Steerpike58

But what about port visits? Surely that's when the size would become most obvious. The more passengers there are to disembark, the slower it's likely to be, and how can a cute small-town destination (like Kotor, Montenegro) cope with 2-3,000 passengers descending on them at once?

One advantage Viking Ocean has is their smaller ship size; one example - we were able to dock in Kotor, spitting distance from the center of town, while another cruise ship had to 'tender'. Obviously, coming and going was a piece of cake for us. Our upcoming HA cruise is on a ship with about 1900 passengers, which is more than double the Viking number. I simply cannot conceive of being on a 'big' ship - these new monsters they are building now. On our one (and only - never again!) Viking River cruise, several of our visits were to non-descript remote locations on the Danube; in part because of water levels. We couldn't dock in Budapest last year, and ended up in some remote spot with nowhere to go at night. Similar issues near Bucharest. Vienna was perfect - walking distance to town.

That's a very good question! We have yet to ever arrange our own formal excursions. We have so far gone with a mixture of the 'included' Viking excursion (which tend to be a moderately extensive intro to a location, but without anything fancy like big meals, etc - probably the equivalent of a $100-$150 HA excursion) and 'extra cost', more extensive / elaborate excursions from Viking. How they compare to HA's offerings we won't know till September. We are nervous about arranging our own excursions due to the usual concerns about getting back to the ship. In general, we are finding that we prefer to just explore a location on our own, so if the port is close to the destination, or if there's a flexible shuttle or public transit option, then we'll simply explore the destination on our own. We did that in Athens, Istanbul, Kotor, Dubrovnik, Hong Kong, Vienna, Budapest, etc. I have to say, we've had some disappointing excursions with Viking; I don't think it's Viking's fault necessarily - any time you want to feed and entertain a large group of people, you are asking for trouble! On an 'extension' in Prague, they bussed a coach-load of us out of the beautiful center of Prague and dumped us in a remote rural 'barn', where we were fed mediocre food, mediocre wine, and entertained by terrible singers wearing local costumes ... supposedly an intro to the 'flavors and sounds of Prague'. We would have been 10x happier going to a restaurant in Prague on our own! But you aren't going to find an atmospheric place in the center of Prague that's willing to take 30+ people, that's also accessible by coach. My current impression is that a) HA give you a lot more time to cancel than Viking, and b) HA are more liberal in terms of giving refunds? I haven't researched it in depth.

One difference between HA and Viking that I've noticed while booking the excursions for our cruise seems to be 'shuttles' into town. It seems like HA charge for nothing but a coach into town and back. With Viking, they provided coach shuttles at no cost. Eg - Athens (Piraeus) - HA: This transfer may suit you if you would like to explore on your own. It consists of a motorcoach ride from the ship to the city. You will be dropped off at a central location, and your escort will show you to the Old Town (Plaka) area and advise you of the pick-up time for the return journey. You will have approximately two hours and twenty minutes to shop and explore on your own. Viking - in Athens (Pireaus), they just ran a coach to and from a central pickup location and published a schedule for the pickups (roughly every 30 mins or hour, with the last one clearly identified). This was free, and as noted gave you as much or as little time in town as you wanted. I do see that HA are providing an 'escort' to get you to Plaka. Google Maps did a fine job as our escort on Viking 🙂 So this is another way HA is charging for something that Viking 'build in' to their (much higher) price. So far, we've run up an 'excursion' cost of about $2,200 ($1,100 each), minus $400 (200 each) HIA credit so $1,800 so far. Viking guarantee at least 1 free excursion per port, so our excursion costs tend to be lower on Viking. The HA approach would seem to favor those who prefer to organize their own excursions, since you aren't already paying (indirectly) for the 'included' ones with Viking. At the end of the day, it will be interesting to see just how much cheaper these HA cruises are going to be!

Thanks for all the info here! I ended up booking two cruises on HA on Friday; a single-occupancy circle-Japan cruise next March with my buddies (the ones who will be in the Neptune Suite, requiring me to have Club Orange so I can join them) and one with my girlfriend to Malta in September. The price was so cheap (compared to Viking) that we upgraded to a 'Signature' room on the Malta cruise and it's still much lower than the Viking rate for a veranda room. We went for 'Club Orange' on the Malta cruise also; it seemed to give us a much lower price on the rooms, somehow (or at least, our HA travel guy was able to get us a better price than we could get on the website). The HA travel guy was very helpful. We're going to have two nights (one full day) in Rome at the start, and 4 nights (three full days) in Barcelona at the end. HA seem to have fewer 'pre-' and 'post-' cruise extensions compared to Viking, but - we felt the last two pre / post extensions with Viking were not good value anyway so we'll just put together our own package. Now we get to see how the excursion booking process is, compared to Viking.

I kept notes/screen shots. It's a 14-day Iceland cruise, from Rotterdam, but - it's for single occupancy so the rate is basically double the typical 'double occupancy' quote (which gets doubled at the end, for two). I've since been looking at lots of cruises, and the premium for choosing your own room seems to vary wildly, I believe depending on what range of 'other' rooms exist in inventory. So, for example, if there's only a few rooms left, and those rooms are at the bottom level of the category, the price difference is zero. But if you started out with, say, obstructed view', then go 'choose your own room', the difference jumps up because the range of rooms shown isn't restricted to obstructed view rooms only. Thats my current theory!

I try real hard on cruises, especially since Covid, to avoid elevators at all costs - I view elevators as germ concentrators, and stairs as weight-loss devices/gym substitutes 🙂 . But yes, I will find a way to get to the Cafe. Or just eat in the cafe ...

To clarify, on the itineraries I've looked at (4 looked at in detail today!), HA typically arrive at a port at 7 or 8am, and depart from the port around 4pm, 6pm, or very rarely 11pm - almost never spend any nights in the port. EG - (HA snippet from a longer itinerary here): Compare that to this from Viking, similar itinerary (In reverse) - this is from our recent cruise): (I just noticed they didn't state the departure time from Sihanoukville 🙂 - it left around 6pm I believe). As you can see, only in Hue (Chan May) did they arrive and depart the same day. It seems like Viking often give you two half-days in a port, and spend the night in port, while HA arrive very early, and depart very late, but are always sailing overnight. Again - not a scientific analysis, I just happened to compare these two in detail.

My friends tell me the Noordam has a 'dedicated VIP section' for CO within the main dining room area. So that's why they want me to get CO, so I can join them in that section. Makes sense.

Since you have experience with Viking, I do have a question for you if I may. Looking at the HA itineraries, it seems like HA very rarely spend an overnight in port. We just got back from a Viking cruise in Asia (Bangkok to Hong Kong), and HA have an almost identical itinerary (Hong Kong to Singapore). But comparing the two in more detail, we had 5 overnights in port, with some of them two nights/3 days (Bangkok, Sihanoukville, HoChiMin City, HaLong Bay, Hong Kong) while HA seem to only have one overnight, in Bangkok (but HA then goes on to two extra destinations). A couple of other quick reviews of itineraries suggested a similar pattern (though I'm still new to their itineraries, of course). Are overnights in port more expensive for the cruise line? I also noticed, Viking seem to give you two nights in both the start and the end port, while HA just 'depart' on the first day and 'arrive' on the last day. Not sure what to make of this - though it does give you (on the first port) a bit of a buffer in case you have issues with flying in.

Thanks for all your detailed responses! Very helpful! I'll try to ask follow on questions in context ... let's see if this works ... (crystalspin said): There are Nespresso type machines IN neptune suites but I have not heard much good about them! Also I have no memory of seeing anyone toast their own bread in the Lido. The Exploration Cafe is on Deck 3 on the Noordam, starboard between midship and forward stairwells/elevators. Lattes are not free, but they are reasonable and probably not worth booking with HIA. I hate Nespresso machines; I just want steamed milk with an espresso shot. The Exploration Cafe is on Deck 3; Google tells me the Lido Cafe is on deck 9 ... so I'd be running up and down stairs to go between the two. Is the Lido the main location for breakfast buffet, and can I at least order a latte in the Lido (served, and paid for)? Regarding toast - every breakfast buffet I've seen in the past few years (cruises, hotels, etc) has had a pile of fresh bread next to either a toaster, toaster oven or a 'conveyor belt' toaster. Do HA simply provide a stock of recently toasted bread in the buffet? I like my toast fresh, and 'very' dark (I call it cremated, for emphasis!). To restate my desires - I feel like my needs are incredibly 'basic' for breakfast - I don't want bacon/eggs/omelets/sausages/benedicts/porridge/cereal/pancakes, etc - just fresh toast, lattes, and fresh fruit. I guess I could 'place an order' for a latte if that's possible in the lido, but if it's a true 'buffet' (pure self-serve), maybe not? The Viking 'buffet' is more like a full-service restaurant that just happens to have a lot of stuff ready to be picked up. It has an army of cooks and waiters on hand ready to custom make everything, and they'll get you the latte if you ask (I just prefer to do it myself as it's faster). (crystalspin said): The number of specialty dinners included in HIA depends on the length of the cruise, which you did not mention. Duration would be 14 days. My travelling companions are HA veterans but they've been doing Neptune for so long I don't think they remember what it was like to be in the lower grade rooms! But they did suggest I get Club Orange, making it sound like I would need to do that to be able to hang out with them easily. Thanks again for your help! Edit to add (since no replies yet!) This description says (about the Lido Restaurant, at night) "A casual dinner with waiter service, from 6 p.m. to 8 p.m., incorporates a couple of entrees from the dining-room menu and other options, along with multiple appetizers, soups, salads and desserts." So does that mean, Lido switches from Buffet (breakfast and lunch) to 'waiter service' for dinner, and if so, does that mean there's no full-blown 'buffet' for dinner? Using the Viking example again, their 'World Cafe' 'buffet' is more of a hybrid full serve/buffet than a classic buffet; they have plenty of cooks on hand ready to grill a steak, salmon, mahi-mahi, tuna, etc plus there's an array of prepared items to take (eg, 'side dishes'). They don't serve you at the table - you have to walk up and either pick up food or order and wait for food. So is there anything like that with the Noordam?

Thanks for informing me about the 'quench' package! Works out at $21/day it seems - probably worth it if i drink 2-3 lattes and a few bottles of sparkling water, which is my daily dose. But it does say ''Enjoy ... bottled water ... and Exploration's Cafe Beverages". I'm still not clear on where exactly I can get a latte on the ship to have with my breakfast; I want to have the latte with my breakfast buffet; is that 'Exploration Cafe'? (You mention Lido Cafe above). With coffee, I don't touch a drop after breakfast, but during breakfast, I want them fast and furious! Since my friends already have the benefits of Club Orange, and will presumably make reservations and get seated, won't I simply be able to join them at their table, without needing my own 'priority access'? The extra entrees is obviously a benefit. When you say "all restaurants are available to you, you can make a reservation at Canaletto and Pinnacle Grill" (with the Club Orange), is that unlimited - like, every night if I so desired?

Thanks for the detailed replies to my message; I'll review and digest the info and probably come back with more questions shortly. In the meantime, I did a sample booking and was surprised to see the very high premium associated with choosing your own room! For a basic 'ocean view' room on a 14-day cruise, the difference between choosing my own room vs letting HA assign it was $700 - (and I think the premium was higher if I chose a better room class). Is this always the case and why do they charge such a premium? The more I go through the details, the more I see the 'value proposition' eroding between HA and Viking! The 'starting price' for HA is much lower, but - Viking include specialty coffees, sparkling water, basic wine/beer with meals, basic WiFi, specific room choice, one excursion per port, (some) specialty dining, and probably more I haven't figured out yet! It's still hopefully going to be cheaper, but not by as much as I first thought. I guess that's somewhat obvious! (not trying to turn this into a Viking vs HA debate, just making some observations!).

I'm new to HA after a couple of Viking Ocean cruises. I loved the Viking experience but the value proposition of HA is hard to ignore so I want to give it a try. I'm looking at a cruise on the Noordam, joining a couple who are already booked on a cruise in a Neptune suite. I will be joining them solo and will be going for an Ocean View or Veranda suite. I prefer self-service for breakfast. All I want is toasted bread (toasted by me, to my darkness requirements 🙂 ), fresh fruit, and a few cafe lattes. Viking has a 'pretty decent' self-service espresso machine in the buffet - it's not perfect, but it's better than waiting in a long line for a custom-made latte. Does HA have anything like this available with the breakfast buffet? If not, what are my options for a latte? As I understand it, the 'HIA' package includes specialty coffees so I guess that means Cafe Lattes are not free? I typically drink 2 or 3 of them in quick succession and don't like to wait, which is why the machine is such a good option. Since I'll be in a basic room and my friends will be in a Neptune suite, what options do I have to be able to dine with them? Are there restaurants they can use that I can't? This description suggests there's no exclusive dinner restaurants that Neptune gets that I don't, other than perhaps reservations at the Pinnacle Grill and Canaletto. They suggested I get the 'club orange' deal in order to be able to dine with them, but all I see in the Club Orange description related to dining is 'Priority seating in the Dining Room for breakfast and dinner with an expanded menu'. The 'Have It All' package refers to: ‘Specialty dining: Dinner at a fine dining restaurant’, and 'Enhance your cruise with award-winning specialty dining at Pinnacle Grill, Canaletto or Tamarind' - does that just mean ONE dinner at one of the specialty restaurants is included in HIA? I don't drink alcohol so have no real need for a 'beverage' package, other than for the 'specialty coffees' (which I can't live without). I also drink a lot of sparkling water with meals - is that included? Also - if I don't purchase the HIA package, do I get any internet access at all - is there a basic level of access provided for all? Edit to add: One final thing - I saw in this thread some mention of 'open seating' and 'designated seating' (or similar). We tend to eat later (7pm or later). How exactly does designated seating work? One more thing - if I don't dine with them some evenings, will I have trouble eating alone? I'm not always in the mood for dining with strangers. Thanks for getting me started on my HA journey!

Ahhhh .... all the extras! - excursions, upgrades, cabin upgrades, etc. Yes, I can imagine taking advantage of those. We were given the beverages package upgrade on our recent cruise, unasked. Ironically, I don't drink any more (and my partner manages about 1 glass of wine a night) so it was a bit of a waste!