MercedMike Posted August 19, 2009 #1 Share Posted August 19, 2009 We just returned from a great cruise tour with HAL. While we were at Denali I made a point of comparing the Tundra Wilderness Tour and the Natural History Tour. Here is what I learned on the spot. Natural History Tour: About 4 hours. It goes to the Visitor Center and the Wilderness Access Center. Then it drives into the park about 19 miles. The last part of the trip is past the checkpoint which requires permits to pass. It stops at the old Savage Cabin for a living history presentation, and then goes on to Primrose Point. From there Denali is visible on a very clear day (not often!) and there is a cultural presentation. It then returns to the visitor center (or your hotel). Tundra Wilderness Tour: About 7 hours. It travels more than 50 miles into the park, through lots of different scenery, and through the prime wildlife viewing areas. At the turnaround point, Denali is visible on a very clear day, reports say about 20% of the time. There are two stops with pit toilets, but no historical or cultural presentations. The tour we did (included in our cruise tour) was the Tundra Wilderness Tour. This means, of course, that we covered the stretch done by the Natural History Tour. Here are my observations: VEHICLE: This is NOT a modern tour bus! It is perhaps a little bit better than the school bus I rode on long ago. Windows are adequate for viewing and barely passable for picture taking. ROAD: The road is gravel, in a moderate state of repair. It is very bumpy and irregular, and full of curves and in some places quite steep dropoffs. The portion covered by the NHT is in better repair and less bumpy then the further section for the TWT. FACILITIES: Of course the NHT can use the flush toilets at the Visitor Center, but at the cabin they are primitive. The TWT makes only two stops, both with decent pit toilets. SCENERY: The NHT section covers some very good scenery. The TWT is far more extensive, covering a lot of varying geography and ecology, including the Polycrome mountains which are spectacular. As noted, Denali views MIGHT be possible on either one. WILDLIFE: In the NHT section of the road, we saw ptarmigan, caribou, and lots of snowshoe hares as well as a Northern harrier in flight. After that in the TWT section we saw more caribou, more ptarmigan, lots more hares, more harriers, golden eagles, magpies, Dall sheep, coyotes and the star sightings were SIX grizzly bears: Mother with cub, mother with two cubs, and one lone boar. The vast majority of the sightings were the "dot on the hillside" variety. Phtographs with a basic digital camera with 6x zoom were possible but not very exciting. One grizzly was close enough to get pretty good pics with the camera. The bus driver had a 100x video camera and put all the sightings on the screens in the bus and that was the major way we really got to "see" the animals. MY COMPARISON OF THE TWO TOURS: First of all, IF your main desire is to see wildlife, the TWT has incomparably better chances. However the price you pay for those sightings is looooong hours of bouncing over bumpy roads in an antiquated and uncomfortable bus, with minimal stops and minimal facilities. Unless you have a really great camera and really great luck, your pictures are likely to be spotty and indistinct at best. The NHT would require less sacrifice, is shorter, has better stops, and includes interesting cultural and historical performances not available on the TWT. An individual passenger needs to decide which is the right tour for them. Both would be good. We will probably be going back to Denali next year. I pretty much enjoyed the TWT once, but I would NEVER consider repeating it. I am looking forward to being able to do the full NHT. All this, of course, is IMAO. YMMV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBMiller Posted August 19, 2009 #2 Share Posted August 19, 2009 We did the Natural History Tour a few weeks ago, and really enjoyed it. This tour is not so much about wildlife as it is about learning the history and geology of the area. It starts with a short film of the history of the park; followed by the driving tour. Our guide was an expert on the geology and fauna of the area and gave us a non-stop overview of the park as we drove through it. We also made a short stop at the Savage Cabin and met with a guide there. At the checkpoint, we met with an Athabascan native who gave a short history of his people, and discussed how they are adapting to American ways. In terms of wildlife, we saw a snow hare, a family of ptarmigan, and some white dots that may or may not have been sheep. :-) This tour is not for everyone, but if you are interested in history and geology, I would recommend it. And I have to agree with MercedMike, the ride IS bumpy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
negc Posted August 19, 2009 #3 Share Posted August 19, 2009 Thanks for the comparisons. I believe that the information is far more valuable for those who are debating which tour to take, than the usual post which merely says that one tour (usually the longer TWT) is better than the other. We took the NHT the last time and have to agree that the bus ride is not the most comfortable one we have ever taken and will have to decide whether the extra hours on an uncomfortable bus are worth the added value of going further into the park and perhaps seeing more and more varied wildlife and a 20% chance of getting a clear view of Denali. RCI is including the TWT as part of our stay in Denali but we will have to determine for ourselves whether or not we are up to the rigors of this excursion. Again thanks for providing us with things to consider.:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Birder6 Posted August 19, 2009 #4 Share Posted August 19, 2009 We just returned from Denali, where we took the 11-hour shuttle bus to Wonder Lake. For us, seeing more of the park and having a greater chance to see wildlife was paramount. If you are really interested in wildlife, you should not take the NHT tour, as in may cases you will see little wildlife -- our only sightings on that stretch were two moose. The shuttle bus is even less comfortable than the TWT bus, but we didn't find it too bad -- both we and our kids lasted the full 11 hours with nothing but slightly sore butts. The longer tour also gives you a better chance to see the mountain, which we saw most of, as the weather sometimes clears up further in. As with anything, you have to gauge your own interests against what the various tours offer. For us, the chance to see more wildlife and more of the park was the most important thing, so if we did it again, we would probably do the same thing, although if our kids were not there, we would probably get out and walk some, looking for some of the birds that we missed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vbmom87 Posted August 19, 2009 #5 Share Posted August 19, 2009 I have only done the Wonder Lake shuttle and for me it was a good tour. We didn't find the day too long and honestly didn't find the road that bumpy. The bus travels so slowly it really was not uncomfortable for me. What I was not prepared for on this trip were the scary drop-offs that Mike mentions. You really have to hope that your driver knows what they are doing and that they are in good health. I didn't do any small aircraft tours because of personal fears. Well, I think this trip was probably more scary to me than the float plane or helicopter would have been. I got through it okay, but said a lot of prayers. ;) I have read of a few people who actually took both tours a day apart and loved both. Mike gave a great comparison and this will be a good post to link people to that are trying to decide which tour to take. I fully agree that some people will be perfectly fine with the NHT. However, it is necessary that people know what is included in each so they can make a choice that will not result in a disappointment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budget Queen Posted August 20, 2009 #6 Share Posted August 20, 2009 There are the shuttle bus options also to consider compared to the tour buses, which are extremely costly in comparism. KNOWING the details of visiting Denali Park is vital for the right choice for the individual. I don't find the bus, any big deal, nor "uncomfortable". It's a bus- heavy duty school bus type, NOT a tour bus. So knowing that, may be important for some. ALL buses stop at the same rest stops, about every 90 minutes. The bonus of shuttle buses, is you can stay as long as you want, get off the bus ANYWHERE, hike around, get any other shuttle bus. It is important to know, details about the distances. McKinley viewing is in NO WAY, any comparism from Savage River, where the NHT goes, and Wonder Lake. Savage River is a Partial view, at best. IF McKinley is "out" it is FAR far far better to get yourself into the park. The view is just that much superior. So- do your homework, it's unfortunate, that most people just do not know the differences. I will continue to state the NHT is a waste of time, IF you are going to Denali Park, I just can NOT see anyone, going all that way, spending all that money, time and maybe one time trip, and not getting INTO the park. My bias, having been there many times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PennyAgain Posted August 20, 2009 #7 Share Posted August 20, 2009 That's funny I never gave them a 2nd thought as I lived in an area with much worse that had to be negotiated to get the young folks to the school bus stop. Life in the far north! That said I adore Polychrome Pass! I prefer the shuttle buses to any organized tour but I have spent a lot of time in Denali and have camped there plenty. I like getting off the bus when I please and getting on fairly easily when I choose to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glaciers Posted August 20, 2009 #8 Share Posted August 20, 2009 It is important to know, details about the distances. McKinley viewing is in NO WAY, any comparism from Savage River, where the NHT goes, and Wonder Lake. Savage River is a Partial view, at best. IF McKinley is "out" it is FAR far far better to get yourself into the park. The view is just that much superior. Yep, if you're mainly interested in seeing the mountain and not going back into the park, you get a much better unobstructed view near Talkeetna at the pull out on the spur road. Much of park isn't really about the mountain but on the wildlife and beauty of it in general. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaylenhazel Posted August 20, 2009 #9 Share Posted August 20, 2009 We took budget queens advice (THANKS!!!) and did the Eilson shuttle. Wow.... 24 grizzley bears that day. Many other animals. We left at 6 a.m. We couldn't cancel our NHT so we did it the next day. Blahhh.... Budget Queen is right on the mark. Not to mention it saved us a lot of money. Our driver was Matt and he was great. He stopped many times and really knew a lot about the area. We were so pleased with our choice of the shuttle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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