The on going saga of tipping

[Wilba]

I probably should just stay out of this but I don't like the idea of auto tipping. Gratuities should be earned and not just to be expected.

 

Merriam-Webster Dictionary defines gratuity as "something given voluntarily or beyond obligation usually for some service".

 

Prior to becoming an RN, I, in fact, worked in the service industry as a food server and cocktail waitress, I do understand that wages paid are lower and those in the service industry rely on tips. However, they must still be earned. I absolutely refuse to tip those who do not provide good service. I am not cheap by any means and I will always tip well provided the service merits it. I realize that there are some who always "stiff" service providers but that is not my problem. I should not be made responsible for those guests. I have never "stiffed" someone who provided service to me. I instead based the tip upon the service given.

 

This IMO is most sensible response on this thread. I have long believed that the majority of posters on all these boards are not representative of the cruising population in the real world,in their view on autotipping. If the majority of cruisers were happy to throw money to all & sundry who serve them, why would the cruise companies need to impose service

charges/autotips? I have removed the 'auto' on every cruise & pay in cash accordingly. In fifty years of cruising.this is the way I tipped when I started cruising & will defend this right till my last.

[CC Help Michell]

Then it looks like RCCL is one of the lines where you can still do the envelope tipping thing, so there's your choice of line to sail. I really thought there was at least one mainstream line that still had that way of tipping.

[quiesedba41]

Do you continue to write personal attacks about me on this message board?

 

Did I upset you that much? I have an idea, since I'm a gov employee,,, blah blah blah, and you are so concerned for the well being of a bunch of cruise ship employees, I'm going to let you pay for my auto-tips.

 

Would that make you feel better? By the way, according to the IRS I'm in the top 93% wage earners in the country, I could afford to cruise every month if decided to. Just got back from Vegas yesterday had a blast, and tipped everyone I came in contact with that gave me service.

 

Bu the guy in the back that washed my buffet dishes, sorry he did not get a tip.

 

Seriously, after all these post it seems that some like auto-tips some do not. back and forth back and forth, I'm stiffing people, I don't see people behind the scenes ...whatever.....But this I do know.

 

auto tips are bad for the employee, they are bad for the guest they are only good for the cruise line.

 

You see, when the crusie line expects the passenger to tip, or to pay wages for the employee, then they are the ones exploiting the employee and taking advantage. The cruiseline does not want to raise the price of the cruise to have more money to actually pay people a salary. They want us to do this and feel guilty if we do not. This way the cruise company can feel that their fees are competitive with others in the industry.

 

The employee knows that a certain amount of people are going to stiff them, yet they take the job anyway, so it must be worth it to them.

[martinimadam]

1. If you take the autotip completely off, any tips you give directly to staff have to be put in the pool, anyway. So, you've defeated your purpose.

 

2. If you leave the autotip on, and get poor service, you can always lower, even to zero, the individual server's tip. Certainly gets management's attention, and their peers' too.

 

3. If you leave the autotip on, and get exceptional service, you can always give extra, either via the autotip or via cash, to the individual server(s). This extra money they get to keep. Doesn't go into the pool.

 

4. You are not tipping before you get the service. The tip doesn't go to the server until after the cruise is complete. And you can impact the autotip in a negative or positive way, by individual, as much as you want before the cruise is over.

 

5. And for those of you who like the personal touch of thanking the servers at the end of the cruise, many lines provide an envelope into which you can place additional money, if desired. Some give you separate slips for each of the main servers with the amount of tip you've given. That can also be placed in the envelope and given to the server with the traditional last night goodbyes.

[martinimadam]

1. If you take the autotip completely off, any tips you give directly to staff have to be put in the pool, anyway. So, you've defeated your purpose.

 

2. If you leave the autotip on, and get poor service, you can always lower, even to zero, the individual server's tip. Certainly gets management's attention, and their peers' too.

 

3. If you leave the autotip on, and get exceptional service, you can always give extra, either via the autotip or via cash, to the individual server(s). This extra money they get to keep. Doesn't go into the pool.

 

4. You are not tipping before you get the service. The tip doesn't go to the server until after the cruise is complete. And you can impact the autotip in a negative or positive way, by individual, as much as you want before the cruise is over.

 

5. And for those of you who like the personal touch of thanking the servers at the end of the cruise, many lines provide an envelope into which you can place additional money, if desired. Some give you separate slips for each of the main servers with the amount of tip you've given. That can also be placed in the envelope and given to the server with the traditional last night goodbyes.

[Wilba]

Do you really believe in this so called ‘tip pool’? Do you really believe they all rush to hand over any cash because someone removes the autotip? Some of you must still believe in Father Christmas! Who knows, except the recipient how much cash has been handed over? Yes I’m sure these procedures are in place but let’s get real with the reality’s of human nature. We all removed our autotips on our cruise last month, as per our norm, & tipped our Cabin & Table waits in cash, as per our norm. The next morning whilst awaiting our departure call, we sat up on deck. Our table waiter was on breakfast duty & came down the deck at least 3 or 4 times to ask if we needed more food, tea, coffee etc. He was clearly a very happy man with cash in his back pocket & couldn’t do enough for us. This was not the action of a man who was about to chuck all his money in some so called tip pool.

[cruisinhs]

Hopefully I will ask this question right...I have only ever cruised on Carnival, but am preparing for a RCCL cruise. I have always used the auto tip before, do they have it on RCCL as well? Do you have to ask for it?

 

My third question is... do the waiters, etc., know that you have prepaid? I just wonder whether those who pay in person get more personal service. For me, it is more convenient to auto-tip and not carry the cash for it onboard, but if there is an advantage to paying personally, I would consider it.

[sail7seas]

The stewards and their supervisors know the names/cabin numbers of those who remove the auto tip from their account.

 

 

[grannygristle]

The stewards and their supervisors know the names/cabin numbers of those who remove the auto tip from their account.

 

 

In your opinion, or anyone else that cares to comment, does that lead to:

 

a better service because individuals are hoping for an individual gratuity at the end of the trip

 

or

 

a poorer service because they think you're not tipping at all

 

or

 

is there no difference in the level of service received?

 

Thanks in advance.

[Wilba]

As one who always removes autotip I can assure you the service is always exemplary irrespective of how you tip. Regards

[CC Help Michell]

As one who always removes autotip I can assure you the service is always exemplary irrespective of how you tip. Regards

 

I agree -- regardless of how you tip there is no difference in service. Which is precisely why I love tip pools. There is no difference in service, they are hugely convenient, they reward ALL the employees on the ship including those behind the scenes, and nothing prevents you from tipping certain individuals a bit more if you think they merit it.

 

I don't believe in Santa Claus (any more) but I do believe the dozens of crew members who blog and post about the tip pool, and/or with whom I've spoken on my recent cruises. I believe them when they say that they sure DO turn in cash tips from those who remove auto tips -- because their jobs are at stake and that money you gave them isn't worth losing their jobs, no matter how generous YOU thought it was.

 

How would management find out if they didn't turn over the cash? A cruise ship is the smallest small town you ever saw -- if you think Saturday hairdresser gossip makes its way to the church front steps on Sunday in a hurry in your town -- try seeing how fast word spreads among a cruise ship crew!

[scubadiver888]

I have read many post here, soem peopling feeling that auto tipping is bad, some saying that if you cannot auto tip you cannot afford the cruise etc.....

 

What I want to know, being a first time cruiser, but one who can afford the cruise, is can I take auto tip off, and then tip the folks, that give me service?

 

I have 8 in my family going to cruise and 400.00 in tips for a 5 day cruise is a bit steep. I seems to me the auto tippers and paying for the stiffers.....I do NOT mind tipping, but I would like for it to be more personal.

 

My sister crusied last year and told me that she had them remove auto tip all together, and tipped as she came in contact with staff that provided service.

 

So far I have only sailed on Princess Cruises. From the documentation I have received from them, you are automatically billed each day for the tip but at the end of the cruise you can go to customer service and remove some or all of the tip. They do not have an option to just not tip.

 

This kind of makes sense to me. From the ships perspective, some people will not tip but feel guilty going to the service desk and asking for the tip to be refunded. From my perspective, if I asked right up front to have no tipping the crew might mistakenly think I'm cheap and give me bad service. Additionally, if they know I'm not tipping but someone else is tipping, that other person might get better service. With the auto tipping there is the hope everyone will be treated equally.

 

That said, when I plan a vacation I look at the cost of the trip including the tip. If the price of the cruise still seems good then I book it. Even when I calculate the price of my cruises with the tip, they are a better deal then if I went to a resort with comparable food and activities.

 

The base cost of a cruise is pretty cheap. There is no way I could find something comparable at a resort. I suspect the way cruise lines keep it cheap is the staff depend on the tips. If people stiff them for a tip, they really are getting a cheap vacation at the expense of some hard working staff.

 

I ALWAYS tip above the automatic amount. I know what it feels like to put in some hard work and have someone benefit without giving you anything just because they can.

[sultan_sfo]

Hope you never go to ANY restaurant (unless you live in some god forsaken boondock) in a group of 6 or more persons, because 18% to 20% will be automatically ADDED to your bill! /Sultan

 

I probably should just stay out of this but I don't like the idea of auto tipping. Gratuities should be earned and not just to be expected.

...

 

However, they must still be earned. I absolutely refuse to tip those who do not provide good service.

[sail7seas]

sorry.....another double. Groan.

[sail7seas]

If everyone was the generous, over and above, we love to tip cruiserthat sometimes we read about on these type threads, cruise lines never would have had to put auto tip into place. My personal observation through the years is that many people went to obvious effort to avoid tipping. Somehow some HAD to try the other bar for drinks before dinner on the last night of the cruise as, afterall, it was their last chance. I called it 'musical bars'. They went to the same lounge night after night and knew the last night a tip would be welcome. No way they were going to tip. They played 'let's go try the other bar' and stiffed the crew in the bar that served them the whole cruise.

 

These same types had a really late afternoon snack at the burger bar/pizza/whatever; squirreled some snacks in their cabin and skipped dinner the last night. They knew a tip to the stewards would be welcome.

 

Best of all were those who came to the dining room the last night and had a full dinner. The minute the steward was out of the area retrieving orders from the galley or whatever, bingo.....they were out of their chairs like shot from a cannon and out of the dining room in a flash. See 'ya later, Bye. Not so much as goodbye and thanks.

 

Don't forget those who handed over envelopes so they would 'look good'. Those envelopes were EMPTY.

 

So, let's not kid ourselves that EVERYONE is so generous with their tip money. Of course, MANY are. I in no way mean this to apply to anyone who has posted to this thread. I don't know any of you and have no idea how much, how little you may or may not tip and really don't care.

 

Auto tip is being brought to us due to our fellow cruisers actions IMO

Cruising has changed as have the cruisers. Very different from the 'old days'....not saying that is necessarily all bad.

 

 

[George W. Bush]

In 1974, just before I went to sea, I was working as a waitewr in an upscale French Restaurant in Southern California.

I received no salary at all - and had to "purchase" my job from the owner of the restaurant.

I worked 6 nights a week, for 5 hours each night. I served about 20 or 30 people per night. That was before the US Government started forcing me to pay taxes on tips.

I was talking home over $100,000 a year. Good money in 1974 for a part time job.

 

I was quite happy that my employer didn't pay me a "living wage". Cruise ships are not so different today - except for the hours and the clientele.

 

I've never been able to understand why waiters become indignent when they're made to pay taxes like everyone else.

[coffee39]

You told us that you can afford to cruise, then told us that you think the tip amount is "Steep".

 

The tip amount today is only half of what was given 25 years ago. That's without factoring inflation. Maybe you cannot afford to cruise after all.

 

The average waiter / cabin steward is paid an average of $1 per day, plus any tips you give them. How lazy would they have to be in order for you not to allow them to earn more than $1 for working a 13 hour day?

Why would anyone in their right mind work for $1.00 per day? I just don't understand how anyone can get away with paying that kind of wage or why anyone would work for that kind of wage. I have nothing against tipping and will definately leave the auto tip in place but just don't understand anyone working for $1.00/day.

[flamingo3]

I quit reading this thread after quiesedba41 called most of us "bleeding-heart liberals". Know what? I am a bleeding-heart liberal and I am quite proud of it!

 

AND, I would never think of removing the autotip. If you have never cruised before, you have absolutely no idea how hard the staff works. These people are working hard to have a better life. They are working hard to give YOU a wonderful vacation. Folks should not begrudge them anything. Count your lucky stars that you are able to be a passenger, not a crew member -- although in my dreams I would love to work on a ship and see the world. :D Please tell me what is wrong with that. Not only that, they smile when they do it.

 

You don't need to call people names just because you don't agree with them on something.

 

Proud to be a "BLEEDING-HEART LIBERAL" :D

 

Susan

[karatemom2]

Well I am a moderate conservative and I can't fathom why people have a problem with the auto tip. They are always the ones that profess what "generous" tippers they are, yet they are standing on some sort of bizarre principal of not tipping in advance of service. If you all were really that generous you would just zip it and pay the autotip plus more! If there is someone who really gives you lousy service which in all my cruises I have NEVER experienced, you can always address it with Guest Services and then have all or a portion of the tip removed based on actual poor service. The auto tip is in place to make it easy for people to tip, help ensure that those who in the old system might have skipped out on tips actually pay up and to fairly compensate across the board those that serve us in many capacities. You can still hand over that envelope to those that you feel merit a bit extra and thereby maintain the joy of providing a personal reward. All you do in removing the autotip is make it more difficult on the very hardworking people you claim you are so eager to reward "in person". Makes no sense at all.

 

In my estimation people who refuse the autotip are:

 

A. Truly cheap and thoughtless with no intention of tipping.

B. Completely full of themselves and their own importance needing to make the big impression by handing over tips personally to one and all.

C. Control freaks who can't trust that the cruiseline has devised a system that is fair and equitable to all.

D.Prima Donnas who demand that they get the full obsequious service they seek before handing over those precious dollars.

 

I'm sorry if this seems harsh, but if you cruise a line with autotips you should respect the system and comply unless you receive out and out bad service, which I'm sure any seasoned cruiser would freely acknowledge is extremely rare. If you don't like the system pick a cruiseline without autotips.

 

I look at tips as part of the expense of cruising. I appreciate that autotips have made it easier for me and continue to personally reward with extra those that provide me with great service. These people go out of their way to give me and my family a wonderful vacation experience and I would not dream of short changing them, or making it appear to their supervisors that they are not doing their job by cutting off the autotip. If you know you are going to tip these people, what is the difference? Pay the autotip, enjoy your cruise and in the very, very rare instance when you get less then exemplary service address it based on that. To say that you won't pay until it's "earned" is a presumption that service will be subpar, yet you admit it rarely, if ever is. I look at it in just the opposite way. I go in happily autotipping, knowing I will be receiving great service and I am working within a system that appropriately awards these deserving people. I have yet to be disappointed!

[gerif]

Hopefully I will ask this question right...I have only ever cruised on Carnival, but am preparing for a RCCL cruise. I have always used the auto tip before, do they have it on RCCL as well? Do you have to ask for it?

 

My third question is... do the waiters, etc., know that you have prepaid? I just wonder whether those who pay in person get more personal service. For me, it is more convenient to auto-tip and not carry the cash for it onboard, but if there is an advantage to paying personally, I would consider it.

 

On RCCL, they do not have auto tip - however, you can opt to either prepay tips in advance or charge them to your account while on board (HOWEVER, you must be sure to do this prior to the cut-off date indicated, usually the penultimate night) - there will be a form left in your cabin for this. On the last day, you will receive envelopes and vouchers for each person. You are free to then add cash to those envelopes as you want or just give them with the vouchers to the servers in question. We've done it both ways and have not noticed any difference in service.

[sustyse]

Well I am a moderate conservative and I can't fathom why people have a problem with the auto tip. They are always the ones that profess what "generous" tippers they are, yet they are standing on some sort of bizarre principal of not tipping in advance of service. If you all were really that generous you would just zip it and pay the autotip plus more! If there is someone who really gives you lousy service which in all my cruises I have NEVER experienced, you can always address it with Guest Services and then have all or a portion of the tip removed based on actual poor service. The auto tip is in place to make it easy for people to tip, help ensure that those who in the old system might have skipped out on tips actually pay up and to fairly compensate across the board those that serve us in many capacities. You can still hand over that envelope to those that you feel merit a bit extra and thereby maintain the joy of providing a personal reward. All you do in removing the autotip is make it more difficult on the very hardworking people you claim you are so eager to reward "in person". Makes no sense at all.

 

In my estimation people who refuse the autotip are:

 

A. Truly cheap and thoughtless with no intention of tipping.

B. Completely full of themselves and their own importance needing to make the big impression by handing over tips personally to one and all.

C. Control freaks who can't trust that the cruiseline has devised a system that is fair and equitable to all.

D.Prima Donnas who demand that they get the full obsequious service they seek before handing over those precious dollars.

 

I'm sorry if this seems harsh, but if you cruise a line with autotips you should respect the system and comply unless you receive out and out bad service, which I'm sure any seasoned cruiser would freely acknowledge is extremely rare. If you don't like the system pick a cruiseline without autotips.

 

I look at tips as part of the expense of cruising. I appreciate that autotips have made it easier for me and continue to personally reward with extra those that provide me with great service. These people go out of their way to give me and my family a wonderful vacation experience and I would not dream of short changing them, or making it appear to their supervisors that they are not doing their job by cutting off the autotip. If you know you are going to tip these people, what is the difference? Pay the autotip, enjoy your cruise and in the very, very rare instance when you get less then exemplary service address it based on that. To say that you won't pay until it's "earned" is a presumption that service will be subpar, yet you admit it rarely, if ever is. I look at it in just the opposite way. I go in happily autotipping, knowing I will be receiving great service and I am working within a system that appropriately awards these deserving people. I have yet to be disappointed!

 

I Agree with you 100%. We have only been on 1 cruise so far and we pre-paid our tips. For our upcoming cruise in October we are doing the very same thing. If the service was as good as the last time we will again be putting cash also into the envelopes on the last night.:)

[PrincessMelody]

I look at the tipping issue very simply...I am on vacation to have a good time and relax. I love the simplicity and ease of autotips...no worries with envelopes, finding the staff to hand them to, and hoping to have enough cash and the right bills to do it with.

Besides, on Princess I always book with a FCC, and on a 7 day cruise, the $100 OBC covers almost 70% of the autotip! :D

[WinnieinWA]

I love having the auto tip added to my credit card when I book online. It takes away the angst of having to worry about taking enough cash and wondering if I've given enough.

 

I now know that everyone involved in my cruise experience is getting what they deserve and then if I find some crew members who go above and beyond I can give them an added tip to let them know they're special.

 

My biggest tip is filling out every comment card and raving about above the board service.. those can mean the difference in promotions for the crew.

 

Winnie

[scubadiver888]

Well I am a moderate conservative and I can't fathom why people have a problem with the auto tip. They are always the ones that profess what "generous" tippers they are, yet they are standing on some sort of bizarre principal of not tipping in advance of service. If you all were really that generous you would just zip it and pay the autotip plus more! If there is someone who really gives you lousy service which in all my cruises I have NEVER experienced, you can always address it with Guest Services and then have all or a portion of the tip removed based on actual poor service. The auto tip is in place to make it easy for people to tip, help ensure that those who in the old system might have skipped out on tips actually pay up and to fairly compensate across the board those that serve us in many capacities. You can still hand over that envelope to those that you feel merit a bit extra and thereby maintain the joy of providing a personal reward. All you do in removing the autotip is make it more difficult on the very hardworking people you claim you are so eager to reward "in person". Makes no sense at all.

 

In my estimation people who refuse the autotip are:

 

A. Truly cheap and thoughtless with no intention of tipping.

B. Completely full of themselves and their own importance needing to make the big impression by handing over tips personally to one and all.

C. Control freaks who can't trust that the cruiseline has devised a system that is fair and equitable to all.

D.Prima Donnas who demand that they get the full obsequious service they seek before handing over those precious dollars.

 

I'm sorry if this seems harsh, but if you cruise a line with autotips you should respect the system and comply unless you receive out and out bad service, which I'm sure any seasoned cruiser would freely acknowledge is extremely rare. If you don't like the system pick a cruiseline without autotips.

 

I look at tips as part of the expense of cruising. I appreciate that autotips have made it easier for me and continue to personally reward with extra those that provide me with great service. These people go out of their way to give me and my family a wonderful vacation experience and I would not dream of short changing them, or making it appear to their supervisors that they are not doing their job by cutting off the autotip. If you know you are going to tip these people, what is the difference? Pay the autotip, enjoy your cruise and in the very, very rare instance when you get less then exemplary service address it based on that. To say that you won't pay until it's "earned" is a presumption that service will be subpar, yet you admit it rarely, if ever is. I look at it in just the opposite way. I go in happily autotipping, knowing I will be receiving great service and I am working within a system that appropriately awards these deserving people. I have yet to be disappointed!

Well said!

 

By the way, I'm going on a cruise that does not have auto tipping. Not because I don't like auto tipping. The itinerary is just too good. I talked to the cruise line and found out you can request auto tipping, i.e. they will charge you a set fee per person per day. So for those people who like the auto tipping, don't pass on cruises that don't have it... they have it but you have to request it.

[macka]

Do you continue to write personal attacks about me on this message board?

 

Did I upset you that much? I have an idea, since I'm a gov employee,,, blah blah blah, and you are so concerned for the well being of a bunch of cruise ship employees, I'm going to let you pay for my auto-tips.

 

Would that make you feel better? By the way, according to the IRS I'm in the top 93% wage earners in the country, I could afford to cruise every month if decided to. Just got back from Vegas yesterday had a blast, and tipped everyone I came in contact with that gave me service.

 

Bu the guy in the back that washed my buffet dishes, sorry he did not get a tip.

 

Seriously, after all these post it seems that some like auto-tips some do not. back and forth back and forth, I'm stiffing people, I don't see people behind the scenes ...whatever.....But this I do know.

 

auto tips are bad for the employee, they are bad for the guest they are only good for the cruise line.

 

You see, when the crusie line expects the passenger to tip, or to pay wages for the employee, then they are the ones exploiting the employee and taking advantage. The cruiseline does not want to raise the price of the cruise to have more money to actually pay people a salary. They want us to do this and feel guilty if we do not. This way the cruise company can feel that their fees are competitive with others in the industry.

 

The employee knows that a certain amount of people are going to stiff them, yet they take the job anyway, so it must be worth it to them.

 

 

Lady, you'll keep getting personal attacks as long as you continue to write vacuous, unpleasant rubbish like this.