Bruin Steve

[quote name='two4theroad']Still looking for info on best LAX hotel for return leg on April 9th. Want to stay near LAX due to early flight out on 10th but since we are there for 24 hours after getting off the ship I would like to find something to do, somewhere to go on that day.[/QUOTE]

Probably best asked in a separate thread...but, I'll answer here for you anyway...'

IMHO, the best option for a hotel near LAX is the Radisson in Culver City:

[url]http://www.radisson.com/culvercityca[/url]

Why? It is NOT in the strip of hotels right under the runway along Century Boulevard...Those hotels have nothing near them except industrial airport-related blight...

The Radisson is actually a couple of miles NORTH of the airport in an area with shops, movie theaters and restaurants...yet it still has a FREE airport shuttle and a direct route to the terminals without using the freeways...You've got a major, recently renovated shopping mall right across the freeway:

[url]http://westfield.com/culvercity/[/url]

Another shopping/restaurant/movie theater complex right up the street:

[url]http://www.hhpromenade.com/[/url]

An eclectic local institution of a diner right actross the street:

[url]http://www.dinahsrestaurant.com/[/url]

A local bus line that can take you to various Westside attractions:

[url]http://www.culvercity.org/Government/Transportation/Bus.aspx[/url]

A major movie studio nearby:

[url]http://www.sonypicturesstudiostours.com/[/url]

Definitely beats any of the hotels right at LAX...

The lists are so long, it is hard to just remember some...

And, they tend to vary ship to ship...

One thing that's certain is that they NEVER seem to have the songs I want to sing!!!

 

That said, I've preformed "Cheeseburger in Paradise" a few times...

And shocked some of the seniors on board by singing the Kinks' "Lola"...

One ship, I was at least happy to find CCR's "Lodi"...

 

I WISH...but have never found on a ship yet...for them to have any of the following:

Rod Stewart's "Maggie May"...

Warren Zevon's "Werewolves of London"

Bob Dylan's "Rainy Day Women"...

 

In other words, the lists are never any FUN...

 

There's only so many times I want to hear some 19 year old singing "I will Survive"... or disco hits of the 70s...or anything by Ricky Martin...

 

Give me some good, fun, classic rock...I'll even take a good TRADITIONAL Country number (not the newfangled crossover pop stuff, I mean stuff that talks about dogs and trucks and getting drunk and so on)...

 

Either Karaoke has to blow you away with talent...or...and this means most of us...it has to be silly and fun...sung by people who DON'T take themselves seriously...where they've had a couple of drinks...and they don't mind the audience singing along...

 

JMHO...

Easy way to think of it is this--and it's pretty much true for all ships on all cruise lines:

 

There are really only four types of cabins:

Inside--no windows

"Ocean View"--a window to the outside

Balcony

Suite

 

The different categories within each group (aside from suites) are really more to do with location than anything else...

All cruise lines will create different categories within the above groups with slight price differences...usually based on deck or on location within the ship...go one deck up in virtually the same cabin and you are one category higher...a cabin near midship may be one category higher than one toward the front or back...anf the "higher" category will have a marginally higher price...

 

They do this because some people perceive an advantage to a higher deck or a more midship location and are willing to pay a little more for that location...

 

Celebrity (and some other lines to some extent) have also differentiated groups of balcony cabins based on some added amenities--hence "Concierge" and "Aqua Class"...Concierge has a few added amenities and Aqua Class some special spa and dining amenities...but the cabins are basically the same as all other balcony cabins...

 

Suites, of course, are in different categories based on the size of the suite...all of which are larger than standard balcony cabins...

 

As far as I am concerned all inside cabins are basically the same--the layout is the same, the view :) is the same...The only difference is the convenience of the location and what deck you are on may be of importance to some...

 

Ocean View cabins, again, are all the same...and, for the most part, all on low decks...and, again, it's a matter of location...

 

Balconies are higher decks...and, in my mind, no difference between being on, say, Deck 7 and Deck 8...but 8 will be a slightly higher priced category...

 

Of course, if you find a cabin you like, don't worry about the category, the price difference isn't that much anyway...

 

But, really don't expect to see much of a differnece between, say, your 1C cabin and a 1A cabin or your category 10 inside from your category 11 inside...

Just got the Westin Bonaventure in Los Angeles for $80 for a Thursday in mid Jan.

anyone have any info on how this hotel is?

 

WHY???

It's a nice hotel...but...in a very poor location UNLESS you are in LA for one of few reasons:

1) You need to be in Downton LA for business

2) You are attending a conference or seminar at the hotel

3) You are attending an event at Staples, the Nokia Theater or the LA Convention Center...

 

Other than that, you are in an area where you will not want to walk out in the streets at night, where there are no restaurants or shops to go to nearby...

 

If you are there without a car and you arrived there by plane, you will spend an inordinate amount for taxis or shuttles to and from the airport...You are even farther from the cruise terminals.

 

If you have a car, you will pay an additional $42 per night to park at the hotel...

 

LA is NOT Vancouver...Downtown LA is NOT the center of things...

Downtown LA is more of an historical and geographical accident than it is an important location. California was first colonized by the Franciscan Friars, who built missions up and down the state in order to subject and convert the native populations to Christianity...In the LA area, the local native populations were densest not by the coast, but by the foothills, due to the availability of water sources...So, rather than sticking to the coastal route, the Franciscans took the mission trail inland to San Gabriel and San Fernando...The Spaniards typically built a Presidio--a fort--with each mission to protect the mission from attack...But the Spaniards didn't believe either San Gabriel or San Fernando to be an important mission, so, rather than build a presidio at each, they located a single presidio approximately halfway between the two...at a point with a ready water source--the Los Angeles River ran underground through the Glendale Narrows and emerged from the ground at the point Downtown LA is today...hence, the Spaniards built El Pueblo de Nuetra Senora la Reina de los Angeles de Porcuncula --the Town of Our Lady, the Queen of the Angel of Porcuncula (Porcuncula being a river in Spain that the small LA River, springing from undergroud, reminded them of...

 

But the small frontier fort was nowhere near much of anything...not near the harbor, not near the beach, not near the population centers of the two missions it was built to protect...

 

The harbor was TWENTY-FIVE miles away! So, economic important was diffused...as is cultural importance...

 

Aside from the missions, the Spanish divided up land by "land grants"--ranchos--large tracts of land given away to influentuial individuals--and people who wanted to farm them and hold them in the name of Spain...Over the years, as each land grant family decided to sell off or develop their rancho, different town sprung up at each of these developments--and each took on a different flavor depending on how they were developed and what was happening in the economy at the time...and how favorable the location for certain activities...

 

So, various functions and attractions are spread out all over a very wide area...The movie business sprung up at the time Hollywood and Burbank were being developed...and Beverly Hills was being developed as a residential area...Santa Monica and Venice were developed as "resort" areas...

 

Downtown LA, being one of the older settlements, but, more importanly, the seat of political power, was developed as a corporate and banking area...with industrial uses to the north, south and east of downtown...

 

But, nobody ever really wanted to live near downtown...LA was built in an era where transportation was paramount...and cheap...and easy...First, the railroads, then the automobile...For a long time, LA had an incredibly widespread fixed rail system--the Big Red Car--which was eventually bought up by a consortium made up of the auto manufacturers, tire companies and oil companies--and shut down...then replaced by freeways and roads...

 

Angelenos had no problem commuting to jobs...and living where they wanted to live...hence then nicer suburbs in all of the outlying areas...

 

So, meanwhile, Downtown LA has banks and law firms and industry...and a poorer, working class and transient and unemployed porpulation base...Monday through Friday, 8 to 6, there are bankers and lawyers and corporate types--who all desert downtown with some giant flushing sound...At night and on weekends, that leaves only the homeless, the winos, the poor and the illegals to wander the streets of Downtown...

 

Tourists are much better served staying in Santa Monica or Universal City or Beverly Hills or even West Hollywood--where there are shops and restaurants and walking streets where one can enjoyably spend an evening or night...and be close to attractions like the Venice Boardwalk or Santa Monica Pier or Getty Center Museum or Universal Studios and Citywalk or Sunset Strip, the Grove, Rodeo Drive, Third Street Promenade...

 

If you took it on Priceline, you're stuck with it...but, to anyone else even remotely considering Downtown Los Angeles, take it from a local...DON'T...

Did they move TPIR from CBS TV City?

I think loveJake was just confused about where they were when they wrote "Burbank"...

 

By the fact that they killed time by going over to "Farmer's Market", that indicates it clearly was CBS Television City...

 

For those not from the area, Burbank is a town "over the hill" from and Northeast of Hollywood--you go north of Hollywood on the 101 through the Cahuenga Pass, pass Universal City and cut back on the 134 and you're in Burbank...

 

CBS is in the other Direction--Southwest of Hollywood in the "Fairfax District"...Just North of CBS is the old Jewish neighborhood with Canter's Deli (an LA institution and favorite of celebs)...immediately south of CBS is the old original LA Farmer's Market and the new "Grove" shopping center that was recently developed around it...

eye yi yi....but now he has THINKS he wants to stay right in the heart of LA- *[/i]holding hands in the air!*

....and we do have the car rental.

...please... Ideas in the LA area so we can walk outside and enjoy the evening...

 

Pam, here's the deal:

 

You cannot look at LA like any other city you may know...

Maybe you could say we're "heartless"...

 

Most cities in the world are built around a central "Downtown"...most of the business, the jobs, the culture, etc. is there...with residential areas spreading out from spokes all radiating in toward the hub...Everyone commutes into downtown to work, then back out to the suburbs to live...

 

NYC, with Manhattan as the hub, fits that model...

 

But NOT LA...

LA has been described as 100 small cities run together...

There are dozens of "Downtowns" spread all over the megalopolis...

 

Here's the historical version of how LA came to be this way:

 

LA started out in not one, but three or more locations...

Father Junipero Serra and the Franciscans founded Missions where they found large groups of Native Americans living, each a day's travel apart (in 1700s terms)...But, because of the natural drinkable water situation, the Amerinds did not live along the coast, but inland, at the base of the mountains--where the streams flowed down. So, Missions were built at San Gabriel and at San Fernando--both in inland valleys....The, the Spanish always sent soldiers to protect the Missions--usually near each Mission...But, neither of these Missions were considered very important, so they decided to build just one Presidio (Fort) to cover both...and placed it roughly halfway between--in what is now Downtown Los Angeles.

 

The Spanish also handed out large tracts of land (Ranchos) to wealthy individuals...and this pretty much divided up the area amongs several different families...Each of these families eventually choosing to subdivide and sell off their holdings at various and seemingly arbitrary times (The last such Rancho to be developed being the Irvine Ranch in Orange County, giving rise to the relatively new city of Irvine)...

 

With the actual Los Angeles being far inland and of no particular economic value (other than being along the Los Angeles River where it once emerged from underground at the Glendale Narrows), other nearby cities grew in importance depending on where they were located and by who. San Pedro and Long Beach had economic importance--actually controlling the harbor and international trade and shipping (so much that in the early 1900s, the City of Los Angeles annexed the City of San Pedro so as to control at least half of the harbor).

 

Santa Monica and Venice grew in importance as beach resorts...Beverly Hills came into existence and grew just as the very lucrative Motion Picture business was taking hold in the city...The moviebusiness grew so wealthy and controlled great pieces of land...so that, at one point or another, they were able to develop some of their studio lots into mini-downtowns--giving birth to Century City (20th Century Fox) and Warner Center (Warner Bros.)...

 

As each small city grew, they pretty much spread out into one contiguous megalopolis...but with functional "Downtowns" in Downtown LA, Beverly Hills, Santa Monica, Century City, Warner Center, Pasadena, Newport Beach, Long Beach and other places...

 

Remember the movie Chinatown? The Water District scandals? Insiders knowing where the water was going buying up land for personal gain? Based on a true story--though misplced a little in time for theatrical effect--actually took place in the 1910s...And, part of the deal became that if a city wanted in on the water supply--that was owned by the City of LA--they had to allow themselves to be annexed into the City...Many cities bought in...others--like Santa Monica, Beverly Hills, Culver City, etc. did not (they had independent water sources)--even though they are now completely surrounded by the City of LA. So, when you look at a map of LA, the city limits make very little aesthetic sense...

 

Historical sites, Cultural Centers, Museums, tourist attractions and other sites are pretty much spread out as well...

 

So...there is no "central" LA...at least not in a tourism sense...

The movie industry started in Hollywood (Paramount Studios and others), so a lot of the old show biz attractions are there--Walk of Fame, Grauman's Chinese, etc. But the movie and TV industry today has mostly moved north of there to the Universal City/Burbank Area...so, a lot of the current production, tours, theme park stuff are in that area...

 

But, a lot of the original tourism areas were the beach cities--so, from Redondo in the South Bay up to Malibu is really the hot tourism area--with Santa Monica and Venice at its heart...and tourist sites like the Venice Boardwalk, the Santa Monica Pier and the Third Street Promenade are found along the Western edge of the city...

 

LA's great benefactors--the folks who gave us art museums and such--generally placed these where they themselves lived. Huntington and Simon in the Pasadena area, J Paul Getty lived in Pacific Palisades (between Malibu and Santa Monica)--so he (or his foundation) put his museums there (the Villa at his own home, the later Getty Center just inland at Brentwood along the 405)...

 

So, when you say your dh wants to stay "right in the heart of LA", he needs to realize there is no such place that will make any sense to anyone...Santa Monica or Hollywood or Burbank or several other places are just as much the "heart of LA" as any place...

 

None of us locals will ever recommend you stay in Downtown LA--although there are a few choice historical sites in the area--it's just not a very tourist-friendly place to stay...

 

Santa Monica is actually fairly convenient to a good portion of tourist areas and is more pedestrian friendly than most places in the city...

 

Staying in Beverly Hills or West Hollywood or in the Fairfax District may make you a little more centrally located, but also a little more crowded and urban...and not necessarily with as much to comfortably walk to...

 

With a rental car, you may also want to look into whether a hotel charges for parking--in some locales it could get expensive...

 

IOW, you may be looking for something that doesn't exist...

I also wanted to fly in a few days ahead, and I do not want to rent a car. I can't imagine there is not something like a Grayline Tour bus that would do major tourist sights.

 

Fran,

There is only one tour provider that picks up at San Pedro/Long Beach area hotels:

 

http://www.sunseekertours.us/

 

I would contact them about a Hollywood/LA tour. They do an 8 hour tour for $79 pp and are based in Long Beach...

The other tour companies usually only pick up from Hollywood and West Side hotels.

 

Depending on how many days you are planning on spending, there are other things you can do using taxis (which will be expensive)...or even public buses if you are daring and adventurous...

 

Remember, you are quite a distance from most of the major LA area tourist spots...

 

You can reasonably spend a day, if you like, in Long Beach...it's only a 6 mile taxi ride away and has attractions like the Queen Mary, the Aquarium of the Pacific and a very touristy couple of shopping/restaurant areas in Shoreline Village and the Pike...You only need a taxi back and forth...getting around Long Beach is easy on the free "Passport" shuttle...

 

Another easy day trip from San Pedro if you are there multiple days is the boat across to Catalina Island...

 

http://catalinaexpress.com/

 

This leaves right out of San Pedro and only takes about an hour to an hour and a half in each direction...

 

Good luck...

Ah Steve...TY.... I've just looked into your hotel suggestions and find them way above my budget.

 

We took the boards advice and rented a car, so we are not locked in to public transit.

 

any other suggestions?

Which is better location for a hotel ...Santa Monica or Universal City/LA?

 

I like Santa Monica better...better weather, more restaurant choices...at the beach...

 

Here are some more reasonable hotel links courtesy of my compadre Curt Jerome Wild:

 

These are IN Santa Monica...and lots cheaper than the ones I gave you before (that was the "luxury" tier):

 

The Hotel California

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=451075

 

Cal Mar Suites

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=423818

 

Holiday Inn

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=699622

 

That Holiday Inn isn't great, but it's reasonably priced and walking distance to attractions...It is right on the Freeway, though...

 

These are Curt's suggestions in Venice--the beach town just South of Santa Monica--a little "funkier"...If you've ever watched the classic "California" beach clips in movies and on TV--the girls roller skating in bikinis, the muscle guys lifting weights on the beach, the bicyclists, the street entertainers, etc.--THAT is Venice Beach...

 

Jamaica Bay Inn

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=679886

 

Inn at Venice Beach

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=679916

 

Foghorn Inn

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=724713

 

Hope maybe one of these fits your budget and strikes your fancy...

Steve I Love your outline.... now...

1) what hotels are suggested there (with maybe shuttles? or at least BREAKFAST!)

2) where the heck can I get a good map to map out all the places I want!!

 

Thanks for the info!!! you are all the best!

 

If you are looking for printed maps, the place I always go is the Auto Club...Los Angeles is so big that in order to get to street level detail, it requires several maps...The main tourist sites are mostly in their "Central and Western" area map--which includes Santa Monica, Hollywood, BeverlyHills, etc. and the "San Fernando Valley" map--which includes Universal City, Burbank, etc. You can also create and print maps using Google.maps and other internet sites...

 

Hotels in these two areas:

Universal:

As I noted before, there are a Hilton and a Sheraton right in the Universal complex...outside, but in the area, the more popular places to stay are the Sportsmen's Lodge and the Beverly Garland.

 

http://www.starwoodhotels.com/sheraton/search/hotel_detail.html?propertyID=83

 

The Sheraton has a "Shuttle Service within Surrounding Area (Limited)"...which I believe only takes you to places in the immediate area--including the Metro Station.

 

http://www1.hilton.com/en_US/hi/hotel/BURUCHF-Hilton-Los-Angeles-Universal-City-California/index.do

 

I don't know if they priovide a shuttle.

 

http://www.beverlygarland.com/

 

They have a free shuttle to Universal, CityWalk and the Metro Station.

 

http://www.slhotel.com/

 

I don't know if the Sportsmen's Lodge provides a shuittle...it is a fair distance from the tourist sites--a little too far from Universal to walk...But I also know some of ny compadres here--like Curt Jerome Wild--are very high on the Sportsmen's Lodge as a place to stay in this area. It is close to shopping and restaurants...

 

Santa Monica:

A lot of my favorite hotels here are a bit on the "pricey" side...but incredibly well located...

 

http://www.loewshotels.com/en/Hotels/Santa-Monica-Beach-Hotel/Overview.aspx

 

http://www.fairmont.com/santamonica/

 

http://www.lemerigothotel.com/

 

http://www.shuttersonthebeach.com/

 

You are not going to find shuttles from these hotels...but they are all very convenient walking distance to the Santa Monica Pier, the Third Street Promenade, Palisades Park and the beach...

 

The area also has some more reasonably priced hotels of varying quality...

 

http://doubletree1.hilton.com/en_US/dt/hotel/SMOPCDT-Doubletree-Guest-Suites-Santa-Monica-California/index.do

 

http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&um=1&ie=UTF-8&q=Santa+Monica+hotels&fb=1&split=1&gl=us&view=text&ei=FmiVSurHJZXKNa_rsPoH&sa=X&oi=local_group&ct=more-results&resnum=1

 

Check out reviews on this board by Curt Jerome Wild...he has actually researched many of these hotels...and ones in nearby Venice--just down the beach...

 

There are lots of choices...

 

Good luck...

Is the Getty Griffith Observatory an all day tour...or a couple of hours?

 

Getty.....Griffith Observatory...

Two different things...actually, three...

 

The Getty is an art museum...Actually two museums...

J Paul Getty was actually my neighbor (though late in his life, he lived in England most of the year and only lived here part time...But, he IS buried on the property...Getty's LA house was in Pacific Palisades (though they always call the museum "Malibu", Malibu is actually a short hop further up the coast)--right behind my parents' house...in the mid-70s, much to my parents' and most of the other neighbors' dismay, Getty built a museum on the property, down in the canyon below his house...and left a rather large estate to a foundation to run the museum and collections...A few years back, the collection considerably outgrew the facility, so the foundation bought another piece of property--on a hilltop overlooking the city in the Sepulveda Pass area near Bel Air/Brentwood and built a larger museum...

 

The original museum is now called the Getty Villa and houses the "Antiquities" Collection...The newer museum is called the Getty Center and houses most of the other art collections...either property is worth a few hours on their own...both are also architectural masterpieces...They are among the world's great museums...

 

http://www.getty.edu/museum/

 

The Griffith Observatory sits on a hilltop in Hollywood in the middle of Griffith Park. Griffith Park is one of the largest city parks in the world--over six and a half square miles...It was a gift (1896) to the city from Real Estate Developer Colonel Griffith J. Griffith (seriously, that was his name! He was a very wealthy, but somewhat eccentric and notorious gentleman who actually served time in prison for shooting his wife)...Griffifth also left a trust fund after his death in 1919 to fund the park's improvements--including the Greek Theater and the Observatory--which was completed in 1935

 

It also includes the LA Zoo, the Greek Theater and the Autry Museum, depending on your interests, all interesting sites in and of themselves...

 

http://www.lacity.org/rap/dos/parks/griffithPK/index.htm

 

The observatory alone is easily worth a couple of hours...

 

http://www.griffithobservatory.org/

 

A little note here--the HOLLYWOOD Sign is actually located in Griffifth Park and was originally built in 1923 as an advertisement for a real estate development...the originl sign was longer--it said "HOLLYWOODLAND"...

 

By 1978, it had fallen into disrepair and the refurbishment was organized by none other than Alice Cooper and funded by 9 donors, each of whom funded the refurbishment of one letter including Cooper (who paid to rebuild one of the Os which was completely gone), Andy Williams, Hugh Hefner and Gene Autry...

Pam,

I'll try to throw around some "no car" options...

[Of course, like all Angelenos, I have trouble conceiving of life in LA without a car]...

 

For three nights, I'd look at one of two options:

Universal City or Santa Monica...

 

Universal City (there's a Hilton and a Sheraton right in the Universal complex) puts you close to those sites you mentioned. You would likely have to get a cab to Warner Bros., but you could walk to Universal Studios, hang out at the very popular "Citywalk" at night...or go to one of my faves for dinner--Miceli's on Cahuenga)...You could get to Hollywood (Grauman's Chinese, Walk of Fame, Hollywood & Highland) by use of the Metro...For a larger tour of the stars' homes (as it were), the tour companies will pick you up at these hotels...You will need a shuttle service or taxi to take you from LAX to Universal and from Universal to the pier...An option here is to fly into Burbank Airport instead...a short shuttle or taxi ride away...

 

Santa Monica...I would use a tour company that picks up at the hotel to take a tour of Hollywood, Beverly Hills and so on...Warner Bros might be a little tough to do from here--an expensive cab ride...But nightlife abounds...Third Street Promenade, Santa Monica Pier...and you've got lots to do between here and Venice and Marina del Rey...plus the Santa Monica "Big Blue Bus" is one of the better public transit units in the area if you want to take atruip up to Westwood, Beverly Hills or the Getty...Again, you would need a shuttle LAX to Santa Monica and Santa Monica to the pier...

 

Hope that helps...

Ava...

Try going through Spiros at

BY PHONE (FROM U.S.A)

011 30 6944 285 686 (Mobile)

011 30 210 99 44 771 (Home)

BY PHONE (FROM EUROPE)

00 30 6944 285 686 (Mobile)

00 30 210 99 44 771 (Home)

BY EMAIL

***

 

But you may want to see if you can get Spiros himself first...

 

Cathy,

 

It was your standard Mercedes sedan...Check the photo on Spiros' website--one like that--really suited for a tour for 2-3...I guess you could fit four if someone was willing to sit in the middle and three-across...

 

But, you could always ask if they could arrange something bigger...some guides in other ports have access to vans...but I do know these guys in Athens really pride themselves in going in luxury in a Mercedes sedan...

BruinSteve, still looking for the name of your guide for your out-of-town day trip from Piraeus. Thanks, Cathy, fellow UCer/ex-SF Valley girl

 

Our guide's name was Fotios...We actually booked with Spiros--***--but Oceania changed the order of ports the last minute, switching Athens for Santorini--and Spiros was booked on the new date so he handed us off to Fotios...Fotios was okay, but I am guessing, from reviews on here, that Spiros himself would have been better...But that is one of the risks in booking guides...

As always, it is necessary in every port to consider all the available options and decide which is right for you. The exchange of ideas on this board is a very valuable way to do this, but in the end it is what YOU want to do that will decide the best way to do it.

 

Mike I could not agree more.

 

As you can likely tell, we tend to do a mixture of every kind of touring...For us, it depends a lot on what it is we may want to see, whether we've visited the port before and think we know it well enough, how close or distant the attractions are to the pier and many other factors. Often, for us, there is the financial considerations--but everyone's financial situation differs as well. Luckily, we are in a position where we don't have to skimp on cost, but we do like to get value for our money--I'll shell out $500 for a nice day of touring, but I want to get something special for that.

 

But, the real issue is that there is no "right way" to do every port for every traveller...

 

Some folks are experienced, capable and comfortable striking out on their own...they do their research, hopefully even know the port, have a plan, are able to deal with contingencies for unexpected occurrances...

 

Other folks are best served by using the ship's excursions...they don't need to know much or prepare much, they have the safety of a tour planned for them and the comfort of knowing someone is responsible for getting them to sites and getting them back to the ship (except maybe if they get the guide we did in Gdansk last July--who lost half of the tour participants somewhere along the route).

 

And still others are willing to pay the freight and have a well organized and personalized private tour set up for them...They like the efficiency of having someone with local knowledge getting them to and from various sites without waiting for local buses, trains or subways.

 

And different ports lend themselves more to one method or another. We have been to ports, like Kusadasi, where private tours for two cost less than shore excursions and the tourist sites are far from the dock and public transportation questionable. Or ports like Mykonos where there's not much a tour can show you and everything is fairly close.

 

In many ports, your specific choices as to what you want to see will dictate how you do it. Athens, I believe, is one of them...If you are satisfied with seeing only the sites within the city proper, "on your own" can work--though, for me, I would likely still take a tour of some kind. You need to be very well organized--the city is crowded and urban and it is not that easy to get around. The pier is not that close to the Acropolis. If you want to see the city and also get out of town--say, to Cape Sounion, a shore excursion actually works best. If you want to visit the various sites in the Pelopennese, note that they are a fair distance from the port and scattered...having a private guide or driver at your disposal really works for that.

 

But then, also consider the style with which YOU prefer to travel...and what you are willing to pay. Everyone is different. Consider your options carefully and in the context of what it is YOU want.

 

Whenever someone starts a thread asking if one port or another can be done "on your own", all of the "on your owners" tend to jump on and tell everyone how easy it was to see EVERYTHING on their own. But, most of them really haven't seen everything--they MAY have seen the things they planned to see...and were satisfied. It doesn't mean the experience will be the same for you. Consider also the experiences of those who have used different methods of touring...and consider what YOUR needs, requirements, budget, etc. are.

 

For Athens, ask yourself:

1) What do you want to see? The Acropolis and Plaka and maybe a few other sites in the immediate area? Cape Sounion? The incredible archaeological sites of the Pelopennese? If you don't know, google Athens, the Acropolis, Cape Sounion, Mycenae, Epidauras, Corinth, Nafplion et al and think about what appeals to you.

 

2) What sort of budget do you have?

 

3) How comfortable are you with using public subways and buses in a country where the language and customs may not be familiar to you? Or do you prefer to have someone pick you up at the ship and organizze it all for you?

 

4) Do you prefer to strike out on your own? Are you comfortable with a busload of fellow passengers? Can you put together or join a small group of fellow passengers? Do you, perhaps want the comfort of your own car and driver and are willing to accept the expense?

 

Actually, do this to some extent for ALL ports.

 

For our upcoming cruise (most of the ports are either new to us or it has been some time since we visited), as it is working out, we are taking ship's excursions in 3 ports--they offer what we want and my wife appreciates the safety...one of the three is a short day and getting back to the ship would be a concern...In four ports, we have private tours organized and are trying to put together roups for three others...In our starting port, Barcelona and our ending port, Istanbul, we have been to both before and will do Barcelona on our own, but take at least one tour in Istanbul (spending the rest of a four day stay on our own) to visit some things we haven't seen before...Last time there, we had a guide--and, thought he city can easily be done "on its own", we appreciated the incredible insight into the local culture only the guide could supply--thought he was well worth the money...

I am going to differ with the previous posters on this thread.

 

We have visited Athens three times now...and toured three different ways.

 

The first visit to Athens, we toured on our own...saw the Acropolis, the museum and a little of the Plaka...got horribly lost...got taken 17 blocks out of our way by a taxi driver with whom we had a language problem apparently...and left in the middle of a remote residential area with no method of cummunicating and had to walk those 17 blocks to catch a bus...

 

I am certain that, with a lot of planning...and especially if it's a pre- or post-cruise multiple day stay, you can adequately tour quite a bit...But a one day port visit in Athens can get very difficult...traffic is bad...

 

...and here's the other key: My guess is that a lot of folks who like to tell you just how adequately they covered a port "on their own" really don't know that they did...They haven't tried some other methods. People here on Cruise Critic tend to be "married" to whatever form of touring they typically do. Of course, it really matters little how you spend your port day or how much you see or don't see so long as you've had a good experience and have seen whatever you want to see...In that case, an "on your own" visit to the Acropolis, the Museum and the Plaka makes for a very nice day...

 

After our first visit, despite the logistical snafus, we were very pleased with our experience...

 

Our second visit was a port stop on the Celebrity Millennium in 2003. This time, we opted for a Shore Excursion to the Acropolis and Cape Sounion...It seemed a good way not to deal with the logistics and to see something outside of Athens proper...and the cost in 2003 was a mere $99 per person, including admissions charges and lunch...We were picked up right from the ship and were brought right to the Acropolis with guide, skipped the lines and ticket booths and had a nice tour and some time in the Museum, then a visit to the Presidential Palace, a drive past Olympic Facilities and other sites, some shopping time in the Plaka, a VERY GOOD lunch then the very scenic drive out to Cape Sounion, some time wandering the old ruins there, some free time to get a coffee or beer in the local cafe...and the drive back to the ship...All in all a VERY GOOD excursion...We saw more in the morning alone than we were able to cover in a full day on our own...and it was EASY...Only negative was that we had to wait for 30 or so people to get on and off the bus at each stop--we would have cut the shopping time and the free time a little shorter...

 

When we got back to the ship, one of our tablemates told us of how they went on their own--walking to the metro, dealing with a very crowded and difficult Metro system, visited the Acropolis and Museum and back to the ship and their day was over...

 

Our third visit, we hired a private guide...Having seen the Acropolis twice already, we were ready for much more...We took a route OUT of the city and into the Pelopennese...Visited Mycenae, Corinth, Nafplion, Epidaurus and more...we fit so much into the day that it was incredible...the sites OUTSIDE of Athens actually blow away anything IN Athens save, MAYBE, the Parthenon...It cost us a mere 250 euros for the full day tour for two...We didn't have to deal with any logistics, directions, bus or metro systems...nothing...We controlled our itinerary...if we were "done" with a site, we told our driver/guide that we'd seen enough and it was back in the car to another site...

 

So, IMHO, yes, you can "do" Athens on your own...BUT, if you really want the best experience, hire a guide...There is just so much to see and do in and around this port that you are only going to get a brioef snippet on your own...of course, though, that may just be enough for you...

 

...but certainly don't jump to the conclusion that this is "an ideal port to do on your own"...

 

That's merely one of a few options--all of which have their pluses and minuses. Really depends on what you want out of the port...also, what you are willing to spend.

Here's what I would do in your situation:

 

If I really wanted to go on this cruise, I'd take any cabin...even the "E" if that's what I can afford...

 

But I'd watch the booking sites--Oceania and others--very carefully on a daily or even more than daily basis...and have my travel agent monitor it as well...

 

Booked cabins open back up all the time--especially in this economy...On my roll call, most of the posters we've been talking to for months have now backed out for one reason or another...So, it is very possible one of those inside cabins comes back on the market...when it does, have them switch your reservation...I maybe would even have my TA contact Oceania to see if they had any mechanism to wit list you for what you want...

 

By the way, we're going back on the Nautica for the second time and have booked the same cabin we had last time--6010--It's, for some reason, the lowest category cabin on the ship--but we thought the location was great...Sure, it's forward, but the ship is quite small...it's not that many steps to anywhere and Deck 6 is great...

Has anyone stayed in an E Cabin before? We are considering an Oceania cruise and have an E cabin on hold. I was just wondering how much of the lifeboats you actually see in one of these rooms.

 

Any help would be appreciated. :)

 

I'd rather have an inside cabin...

In an E, you get a small porthole which is likely allowing you to see the side of a small lifeboat (I am assuming that, as with most ships with "obstructed view" cabins, the minimal view may vary depending on where you are in relation to the lifeboats...Different cabins may have slightly different views...

 

But, here is the kicker for me:

 

>>Category E is 143-square-foot and has no sofa.<<

 

If given the choice of paying more money for a smaller cabin and no sofa, but with a small round window with the view of a wall of a lifeboat...and

...a larger "inside" cabin with a sofa and more space in the room at a lesser price, I'll take the 160 sf inside cabin any day of the week...

 

I'm not in my cabin all that much...but when I am, it's to sleep and to change clothes...I'd rather have the room to maneuver when I dress and a place to sit down than to have a small porthole to look out of hoping I might see around that big boat that's covering the window...

 

There are really only two choices: Suite/balcony stateroom OR Inside...

 

A balcony gives you SOMETHING for the money--a place to go outside, to get some fresh air, added personal space...But...it is a lot of extra money...If you want to save all that money, just take it all the way down to an inside cabin--and save an awful lot on Oceania...

 

A window cabin of any kind is really just a bad compromise...but an obstructed porthole and a smaller room with fewer amenities is just foolish...

I am interested in finding out what the distance between San Pedro and Long Beach. We are sailing with Carnival which means we will be sailing out of Long Beach but was wondering if a hotel in San Pedro would also be feasible. We are only staying one night prior to the cruise. (June 6, 2009)

 

It's about 6-8 miles depending on which hotel...The drive goes clear across the "front" part of the Los Angeles/Long Beach Harbor...Across the Vincent Thomas Bridge, then the length of Terminal Island...It's all industrial, so there is a lot of truck and cargo traffic...

 

It's workable, but if I were sailing on Carnival, I'd look for a Downtown Long Beach hotel first--Hyatt, Westin, Renaissance, Marriott Courtyard, Hilton or Hotel Maya (formerly the Coast)...It will be more convenient and make your life a little simpler...But, if the hotels in Long Beach (and only stick to this specific small area of Long Beach) are booked, then San Pedro (Crowne Plaza or Doubletree) would be a good second choice--but you will need a taxi to the ship in the morning...

 

Good luck...

This makes E114 look very appealing....lol

 

For our cruise, RIGHT NOW, an inside cabin is priced at $1312 pp...Category "F" like this one for $1642 pp

 

So, you'd pay $660 for THAT window!!! Would ANYONE here think they'd grab that cabin? WHY???

 

Does Princess have nerve or what?

Wow!!!

I think I'd have found that view depressing...rather have an inside cabin...

That one looks like you're living in an underground industrial plant...The courtyard views from the cells at Alcatraz are cheerier...

 

 

This "fully obstructed view" became a joke between my daughter & I. We'd definitely book this view again :)

 

San Juan, St. Thomas, St. Kitts

 

Ahhh, Bermudiana...but that is one of the smaller lifeboats, the ones you can see "over"...further back on the ship, in the E500-600 range, there are three larger tenders on each side of the ship...from a similar position behind one of these six tenders, you have no view like this...

 

Beware of the individual cabin...The categories, BTW, go by distance from midship, not by how obstructed the view is...So, some Category Fs, for example, may actually be more obstructed than some HHs--making booking a guarantee in this area a real crapshoot...

Tenders are the larger ones...

We originally booked an HH guarantee on the Sapphire, but when they assigned us E612 and a better obstructed view came open (the unobstructed ones were sold out), we paid to upgrade...

 

E612 on the Sapphire is not where E612 is on the Emerald...On the Sapphire, that cabin comes out smack behind a tender--meaning your entire view, as it were, is the side of a tender...

 

All obstructed views are not created equal...

The ones in these photos are lucky enough to be "between" lifeboats...

Others are behind the smaller lifeboats so there's some bit of a view OVER...

 

But some are fully behind a tender...and, if you get one of those, you might as well save the money and book an inside cabin...

Bruin Steve,I was not calling you a snob!!!!...Steve I am sorry if I offended you I didn't mean this to be personal to you

 

Linda, I didn't take it personally...I just wanted to emphasize the point that I'm not one of those who criticize without trying the line...

 

I really do believe that no cruise is truly bad...beats work...and that everyone has different criteria and standards...And I don't mean that to imply that Carnival cruises have no class--only that those who enjoy Carnival may have diiferent standards and expectations than those who don't want to cruise with them...or who have tried them and won't go back...

 

We all look for different things in a cruise...

 

I, for one, can eat at TGI Fridays or Chili's or Red Lobster...or even Denny's...but still appreciate that I'm getting a better product at Spago or the Palm...Sometimes I want a bargain...and I'm willing to put up with lesser service or average quality...I may just want a filling meal at a reasonable price and don't care if I get paper napkins and no tablecloths and a noisy, tacky crowd...But sometimes, I want an evening to be "special"...to have everything elegant and perfect...maybe only a few times a year--our anniversary, my wife's birthday, Valentine's Day perhaps...

 

Well, I look at cruising like it is something special...I want the dinners to be elegant, the service to be exceptional, etc. I'm willing to pay a little m0ore for that...

 

I know that some people don't care about that...They just want to get away...and don't want to pay a lot. They may be willing to accept less in the way of service or ambiance...or crowding...It's okay...there's a cruise line for everybody...Some folks really don't notice the differences...They may not be looking as hard...

Linda,

Your opinion and comparison is valued.

What is always interesting to me is how different people value different things and how our individual perceptions are often colored by our different experiences and standards.

 

Let me say that I do not believe that I am a snob...I have been on over 20+ cruises (most of which are noted in my board signature)...And I've cruised on seven different cruise lines...But I do prefer Celebrity...And I doubt I will ever cruise with Carnival again...

 

A lot of that comes from my recent experience of having cruised Royal Caribbean and Carnival in back-to-back weeks. Whereas you may have been comparing your recent sailing on Celebrity to more distant pleasant memories of Carnival cruises, I had the vantage of experiencing two cruise lines in an almost direct comparison.

 

Though you mention embarkation, debarkation, food, cabin and ambience, I think there are some very important aspects you missed. Perhaps they are less important to you or you just didn't pay attention to the same things I pay attention to.

 

Let me also say that there are some things Carnival does do well. Though, IMHO, their food is far short of Celebrity, I will say that it is surprisingly good. Carnival has improved in theis regard drastically over the years. The service, which I'll get into in a moment, is not even close.

 

You mention the entertainment as being "excellent" on both...I would refute that. Viewed in a vacuum, one might think so...It's hard not to enjoy oneslf while being entertained. But, having viewed RCCL entertainment and Carnival entertainment back-to-back, it's really easy to quantify where Carnival falls short. First, the good: Carnival's comedians on our ship were excellent. That's where the excellence stops. Royal Caribbean's production shows were outstanding (as they are on it's sister line, Celebrity)...FOUR singers rotating with multiple costume changes and a bit of variety. Carnival cut corners, using only TWO singers...which also meant they could not rotate off for costume changes or for rests...So, the quality suffered greatly. To make matters worse, Carnival relied heavily on TAPED back-up vocals. Clearly inferior shows. Past this, the two non-comedy, non-production shows on Carnival included an incredibly tacky "hypnotisty show", where the guest hypnotist shilled constantly for his diet and quit smoking DVDs...and a "Guest performer" show where the guest performer was merely a former Carnival production show singer.

 

Now, back to service:

 

The first thing we do onboard EVERY cruise is to hit the buffet for embarkation day lunch...We couldn't help but notice this difference between Celebrity, RCCL and Carnival. On Celebrity, a crew member will greet you at the end of th line and carry your tray for you to an open table, then ask if there is anything else he can get you--beverages, forgotten silverware, condiments, etc. On RCCL, once you find your table, a crew member is right there to ask you what else he can get you. On Carnival, you need to search ard for a table in the overcrowded buffet, likely find one that hasn't even been cleared or wiped off, then leave your food and go back out again to find the drink station etc. Absolutely no help or service in the buffet area...

 

As to Dining Room service, we counted--the number of tables served by our waiter and our assistant waiter...Each waiter on Carnival was serving, at a minimum 1.5 times the number of people per seating as were the waiters on RCCL...and they seemed to be sharing the same assistant waiter with two waiters! The effect on service was that service was always rushed, things were forgotten...Often our appetizers and soup or salad and sometimes the main entree all arrived at the same time. Either due to the rush...or the fact that the dining room was so crowded, the waiter never followed the "rules" of which side to serve or remove from...We even saw our waiter, when serving the table across the aisle from us, handing a plate to someone and telling them to "pass" it to someone else!! I don't even have the time to enumerate the large numbers of service faux pas we noticed...Of course, I am also aware this isn't important to some people and they'd likely never notice it...And some might call me a "snob" for making it an issue...but trust me, I am not a snob...I just think that the "elegance" factor on a cruise is an important part of service...I also will tell you that on Celebrity, RCCL, Princess or Oceania, I virtually never have to even ask for refills on my iced tea...On Carnival, I'd often have to ask...and then ask again...

 

The cabin size on Carnival...and the storage space in the cabin was, as the OP noted, ample...I have no real complaints on the cabin--other than the day-glo orange vinyl decor...I don't think the cabin was appreciably larger than the same category cabin on the newer RCCL or M-Class "X" ships though...

 

The Carnival ship, itself, however, was laid out poorly, walkways were insufficiently narrow...and, the most notable thing was the overcrowding...The space-per-passenger ratios (we were on Carnival Liberty) were outrageous compared to the RCCL Liberty of the Seas...and those ratios pale compared to the Celebrity M-Class...When you add to that that "X" passengers and even RCCL passengers tend to be more 2 to the cabin, putting kids in their own cabins, etc., we didn't seem to meet a single Carnival passenger who did this...So all of those many "quads" on Carnival had four passengers in them. Carnival customers seem to want to cruise them for the bargain prices...and want to get the most for their money...So, basically, throw whatever is listed as "full double occupancy" out the window...There are about one and a half times as many passengers jammed onto each Carnival ship...

 

What goes along with that is that there are lines and crowds for everything...Forget waiting for a few pieces of sushi at the Carnival sushi counter...The shows? Prepare to show up an hour ahead of time for a reasonable seat (getting a seat at an "X" show is simple--show up a few minutes before showtime and sit where you want)...Carnival did cut down on my drinking--hard to get a bar waiter in the showroom...Why? I don't know...they seemed to hawk incessantly every other profit area like no one else...

 

The payoff with Carnival is that their cruises, for the most part (not always the case) tend to cost a few dollars less...

 

But, after 20+ cruises, I've decided it's well worth paying a little more for service, elegance, roominess, less stress, etc.

 

I've done three Carnival cruises now...But I doubt I will ever do another...

Having read the "chilling effect" notice the original poster used in phrasing her question, I initially avoided this thread...

 

My only tongue-in-cheek response to the best way to bring alcohol on board would have been to drink it before boarding and merely bring it on already in your bloodstream...

 

Of course, coming back to read this thread, I first noticed the rude treatment given the one anti-alcohol smuggling poster who first attempted to enter into the debate...and, surely I do not want to be treated with the same disdain...

 

However, I then noticed that a lot of you, including the original poster, seemed to get into the "morality" debate anyway...

 

So, though I'll tread lightly here, let me just address a few things...

 

First, I have NEVER brought alcohol (or soda or tea bags or salad dressing or anything else I can get onboard) onto a ship for the purpose of use onboard...I'll explain why in a moment...

 

What I have done is to bring alcohol (wine, rum, liquers, etc.) onboard that I have purchased while in port in order to bring it home...but I generally only do this where the particular spirit is something particular to the place visited and can not be easily acquired back home...I am NOT going to schlepp a bottle of Bacardi that I can buy at Costco for $19.95 through a vacation and on and off of ships and planes just because I got it for only $15 by buying it in San Juan...It's a "value" thing...It's just not worth the whopping $4.95 I'm saving...

 

But, when I do procure a bottle or two while on the cruise, I generally carry it, virtually in the open, right onto the ship...Sometimes they have confiscated it, returning it to me the final night...and other times, they've let me take it straight on...there seems to be no sense to it...but, since I'm not drinking it onboard, I don't care...

 

On the plane, I'll generally keep it in a carry-on so as to avoid the breakage issue...With the new security rules, I'm not really sure now...of course, they seem to change those rules day to day...

 

But, the real question I wanted to get to here is that "morality" issue...

Look, I, personally could care less whether YOU cheat the cruise line out of its liquor profit...You want to drink in your cabin from your personal stash, fine by me...

If you want to drink from your personal stash in public areas, hey, I'm not "turning you in"...that's not my job...But, yeah, I really do think it's incredibly tacky and lackling in class...But so are a lot of other things a lot of other people are doing...I can only handle myself with class, I can't be responsible for anyone else...

 

And, since I can't I can only tell you what I think...or how I think...and consider this a "public service"--food for thought--rather than a criticism...

 

Drop the "morality" point and look instead at a "cruising philosophy" issue:

 

My philosophy of cruising is that you want the easiest, simplest, most stress-free vacation possible...

 

This means I pack as light as possible, I bring as little as possible, etc.

 

To ME, the biggest issue is that it's just not worth it to overload my luggage or carry additional bags...

 

For ME, the costs involved are inconsequential--an additional couple of hundred dollars in bar bills doesn't make or break me... I'm willing to pay for my drinks...just like I pay at a restaurant or bar when I go out--sure, I can buy booze cheaper than my favorite restaurants charge me, but, I don't bring my own there either...

 

I pay the cost in return for the convenience and the service...

Thyis is my deal with the cruise lines: I pay them whatever they charge...and they take care of it for me...

 

Of course, it all comes down to what YOUR objectives are in cruising...