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Hey Cheryl,

It becomes increasingly more evident that the passport is the way to go...despite the lesser cost of the 'passcard'. It seems to me that despite the political pressures involved, the reality is, that a passport is the only way to go anywhere these days. Thats not necessarily a bad thing however.

Have a great day and as always a pleasure to read your posts.

Paul from NJ

First, I appreciate everyone who has made an effort at helping others keep up with the passport changes, with a special thank you to cherylandtk.

 

My son and I do not yet have passports, and I have been watching these developments with much curiosity. The only cruise in the budget for this year is a 3 night Disney, which is in two weeks, so we are good with birth certificates. I had figured that at some point over the following year, we would go ahead and get the passports, although I was hoping to just get passcards. I was surprised to see that passcards are not good for air travel - I thought they would be phased in as full replacements for passports. I wonder if they plan on changing that at any time in the future? If not, we will definitely get the regular passport so that our future travel will not be hampered.

My advice... bottom line...apply for a passport. The word passport appears, as an approved travel document requirement, in nearly every discussion set forth by the DOS, DHS, & CBP. It is difficult for me to understand why, travellers, who plan to travel anytime soon, would not consider getting a passport. Passports have been a universally accepted form of identification for many years...long before 9/11, and the newly proposed required travel document requirements.

It's not a great big deal to get a US Passport, providing you have the necessary documents and can afford to pay the fee to obtain the passport.

I got a US Passport, not because I plan to travel out of the country, but because I had the foresight to know that this day would someday come...and that I wanted to be prepared.

Paul,

My thoughts are that this is a strong-arm political move designed to bring the issue to the forefront. When the average citizen is forced to undergo security delays because they do not have a compliant ID, they tend to complain loudly. As a result, I figure this summer will see far worse complaints and travel delays than 2007. I think that a passport will always be the ultimate travel ID, but that many US citizens will suddenly need one (or a passcard) for flying on business, or to see Grandma over the summer, or going to Disney World. So states that are fighting the 'national ID card' on constitutional grounds better start a PR campaign getting their citizens ready and WILLING to suffer personal inconvenience in the name of constitutional principle. It will be interesting, to say the least, to see if either side blinks.

Hi Cheryl,

I agree with your thoughts on the matter, however, I do believe that the matter of travel security needs to be brought to the forefront of public awareness...notwithstanding the opinion and objection of the ACLU regarding "The Real ID Act", and the constitutional principles concerned therewith. I have no problem providing proof of citizenship with whatever documents are necessary to do so.

I personally know many people that don't feel the need to obtain a US Passport, because they say they will not travel anywhere in order to need one. The 'Real ID Act' throws a 'curveball' into the mix by the requirements set forth in the Act, namely airline travel, and accessing Federal or Nuclear facilities, without a Passport or Real ID.

I am unclear as to exactly what 'accessing a Federal facility' means. Does that mean if I want to visit the Library of Congress in Washington, DC, that I will need either a Passport or a Real ID to do so?

Many of the 'bogus' ID documents provided to the perpetrators of the September 11 attacks were obtained in NJ, hence, I believe, NJ's compliance with the Real ID Act and the already in place implementation of a "6 Point ID Verification Program", to obtain a drivers license.

I disagree with the ACLU if they maintain that national security is an invasion of privacy. If someone has something to hide then we all need to be concerned.

As always a pleasure to hear your thoughts and that you share them with us all.

Paul from NJ

Here is a new wrinkle to the entire Passport/passcard/BC-DL question:

 

The Real ID act will require the use of a Driver's License which complies with the Real ID act for federal purposes, which includes domestic airport security, entering a federal building or getting on a cruise ship.

 

In the Final Rule published Jan 11, 2008 DHS says the states have until May of this year to apply for an extension waiver to meet the regulations. Residents of States which do not already meet the requirements or apply for the waiver will not be able to use their state Driver License for federal ID purposes after May 2008.

 

Several states have declared they will not comply with the Real ID act*, but these states could still apply for the waiver. Doing so would give residents of those states until at least Dec. 31, 2009 to use their state DL for federal ID purposes. IF their state did not comply with the graduated requirements they would need an alternate document for ID (passport or passcard). If their state materially complies with most of the requirements, they have until 2014.

 

This means that travellers will now need to keep track of whether or not their state issued DL is compliant or not. OR, go ahead and get a passport or passcard for domestic travel use.

 

*The 17, according to the ACLU, are Arkansas, Colorado, Georgia, Hawaii, Idaho, Illinois, Maine, Missouri, Montana, Nebraska, Nevada, New Hampshire, North Dakota, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Tennessee and Washington

 

California and New Jersey have stated they intend to comply. For all other states, contact your local legislator and Motor Vehicles departments.

Hi Again Cheryl,

I have just read a portion of the DHS ruling re: "Real ID Act" and it is certainly a wake up call or strong arm tactic to insist that States comply with the ruling or for travelers to be forced to obtain a US Passport. I have always maintained that obtaining a Passport would be a prudent measure for securing proper ID, prior to ever knowing about this measure, but I would continue to maintain that obtaining a Passport sooner rather than later would be in the best interest of all US Citizens at this point, based on the DHS excerpt set forth below.

What if my State does not comply with REAL ID?

If a State chooses not to comply with the provisions of the final rule, its driver’s licenses and identification cards will no longer be acceptable for official Federal purposes. Individuals of the non-compliant States can still present other forms of acceptable identification such as a U.S. passport to board federally regulated commercial aircraft and access Federal facilities.

What will be the impact on individual citizens of non-compliant States?

Per the REAL ID Act, beginning on May 11, 2008, citizens of States that are not REAL ID compliant may not use their driver’s licenses or identification cards for official federal purposes such as boarding federally regulated commercial aircraft or accessing federal or nuclear facilities. If these citizens do not have other acceptable forms of identification (e.g., a U.S. passport), they may suffer delays due to the requirement for enhanced security screening. REAL ID-compliant States are those that have both requested and obtained an extension of the compliance date from DHS, or have been determined by DHS to be in compliance with the Act and the final rule.

I certainly understand the necessity of having proper ID for national security purposes, but the more I read, the more I wonder whether or not having a US Passport alone, will be entirely sufficient in the future.

What are your thoughts on this matter?

Paul from NJ

We applied for our passports on January 4th and we received them today, January 14th. :)

Good for you!!!:D At least you won't have to worry about pre-vacation travel documentation anxiety!

Do yourself a favor and make at least 2 color photocopies of the passports. Bring one with you along on your trip, kept in a safe place, separate from the original. Keep the other copy in a safe place at home, safety-deposit box, or wherever you keep important documents. The copy will facilitate replacement of your original passport in the unfortunate event you were to lose the original.

Enjoy your upcoming trip!!!

Paul from NJ

Hi Paul,

Nice to hear from you again. I think that with the ongoing changes, many people will throw up their hands, say 'Oh for Heaven's sake' and just get the passport. At some point, keeping track of the variety and further revisions to the list of acceptable documents will overwhelm the average person. It originally was the intent of DHS to require a passport/passcard for everyone, and I suspect this latest move is more of a Big Stick persuasion than anything else. But there is still a choice--albeit a choice that is becoming increasingly more difficult to exercise--and I want to ensure that cruisers on this board are at least aware of their options, as well as their obligations. I suppose, for me, the issue is less the actual cost (and as you may recall, I am now on my fourth passport myself) than the principal of law.

 

From what I understand, your current NJ license is materially compliant with the Real ID act. OTOH, I happen to live in a state that allows illegal aliens to receive Driver Licenses, so I expect a real showdown when folks suddenly cannot use their New Mexico DL as ID at the airport. (Except for the ones like me; I also have a passport and a federal ID card). Unless the Governor blinks, which he may well do since he is no longer in a presidential campaign. It will be verrrrry interrrrresting to see how this plays out in all 50 states.

 

LBNL, how was your shakedown cruise? Thrilling and inspiring I trust?

Hey Cheryl,

Thanks for your reply. I think the bottom line is that the system is continually going to be undergoing upgrades and there is no question that a Passport is the best form of ID available as of today. As it looks now...a Passport alone may not be enough in the future. I don't work for the DOD, the US Dep't of State, The Dep't of Homeland Security, the CBP...or any other Governmental agency...so I don't advocate getting a Passport for the sake of benefitting the US Treasury, however, it seems obvious to me that, a Passport is the one thing that any traveller should obtain sooner rather than than later.

My 'Tiger Cruise" aboard the USS Enterprise was outstanding, and particularly emotional when the ship returned to Norfolk, being among 5,000+ Sailors and Marines, waiting to disembark the ship, to walk down the gangway into the arms of their loved ones...particularly the Sailors and Marines who would see their newborn children for the first time.

The average person can't buy a cruise like I was on...invitation only...it was 'priceless'.

If you are interested...check out the following links for still photos and video.

http://www.kodakgallery.com/I.jsp?c=iopr9ig.sjhp0zs&x=0&h=1&y=-kctkzr

Once again, it is a pleasure to have made your aquaintence. You are very knowledgeable, informed, and helpful.

Talk soon, Paul from NJ

Here is a new wrinkle to the entire Passport/passcard/BC-DL question:

 

The Real ID act will require the use of a Driver's License which complies with the Real ID act for federal purposes, which includes domestic airport security, entering a federal building or getting on a cruise ship.

 

In the Final Rule published Jan 11, 2008 DHS says the states have until May of this year to apply for an extension waiver to meet the regulations. Residents of States which do not already meet the requirements or apply for the waiver will not be able to use their state Driver License for federal ID purposes after May 2008.

 

Several states have declared they will not comply with the Real ID act*, but these states could still apply for the waiver. Doing so would give residents of those states until at least Dec. 31, 2009 to use their state DL for federal ID purposes. IF their state did not comply with the graduated requirements they would need an alternate document for ID (passport or passcard). If their state materially complies with most of the requirements, they have until 2014.

 

This means that travellers will now need to keep track of whether or not their state issued DL is compliant or not. OR, go ahead and get a passport or passcard for domestic travel use.

 

*The 17, according to the ACLU, are Arkansas, Colorado, Georgia, Hawaii, Idaho, Illinois, Maine, Missouri, Montana, Nebraska, Nevada, New Hampshire, North Dakota, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Tennessee and Washington

 

California and New Jersey have stated they intend to comply. For all other states, contact your local legislator and Motor Vehicles departments.

Hi Cheryl,

It certainly has become increasingly more abstact and complicated to know what traveling documents will be required to travel anywhere, as it seems that just as you learn the rules...the rules change.

I live in NJ, one of the states you indicate will comply with the Real ID ruling. However, in NJ, there is a 6 point residency/citizenship verification process already in place. In this past December, I renewed my Drivers license and received a 'digital drivers license' with embedded features. I am not quite sure whether or not this license meets the requirements of the "Enhanced Drivers License" or the "Real ID".

I have recently flown to Jacksonville, FL, from Norfolk, VA, cruised aboard a US Navy Aircraft Carrier, and drove from Vermont into Quebec, Canada, and the only ID I had to display at all of the above, was my US Passport.

Hence, my insistence that a Passport is the only way to travel. If you can afford to go on a cruise, consider the $112 for passport and picture, at a US Post Office, (forgive me I misquoted the cost in a previous post), part of the cost of taking the trip. It will be peace of mind and the US Passport is a Federal ID, and not based upon the bureaucracy of a state government.

Thanks for your continued input and updates and have a great day!!!

Paul from NJ

Ok, just so that I am crystal clear...we will NOT need a passport for cruise travel. We can purchase this card and use it for cruising but not AIR travel and it is still good for 10 yrs!??

 

I hope so, because this is a huge savings!!

I personally would refer to the Department of Homeland Security website and while there, sign up for e-mail updates, as this information changes frequently, e.g. the "Real ID Act" to be implemented in the future. The following is an excerpt from the DHS, as of today, that should answer your question. The burden of proof of citizenship falls on you alone, at the time that you are traveling. My advice would be to save up and get a passport...eventually you will need one if you plan to leave the US and expect to return to the US, anytime in the future. The cost of $115, including photo's, at your local post office, will put your traveling document worries to rest.

For U.S. Citizens

Travel Document Requirements - Traveling to Canada, Mexico, the Caribbean, or Bermuda U.S. Citizens (including children) must present a passport or other other WHTI-compliant documentation to enter or depart the United States if traveling by air.

Beginning January 31, 2008, U.S. Citizens traveling by land or sea will need to present the following to enter or depart the United States:

• Ages 19 and older: a government-issued photo ID, such as a driver’s license, along with proof of citizenship, such as a birth certificate or naturalization certificate
  
• Children ages 18 and younger: proof of citizenship, such as a birth certificate.

The following is the link to DHS...

http://www.dhs.gov/xtrvlsec/crossingborders/

Do yourself a favor and get a passport...it is valid for 10 years...and in the future there will almost certainly be a mad rush to obtain a passport...and no doubt...the cost will go up as the demand increases.

Hope this is helpul to you.

we are taking our family april 2008 on a cruise out of miami. it is our gift to them. there will be 16 people 5 are children. this will be their vacation for awhile. they need to save what they can and if that means they can go without passports good. i believe in them we have them for dh and self. what will they need birth certificate and photo for children also?

It depends on which country or countries you are going to, but this is an excerpt from the Department of Homeland Security at:

http://www.dhs.gov/xtrvlsec/crossingborders/

For U.S. Citizens

Travel Document Requirements - Traveling to Canada, Mexico, the Caribbean, or Bermuda U.S. Citizens (including children) must present a passport or other other WHTI-compliant documentation to enter or depart the United States if traveling by air.

Beginning January 31, 2008, U.S. Citizens traveling by land or sea will need to present the following to enter or depart the United States:

• Ages 19 and older: a government-issued photo ID, such as a driver’s license, along with proof of citizenship, such as a birth certificate or naturalization certificate
  
• Children ages 18 and younger: proof of citizenship, such as a birth certificate.

If you are going to a country other than the above, check with the country directly through www.travel.state.gov

Make sure that the Birth Certificates are original or certified copies with raised seal, NOT a photocopy.

Hope this helps and enjoy your trip!!! Happy New Year!!!

Paul from New Jersey

Actually the "Round Trip cruises from a US port" are permanently excepted from the passport requirement in the WHTI. The second phase implementation will not change that.

 

 

Lastly, thanks for your service. Having been married for 25 years to a Dual Winged Naval Aviator I know exactly what you do in service for this country and what you give up to do that.

Thank you Cheryl and I am glad that we agree to agree... on the wisdom of having a passport...lol.

That having been said...I am not in the US Navy myself, however my son is...and I will be onboard the USS Enterprise as a participant in a 'Tiger Cruise', in which family members are allowed to witness first hand, the day to day experiences, effort, and work that our Sailors and Marines (as well as all of the members of our Armed Forces), put forth to defend our freedom.

I am very excited about the opportunity to be able to be a part of this experience in 9 days and counting...and to the Homecoming of the ship, for all of the families and loved ones who are not able to participate on the "Tiger Cruise".

Anyone can buy a ticket for passage on a cruise ship...but not everyone can cruise on an Aircraft Carrier. I consider myself lucky and blessed that I will have this opportunity.

Thank you for your kind words, Best Wishes, and Happy Holidays to you and yours.

Paul from New Jersey

Thank you. I suppose I should have also said complete as well as current. The State Dept website has since been updated but still only summarizes the DHS information, whereas the DHS site lists all the exceptions to the passport requirement. Cruises being one of the exceptions.

You are welcome.

I am not concerned for myself having a US Passport as I have recently received one. I only suggest that travelers who do not...should consider getting one in the near future.

I have also registered with the DHS, to receive, via email, info. concerning travel restrictions and other updates offered. Anyone can register for the same, at www.dhs.gov

Cruises, according to the WHTI, are excepted, until a still undetermined date in the future...either Summer 2008, or I read...Summer 2009...

But he who hesitates is lost...not to mention waiting until then...one thing is certain...the cost of a Passport will NOT go down.

Again...enjoy your trip...I will be on an active Aircraft Carrier for my next cruise...and I will have my Passport!!!

great idea to have a passport. but a large family who will not being going out of the country after trip this is difficult money wise

bia

Understood. Exactly why I took my two daughters out of the country before the new Passport requirements are enacted. Eventually I see having a Passport as a necessity rather than a luxury, regardless of whether or not you leave the country.

The State dept website refers you to the DHS website, where the most current information is found. See also page 10 of this thread for links and summaries.

I understand what you are saying, however, I can tell you that from just now visiting the DHS and CBP websites, that their travel information is no more current than that of The US Department Of State at www.travel.state.gov .

For the total current cost of $122.00, including photos, for a US Passport, taken at your local US Post Office (depending upon Passport services provided at your particular branch) it will be well worth the cost to eliminate the 'unknown' factor by NOT having the Passport in your hands...when traveling abroad or elsewhere.

I hope you enjoy your next trip.

I was told ALL must have a passport to cruise beginning Jan. 1, 08. This from my cruise travel agent. I didn't check all the threads so I hope it's not redundant! Mary

My advice would be to go the The US Department Of State website at www.travel.state.gov . Look under the heading "New Travel Requirements For US Citizens". I would rely on the information on this website before I would rely on the information from any other persons.

Moreover, I believe it will be in everyone's best interest to obtain a valid passport in the nearest future whether or not you plan to travel outside the US, since it is a universally accepted form of ID. Not to mention...apply for one before the next mad rush and they raise the cost!!!

I hope this is helpful.

Paul from New Jersey

I was told by the cruise line that my mom would not need a passport. She is disabled and won't be able to cruise, or travel for that matter, much longer so I did not want to go through the expense of getting her a passport. We were told that as long as the ship departs and returns to a US port that she could travel with just her driver license and birth certificate. We are only going to Ensenada. Have we been given erroneous information?

The short answer in my opinion is NO... but...

Please do yourself a favor and go to the website http://travel.state.gov ...all of the information you will need will be found there.

Have a nice trip!!!

Paul

A valid Passport is the best form of ID available. In today's world, it has become increasingly more important to have a valid passport in your possession...whether or not you plan to leave your country of origin. I applied at the Post Office on August 11, and received my Passport on September 10, without expedited service. It is the new Electronic Passport with integrated biometric chip.

My advice to anyone is to get the Passport NOW...before the cost does go up...it is good for 10 years...worry about the increased cost 10 years from now when you have to renew it!!!