in place on land also.  Mask wearing is not exclusively for tourists! Limited meal options are everywhere. And lack of service employees is everywhere.  So, as always, you have to choose where you want to be, at home or traveling 
 

  I will cruise and I will choose wisely.  

 

[dreamercruise]

Staying onboard a ship that is not allowed port visits is a better situation than being forced to disembark, quarantine in a hostel (of no choice), and when you are cleared to fly, figure out how to arrange for a last-minute flight back.

Any amount of insurance for emergency medical and medical evacuation would not help the situation of quarantine on foreign land, especially where resources and facilities are limited.

To answer OP’s question - probably not, given so many recent Covid cases detected before boarding and within 2-3 days of boarding in current sailings.

[ldubs]

Right now, with all the restrictions happening, I do not think it is worth it.  Don't get me wrong, I like being on a cruise ship.  But, I don't like the ship atmosphere I'm currently reading about.  

 

We have two cruises scheduled for next year.  The earlier of the two has a final pmt date in January.  Unless a miracle cure happens, we will likely cancel that cruise.  I expect that we will cancel the August cruise as well.  Instead of those two cruises we will do self guided land trips where we have more control over distancing & exposure, not to mention itinerary.   

 

Hiding at home is not the only alternative to cruising.   

[donaldsc]

Simple one word answer as far as I am concerned - NO!

 

DON

[ilikeanswers]

6 hours ago, Hlitner said:

I will disagree with your comment about "much of the enjoyment of cruising" being withdrawn.  That does seem to represent your attitude and the attitude of many folks.  

 

A lot of that talk reminds of pre covid cruising threads that complained cruising is not like the "good old days" (IIRC I think there is a sub forum dedicated to the topic🤔?). In a way nothing has really changed except for the changes we are complaining about😂. 

[navybankerteacher]

6 hours ago, Hlitner said:

…

 

I will disagree with your comment about "much of the enjoyment of cruising" being withdrawn.  That does seem to represent your attitude and the attitude of many folks. …

 

Hank

I think that having to wear masks virtually full time, not being able to enjoy a dinner conversation with a group of new acquaintances, or having to keep distance from other passengers, or not being able to go ashore in a port of call on ones own (or having desired ports of call cancelled altogether), and risking truncation or termination of anticipated itineraries all represent withdrawals of “…much of the enjoyment of cruising…”.  
 

Yes, it would still be nice to see a sunrise at sea — but losing so many of the small facets which made cruising good  sure as hell does represent precisely that loss.

 

Because you seem to feel that being on a cruise ship is good regardless of the limitations and conditions currently imposed - I am happy for you - but I feel that as we seem to have very different standards, I see little value in continuing this conversation.

 

Happy sailing.

[lissie]

10 hours ago, Markanddonna said:

I am shifting my thinking to last minute travel that is more prepackaged. My latest are those land tours in Europe and Israel that I have generally avoided since I am generally an independent spirit. If there is room on the tour, I can book it since I have little or no planning to tackle. I usually am able to plan out travel that is tailor made to my interests and budget. That may be ancient history.

Or you could just  book a flight - have a rough idea of where you want to go and see and book as you go. In fact that worked perfectly OK for us for our last decent oversees land trip in 2018 (Borneo and the Philippines). I generally booked  a day or 2 ahead. Booked internal flights less than a week ahead.  Turned up and ferry ports and bus stations and got on the next available. 

[lissie]

On 12/29/2021 at 8:47 AM, NantahalaCruiser said:

We have an Alaskan cruise from Seward to Vancouver booked for next July.

 

Even though we both have our regular 2 shots of COVID vaccine plus a booster, we have a concern regarding the low but possible chance that our COVID test 2-days prior to boarding might turn positive.  If that were to happen, we would not be allowed to board and would be stranded in Seward for several days of quarantine in who knows what facility!

 

Thus we will probably decide to cancel the cruise before final payment and not cruise again from a remote port of embarkation until pre-boarding testing is no longer required.

I'm sorry but how is Seward remote? Its not even in a different country from you?  Its only 2 hours from Anchorage ? I'm assuming that Anchorage has good quality hospitals? 

 

You'd be quarantined in a hotel for a few days. You'd get a  negative test and continue on by either rebooking on a different cruise or flying home.  Or combining flights and ferries all the way to Vancouver. 

 

We have a cruise in July too (not Alaska) - I'm happy starting to plan on how to get to SF and what to do before and after the cruise. But I also have options if the cruise doesn't sail. If we can't be on it for whatever reason I can think of options for that too 

[Hlitner]

9 minutes ago, navybankerteacher said:

I think that having to wear masks virtually full time, not being able to enjoy a dinner conversation with a group of new acquaintances, or having to keep distance from other passengers, or not being able to go ashore in a port of call on ones own (or having desired ports of call cancelled altogether), and risking truncation or termination of anticipated itineraries all represent withdrawals of “…much of the enjoyment of cruising…”.  
 

Yes, it would still be nice to see a sunrise at sea — but losing so many of the small facets which made cruising good  sure as hell does represent precisely that loss.

 

Because you seem to feel that being on a cruise ship is good regardless of the limitations and conditions currently imposed - I am happy for you - but I feel that as we seem to have very different standards, I see little value in continuing this conversation.

 

Happy sailing.

So let me put some reality to what you have posted based on our three recent cruises.  Two of the three cruises (Seabourn Ovation in Greece and the Enchanted Princess in the Caribbean had few port restrictions.  In fact, in Greece we had no port restrictions anywhere other than following local protocols which often called for masking indoors.  In addition we easily spent another week in Greece island hopping (via ferries) on our own. 

 

On our 20 days cruising on the Enchanted Princess we were able to go ashore independently in all of our ports except for Dominica, Barbados, and St Lucia.  On our third cruise (Seabourn Odyssey out of Barbados) all the ports were restricted to cruise line excursions.  But three of our port days were fantastic fun when we had beach parties (including things like the famous SB Caviar in the Surf).   Other ports offered some decent excursions and we did sometimes compromise (we normally dislike excursions) in order to take an excursion.  But as a result we had an absolute ball on St Maarten where because we had to take an excursion (to go ashore) we discovered Rhino Riders.  On all three cruises (totally 48 days) we did not have a single missed or cancelled port!  

 

You are definitely right about being concerned about the risk of truncation or even termination (although that has become somewhat rare with the newer protocols).   We expect that risk to continue for many years and one could make a case to avoid cruises and simply take land trips.  But if your land trips are structured tours you also run the risk of truncation and cancellation.  Our norm for land travel is to independently do our own thing which allows us to quickly adjust our own itinerary depending on circumstances such as restrictions, weather, etc.  So, for example, although we had not originally planned on going to Greece last summer we quickly adjusted (and even booked a cruise) once we saw that the Greek Government was determined to open up to tourists.

 

 I actually think that land tour and River Cruises are higher risk than Ocean Cruises since the Ocean cruises often have more ability to change an itinerary.  On our next cruise from Miami to Monte Carlo there are two scheduled stops in North Africa (places we have been a few times) and we would be very happy if those ports were replaced by other ports on the European side of the Med.  But we are adventurous travelers and will adjust to most changes without much protest.  On the other hand, when a cruise line vastly changes a cruise such as happened with our recent Oceania booking we simply cancelled that cruise (with a full refund) and booked the Princess cruise that turned out to be lots of fun.  

 

My message to those who want to travel in this new normal is to learn how to be flexible and somewhat independent.  So, for example, while planning a very possible spring trip that includes Europe we have currently allowed a little more then 3 weeks within Europe without actually nailing down a definite itinerary.  We will eventually book some hotels but will keep them refundable so we have the ability to change our plans if that becomes necessary.  So, for example, if Austria is closed because of COVID we would simply skip that country and substitute another country that is open.  Our biggest risk would be if everything is closed but that is a risk we can accept.  If the situation really looks awful, then we would cancel and find somewhere else to visit.

 

Folks that only feel comfortable on specific itineraries (without changes) or taking organized land tours or river boat voyages should have more concern.  When a river boat that is going from Point A to B to C cannot go to Point B.. it will likely need to cancel the entire trip.  Likewise, when you take a structured land tour to certain countries (such as France and Italy) you would likely find that land tour cancelled if either country was closed or too restricted.  But an independent traveler planning a land trip to France and Italy and finding that Italy is closed might easily change their plans to simply stay in France or perhaps do France and Spain.   Bottom line is that while independence also can mean flexibility, structure often means cancellation in these new times.    Even independent travelers face challenges in this new normal and there are not always viable solutions.  But the travel odds favor those who are willing to try while there are zero odds for those who simply stay at home. Like always, folks get to make their own choices and do what is best for themselves.

 

Hank

[gerryuk]

6 hours ago, Hlitner said:

So let me put some reality to what you have posted based on our three recent cruises. 

 

Hank

If you have not been on a cruise in the last 3 weeks, things have changed dramatically, and not for the better. I have a cruise in March from Dubai to Rome with final payment due in a couple of weeks, i will not be making final payment. I have Med cruise in September i will wait and see what happens closer to time. You can test all you want, but recent events on RCI and other ships tells me to steer clear for now and wait this out. 

[Flatbush Flyer]

6 hours ago, lissie said:

I'm sorry but how is Seward remote? Its not even in a different country from you?  Its only 2 hours from Anchorage ? I'm assuming that Anchorage has good quality hospitals? 

 

You'd be quarantined in a hotel for a few days. You'd get a  negative test and continue on by either rebooking on a different cruise or flying home.  Or combining flights and ferries all the way to Vancouver. 

 

We have a cruise in July too (not Alaska) - I'm happy starting to plan on how to get to SF and what to do before and after the cruise. But I also have options if the cruise doesn't sail. If we can't be on it for whatever reason I can think of options for that too 

SF land options? Get a car and drive the 3 hours north to Mendocino County (US 1 for the drop-dead-gorgeous coast route or 101 for the faster route that also takes you on Hwy 128 through the redwoods. Stay (and dine) at the Albion River Inn, do a little wine tasting around Phylo, eat at Macallum House in Mendocino....

[Mary229]

To add some reality, those who are nervous should stay home, it will make it easier for everyone else.  Be thankful others are willing to be pioneers in the new era of travel and leave them alone.  We don't need to be nagged after we have made a reasoned decision based on  research and personal circumstances.

 

There were other times in history people ventured where others were nervous.  When the wall fell some rushed into East Germany and the USSR before there were any "tour guides" and other systems in place.  My parents were one of them, they had a great time.  

[Hlitner]

3 hours ago, gerryuk said:

If you have not been on a cruise in the last 3 weeks, things have changed dramatically, and not for the better. I have a cruise in March from Dubai to Rome with final payment due in a couple of weeks, i will not be making final payment. I have Med cruise in September i will wait and see what happens closer to time. You can test all you want, but recent events on RCI and other ships tells me to steer clear for now and wait this out. 

We had been on a 20 day cruise (20 days on the Enchanted Princess) until this past Monday.  There were about 1800 other cruisers on our ship which is about 55% of capacity.  Our particular voyage, which included many Caribbean ports, successfully made all ports and we were not made aware of any COVID cases aboard.  In retrospect, after watching the recent crews news and knowing about the Covid surge in the USA, we were pretty lucky :).

 

Nobody has a good answer to the COVID problem on ships.  I have little doubt that Princess (and most other lines) are doing just about everything reasonable to mitigate COVID onboard their ships.  I have posted elsewhere that the Enchanted Princess had a mask mandate (indoors in public areas) and encouraged "sip and cover" in the more crowded venues.  Elevators had signs to maintain capacity at no more than 6 persons.   Most (not all) passengers seemed to go along with the rules although we never saw any member of the crew making an attempt to enforce the rules other then the usual PA announcements.  

 

If I lived in the UK or the EU and was thinking of a Caribbean cruise from Florida ports, I would also cancel.  Given the time and cost of just getting from the UK to the USA (not to mention the current travel hassles) it makes little sense to take the gamble.  For those of us here in the USA with relatively easy access to the Florida ports it becomes a more difficult decision.  Our next cruise is not until late March (a repositioning cruise to Europe) and we are moving ahead with our plans (and cruise) but will do our best to keep all reservations (hotels, air, rental cars, etc) cancellable.   I will also say that the current situation will likely change by the Spring (have no clue whether it will be for the better or worse) and we will do our best to "roll with the waves."

 

We would have no hesitation in booking a Med cruise for next September :).  On the other hand, we do not live in the UK where the government has some history of imposing very tough restrictions.

 

Hank

 

 

[Markanddonna]

3 hours ago, gerryuk said:

If you have not been on a cruise in the last 3 weeks, things have changed dramatically, and not for the better. I have a cruise in March from Dubai to Rome with final payment due in a couple of weeks, i will not be making final payment. I have Med cruise in September i will wait and see what happens closer to time. You can test all you want, but recent events on RCI and other ships tells me to steer clear for now and wait this out. 

Exactly right.  I'm getting a bit tired of the lectures from those who had reasonably normal cruises in the past year. Even though a few are very seasoned cruisers and travelers, their experiences are really irrelevant to what is going on now:

 

- Elimination of most or all ports of call at a moment's notice

- Theaters closed or programming cut back

- Crew members coming down with COVID despite being 100% vaxxed

- New variant that doesn't seem to show up positive on many tests

- Children's areas closed

- Canceling all or many of the activities

- Cutting back or eliminating some specialty dining or MDR breakfast and lunches

- Canceling private island

- Current airline issues with cancelations

- Difficulty for some finding a testing location pre-cruise

- A good chance of catching COVID considering how it has broken through the vaxxed populations. 

 

The above list applies to some cruises, not all but the scene on cruise ships seems to be going downhill fast. The above is not the "new normal" but a short term situation that most people do not want to endure. 

 

I want to thank those of you who are currently on the ships letting us know what is going on. YOUR info is crucial for those of us with a cruise coming up in the next few weeks.

[cruisemom42]

2 hours ago, Mary229 said:

To add some reality, those who are nervous should stay home, it will make it easier for everyone else.  Be thankful others are willing to be pioneers in the new era of travel and leave them alone.  We don't need to be nagged after we have made a reasoned decision based on  research and personal circumstances.

 

I don't think anyone is naysaying those travelers. I rather think it is the other way around!  Those not wishing to travel are repeatedly called "nervous" and are told we need to stop "hiding in our basements".

 

I am absolutely fine with those who want to travel now, as long as they are willing to comply with all of the requirements made of them. But not everyone is okay with the type of travel Hank describes, e.g., just "going with the flow".  I have specific goals that I look to achieve when traveling, whereas he just travels to be traveling (at least that's the impression left). Some of the reasons this style wouldn't work for me include:

 

• Potential for major changes in itineraries, e.g., having to change a land-trip from Italy to France. I research destinations far in advance and make specific plans to visit sites, some of which require specific reservations and pre-payment.
• Limited port selections:  I would not be happy doing a cruise to the Greek isles only -- yes, all ports may have been reached, but the selection of ports to start with was extremely limited. 
• Concerns about quarantine while traveling ex-US:  Not everyone is retired, and my company would not be thrilled to hear that I have to quarantine somewhere, likely a foreign country, for a period of a week or longer in addition to the time already taken off.
• Dining alone (specific to cruising) -- I cruise solo, and I do not want to eat by myself for a period of time longer than a few days. As of right now, most lines are not allowing shared tables.

I did take a cruise in August, to Alaska, so I am not a quivering heap of jelly. I enjoyed the onboard experience, but it was more or less a one-off as I traveled with DS and we made the best of it. I have little or no interest in most US destinations. 

[sparks1093]

21 hours ago, Hlitner said:

We might call this a rhetorical question and it is sad but we wish the best to your brother-in-law.  We also know a few folks who have contracted COVID (thought to be the Omicron Variant) despite being fully vaccinated.   As I have stressed, we each have our own level of risk tolerance and it has become all too easy to find things about which to be anxious.

 

Hank

And risk tolerance has no correlation to intelligence, it's simply a matter of what one will tolerate after considering everything (and yes, different people are going to focus on different aspects of any given situation and some will even jump without looking at all). We've done what we can to reduce our risk and will live life as best we can, including travel. 

[bthomas67wagon]

@HateCruising - Yikes, someone needs a Snickers!! 🤣 

Yes, I think we all know that the Cruise Line holds the deck of cards. Because they are basically blanketed to do what they want. It's not just a small something like some restrictions, but closing down so much of on board activities. Add the outside issues like ports denying access and this is what prompted my question/thoughts. My budget is very limited and I never take vacations, so if I planned something and then 50-75% of the ship was shut down/restricted and then an island says I can't come to shore then why the "heck" am I even taking this chance?! (sorry not trying to rant)

Hopefully this doesn't rub anyone wrong, but to be completely honest, I don't think the Cruise lines are being ethical. I know they don't want to/can't shut down and loose so much money, but instead knowing that COVID and variants are going to be on the ship and people are going to catch it and spread it (denying that would be lying to yourself) and probably knowing that some ports are NOT going to allow access, but still advertise the cruise is going to Aruba, etc, etc... , but pocketing 100% of the $$$ (again sorry not to try and start ranting again) and are "cover" to say, sorry, we are allowed to do this...

@Markanddonna - Holla from Westerville, Ohio as well!!

 

Edited December 30, 2021 by bthomas67wagon

[Glaciers]

On 12/28/2021 at 8:54 PM, cruisemom42 said:

 

Sorry, but I have researched this extensively and Oceania does not offer the kind of in-depth lectures specifically tied to itineraries that some lines feature and that I prefer. And Oceania, no matter how I have priced it, is not even remotely in the same ballpark price-wise for a solo cruiser.

 

Good research. We did an Alaska trip on Oceania a few years ago. The naturalist they had speaking on board appeared to know little about Alaska specifics and more just general knowledge info.  We were approaching a known humpback feeding area and I asked him about it. He didn’t have a clue.