theHunter05

Hope they fix it soon, we will be on the Magic in July.

Certainly it is their ship and they can do as they please, whether it is lawful or not, hence the lawsuit, if this is decided in court it will set precedence for future actions. This is why it is in Carnival's best to settle out of court as stated by someone else above.

I am not aware of any detention laws in the international laws other than a captain having someone either confined to cabin or removed from their ship. If the law of their flagged country gives them to enforce the law then they are an officer of that countries court then(unknown to me). As far as them breaking US law in our waters they are most certainly bond by our laws how else would the USCG be able to arrest and detain people on foreign flagged vessels for trafficking drugs or weapons or other illegal acts. Happens all of the time so there may be something in the maritime that has been added since the cases were adjudicated in the 50's and 60's.

I won't respond any more to this thread because we are way off topic, this is a discussion for a law forum somewhere. We can wait and see how the lawsuit is settled and hopefully someone will come here and inform us all of the decision made by the court.

Traffic stop is not a good example of your supposed authority to detain a person, in the State of Texas an officer must inform you that you will receive a ticket(which is an arrest in the State of Texas) in order to keep you from leaving. This is also an event that they themselves witnessed negating all of the other information stated here about a third party witness. I have researched many states laws and this seems to be the case in most but not all.

A ticket is an arrest and the person is released on their own recognizance with a promise to appear before a judge in the allotted time. If this does not occur a judge then signs an arrest warrant. In some states an officer of the court including police officers can sign the arrest warrant if they are attesting to having first hand knowledge of the offense.

Laws are very tricky to understand unless you spend a lot of time researching all of the laws that pertain to a certain situation. I know all sorts of people in law enforcement from police officers to judges that do not know all of the laws and I do not expect them to, due to the sheer volume of laws.

Again I stated that if this incident occurred in US waters they are governed by US laws, Carnival security has the same abilities to hold and interrogate anyone they want but it could be considered unlawful detention if they are not an officer of the court, just as if anyone that is not an officer can only make a citizens arrest and detain someone if they have first hand knowledge of the offense. In this case they did not, unless they have some first hand knowledge, and yes the video would qualify unless it was later proven to have been doctored in some way, there should not have been a detention.

I understand that the offense is disturbing and it is with in the rights of a ship captain to restrict someone to quarters but I believe that the 90 minute interrogation if proven to be true is a little excessive. Again I am not an Attorney, I only offer my opinion and understanding of the law over the last 40 years or so.

We are agreeing more than you realize, as the ships have agreeded to their respective laws of their flagged countries, then yes they have agreed to follow the more restrictive laws of their own country, if it covered by both maritime and their respective law. What they can not do is go against what maritime says if it is more restrictive.

Just as in the US most states have agreed to follow all Federal laws with a few exceptions but the law that gives the citizen the most protection is usually the one followed. That being said in some cases you can still be prosecuted federally for a crime if the state offers protection yet the law broken is a federal law.

As this is getting off subject, I agree that the ship must follow maritime and in most cases their flagged countries laws at the same time.

So lesson here is research the law in the country the ship is flagged in.

I am sure that all ships agree to follow their flagged states laws not just the ones from the US. That being said yes the US laws may be more stringent so it appears they are always following our laws but in some cases there are other laws that the US may differ on that maritime says they must do, so they will follow that when in international waters, as I said that is the order that the laws must be followed. Not taking away from your add, in my opinion, about what US flagged ships must do. As far as I know Carnival has no US flagged ships.

The UNCLOS (United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea), article 92 states:

 

"Article 92. Status of ships

1. Ships shall sail under the flag of one State only and, save in exceptional cases expressly provided for in international treaties or in this Convention, shall be subject to its exclusive jurisdiction on the high seas." (bolding mine)

Just as I said if not covered by international law then it falls to flagged country law, I recognize that you have sailed for many years but please read the whole thing.

Blue bolding mine.

First off I love the way all of you know the law, are you all lawyers that deal in international maritime law(admiralty law) and also binding contracts? By the way international maritime law is law of record in international waters, the only time the flag country comes in is if they are in that countries waters, in some cases if maritime does not cover something particular then it falls back to the flagged country next.

Just because a statement is in a contract and you both sign it does not mean that it is legal, all contracts in the courts eyes are written in the favor of the proposer of the contract, in this case Carnival, so it will be their burden to convince a judge to send it to arbitration. That being said, most states require arbitration in all civil cases before going to a jury any way.

As far as the detainment, if this was in US territorial waters then US law dictates what can be done. As for the person that says they work for a law enforcement agency, officers are not allowed to detain any one against their will for questioning unless they have been arrested. This action is abused by many officers, the reason asking for a lawyer is always recommended to help you with your rights. An officer can ask you to voluntarily answer questions but your right is to refuse and not answer any questions. In many cases even the bad guys never get questioned, they refuse to speak, so evidence has to be presented to a judge in order to obtain an arrest warrant. In this case the security may have been acting in good faith from eye witness testimony but they have the burden of proof via what ever means possible, sometimes the wrong people are convicted because of a witness mis identifies a bad guy. Once video was available then it should have been reviewed, the improper action most likely was the information getting to the victims family about the room number before the investigation was completed causing the process to be hastily and wrongly handled.

As far as lawsuit, he has numerous things to sue for, wrongful detention, defamation of character and party to assault. And before any of you experts chime in on not being able to sue big companies, first you can sue anybody in America if you know how to read a little research and know how to write a lawsuit. Which can be done at your local free law library.

After this incident, which we don't have all of the facts, and the incident on the Legend that video was provided, I have very little faith in the character or integrity of security team on Carnival ships.

No I am not a lawyer, just someone who deals in multi-million dollar contracts and law suits on a regular basis.

Thanks for the info, we are celebrating our 25th anniversary and my 50th birthday on this cruise.:)