So Much for Honesty!

[OceanDreamin]

Oh I'm so mad!

 

I wrote this lovely letter to the Principal of my 1st grader's school, requesting Independent Study for next week, so the school would still receive funding, and asking the teacher to send home her work, etc.

 

I just heard from the Principal. Los Angeles Unified School District will not authorize Independent Study or excuse her absence because we are going out of the country! If we stayed in the country it would be authorized. So because I was honest about what I was doing (taking a family vacation cruise to Mexico), and not lying and saying it was a work-related thing, which they do excuse, or just calling her in sick every day, she will be considered truant!:eek:

 

I said to the Principal, "So I would have been better off just calling her in sick every day?" The Principal said that with a 5 day absence they require a doctor's note. Well I could take her to school on Monday morning (we drive to the port, and it's only an hour and a half from our home), and then pick her up after an hour or so. She will not be considered absent for that day, thus only a 4 day absence - no doctor's note required.

 

I hate lying, but I just don't understand what the heck the differentiation is between a vacation in the U.S. and a vacation outside of the U.S. If I pulled her out for a week to go to Sea World, Magic Mountain, Disneyland and Universal Studios it would be excused, but a cruise to Catalina and Ensenada is not! I don't get it!!!:confused:

 

Although I am SO tempted to lie, and send her to school for an hour on Monday, and then just call her in sick every day, that would also require telling my DD to lie about where she was ("Mommy canceled the cruise and I got sick and stayed home") - which I just will not do.

 

This just sucks. I will suffer the consequences (the Truant letter), because I know my DD's attendance is otherwise great, and she's a good student, but I'm really angry about being penalized for being honest.

[Kerry's Girls]

I'm curious - what happens when absences are unexcused? What are the consequences of a "truant letter"?

 

So sorry for the circumstance, but enjoy your cruise.

 

Best,

Mia

[sas80]

Send her to school for the hour and a half!

It just seems easier to me....

[OceanDreamin]

I'm curious - what happens when absences are unexcused? What are the consequences of a "truant letter"?

 

So sorry for the circumstance' date=' but enjoy your cruise.

 

Best,

Mia[/quote']

 

I asked that question of the Principal. She said that if there is more than one instance, she will have a meeting with me and DH. If there are repeated truancies, then the School District will have an official hearing, which she (the Principal) attends. She said that she's only had to attend one of those in her career. Presumably repeated truancies can lead to fines, imprisonment (of parents not the kids), and even having the child taken away by Child Protective Services. No, I don't think that is going to happen for me taking her on a 4 night cruise to Mexico - that is just the extreme, if she were chronically truant - which she isn't.

 

Now that I've had a chance to calm down I have thought of a solution. I was iffy about taking DD into Ensenada with me anyway - there really isn't much for her to do there. I was thinking about leaving her in Camp Carnival, and just going into town, doing a little shopping, having a drink or two, and heading back to the ship. With that in mind, I will tell the Principal that I was so concerned about her being considered truant, that I have changed my plans, and am making arrangements for DD to be in a childcare facility for the day that the rest of the family will be visiting Ensenada, and that DD will only be accompanying us to Catalina, not into Ensenada. I know, it's still a lie of omssion, since she WILL be in Mexican waters, and the rule is that she can't leave the country, not can't go to Mexico, but it SOUNDS as if she isn't going to leave the country, doesn't it?

 

It's a stupid rule, and I hate for DD to have a truancy in her records in 1st grade!

[Paleochick]

I asked that question of the Principal. She said that if there is more than one instance, she will have a meeting with me and DH. If there are repeated truancies, then the School District will have an official hearing, which she (the Principal) attends. She said that she's only had to attend one of those in her career. Presumably repeated truancies can lead to fines, imprisonment (of parents not the kids), and even having the child taken away by Child Protective Services. No, I don't think that is going to happen for me taking her on a 4 night cruise to Mexico - that is just the extreme, if she were chronically truant - which she isn't.

 

Now that I've had a chance to calm down I have thought of a solution. I was iffy about taking DD into Ensenada with me anyway - there really isn't much for her to do there. I was thinking about leaving her in Camp Carnival, and just going into town, doing a little shopping, having a drink or two, and heading back to the ship. With that in mind, I will tell the Principal that I was so concerned about her being considered truant, that I have changed my plans, and am making arrangements for DD to be in a childcare facility for the day that the rest of the family will be visiting Ensenada, and that DD will only be accompanying us to Catalina, not into Ensenada. I know, it's still a lie of omssion, since she WILL be in Mexican waters, and the rule is that she can't leave the country, not can't go to Mexico, but it SOUNDS as if she isn't going to leave the country, doesn't it?

 

It's a stupid rule, and I hate for DD to have a truancy in her records in 1st grade!

 

A truancy letter in the first grade...um, I really don't think this letter will follow her to Harvard. As long as you don't plan to make this a frequent thing, I'd say take her on the cruise, tell the truth, and tell her to tell the truth. Take the truancy letter and file it under T in your filing cabinet. It's the last time you'll ever see it. Talk to the teacher directly. Explain that you are going to be receiving a letter, but explain that you'd like to have your daughter do all the missed work. Give the teacher plenty of time to prepare it. Just go and have a good time. This letter will not be a problem unless you are a frequent cruiser to non-American waters. :)

[Fogfog]

Oh I'm so mad!

 

I wrote this lovely letter to the Principal of my 1st grader's school, requesting Independent Study for next week, so the school would still receive funding, and asking the teacher to send home her work, etc.

 

I just heard from the Principal. Los Angeles Unified School District will not authorize Independent Study or excuse her absence because we are going out of the country! If we stayed in the country it would be authorized. So because I was honest about what I was doing (taking a family vacation cruise to Mexico), and not lying and saying it was a work-related thing, which they do excuse, or just calling her in sick every day, she will be considered truant!:eek:

 

I said to the Principal, "So I would have been better off just calling her in sick every day?" The Principal said that with a 5 day absence they require a doctor's note. Well I could take her to school on Monday morning (we drive to the port, and it's only an hour and a half from our home), and then pick her up after an hour or so. She will not be considered absent for that day, thus only a 4 day absence - no doctor's note required.

 

I hate lying, but I just don't understand what the heck the differentiation is between a vacation in the U.S. and a vacation outside of the U.S. If I pulled her out for a week to go to Sea World, Magic Mountain, Disneyland and Universal Studios it would be excused, but a cruise to Catalina and Ensenada is not! I don't get it!!!:confused:

 

Although I am SO tempted to lie, and send her to school for an hour on Monday, and then just call her in sick every day, that would also require telling my DD to lie about where she was ("Mommy canceled the cruise and I got sick and stayed home") - which I just will not do.

 

This just sucks. I will suffer the consequences (the Truant letter), because I know my DD's attendance is otherwise great, and she's a good student, but I'm really angry about being penalized for being honest.

 

This seems insane--since you are talking about a first grader...

 

we have taken our kids out of school--even for as long 5-6 days over the regular break in order to travel for more than 2 weeks...

 

and as 3 months for a mission trip to africa..and took books with us--and a study plan...

 

I say--take her to school for a hour and half...

and enjoy your cruise..have an extra mojito

[CC Help Michell]

Not to add some heat to the fire, but most districts' absentee policy requires that a student be present for half the school day (not just 60-90 minutes), or they are considered absent for the whole day. So it may not matter whether OP's daughter attends school for a little bit on embarkation morning. It sounds like the OP's district is under heavy pressure to improve attendance statistics -- hence the reply you received.

[OceanDreamin]

Thank you everyone for your kind support and suggestions.

 

Tonight is back-to-school night, so I just wrote a letter to the Principal, which I plan on handing to her (or giving to someone in the office to give to her):

 

"Dear Ms. Sxxxxxxx:

 

I was very concerned after our telephone conversation earlier today about ***** being considered Truant for October 15 through the 19th.

 

You indicated to me that ***** cannot be granted Independent Study since we were taking her out of the country.

 

Subsequent to our conversation I contacted our travel agent. Although I cannot cancel my family’s travel plans, I was able to modify them. Accordingly, I have made arrangements for ***** to be looked after in a licensed child care facility for the one day the rest of the family will be in Ensenada, Mexico. ***** will accompany the family on our visit to Catalina Island only, but will not go with us on our excursion into Mexico.

 

In light of the fact that ***** will now only be accompanying the family to Catalina, this meets the LAUSD criterion, and I beg you to please reconsider her for Independent Study, and not mark her truant for next week.

 

Thank you for your kind attention to this matter."

 

I need a Drink of the Day already!:eek:

[cruisead]

Bad News. Once you're out of the three mile limit of the coast of the US, which you'll be soon after leaving the dock, you're officially, and by law, considered out of the United States. You don't have to step on foreign soil to be considered out of the US when you're on a cruise. So keeping her on the ship while in Mexico won't make any difference. You're still out of the USA when you're on a cruise ship.

[mumeof3]

okay I think 1st it is crazy to hold her truant,but I also would not leave my child on the boat while the whole family is off in another country:( ,I would have just took off and have her make up the work since it is only 1st grade now if it were High School thats a different story....

truthully let them right the paper work up unless you plan to do this every year.....and take your daughter with you on the excursion

JMO

[Valmoisy]

I wouldn't worry about the truancy and I wouldn't send her to school for 1 1/2 hours either. As another posted noted, most schools require the student to be present for at least 1/2 the day to be considered there. As far as unexcused absences go, most school districts don't worry about them unless they exceed a certain number of days. In our district the number of days that send up a red flag are 7 within a 6 month period. So unless you plan to take her out of school on another vacation within the next six months you shouldn't worry about it. By the way, I'm on the school committee in my town and I take my daughter out of school for family vacations when necessary.

[Conrycol]

I've never heard of anything so nutty, but then again it is California (OJ got away with it). I have 3 children. The oldest is in the fourth grade. Each year we take him out of school to go on a two week vacation with us. Not out of the US, but who cares about the destination. The teacher gives him work to do and we make sure he does extra reading. The family time he gets on these vacations (things he'll remeber all of his life) more than make up for the lost time in school. I would think your school district has a few more worries than a child on a vacation with his family, especially in the first grade. Go on the cruise, have a great time, and tell the school district what you were doing.

[cruisead]

People, it's called the No Child Left Behind Act, and since so many schools in the country are considered failures according to the act, they have no choice but to get really strict with their policies. If a school or district is on the failure list for two years running, there's heck to pay. School administrators have their hands tied with this. One of the areas considered for failure is attendance. That's why they are becoming more and more strict with attendance. Parents need to be prepared for this because it could be coming to your school. I know a lot of districts are being forced to not allow vacations because of this truancy issue. Some are only allowing three unexcused absences in a semester before there are issues with the child, family and school board. Vacation is not an excused absence and therefore when you take one, it can be considered truancy. And yes, many districts are using fines and jail as a deterrent to truancy.

[kidznp]

I am sure this is the wrong thing to say, but is it not possible to plan vacations when your child is not in school? I do not think pulling a kid of any age out of school for any length of time "for a family vacation" is appropriate or necessary.

 

Getting an education is a child's "job" and as a parent this should be a priority. Even if it means you can't go on vacation during school terms.

 

I am a pediatric nurse practitioner and live in Texas. The school attendance policies here are very strict. Parents get annoyed with me at times when I refuse to provide a "doctor's note" to cover absences (sometimes months beforehand) to keep them out of trouble. I will only excuse school attendance if I have personal knowledge that the child was too sick at a given time to attend school.

[larronry]

I am sure this is the wrong thing to say, but is it not possible to plan vacations when your child is not in school? I do not think pulling a kid of any age out of school for any length of time "for a family vacation" is appropriate or necessary.

 

Getting an education is a child's "job" and as a parent this should be a priority. Even if it means you can't go on vacation during school terms.

 

I am a pediatric nurse practitioner and live in Texas. The school attendance policies here are very strict. Parents get annoyed with me at times when I refuse to provide a "doctor's note" to cover absences (sometimes months beforehand) to keep them out of trouble. I will only excuse school attendance if I have personal knowledge that the child was too sick at a given time to attend school.

I do understand where you are coming from but I think you have to take family circumstances into considerations. I know my neighbor is very upset with her DH's parents because she schedules cruises (she gets them comped) during the school year and her DH sees nothing wrong with pulling their daughter from school who is having problems. This is going to be the second year of that fight.

 

Other issues are that if you work for a company where vacation time is by seniority and you can't get your during school vacation time then your family can never take a vacation.

 

I'm lucky that neither applies to me right now, but it's hard to make a judgment call without knowing all the information.

[crusinmama06]

I am sure this is the wrong thing to say, but is it not possible to plan vacations when your child is not in school? I do not think pulling a kid of any age out of school for any length of time "for a family vacation" is appropriate or necessary.

 

No, during the summer we travel the country. During the school year we do cruises. And luckily the private school my daughters attend agree with me. My children do not get marked with unexcused absences. They are all excused. And while we are gone, they are to write reports about the countries we visit. When they return, they give a presentaion to the classes.

 

So while you think it's not "appropriate", I know that I am giving my children learning experiences that they could never get anywhere else.

 

Does it affect their school work? Well since I have a meeting this Tuesday with the school to discuss moving my 2nd grader into 3rd grade...I can assure you, it's not hurting her education. :)

[sas80]

I think this is a subject that could be debated on a every long thread. Every child is different, every circumstance is different, every family is different.

 

Everyone should do what works best for their family and their own situation.

[crusinmama06]

I think this is a subject that could be debated on a every long thread. Every child is different, every circumstance is different, every family is different.

 

Everyone should do what works best for their family and their own situation.

 

Exactly, I agree 100%. And I think it has been debated ad nauseum on CC. ;)

 

So no need to debate anymore, the OP knows what's best for her family. She is just trying to find a way to convince the school district of that. :)

[sas80]

Exactly, I agree 100%. And I think it has been debated ad nauseum on CC. ;)

 

So no need to debate anymore, the OP knows what's best for her family. She is just trying to find a way to convince the school district of that. :)

 

LOL, see...and what would work best for me and my family is to send the kid to school for 1.5 hours on Monday and then call her in sick the rest of the week.

 

I figure, after I try to work "with" the system, compromise, etc, and the system is really the ones whom (I feel) are being totally unreasonable, then I am going to do what I need to do, and have no qualms about it.

 

Now, the issue of modeling being a liar to my young child is not one that I would take lightly...BUT I would make sure that my child understood that a lot of money was going to be wasted if we didn't go on vacation, and, next time, mommy and daddy are going to plan better so this situation does not occur, and we don't have to fib to anyone ever again.

 

What else can you do? Eat a $3-4k loss? I don't think so! money, at least in our house, doesn't grow on trees!

[MEcruzr]

All I can say, as a former teacher, is that your child misses more than "book work" when he/she misses a week of school. Not all of it can be made up or taken with you. I also would NOT, ever again, prepare missed work for a student to take on a vacation. I did it too many times only to hear that the student lost it, forgot it, or just didn't have time to do it. You should all know it's a huge pain and inconvenience to ask a teacher for work ahead of time. Most of what you get will be busy work... it won't be what the student actually missed because that stuff hasn't been planned/prepared yet. And if you insist on asking for work ahead of time... do you child's teacher a favor and ask at least a week in advance. I'd like to know how many times I recieved a note on a Thursday or Friday asking for the next week's work because a student isn't going to be in school. In order to do this, I would have to give up my 20 minute lunch break. Yeah, that makes a teacher real happy with you.

 

If you choose to take your child out of school for a family vacation then know that there are consequences... your child will miss part of their education and your school may hold you accountable. And the argument "then your family can never take a vacation" doesn't hold water with me. Vacations are not something you have to do. It's a choice. From a teacher's point of view: Either take them during school vacation periods or don't take them.

[CondoDiva]

Life is too short.....I never think twice about taking my kids out of school for vacation.

 

We have lost my dad, mom, mother-in-law in the past year, I can't even describe how hard that is, especially for my kids. We now live in the moment, you never know what could happen tomorrow.

 

The family time that we have is so much more important than the week of school!! When on the cruise it is just so wonderful to have so much concentrated time with our boys. I have a high school freshman, middle schooler, 6th grade, and 4th grader. Principals are not that happy about it (probably a money issue, funding) but every teacher we have had said...GO...have a great time, you will learn so much more on the cruise!!

 

I will never forget our 1st vacation when I was "honest" and told the principal we were going on vacation, it was awful, same reactions. So then I started just telling the teachers before we left. Last fall when I took my boys out for 10 missed days(Disney Southern Carribbean Cruise), I actually wrote a letter before we left and described all the educational experiences and left it at that. Since we were gone 2 weeks, I did give the letter to the principals before we left. I guess they were so used to this, nothing was said!!

 

And I always will know that my kids memories will NOT be..."Mom, why did you take us out of school!!", but...."What great experiences we had on our vacations growing up" and hopefully they will do the same for thier children.

 

I wish you all the best of luck....and what a great parent you are giving your child these opportunities!!!:)

[crusinmama06]

 

I wish you all the best of luck....and what a great parent you are giving your child these opportunities!!!:)

 

Hey Suzi, not to change the topic but you will have to come back after your cruise next week and let me know what you think of Liberty compared with the Disney ships.

 

I've been on Magic and Freedom. So I know what kind of experience you are in for when you go on Liberty. I hope you have a wonderful time. And I want to hear all about it.

[lexxity]

You know what, being honest gets you no where as far as I can tell. Today, for instance, DS is sick, he has been all week and I don't see it clearing up anytime soon so wanted to take the rest of the week off. I have had to take it unpaid because I can't take it as sick leave and I don't want to use my reaming paid leave. (2 days) If I had just called in sick noone would be any the wiser and I would still get paid!

 

Have a wonderful time and those memories will last a lifetime.

[RevSmith]

Life is too short.....I never think twice about taking my kids out of school for vacation.

 

We have lost my dad, mom, mother-in-law in the past year, I can't even describe how hard that is, especially for my kids. We now live in the moment, you never know what could happen tomorrow.

 

The family time that we have is so much more important than the week of school!! When on the cruise it is just so wonderful to have so much concentrated time with our boys. I have a high school freshman, middle schooler, 6th grade, and 4th grader. Principals are not that happy about it (probably a money issue, funding) but every teacher we have had said...GO...have a great time, you will learn so much more on the cruise!!

 

I will never forget our 1st vacation when I was "honest" and told the principal we were going on vacation, it was awful, same reactions. So then I started just telling the teachers before we left. Last fall when I took my boys out for 10 missed days(Disney Southern Carribbean Cruise), I actually wrote a letter before we left and described all the educational experiences and left it at that. Since we were gone 2 weeks, I did give the letter to the principals before we left. I guess they were so used to this, nothing was said!!

 

And I always will know that my kids memories will NOT be..."Mom, why did you take us out of school!!", but...."What great experiences we had on our vacations growing up" and hopefully they will do the same for thier children.

 

I wish you all the best of luck....and what a great parent you are giving your child these opportunities!!!:)

I can't tell you how much I agree with you...and I am a teacher. Family time is the most important. Your family is forever in your heart no matter how old you are. Every moment with them is special.

[sherin65]

Although I am SO tempted to lie, and send her to school for an hour on Monday, and then just call her in sick every day, that would also require telling my DD to lie about where she was ("Mommy canceled the cruise and I got sick and stayed home") - which I just will not do.

 

As a first grader, she shouldn't be asked where she was while she was out of school. If you call in her absence, that should be enough. I wouldn't stress over it especially at the elementary school level. Take your trip and have a great time.

 

**This kind of situation affected many of our local ballet dancers that were in a daytime production of The Nutcracker. The ballet company constructed a nice letter detailing the benefits of the experience and requesting the absence be excused. Some but not all schools denied the request and told students their absence would be unexcused. Those parents felt forced to just called their kids in sick for the day so that they could make up their homework without penalty. No one felt very good about it but the students that were in high school would have suffered if there had been a big assignment or a test that day.