MATHA531

Does anyone have the Barclay's Hawaiian code and can confirm that it is chip and pin secondary?

It is available with an emv chip. I'm not sure if they send you one with the chip automatically but you can certainly request one if they don't. It is what seems to be the direction the American banks have chosen to go i.e. it is what is referred to as a priority 1 chip and signature with a fall back chip and pin where the card determines it is necessary. It should cover you for most everything. Barclay's Bank does plan to add emv technology to its arrival card sometime this year and it will be the same. Their claim is their using the Hawaian Airlines card to test out the bugs.

Hope that helps.

Well, here you go although I would not be sure the food is identical to that in the US. In Istanbul the Big Macs were made with ground lamb.

Boy look how crowded the place is! Wonder if most of them are locals. Incidentally, although it may have been eclipsed recently, for years the McDonald's in Moscow across from Red Square or whatever it is called now had the distinction of being the largest one in the world.

Well to be truthful about it, I wouldn't mind a stop at a local Russian McDonald's which is my m.o. in most places where this very picky eater (me) is afraid to sample local cuisine. At least, I would know, I could go up to the counter, ask for a royal cheeseburger (which we in the USA know as a quarter pounder with cheese), fries and a coke (probably a set meal) and have some idea of what I'm eating (McDonald's is one of the few companies I trust to make sure their beef meets certain international standards and with few exceptions, and I've sampled Mickey D in such places as the Netherlands, Great Britain, Poland and the Czech Republic and the food tasted identical to what I could get a home and it was always sort of fun to see these places jammed but I mean jammed with locals. I would love to see what a local in St. Petersburg McDonald's looks like. But of course, the tours have to serve to the lowest common denominator and I read on the Alla blog, the meal entrees on the comfort tour (the deluse tour has the packaged lunch in Peterhof) will hae an entre of, surprise surprise, chicken or turkey...

A few of us on CC have been able to get the Visa Global Trek card from Andrews Federal Credit Union. Their card is a true EMV Chip/PIN although it will default to Chip/Signature if it is available. There card has no annual fees and no foreign exchange fees. They issue it with credit limits up to $50,000 (not easy to get the higher limits) and they offer a way (mentioned on their web site) to make nearly anyone eligible for membership in their credit union. They do seem to have tough credit standards and getting their card does involve a little work.

 

Hank

Just for the record and probably it will still be confusing to some if not many, this is still not quite a true chip and pin card as is true for virtually all the American cards which claim to be chip and pin. Why not? Because as noted, its first priority is chip and signature at the pos terminals most merchants use. In some rare cases, although the numbers are increasing and here's the rub, some merchants refuse to accept transaction made with these cards. It has been reported. The merchant, sometimes just a student with a part time job, doesn't have a clue about the intricacies of this whole thing and has been indoctrinated that if you accept a card containing an emv chip and don't use the pin authorization, the merchant is liable for fraud. As noted, it is a small occurrance. The problem is that although the card is chip and pin secondary, you don't control that. If the pos terminal takes chip and signature, that's what will be produced. Certainly the Andrews card is far better than no chip and pin at all, I don't questin that for a second and if that's the emv chip card you have, it's pretty effective and will work or at least it should in automatics ticketing machines.

Unfortunately, this seems to be the direction the American banks have decided to adopt leaving, as far as I know, really only 3 "true" chip and pin cards. USAA MC, UNFCU (which has recently opened up membership by joining a pro UN organization at a minimum cost of $25/year and Diners Club which is currently not being offered to US residents and has a hefty annual fee.

Not trying to be confusing, contrary minded or anything like that. But them are the facts.

So my fiancee has a USAA account (and phenomenal credit) so we were planning on upgrading to their Chip/pin card...but now I'm not sure because of the foreign exchange rates.

 

Maybe I missed it somewhere, but do any of the true chip/pin cards have zero forex fees or just the ones that have chip/pin as a secondary?

 

(hides from the people who will yell at me that this has already been answered)

The what for lack of a better term I'll call the priority chip/sig cards which can fall back on chip/pin are the ones issued by the 3 fcu's in the DC area primarily although there are others. They are State Department FCU, Andrews FCU, and Pen(tagon) FCU (all open to everybody). All have no annual fees and no foreign transaction fees and relatively puny rewards programs. As it stands today, to the best of my knowledge, as you note, USAA MC is one of the few true chip and pin cards but has the 1% foreign transaction fee which is relatively low (many of the larger banks charge 3%). Look, it doesn't hurt to get the card and have it available as a back up just in case you run into a problem. Right now, my primary card is Bank of America travel rewards but it is chip and signature. I do carry the USAA card and am prepared to use it, and suffer the 1% consequences, if necessary. So far, it hasn't been necessary.

(Also I believe USAA ha a MC which has a 1% cash rewards program which would cancel out the 1% foreign transaction fee which is also a direction you can look).

Guess we need to explain this again (have done it in other posts). The EMV Chip (which is necessary for a Chip/PIN card) has various pieces of date encoded onto the Chip (it cannot be changed). One piece of data is whether the card defaults to the Pin option or the signature option (Chip/PIN cards can be programmed for either default option). In the USA, the few issuers of true EMV Chip/PIN cards (such as Andrews Federal Credit Union) have chosen to program the default to the "Signature" mode since it costs the financial institution less money to process a Signature transaction versus the PIN transaction. However, if the terminal used to process the transaction is set to accept PIN only (like at an automatic gas pump, some restaurants, etc) then the Pin does work and the terminal will request the user to input their Pin.

 

But, and this is the big but, some cards issued in the USA that are called Chip/Signature cards (even those with a compatible EMV Chip) may or may not have the Pin function enabled...or the user may not have ever received their PIN. In that case, the card will be worthless at terminals that only accept the PIN function.

 

To complicate matters even more, if you have one of those so-called Chip/Signature cards and call the issuing bank's customer service, there is a good change they will not have a clue to what I have described or to whether their card will actually work at a European Chip/PIN terminal. These banks really need to update their "scripts" so they can answer the questions, but for whatever reason they have been slow to train their reps and update the scripts.

 

Hank

P.S. We realize this info is somewhat redundant to info in other posts (including mine) but the nature of CC is that one must repeat themselves again and again and again for the readers that either do not bother to read all the posts or are unable to easily absorb what they read :)

All the absolute truth and I don't disagree with a single word. The one drawback, as I have said, occurs when the merchant's acquirer processor accepts chip and signature (the pos terminal starts spitting out a receipt) and the merchant on his or her own decides he or she will not complete the transaction for a variety of reasons; mostly a mistaken belief that is impressed on them by their processors that their liability is increased if they process a chip and pin card without a pin. It doesn't happen frequently but it happens. As I said, there is no way for you the cardholder with such a card, says the Andrews card, to get it to fall back on the pin function but as I said this seems to be the direction the American banks have decided to travel as the brand new Barclay Hawaian card is such a card as will be their arrival card when they issue them with the emv chip in the second and third quarter.

The other point is that there has been some limited success reported by some on various blogs I have looked at, especially in Denmark, who have a chip and signature card, the pos terminal requests a pin and they enter their cash advance pin (which is an online pin). I wouldn't count, however, on this always being so.

I agree with everything else you said.

Yeah, I tried to lay it out too in post 4 above, but I now fear my post did more harm than good. I'll try again, this time focusing not on the technology, but on the usefulness of the card. For those in the US wanting to use their cards abroad, there are four types of card:

 

1) A regular credit card with no chip and only a magnetic stripe on the back. Up until recently, this was the standard card issued in the US. You can tell whether or not you have a chip by looking at the card. If you have a chip, it's a little square with some lines in it. You will see it. If you don't, you have a no chip, magnetic stripe only card. This card will cause you problems abroad. It will work many places, but many will not accept it. If you have only this card in your wallet, take lots of cash.

 

2) A USA issued card with a chip in it, that has only chip and signature capability. The vast majority of cards issued in the USA with chips in them now are this kind of card -- chase sapphire, Amex platinum, BofA's cards with chips, citi, etc. They are all chip and sig. If you got it from one of the major credit card issuers, and it has a chip in it, this is probably what you have. This card will be fine for most travelers who do not stray from the beaten path. It will work in restaurants, hotels, and most places you will go, except for unmanned stations, like ticket kiosks. Also, some vendors have handheld credit card terminals and they are not very educated on these cards and will simply not process your transaction when their terminal doesn't ask for a PIN. The issuers of these cards lie or are misinformed when you call them, and will tell you it has PIN or that you don't need it. But the bottom line is these cards are fine for most uses -- if you have one, you'll be ok, just also make sure you have access to cash and be prepared to wait in lines for tickets instead of being able to use kiosks.

 

3) A USA issued card with a chip in it that has chip and pin, but has chip and pin as its second priority. There is no way to tell by looking at the card whether it has chip and pin capability. You just have to know. This card will be good for virtually every use you want to make of it overseas, so long as you remember your PIN. For most transactions, it will work as chip and sig card, but in those places where chip and sig doesn't work (see 2 above), it will change to chip and PIN and you will be good to go. There are a very small handful of places you may have problems -- but they will be off the beaten path, like remote toll booths. For cruisers, this card will 99.5 percent of the time work everywhere you need it. There are very few of these available in the USA. Until two weeks ago, the primary one of these was only available to the public through Andrews CU, through a cumbersome process. On 1/1/14, however, Barclays come out with a mass-consumer card with this functionality -- it is their Hawaiian Airlines card.

 

4) A USA issued card with a chip in it, which has chip and pin as its primary priority. This will work everywhere -- that is, it will work in the .5 percent of places that number 3 above won't. These are very hard to get in the USA. If you have access to the USAA credit union, you can get one. There also are some very small credit unions that have them. Also, you can buy prepaid cards (like from travelex) that work as true chip and pin, but these are a horrible deal.

 

So, what should you do?

 

1) If you have only a magnetic stripe card, call your issuer and see if it is available in a chip version. This will be chip and sig and will get you through 90 percent of transactions.

 

2) If you want chip and pin, get the Barclays HA card. (I don't work for the company, I promise. I just think as the first major bank to issue a mass-consumer chip and pin card, they should be rewarded with our business.) This will get you 99.5 percent of what you need and you can rest assured your card will virtually always work.

 

3) If you have USAA credit access and don't mind a pain in the butt to apply, get a true chip and pin card, and brag to your friends about how you're one of the only people in the USA that has one.

 

 

 

I've seen that page. It has a lot of misinformation. You'd almost think it was written by the banks who want you to think "EMV" and chip and pin are synonyms. If you want the truest, up to date information about which cards are out there and what has what, there is a google spreadsheet maintained as a wiki by flyertalk. Google "flyertalk and EMV cards available in the United States," and you'll get to it.

Mostly good info. Just to add a couple of things or better to clarify. USAA does have a maswtercard that is a true chip and pin card. As of last summer, it was only available on its mastercards but that may have chanted or is about to change. An article I read says USAA intends to issue all its cards with emv chips in the near future but is unclear whether they will be chip and pin or chip and signature. However, be aware USAA mastercard charges a 1% foreign transaction fee for all purchases processed outside the USA (or at the very least a 1% foreign currency fee, not sure which). Not bad but there are several credit cards that have 0% foreign transacton fees.

Now Barclays USA is indeed offering a card they claim is chip and pin on its Hawaian Airlines card. But, as with the cards issued by Andrews FCU, Pen Fed FCU and State Department FCU, it is chip and signature priority. That is in manned pos transactions, it functions as chip and signature. It will work in unmanned kiosks as chip and pin like the fcu cards. the problem is that there are merchants who in violation of their agreements with mc/visa refuse to process a chip and signature transaction with these cards under the mistaken belief their liability for fraud is increased if they don't use a pin and the catch is you can't tell the merchant or have the card fall back on chip and pin if the terminal accepts chip and signature. Barclay will be issuing emv cards on its arrival line of cards sometime this year but will be starting with the premium cards with annual fees and will not issue the emv cards for us peasants who refuse to pay annual fees until the third quarter of the year according to their blog. But it will be the same as the Hawaian Airline card; chip and signature priority with chip and pin fall back. That seems to be the direction the American banks are going.

Finally as a matter of informtion, a small credit union in the NYC area, UNFCU has now opened up membership to others than just UN employees if they join an organizaton pushing the UN for $25/year (think of it as the annual fee). It is a true chip and pin card unlike the cards described above.

Hope this clarifies a couple of issues raised here.

See post 39 I copied that off today from the B of A website where they clearly state that they do NOT have Chip & Pin technology. But if you talk to their employees they will swear that they do.

So I'm believing the Official website on this matter. This poster simply has a PIN for use in ATM's

 

I think all the banks will be jumping on this in the next year or two. The whole target thing I think will be the "straw that broke the camels back".

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app

Bank of America has several cards that have an emv chip. One of them is their travel rewards card. It has no annual fee, no foreign transaction fees and a puny rewards program. HOWEVER...

Like many of the American banks, the cards are called chip ad signature cards. They do not require a pin. Instead, when inserted in the card reader, they print out a receipt for you to sign. In theory, they will work at every pos (point of sale terminal) where there is a human being processing the card. The operative words are in theory. There is a degree of controversy regarding these cards. Some merchants refuse to process them once the receipt prints no matter what visa/mc say that they are obligated to do so because they feel their liability is increased by accepting a non pin card in a pin terminal. In some cases, the terminal asks for a pin. Sometimes the cash advance pin works (you can request a cash advance pin on this card which would be used in an ATM which is basically a no non because of the fees). Some say no need to enter a pin just press the green button. Some say to enter 0000. We get mixed answers to this.

So the answer is a definite maybe. There are banks that issue chip and pin cards but there are other associated problems with some of them described elsewhere.

It is not surprising the csr's don't have a clue. They rarely do.

I see some wrong info here the Canadian dollar is worth MORE than the US.

 

So $100 US is about 95.00 Canadian at current rates.

 

On a not so recent cruise all the Canadian ports took US at par. Those with heavy tourist traffic figure the difference isn't worth worrying about . I have gotten Canadian at an ATM, but regretted paying the premium as the US was worth the same.

ATM withdawals may, depending on your bank, be subject to a flat fee (one USbnk charges $5 for withdrawals out of the country plus they might charge a 3% foreign transaction fee.

As I said, despite the 5% spread, unless you use a credit card without a foreign transaction fee for purchases in Canada (highly recommended), you will find, although I agree that it is somewhat rude, US and Canadian currency pretty much on the merchant level are pretty much at par and a Canadian merchant is hardly losing money by taking US currency at par. As a matter of fact most probably have US dollar accountsx with their banks and make money on the tranaction. Non credit card dynamic currency converion soto speak. The only way to get the interbank rate is to use a UScredit card, and there are a few esides Cap One, that offers a card with no foreign transaction fee. Take a look at the Bank of America travel rewards card. No annual fee, no foreign transaction fee and it even has anemv chip although it's a chip and signature card not chip and pin.

As of this instant, according to xe. com, US$1 = CA$1.05008.

Yeah, I don't see Canadians as agreeing to this, ever. Politically we are closer to Europe than to the United States. Currency wise, the Canadian dollar is influenced by the US dollar and the US economy, but Canada's economy is heavily resource based (along with service industries) and so the value of our dollar increases based on things like oil and minerals. Canadians are also deficit averse, war averse and very much see personal freedoms differently than the US. We share many things, but if there was ever a referendum on it, I can pretty much guess than unless we are all offered pretty big cheques, it's not going to be for union with the US.

 

As for the current exchange rates, I usually use those of HSBC on this page... http://www.hsbc.ca/1/2/personal/banking/accounts/foreign-currency-accounts/foreign-currency-exchange and the current exchange on USD is 1.024 or CAD$102.40 per USD$100. The banks usually use a 2.5% margin on cheques and 3% on cash.

 

Just in that last year, the exchange rates have fluctuated widely. In the last 365 days, USD$100 has been worth anywhere from CAD$98.50 to CAD$105.00 (And in the last 5 years from CAD$94.86 to CAD$128.36) You can check historical rates via http://www.oanda.com/currency/historical-rates/

Hi...you're probably right I am sure. As far as currency exchange rates, I use xe.com which at this instant, as I am writing the reply, showUS$1 = CA$1.0428. Now that's the interbank rate, the rate banks use to exchange millions of dollars at atime. You might be uing the consumer rate of HSBC. What I've found in Europe is the exchange rates listed at banks haveboth abuy and sell rate with the interbank rate in the middle (of course that's the way banks make money on currency exchange just like any other bank's transactions sort of a legalized ponzi scheme but not worth disagreeing about.

Again, the best way to deal with currency when travelling in any foreign country is to use a credit card, and several US banks offer credit cards like this, with no foreign transaction fee.

In theory, it is sort of rude to expect to be able to use US currency in Canada. But there is a practical side to all this also.

Today the official exchange rate is $1.045 Canadian is $1 US. But if you go into a bank to exchange say US$100, you won't get CA$104.50. There will probably, as a matter of fact, almost certainly a transaction fee that will bring the total down to just about par, perhaps less than $1 more so you might get, if you're lucky on this exchange CA$101 after the bank deducts its fee.

My experience on a recent cruise, now I do understand the paces I went are used to cruise passengers with US currecy, took US currency at par and I think that is the norm for the most part today. So from a practical view point, it really doesn't matter (again for the most part) that you spend US currency. While it is true the merchant may pay some fees (and many Canadian banks offer US dollar accounts) there is a built in 4.5% profit in taking US money at par. You will get your change in Canadian although, you will find if you get any coins back, that US and Cnadian coins are almost interchngeable...you might fnd a bunch of American coins in your change and again, for the most part, US coins work in Canadian vending machines.

Now I will repeat. To a degree this is rude and many Canadians may feel slighted that Americans expect their money to be taken in Canada while Canadian money is routinely rejected, even the coins, even in border cities like Buffalo or Detroit. It is what it is. Of course the solution is to use credit cards without foreign transaction fees and to avoid at all costs dcc.

Sorry if I am coming across as an arrogant American. I do try to hit an ATM on arrival in Canada and pull out $20 Canadian and most times, I don't spend any of it as I use credit cards for everything everywhere they are taken and they're taken most everywhre in Canada. I'm simply trying to be pragmatic, rude or not. So I wouldn't worry. I am almost sure the taxi will either take American currency at par or a credit card.

BTW a new book has just come out discussing te inevitabiliy of a union between Canada and the USA (it's certainly not imminet) but if this ever hapened, there would be one common currency. Also be aware, Canada has done several things with its money that the US refuses to do. There are no $1 or $2 bank notes (or bills as we say) in Canada; rather they have a $1 coin(the loonie) and a $2 coin (the twoney) and they've done away with pennies (of course rounding prices up tothe next nickel). Something the USA could learn from.

We're considering Aer Lingus but are unfamiliar with them. If we did fly AL it would be from MCO or RDU to LON.

 

Can anyone give me some insight on this airline? Or are we better off paying more and going with Delta?

 

Thanks!

Assuming you are from the United States, be aware of the following...

Aer Lingus processes its visa and mc payments through a bank in Ireland. Therefore if you use a visa or mastercard that charges a foreign transaction fee, even if you book it with an on-line agency such as Orbitz or on the Aer Lingus web site, you will be nailed for a 3% foreign transaction fee by the credit card company; an unpleasant surprise many receive.

I have no idea what you're talking about. Not a date night choice? Almost no women dine there?

 

Peter Lugar likes to be exclusive and therefore only accepts their own credit card. It's nice when you find someone with a low number card, knowing they had it for decades. I don't see the problem with paying cash. Will someone give up the opportunity to experience one of the best meals out there, just because you have to pay in cash?

 

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Absotively, posilutely. This is the 21st century. I don't walk around with that kind of cash....besides this quarter my Chase freedom visa card is giving me 5% cash back on restaurant charges and when the quarter is over, beginning 01 January, I switch over to my American Extress card from Fidelity gives me 2% cash back.