BrianLo

On 5/21/2024 at 7:38 PM, richstowe said:

Your point? If it's that 300 million translates to only $22 per cruise I'd say there are lots of ways the experience can be lessened for that amount. For instance, how much does eliminating Broadway shows save them? I'm betting much less than that.

They used the example of duplicated onboard casts. Removing SIX opened up 10 revenue cabins being occupied by the cast. Which isn’t entirely Insignificant.

Though they used the example of SIX versus elements. How the latter is better received by guests and is cheaper and is done by their onboard cast. All of which I believe (and I liked SIX).

It is a bit silly they have 10+ day sailing and the casts do a single show. So I’m not actually that negative on their thought process, but at the same juncture they didn’t have the replacements line up. They thought they could sub in Wheel and it blew up in their face.

I’ll be very curious to see how they handle the entertainment on Aqua.

Another small tidbit. Non-newbuild Capex is increasing 40% in 2025/26 over 2024 (which they qualify as both maintenance and investment).

I think 2024 is fairly "normal" or even a bit elevated for just straight dry-dock time, since it was so deferred for a lot of the fleet. This suggests to me we might see some of the enhancement programs start to return.

I guess Joy sort of had spending as well this year; it seems like a lot more should be coming down the pipeline.

15 minutes ago, Panhandle Couple said:

Stock jumped over 7% today. 

Ya, very good stuff for the stock. Ho-hum for NCL as a brand differentiator. I felt like NCL was somewhat heading upstream to Celebrity, but now seems to be swimming back downstream where the oodles of money is.

4 minutes ago, JustAPilot said:

That’s to bad, NCL had some great itineraries especially in Europe. More tourists trap sailings to Costa Maya and what ever that Dominican stop is and sitting with thousands of others in a lazy river is not my forte. 

For the moment, it doesn't look like they are reducing the variety, but diluting.

All new product through 2026 are being added to the Caribbean market. Rather than seemingly them shifting ships back. The Caribbean market inherently has shorter cruises so I think that also reduced their lengths of cruises fleet wise by dilution.

NCLH had their investors day today.

Highlights or low-lights;

-Drifting more itineraries towards Caribbean.

-Moving towards shorter itineraries

-Moving towards more consistent repetition of itineraries for a given ship

-Focusing on more things to upsell above product above all

-Ongoing drifting to more higher end cabins in percentage mix

-Focusing more on their private islands, more itineraries to include

-Moving towards larger, more efficient ships (we kind of already knew this, but spelled out as a strategy).

-Cost containment, as always

-CruiseFirst seems permanent. Which is a bit odd as I find it somewhat of a redundant program to CruiseNext, there is no real actual benefit to CruiseNext really (other than they hawk it). I'm not complaining, CruiseFirst is more consumer friendly.

All things good for the stock and that have worked well for RCL. Many things I'm not personally that enthralled with, that RCL does.

Thanks for the review.

Any idea if anything of significance was changed during the dry dock?

3 hours ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

I was on both the Sun and Sky last year, and they both are in great shape.

Should have clarified I didn’t mean they need it now. But that they need to decide in 3-5 years what the long term fleet vision is. If those ships are going to last 20 more years, they’ll need another major investment cycle. First and foremost Dawn and Star. Sun/Sky already got the partial treatment that culminated in Spirit.

NCL needs to figure out in the next 3-5 years if Star/Dawn, Sky/Sun are getting a final kick at the can. They need a hard goods full refurbishment on the scale of Spirit. That buys them perhaps a final 10-15 years in the fleet.

Even still that only carries the small end of the fleet through the 2036 build plans. Will NCL go small-er subsequently?

I actually think the 5000 vessels are smart though, NCL covered their bases with a really nice variety of ships.

I'd love to see a couple small-mid 'cold weather' vessels though as their next push. More intimate Alaska, Patagonia, Antartica, Iceland, Norway, Greenland options. Get the Prima out of there where it doesn't belong. Especially something to sail Stars currently itineraries. Something with purpose built tenders... honestly like Celebrity Edge Class or a tad smaller.

I'm a bit surprised and actually kind of impressed that their roadmap is so laid out now. I really thought we'd hear about a Celebrity new class order well before NCL, or even RCL.

These four new ships are probably going to be Caribbean focused only. I don't terribly mind them having a large sized class, considering they've otherwise kept things on the smaller end.

Though I'd be a big fan of them going to the Spirit overhaul maneuver for Dawn/Star, Sky/Sun. That buys those ships another 10 years... but we're already talking about ten years from now with this order.

What they do need though is a long term replacement goal for the exotic sailings that their small ships do... Prima class should have been that, but the inability to use tenders and the warm weather focus is a major inherent flaw.

4 hours ago, 7Contraveler said:

How is the trip? Is it worth it? Contemplating doing the same one way next year. 

I had a good time! The itinerary changes were mildly disappointing, but I just had an exceedingly early ship tour (4:45 departure for a game drive) to compensate one day and I think the other  I replaced with a non ship tour as they cancelled mine from under me and didn’t offer an option. Richards Bay had bad weather (not their fault-but also lost out on a tour there) and Luderitz was cancelled outright. I was also in South Africa for a week before and I’d highly recommend something similar if you are traveling far. The entire starter week was great!

Overall though I saw the big game and each of the drives I did all had their respective highlights that all seemed complimentary. If the itinerary was a little less altered, which it should be in theory, I’d highly recommend.

I’m going to do Doha to Mauritius leg next year. Hopefully that’s less dramatic as well! 😂

On 3/26/2024 at 1:05 PM, NCL ruined vacation said:

@complawyerThen they did the same thing to the cruise that followed our cruise. The did same to a cruise around south africa. This is NCL’s current operating model.

Just a correction, they emailed us on February 28th for the South Africa Cruise itinerary changes. The Cruise left March 8th.

22 hours ago, RocketMan275 said:

How do you know what the majority prefers?

I’m not one for basing reality sheerly on anecdotes, but 7 versus 1000+ being the differential on Wheel versus Elements is pretty damning. 
 

Now Price of Right is a Production show and is very, very popular. Wheel of Fortune is Bingo adjacent that landed in the wrong venue at the wrong time.

edit: don’t ask me why the photos are uploaded upside down, but anyways the receipts.

On 3/17/2024 at 6:15 PM, schmoopie17 said:

In my review of our trip on the Jade last week, I talked about the failure of this game. 

There was a delay of over half an hour due to "technical difficulties", after which they ended up canceling the game altogether. However, the technical difficulties didn't stop them from begging for people to pay to play the game the whole time. Apparently, the suck---I mean players---who contributed money got refunds, but I can't verify it.

 

Also, the theater was only about a third full...which is an indication of what the cruisers think about this "entertainment" option.

10% full on mine, only 7 players signed up so they had to cancel (minimum is 20). They did reattempt it a second night, at least wedged in between the comedy act, but I didn’t bother the second go round to see if it got off the ground or not.

Just got out of elements, it was fully packed with the requisite standing ovation. Of course there’s a second showing.

I really feel like this time the guests are voting correctly and in unison. I just wish upper management had been on my cruise, a true indictment. At the very least they need to shuttle this to the bliss lounge or equivalent at 3PM on a Sea day and get it out of the main theater.

I really don’t feel like it is sticking around though, both from lack of interest and from guest issues. They are at least going to get metrics on paid uptake and not be impressed.

I’m batting about 25% missed, cancelled, rescheduled ports with NCL, over 8 cruises.

25% of that is bad luck, 25% is weather, 25% is the itineraries I book and it is starting to feel like 25% is the fault of NCL.

I am booked for Greenland June 2025, so I apologize to everyone who hopes it is going there! But at least that one was warned reasonably ahead of things and the replacement ports are not bad, assuming that’s what they do next year. But they are still offering Greenland itineraries for June 2025…

10 hours ago, UKstages said:

I would submit to you that it's not the age of the audience that's the problem... it's the reliability of the internet connection and how NCL implements the software. it also may depend on the user interface/experience designed by the gaming company.

Absolutely. And again my comment was meant to be an indictment against the tech service, not the age demographic.

9 hours ago, ready2cruzagain said:

I am older (well old for me late 50s) and have no problems working a phone, computer or anything else technical. I do not go on a cruise and use my cell phone. It goes in the safe and stays there until the day we get ready to get off of the ship. 

Also absolutely. Perhaps I should have re-worded it that the older generation doesn’t ‘like’ the experience. It wasn’t meant to be a capability issue or indictment.
 

Experiencing the same software on the free version on the Edge didn’t go over so well. A lot of people said they just wanted a pen and paper. I liked it, but I think the enjoyment aspect is generational rather than capability. 

11 hours ago, ontheweb said:

At the meeting with the officers, I did ask the officer who was in charge of the stewards about their workload. He tried to say that they really did not have more cabins than pre-Covid.

 

He later noticed me at the latitudes meeting and thanked me for the question.

I’d be a bit surprised if they didn’t have at least a few more cabins in some form, maybe not the doubling like the RCL test bubble attempted.

Otherwise, where is the cost savings if house keeping crew also can’t be cut back? Maybe a few less refreshed towels.

16 minutes ago, UKstages said:

the contemporary cruiser line is a nod to a frequent comment we see here on cruise critic... that there is somehow something called a "contemporary cruiser" and that NCL is making all manner of changes to appeal to the tastes of this predictable and pigeon-holed mythical beast.

 

we have previously noted here that "wheel" seemed to be more of a slipshod affair hosted by the cruise director... more of a pimped out "deal or no deal" than a genuine "show" with the production values of "price is right." some who have seen it have seemed to enjoy it. but it ain't professional cruise ship show business entertainment.

 

with regard to the over 50 crowd, you are not going to find much sympathy for those comments here. many of our frequent posters are on sixth and seventh or eighth avenue and most are quick witted vibrant folks who would have no problem playing the game or regaling the audience with tales, both tall and small. now, paying $$$ for the game, they'd have a problem... and rightly so. but no problems for the average joe to play.

sorry, that comment didn’t come off the way I meant.

It is making one’s phone connect to finicky timeplay that seems to give older generations a hard time. But they do have lots of crew walking around helping. It’s just a messy way of appealing to an older crowd, who would much rather have a physical wheel and low barrier to entry. It’s the antithesis of what the actual “Wheel Demographic” wants. Probably why people just stand up and leave.

1 minute ago, UKstages said:

 

my experience has been that cabin attendants very quickly learn the schedules of their guests and adjust their rounds accordingly, so they accommodate guests whenever they can.

I think I just have a sub par steward right now, you are probably right. The quantum test cruise one they actually seemed seriously understaffed.

On 2/29/2024 at 8:04 PM, Smitheroo said:

I sure would like to know what people miss so much about no more "turn down service"  Ok, I get the towel animals. They're cute. But people are upset because someone doesnt come into their cabin before bed and turn down the covers? (I'm assuming that's what it is)  Seriously?   

I don’t miss the turn down itself personally. But what I have found is that the quality of the whole housekeeping has declined because your room stewards room load is doubled.

I mean it is probably steward dependent, but my worst experience was on Quantum, we happened to be the Australian bubble cruise where the once a day was trialed, before NCL or RCL officiated. My poor steward seemed overwhelmed and basically couldn’t get to my room until 1630. I sent him away one time because I just didn’t feel like leaving pre dinner and the poor guy was so concerned that I wouldn’t have anything since his shift was ending.

I largely find now you get your room cleaned based on the order they do cabins. Putting your ‘clean my room now’ sign is meaningless, it will literally go ignored for up to 8 hours if you are towards the back of their load.

it was a breath of fresh air on the Celebrity Edge recently to have the double service and the room steward who would see us leave for breakfast and go in and out like a ninja.

I mean, you do eventually learn when you are due, and right now I’ve learned my time is about 2PM on my current cruise. Didn’t matter that my you can clean my room now thing was flagged at 4am (literally).

2 minutes ago, UKstages said:

but, but, but... i have it on very good authority that the contemporary cruiser loves game shows!

I probably qualify as a contemporary cruiser (mid millennial), NCL apologist, lover of Price is Right on Prima… I even like Prima. I even can claim I paid for Price is Right Live when it toured through our city over a decade ago and it was great fun (and I won money so that probably impacts the experience)…

But what just went down with this wheel of fortune thing is embarrassing. It’s the one thing I’ll highlight as an out and out con on my survey, even on another highly disrupted cruise.
 

Also time play with anyone older than 50 is not a smart idea… and 50+ is the Wheel demographic. I did a timeplay free trivia on Celebrity Edge and it was great, but boy did the audience struggle and that wasn’t when there was a charge on the line.

I’m still reading through the thread, but I have good news folks. Just almost sat in my first Wheel of Fortune on the Dawn. I was ready to exaggerate how poorly it was attended… I say almost because seven people signed up and they needed a minimum of 20, so it was cancelled. No exaggeration required. All the previous entertainment has been well attended.

This was the 8PM Theatre show for the night. Sea day tomorrow. The 7PM Broadway Cabaret show in Bliss was packed with standing room only. There’s a second broadway cabaret show at 9.

As someone who said there was no way this was an entertainment replacement… well I was wrong. But trust me NCL is going to get the message, this isn’t lasting.

For anyone who has actually seen this show (since I haven’t), I also want to say the Price is Right is an actual production. Don’t hold this cheap time play experience that should occur in the bliss lounge at 3PM on a Sea day, against the more elaborate game shows.

3 minutes ago, FPMoosally said:

 

It could be sooner. Occupancy rates won't stay at 100% forever. Eventually NCL will need to attract more customers, and cheap cookies and hashbrowns (among other things) would be an easy start. Imagine the joy and positive threads when they return!

 

 

 

Yes, I definitely think the worst of it is behind us. I was joking about 2027 somewhat. Additional cost savings seem to be stuff behind the scenes, like fuel and reducing food waste with better metrics. 
 

The company will have cleared its highest interest debt and its secured debt by year end, which will allow it to relax a little bit moving forward into subsequent years.

The investor day in May should be interesting as they can start talking a little more about the future and not merely tread water. In some ways we are lucky they had so many ships on order as I think they definitely would have fallen behind their peers with ship orders, otherwise. I think in a few years some of the capital investment starts flowing, would be interesting to see if the Dawn/Sun classes get some Spirit-like money thrown their way for refurbs to increase their longevity.

Stock has significantly lagged behind its peers, particularly Royal. But now some general cause for optimism that the company is no longer in a looming disaster scenario. NCL really couldn’t have weathered an additional year shutdown, but it’s on a positive trajectory. The balance sheet should be sufficiently deleveraged in three years time to pre pandemic levels and then the aggressive cutting can likely stop as they ‘discover’ guest satisfaction can be improved with judicious spending.

Hashbrowns and cookies galore in 2027!

Count me as another who’d gladly go again (and subsequently am booked on Viva, which sort of qualifies).

I think it’s one of those things where the people who dislike it, really-really-really dislike it. But that strong opinion tends to overweight and drown out more than it would imply from a representative perspective. 
 

Even in probably a more critical, less open to change group such as is represented on these boards, you weight 75% of people who liked it.

Not to say I can’t identify some of its flaws. Though I’m quite positive Aqua will be much more well received. Some of the shock factor of the differences will be normalized and some of the biggest (or should I say smallest) design perpetrators will be enlarged and addressed. Including some of the people who dislike the class to an extreme extent should have self opted out by the time aqua releases.

Apparently there are 1500 people doing a back to back next cruise. Which I balked and swear I misheard (from the captain). 38 only on the Auckland turnaround a few days ago.

I didn’t back to back, but plenty of signage was up for it in Sydney on the 4th.