flowery

VMax- thanks for summarizing- perfect!

Vermeul- great strategizing tips- I will mention it to the couple who will likely remain in Vista and can afford more but are conservative with all spending.  

Suslor- I recall seeing a former HAL regular implore others who are paying a lot for HAL suites to switch to Seabourn. Our Neptune suite on our particular sailing is more expensive than a comparable cabin on Seabourn or Regent Seven Seas. We haven't sailed HAL, Seabourn or Regent. But when I pay inflated prices for a Celebrity suite, I know there's value because of the upgraded food and dining experience. 

We are excited about our upcoming HAL cruise and the itinerary, but most importantly, about being with friends.

Thanks for the replies! One couple is considering getting on a Neptune waitlist and so the other might add on Club Orange if it's not too late. I understand OC is limited. Also, we all understand that non OC isn't allowed to dine in that space. I like the noise and energy of a MDR a few times but not nightly.

In our experience, most specialty restaurants on most cruise lines aren't very good although we'll check them out just for variety.

Oops! Just realized I posted on the wrong thread. LOL- sorry.

Thanks for the replies! One couple is considering getting on a Neptune waitlist and so the other might add on Club Orange if it's not too late. I understand OC is limited. Also, we all understand that non OC isn't allowed to dine in that space. I like the noise and energy of a MDR a few times but not nightly.

In our experience, most specialty restaurants on most cruise lines aren't very good although we'll check them out just for variety.

Thanks everyone for your comments- I'm still unclear about the advantages of dining in the Orange Club dining room. Is the food better? Or is the menu the same? On Celebrity, the Luminae food quality and experience is a big step up (in our opinion). Does anyone recall seeing tables for 6 in the OC on the Rotterdam?

Thanks Suslor!

Is it possible that a Vista Suite passenger could get upgraded to a Signature or a Neptune Suite with Club Orange membership?

For those of you who have sailed the Rotterdam using Club Orange perks, please describe the dining venue. Is it a separate room or just a section of the Main Dining Room? Is it significantly quieter than the MDR? Are tables for 6 available?

We will be in a Neptune Suite but the two couples we're traveling with are not in Neptunes. 

I love Luminae on Celebrity ships- can't go back to the MDR experience- but the friends we are traveling with had a lot of FCC and needed to stick with HAL.

Also, is it true that the Pinnacle Grill for breakfast is no longer available even to Neptune passengers? I don't think we care about Neptune Lounge access- Michael's for suite guests on Celebrity didn't hold much appeal etc.

Any comments from people who've been on the Rotterdam in Club Orange or Neptune class greatly appreciated!

Some apparent medical experts on these boards have assured us for weeks that influenza is much worse than covid-19 and on this particular thread that there's no problem with communal lotions/body wash etc.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/wellness/hand-washing-coronavirus-moisturizer-dry/2020/03/06/ede43874-5fcb-11ea-b014-4fafa866bb81_story.html

Bo- I'm sorry but you're wrong about its transmission.

28 minutes ago, Bo1953 said:

Have you forgotten that this virus is 'respiratory' in its' transmission and not bacterial?

 

As such, touching things or individuals is not the way of transmission, it is sneezing and coughing (mainly) then touching your face or inhaling the the virus from a relatively close distance, in any manner, during or afterwards of being in front of the cough/sneeze.

 

The reason it is highly recommended hand washing regularly be done.,

 

As such, until health officials state that this 'virus' acts like (which is highly unlikely) like a bacteria and can be spread like a virus, then there may be no worry on touching things.

 

When that becomes the case all travel will be shut down for sure.

 

In health and bon voyage

The airports we transited through were busy and congested. I saw two people wearing masks- the ear loop type- not N 95s. One was a TSA agent and another was a passenger at a gate.

The cruise experience itself was excellent. I highly recommend the Edge. I wrote a review several days ago which still hasn't posted. I wonder why hotel reviews on tripadvisor (same owner) appear so quickly but not ship reviews.

Good luck to all of us!

We sailed last week on the Edge. Here are a few of the mistakes I observed:

On embarkation, two different people asked to see our express pass (phone) and handled our phone (or other passengers' paper passes) one after the next, quickly moving people along. Personnel didn't sanitize their hands between handling devices and papers or offer sanitizing wipes to passengers to clean their phones or dispose of their paper passes after all that handling.

Capt Kate announced at muster that there would be no hand shakes; however, our butler extended his hand and crew were high five-ing passengers at a trivia game in The Club.

Communal shampoo, conditioner and body wash in the shower and communal body lotion on bathroom shelf- butler refills with a large jug. Not a good idea. Dispensers are likely contaminated.

Luminae dining- beautiful place settings with showy charger plates. The waiter hands you a heavy menu, you peruse the menu but it's very heavy and while waiting for him to return to take your order, you have a natural tendency to lay it on the charger plates or brush against them. Before the first course arrives, the charger plates (all for show?) are removed and taken away- very doubtful that these chargers that were never used but still potentially contaminated by hands/menus are re washed.

Constant handling of plastic room cards by the crew. No sanitation of hands by crew between handling passengers cards. E.g.- "water guy" at ports, takes your pass in his hand and then notes (by hand!) scrawling on a piece of paper your name and room number and then hands you an aluminum bottle of water! One after the next. Bartenders at the Retreat bar take your plastic pass, look at it, set it aside, make your drink, tear off tip of paper wrapper and place it in your drink, bare hands brushing the tip of the straw and bare hands contaminating the outside of your drink glass. No hand washing or hand sanitation between handling dozens of plastic cards and making drinks. The same situation at Raw on Five, Grand Bistro. All these situations require a scanner like the one they have for disembarking at ports- passengers hold up their cards to a scanner- crew doesn't touch the cards.

Studies at airports show some of the most contaminated things are the plastic bins/saucers in security x ray machines. Celebrity also has these plastic saucers- can they be sanitized between passengers?

I'm sure there are many more examples.. cruise lines should hire infectious disease experts (who could function like undercover "secret shoppers)" to come in and analyze things and make recommendations.

Our sky suite was pristine and immaculate- and the rest of the ship appeared that way as well. But in times of covid-19 and noro- appearances can be deceiving. Actually, I think many of these measures are futile- we tried so hard to be careful but it was very difficult and we made constant mistakes ourselves- unavoidable.

Check out the Crystal board topic "Crystal and the Coronavirus." Some frustrated passengers on both Crystal and HAL posting tonight about their refund policies and not canceling Asian sailings. I'm glad that so far, Celebrity is doing the right thing and hope they keep it up! 

Also, some nice comments on how well Celebrity handled issues in the past.

I hope David and Sally Abel and all the others will avail themselves of offers to get off the ship ASAP even if it means a potential separation from their partners. 

flyertalk china forum has many interesting posts- some by infectious disease experts. The Princess Diamond is described as the new global hot spot and some posting on the forum would rather be in an apt in Wuhan than on the ship!

The elderly passengers who are being offered an opportunity to quarantine in a new location would also be helping the remaining passengers and crew by possibly decreasing the spread of infection and decreasing the pressure on the crew.  Crew that are remaining onboard could possibly spread out into passenger staterooms once they've been cleaned.

Bento box meals should be the least of their worries!

https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/china/2005409-corona-virus.html

Re: the "minimal protection" of the initial "quarantine officers":

They were protected minimally which is sad for them but how much infection did they spread? They weren't accompanied by anyone standing outside the room with a garbage bag for the used gloves and ear scan covers. How many pairs of gloves and how many ear scan thermometer covers were in each officer's pocket? How many could their pockets hold? Did they have dozens of each in their pockets?

How did they retrieve these items each time from their pockets? Were they also fishing around in their pockets for pens and a note pad?

David Abel said they didn't change out the ear scan cover between himself and his wife.

The whole scenario is bizarre and defies common sense and medical sense. I wouldn't be surprised to hear that they wore the same pair of gloves for everyone they checked on. They were protecting themselves (very minimally) but not the passengers and crew it seems.

I saw a video or photos of what I assumed to be the "quarantine officers" when they first arrived on the ship- scenes from the corridors of passenger decks as they went about taking temperatures. My recollection is that none were wearing N95 masks- all had on the flimsy, ineffective "procedure" masks with ear loops that the general public is wearing in Asia. And they had on gloves. I don't recall seeing any foot coverings or disposable protective gowns on that first day. If I'm wrong, someone please correct me.

I feel sorry for the infected "quarantine officer" if he and his colleagues were told by their public health dept that this was safe attire. It's also easy to picture the officers infecting passengers and crew as they made their rounds on that first day doing the "45 second" interviews and temp taking that David Abel described. It makes me wonder what advice Carnival Corp has been given by the Japanese health authorities. Of course, I would much prefer being in a Japanese hospital than many others around the world- I'm sure everyone is receiving excellent care once they're hospitalized.

Re: the dirty bedding and towels- were passengers given bags to place their soiled linens or did they just dump them outside their cabins? And passengers in interior cabins who got outdoor deck breaks should've been instructed to remove their shoes and leave them outside their cabins when they returned.  Very sad and disturbing for the crew members who were instructed to collect and launder these potentially contaminated items..

There are also reports of diarrhea being a first sign of illness. I'm glad that alcohol wipes for toilet seats and surfaces were finally provided.

I admire David Abel and his wife's good humor, patience and wit but I hope someone will go to bat for them and all the rest stuck on the ship.

I can't imagine any independent infectious disease consultant recommending that the staff prepare food, serve it and continue to work on the ship rather than be in isolation themselves.

Now that the infection is spreading among the staff, are meals being prepared off site? Who is serving the meals? 

All this talk of whiskey and more video entertainment is heartwarming but what the passengers and crew need now are strong advocates. I'd like to see Carnival announce that they've hired several independent MD infectious disease specialists (not on the company payroll) and will follow their recommendations. If their recommendations run counter to what Japan will allow, then Carnival Corp should lobby the Japanese govt hard!

Who is preparing the food on this ship? Carnival Corp should step up and contract with a local Japanese company to prepare all meals off site to prevent contamination.

Also, it's doubtful the non medically trained crew understands how to maintain precautions against cross contamination. Could outside workers be brought in to deliver meals?

A new study is showing throat swabs might need to be taken from a deeper spot in the lungs- not normally accessible except by medical personnel in a clinic or hospital setting. See flyertalk China coronavirus forum.

.

In one of David Abel's first videos, he commented on the "medical guys" doing a "45 second" visit consisting of a few questions and a temp reading with an ear scan thermometer. According to him, the cover was not changed between his reading and his wife's. I'm glad that everyone onboard the ship has now been issued their own thermometers.

But I'm wondering- who were these "medical guys"- Japanese public health workers or ship employees? In a hospital isolation room- gowns, masks and gloves would be carefully removed and discarded outside each patient's room each time personnel or visitors entered. What kind of safety precautions were taken during the initial 45 second visits? Was a new thermometer cover used each time? What about shoe covers between cabins?

Who is preparing the food on the ship? If the crew falls ill with the virus, shouldn't all meals be brought onto the ship from outside?

If sharing a cabin, have the passengers been issued alcohol wipes to disinfect their toilet seats and toilet handles and other surfaces? 

Thanks again! Appreciate your help!

Thanks so much Karysa for your comments. Someone on the Celebrity board was just at Grand Case and really enjoyed the Rainbow Cafe. I had also considered Holland House for lunch but wouldn't swim there because of Great Bay pollution.

Is Grand Case still in recovery and not a good choice? Any lunch recommendations on the French side? I appreciate your help!!

Can anyone recommend a non polluted beach on the Dutch side?

Has water quality at beaches on the French side been tested?

Glad to hear there's a good private hospital in GC. Decades ago, I experienced care in a GC public hospital that treated the poor. Antigua is beautiful- you must enjoy living there.

Hope the cruise insurance comes through for you! I know the claims process for travel insurance is onerous- look forward to hearing if Celebrity's insurance is an improvement. 

I've read nice things on cruisecritic re: cruisers experience with Celebrity reps who accompany passengers on medical or hospital visits- hope you had a good experience in Curacao. 

Deb- so sorry to read about your ordeal. Thanks for letting us know about the mistake reading your xray. Important info!

In the US, aren't most xrays read by a radiologist? Unless it's something glaring, I would think most generalists would have difficulty deciphering.

Were you able to see an orthopedist in Curacao? I kept looking for your post about this. I noticed in later photos you still weren't wearing a boot.

I don't know if this idea is feasible while at sea but we've had good luck using an app from the Cleveland Clinic called Express Care Online. Specialists are available for online consultations. They accept insurance too but we didn't try to use it. Can the ship's Dr transmit xrays electronically to another party for review?

I saw on tripadvisor you're from Raleigh. James Nunley at Duke is an outstanding foot specialist if you decided to postpone your surgery. If you went ahead with the surgery today, hope you have a successful outcome- please let us all know how you're doing when you feel up to posting again.

Oh no! So sorry!

Since it's been almost 4 yrs I'm fuzzy on the details but we must've left from Philipsburg- Celebrity wouldn't offer it if the timing wasn't doable. AS GMT said, there are several ferry operators.

Beaches don't seem to be a high point of St Bart- there aren't many and they are all small? but still an interesting experience and we enjoyed it. The island is tiny. Anguilla is much closer to St Maarten but perhaps the island has banned cruise ship excursions?