tours for machu picchu

mylove · May 14, 2009

If someone can help I would sure be greatful.We will be in Cuzco February of 2010.We'll be here three days.Our hotel Casa San Blas is offering a tour to Machu Picchu for 299.00 apiece,this includes vistadome train ride,bus ticket.entry fee to M.P. and a private guide for 4 people right now.We thought this was kind of high,but the hotel says we are paying for the guides train ticket also.Is this necessary?We won't be staying in Aqua Caliente and not sure if we will beable to get off the train to find a guide.I may never be back to Machu Picchu so this is why we are considering a guide,I would hate to miss anything.Any suggestions would be wonderful.Greatam I know your here alot,so any comments would be appreciated.Thanks Y'all!!!

Kimberley

greatam · May 14, 2009

If someone can help I would sure be greatful.We will be in Cuzco February of 2010.We'll be here three days.Our hotel Casa San Blas is offering a tour to Machu Picchu for 299.00 apiece,this includes vistadome train ride,bus ticket.entry fee to M.P. and a private guide for 4 people right now.We thought this was kind of high,but the hotel says we are paying for the guides train ticket also.Is this necessary?We won't be staying in Aqua Caliente and not sure if we will beable to get off the train to find a guide.I may never be back to Machu Picchu so this is why we are considering a guide,I would hate to miss anything.Any suggestions would be wonderful.Greatam I know your here alot,so any comments would be appreciated.Thanks Y'all!!!

Kimberley

Hi,

First off, don't know how old you are or what physical shape you are in, but any of the hotels in San Blas are EVEN higher in altitude than downtown Cusco. Easy walk DOWNHILL to town, ROUGH walk uphill to the hotel, especially the first day or two. So take that into consideration.

AMS is a REAL possibility, ESPECIALLY walking UP hill. My favorite hotel is slightly further up the hill in San Blas (http://www.hotelcasadecampo.com/ingles/indexin.php) and I absolutely cannot walk back from the Plaza. I have had AMS and it RUINS your vacation (plus it can be life threatening). Just be really careful and take it VERY easy for the first day. NO jumping on and off tour buses. The most activity I recommend is an easy walk to the Plaza and dinner at Norton's Rat Tavern (upstairs, south side of the Plaza). Best hamburgers in South America and you can sit and watch all the activity in the Plaza WITHOUT strenuous activity.

I personally like the Sonesta Posada and Casa Andina hotels around the Plaza. The Sonesta Posada on the Plaza has an absolutely fantastic suite room that overlooks the Plaza.

$299 per person is WAAAAY over the top. Someone is making A LOT of money. RT train (Vistadome) is $142. Can be booked online at Peru Rail. You now have to get a taxi to Poroy (over the top of the hill outside Cusco) so figure another $30-40.00 for the entire taxi. Plus entry fee (I think it is going up to $25.00pp), bus up the hill-$10.00. BEFORE guide service, about $200.00pp. So $400 ($100 x 4) for a guide is WAAAY over the top. $100-125 for a guide for 4 people is about average. You don't really need a guide and I much prefer to take a GOOD MP guide book and TAKE MY time. You can't get lost-the bus only goes up and down the hill. And once inside the ruins, just wandering around, while a lot of climbing, offers lots of opportunities to just sit and contemplate life. NOT doable with a guide-they hustle you right through and go on and on about this and that. All that stuff is in a GOOD guidebook.

My two favorite places-in the middle watching the resident llamas and at the top by the "guard shack". Great places just to sit and watch and ponder-how in the heck did they do this???

Hope this answered some of your questions.

waterlizard · May 14, 2009

Hello

We just returned from Galapagos Islands (Celebrity Xpedition) and Cusco/MachuPicchu/Lima. We arranged all the transportation/tours on our own.

We hired a local guide in Cusco with driver prior to our arrival. He provided all transfers to from airport/train ect. He provided excellent private guiding for all sites in Cusco and in Sacred Valley. Price was very reasonable. We were impressed by his knowledge. He also will travel to MP with you and provide guiding services there.

We opted to travel to MP on our own and stay at the Sanctuary Lodge. We took the Vistadome train, purchased the tickets online. We utilized the private guide service from the Lodge - cost $60 for the guide(not per person) and arranged this prior to our arrival. Our guide in Cusco also charged the same amount for Touring at MP plus his costs for train hotel and meals which was almost nothing. If you do not have a guide prearranged you may run into an impromptu strike by the local guides. One day while in Machu Picchu April 28 all guides were on strike. People who arrived on Vistadome train and then the Hiram Bingham train could not hire a local guide at the Citadel. If you can arrange it ahead of time you should.

The Vistadome train is $142.00 PP and can be booked online.

Entry Fee to MachuPicchu $125 Peruvian Soles PP per day- Cannot be purchased at Citadel no US $'s - You can purchase in Town by Train station or in Cusco is valid for 3 days from purchase but only one days entry per ticket

Bus to MP - $7 each way

We have posted some pictures from our trip.

http://mysite.verizon.net/vzeejmdu/travelingtheworld/

I have noted our guides information on the bottom of the Cusco page. If you have any other questions, I'm happy to assist.

Lisa

greatam · May 14, 2009

Hello

Entry Fee to MachuPicchu $125 Peruvian Soles PP per day- Cannot be purchased at Citadel no US $'s - You can purchase in Town by Train station or in Cusco is valid for 3 days from purchase but only one days entry per ticket

Bus to MP - $7 each way

Lisa

WOW!!! They lowered the bus price and REALLY jacked the entry fee. I haven't been "up the hill" since November 2007 (been up there too many times and no friends to show around recently). They were talking about $35.00 Fall 2007, which was a $15 increase. So they went to $45-even more than the proposal. Paying in soles has been in effect since 2007.

I just sent email after I read your post to my Peruvian exporter in Cusco about the increased fees. He wrote they are now talking about $100.00 fees to preserve the ruins. Evidently, last summer there were over 600 people per day hiking the Inca trail (thought they were going to control the permits) and TWENTY FIVE HUNDRED some days at the ruins. Waaaaay too many-what- were they standing on top of each other??? So the government is looking at increasing the fees tremendously to keep the traffic down.

Wonder how much Orient Express is getting from this deal? Having to board the train in Poroy is an Orient Express "innovation" (which kind of ruins the train ride, IMHO). And they are again flying the helicopter into Agua Calientes (another Orient Express innovation) but not to the top of the hill. Leave it to big business to royally screw up something.

mylove · May 15, 2009

Thanks so much,I do hope some give more input.Yes thankfully I am in good health and great shape.My hubby and Mary have a few issues but over all pretty good health.The Casa san Blas have just been wonderful,they have called numerous times already making sure we are pleased.

Lisa I put an e-mail to the tour guide you recommended.I haven't heard anything yet but hopefully will.

Kimberley

Nonna and Papa · May 15, 2009

Thank you for the suggestions. As Kimberley mentioned, (we're traveling together), the hotel is on a hill. Is it possible to take cabs (such as from the Plaza) to this hotel to help with the initial battle with the altitude?

Also, I've seen a recommendation for Peter Frost's "Exploring Cusco", which is reported to be a guide book for the entire area, including the Sacred Valley and Machu Picchu, and can be bought in Cusco. Has anyone had experience with this guide book, or is there another one that would be a good guide to the ruins? If possible, I'd prefer to use a guidebook at our own pace, than follow a tour guide's schedule. But of course, a good guide book is essential.

Thanks,

Mary

waterlizard · May 15, 2009

We purchased The Machu Picchu Guidebook - a self guided tour - revised editition by Wright & Zegarra. It was good to read ahead of time a nice fold out map in the back. We used this to explore on our own for 2 days. We also hired a private guide as I mentioned before for the local insight.

mylove · May 15, 2009

Lisa: Jose responded today he told me to tell you he enjoyed his tour with y'all.He hasn't sent the prices yet,but he said they are coming.Thanks so much.Your pictures are awesome,it looks so beautiful.I just can't wait.

Kimberley

Nonna and Papa · May 15, 2009

Thank you , Lisa. I'll make note of the title.

Mary

freddie · May 25, 2009

Kimberley: We've just returned from a marvelous visit to the Andes in Peru. Some observations to supplement those above:

I absolutely agree with GreatAm (who is always a source of excellent advice) that you must take it easy the first day or so. It turned out, to our great surprise and disappointment, that my partner is extremely subject to AMS (Acute Mountain Sickness). In fact, if we had not had an oxygenated room at our hotel in Cusco, the Monasterio, we'd have had to decamp back down to Lima to prevent him from becoming seriously ill, rather than merely tired and miserable. Thus, you may walk down to the plaza; but you should take a cab (they are very cheap) back up to your hotel.

I do not, however, agree with GreatAm about not using a guide at MP. If there are only four of you in your little group, the guide can do the tour according to your wishes, not his/hers. While it is true that we saw larger groups being "herded" through the ruins by their guides, the small groups (two to six persons) with private guides seemed much more comfortable. The two of us had a guide (who was also with us in the Sacred Valley and Cusco) who was excellent and made very good use of the relatively small amount of time (a couple of hours at a time) that my partner wished to spend in the ruins before returning to the hotel to rest.

Although I agree with GreatAm that the $400 (more-or-less) that seems associated with the guide is perhaps a bit high, it might be wise to bear in mind that this is a very special trip and likely a "once-in-a-lifetime" visit. Further, of course the guide has to get up to MP with you and thus needs a train ticket. Therefore, at the end of the day, quibbling over a hundred bucks or two spread over four people and exploring the ruins while trying to read a guidebook (we read the guidebooks in advance and enjoyed our private guide's commentary on our first visit) might not, in my humble opinion, be the best option. If you are only going to be at MP for one day, I suggest that you make the most efficient use of that day, small $$ be damned. In our experience, having had the good fortune to travel quite a bit, private guides are nearly always the most efficient way to visit a place in a short amount of time. We have never regretted the occasional "splurge" for something like a special hotel or private guide; but we have indeed regretted taking a bad group bus tour or having made bad use of our limited time in some unique places in order to save a few bucks. A visit to Machu Picchu is priceless.

In our case, we were staying at the Sanctuary Lodge at the summit and could go back to the hotel anytime we wished for a shower, a drink, a meal, or a nap, and then return for another visit. While my partner rested in the room, I explored the ruins or hiked up to the Sun Gate. We had our private guide for the first afternoon there and then were on our own for the next two days. That worked very well. As you're planning to stay in Cusco and visit MP for only one day, I firmly suggest that you use a private guide to make the most efficient use of your visit. I also suggest that you not plan to find one either at Aquas Calientes or at the summit. There were a few available; but you can't count on that.

As for crowds, we were very lucky (first week or two or May) to not have crowds at anywhere in the Sacred Valley, MP, or Cusco. In fact, I have photos of parts of the ruins of MP with no people at all in the photos.

You will find that MP is much more striking than any photo can capture. Have a great visit.

Cheers, Fred

greatam · May 25, 2009

Kimberley: We've just returned from a marvelous visit to the Andes in Peru. Some observations to supplement those above:

I absolutely agree with GreatAm (who is always a source of excellent advice) that you must take it easy the first day or so. It turned out, to our great surprise and disappointment, that my partner is extremely subject to AMS (Acute Mountain Sickness). In fact, if we had not had an oxygenated room at our hotel in Cusco, the Monasterio, we'd have had to decamp back down to Lima to prevent him from becoming seriously ill, rather than merely tired and miserable. Thus, you may walk down to the plaza; but you should take a cab (they are very cheap) back up to your hotel.

I do not, however, agree with GreatAm about not using a guide at MP.

You had a COMPLETELY different situation. You STAYED at the Sanctuary and Monasterio. That alone indicates the ability to spend more $$$ than the average tourist spends or is willing to spend for a MP trip.

I am in the Cuzco area often, although I have not been up to MP since 2007 (no need to go because I have been there so many times and no new friends to show around). BUT I deal with the guides all the time (they are my translators/schmoozers for my import business). MOST would not prefer to spend a couple of hours just sitting at the guard house or in the middle of MP watching the llamas while you contemplate the world. Those are truly "special" things in MP. No matter whether you have 2 or 20, the guides want to show you MP, explain "a little" and get through with the day. They are doing their job, which just like your job-10-12 hours max INCLUDING train travel.

I still say a good guide book for MP allows all the things the guide will tell you AND allows time to do it your own way.

To each his own.

Diva Onboard · May 26, 2009

In reading the posts here, I'm a bit concerned about AMS - alititude sickness. We are booked for Machu Picchu as an extension of our Galapagos cruise. Is there any way to tell if you might be susceptable to altitude sickness - does age or a physical condition predict if you will be susceptable? Is there a way you can prevent it other than taking it easy your first day in?

Is a yellow fever shot recommended for travel into Machu Picchu?

greatam · May 26, 2009

In reading the posts here, I'm a bit concerned about AMS - alititude sickness. We are booked for Machu Picchu as an extension of our Galapagos cruise. Is there any way to tell if you might be susceptable to altitude sickness - does age or a physical condition predict if you will be susceptable? Is there a way you can prevent it other than taking it easy your first day in?

Is a yellow fever shot recommended for travel into Machu Picchu?

Physical condition more than anything. Breathing problems, COPD, smoking all contribute to AMS as well as heart conditions. Can you ski in Colorado??? Could you walk around Nederland Colorado without problems??? Best thing-ask your doctor

I ALWAYS recommend drinking coca tea constantly and chewing coca leaves. Get off the plane, go IMMEDIATELY to the back of the airport parking lot. There are a couple of little kiosks there. One lady sell bags of coca leaves. She will make you coca tea. You should also buy a bag or two of tea leaves. Drink a couple of cups of tea at the airport AND KEEP drinking the tea about every 2 hours for the first couple of days. IF you feel AMS coming on (usually begins with a headache), start chewing coca leaves. No, they don't taste good. But the alkaloid in the coca leaves will ease AMS. There is also prescription Diamoxx, available in the US for about $50 for 20 pills or $15 in Peru non prescription. You CANNOT take Diamoxx if you are allergic to sulfa drugs. You pee A LOT (it is a diuretic). Things taste funny-like fizzies and rust (I don't know any other way to describe the taste).

Please check with your doctor. Cusco is 11,500 feet. Over the mountain outside of Cusco by Sacsayhuaman ruins on the way to Sacred Valley/ MP-almost 15,000 feet. EVERY tour drags you to Sacsayhuaman. It is JUST TOO HIGH for most people to do this on the first day or two. PLEASE be careful!!!

NO YF vaccination specifically needed UNLESS you have been in certain countries prior to your Peruvian entry- Brazil, Columbia and Venezuela and most any place in Africa.

Diva Onboard · May 26, 2009

Thanks for the coca leaves tip. I don't smoke, don't have COPD or breathing problems that I'm aware of. I do have high blood pressure, completely controlled by meds.

So if you get a headache, can you take the usual Excedrin, Aspirin, Tylenol, type of thing? And if that doesn't work - am I to asume you should be concerned that you have a big issue with altitude sickness?

I will definitely check with my doctor - although I'm not sure anyone can predict if a person would be affected unless they do have some serious health issue.

Thanks again for your advice.

woodley · May 26, 2009

What is COPD?

I do not drink any type of caffeine drinks as just one glass makes my heart race. Does the coca leaf/tea have the same effect?

I am a litle worried about this as If I have any caffeine at all I end up staying awake till about 4am.

greatam · May 26, 2009

What is COPD?

COPD-Chronic Obstructive Pulmonary Disease

Kind of like Emphysema

I do not drink any type of caffeine drinks as just one glass makes my heart race. Does the coca leaf/tea have the same effect?

I am a litle worried about this as If I have any caffeine at all I end up staying awake till about 4am.

Then don't drink coca tea. The alkaloid in coca leaves is what they make cocaine out of (after many refining processes). Coca leaves are age old Peruvian medicine for AMS. But they expand your blood vessels to allow more oxygen in the blood. So yes, they would probably make your heart race. Better speak to your doctor about taking Diamoxx if you are concerned about AMS.

And PLEASE, take it VERY easy the first days. One big reason why I ALWAYS recommend at least 4 days in and around Cusco. Day 1-total chill out day-rest and NOTHING more than an easy walk around the Plaza. Day 2-go to the Sacred Valley AND do not go climbing around the ruins in and around Cusco Day 3-go to MP Day 4 This is the morning to climb around the ruins in and around Cusco. Then get on a plane if you can (often the planes can't fly late in the afternoon due to weather conditions). You MAY have to fly early Day 5

The ship excursions and a lot of packaged tours jam all this into 3 days. Very good way to get AMS.

Nonna and Papa · May 26, 2009

COPD means Chronic Obstructive Pulmonary Disease. It is usually an after effect of smoking, due to the tars in the tobacco. The smaller airways of the lungs become narrowed and clogged with mucus, making it difficult to exchange air. It is a debilitating disease, requiring oxygen and can severely impede physical activity. The disease doesn't get better, and attacks can be triggered by smells or poor air quality.

My (and Kimberley's) concern is that just this year, I've had some breathing problems that my physician is treating like asthma My lungs are clear, and there's no COPD or emphysema. My doctor has prescribed an inhaler and it has helped. I've explained that we will be taking a trip to MP and the altitude is very high. She doesn't feel that the trip will be a problem.

I will take the good advice given here about resting the first day, taking things easy the second, taking a cab from the Plaza to the hotel, and of course drinking the coca tea. I do have a nursing background and know to listen to your body, of course that certainly isn't a guarantee for anything!

A visit to MP will be a once in a lifetime tripfor us, I'm sure. I'd hate to miss anything, but until we get there, and after taking as many precautions as we can, we'll have to see how things go. We surely can't predict much at this time. But all these common sense and experienced suggestions most definitely help the planning.

Oh, and greatam, as far as new friends to show around............;):)

Mary

greatam · May 26, 2009

Oh, and greatam, as far as new friends to show around............;):)

Mary

When are you planning on going??? I KNOW I am going to Cusco in either late October or early November but I also have to go to Puno (Lake Titicaca-THAT is high-12,000+ feet at lake level and no way to get lower without flying out of the place). Depending on how much stuff I buy, I probably won't go back until the first part of January, but if things sell well, then another trip early December for Xmas buying. Then one trip the end of February.

MAYBE we could meet up. Keep me posted about your plans.

Nonna and Papa · May 26, 2009

Hi greatam,

Whew! Do you get any sleep at all???:)

I was kidding...but if you're going to be in the area, we would love to meet you and take you to dinner as a thanks for all your great advice.

We'll fly out of MIA on Feb. 6, and will stay at the San Antionio Abad. We finally managed to get our booking, but correspondence was a real problem. I never received a reply to any of my emails, and Kimberley had problems, too. But all is well and we have our reservations.

Monday, Feb. 8, we'll fly to Cusco and we're staying at the Casa San Blas. We'll fly to BA on Thursday, Feb. 11.

So, please, pencil us into your calendar, and we'll hope that things work out. Thanks.

Mary

freddie · May 27, 2009

Gina - I certainly did not mean to offend you. I have read your posts avidly for the last year or so and have benefited greatly from your advice regarding Peru and Rio (not to mention Dubai - lordie, your advice to that nice kid about whether it makes sense to spend a total of 5 nights in that peculiar city is certainly spot on - I found three days there about two days too many).

I recognize that our trip in Peru was a bit (well, quite a bit) different from one in which people were staying in Cusco and just going up to MP for the day. We made the decision to make the major (and, as you know, rather painful) splurge and stay at the summit at Sanctuary Lodge for a couple of nights in order to have the opportunity (priceless, by the way) of being able to go into and out of the ruins at our leisure. We were very happy we did so, particularly considering that my partner was whacked with major Mountain Sickness and only able to tolerate a couple of hours at a time in the ruins between rest times at the hotel. On the other hand, I had the good fortune to be able to spend many hours within the ruins and above them (on the hike to the Sun Gate), doing exactly the sort of wonderful communication with the ancient stones that you so correctly describe as the greatest experience at MP.

Nonetheless, I will stick to my suggestion that a private guide for a small group of four is an efficient and enjoyable way to visit the citadel. You've obviously been there many times and can enjoy the site with a guidebook and lots of lovely meditation time near the Guard House or watching the llamas. I would respectfully propose that for first (and maybe, only) timers, that is not likely to be a practical scenario. Just getting up to the Guard House is a bit of a chore for someone who is not fit. Twice while we were there, the paramedics were tending to people who could not make it up to the Guard House.

An advantage of a "good" guide (now that's an issue and pretty much luck of the draw) is that he or she would be able to estimate the ability of the persons in the little private group and determine the best options from a physical standpoint, such as which steps to take and whether, indeed, to even try to go to certain places in the ruins.

As for AMS (Acute Mountain Sickness), I cannot repeat Gina's sound advice enough: take it easy the first day or two or three!!! Unfortunately, it appears that there is no way to determine in advance whether you will be susceptible to AMS, unless you've gone to some of the high altitude ski areas in the U.S. and determined how you managed there. If you are staying in Cusco the whole time, Gina's suggested itinerary of when to go where seems enormously sensible.

Diamox is quite useful for AMS, as the local over-the-counter version, Soroche, may well be. We met people on our Galapagos trip who used the OTC Soroche and were quite happy with it, as well as four passengers on our Galapagos ship who used the OTC version in Peru and had unfortunate reactions to it. We were pleased that we had Diamox with us (it's now sold in the U.S. in a much cheaper generic version, Acetazolamide 250 mg, which only cost us abut $2 for 30 tablets with our med plan). Gina is quite correct that it makes any carbonated drink quite nasty (according to my partner).

Again, my point is that for someplace as remarkable as Machu Picchu, squeezing pennies is not the way to go, unless you're 20 years old and backpacking. The difference in experience that a couple of hundred bucks may make in long-term memories is not something to be dismissed casually. Again, just in my humble opinion.

Cheers, Fred

greatam · May 27, 2009

Gina - I certainly did not mean to offend you. I have read your posts avidly for the last year or so and have benefited greatly from your advice regarding Peru and Rio (not to mention Dubai - lordie, your advice to that nice kid about whether it makes sense to spend a total of 5 nights in that peculiar city is certainly spot on - I found three days there about two days too many).

No offense taken. And thanks for the compliments. That poor kid-5 days in Dubai???

Maybe my vision is "skewed" but I have NEVER taken a guided tour of MP. Even the first time (and at the time, I had no idea I would be back), I bought a really good guidebook at the little bookstore/TA upstairs from the Inka Grill and just wandered around by myself. I read the book the night before I went and kinda sorta knew where I was going and what I wanted to see.

The first trip to Cusco, I got AMS horribly bad. It was totally miserable and it was caused by trying to do waaay too much the first two days. Walking around town the first day trying to purchase train tickets, climbing 110 stairs uphill to my hotel, climbing all over ruins in and around Cusco. What a fool I was. The headache started about 5:00PM the first day. By 8:00PM, I was in a very bad state-gasping for air, shivering, unbelievable headache, just feeling totally miserable. Thank goodness for the hotel owner-he made me VERY strong coca tea. Made me drink two cups, then made a whole pot to take to my room. He brought additional blankets (that I could have done without-3 alpaca blankets felt like hay bales on my legs). Brought a little heater (one of those radiator things) to try to keep me warm. I woke up a lot but just keep drinking the coca tea. By the next morning, I felt somewhat OK.

Went to the Sacred Valley on an ORGANIZED tour and they drag you around Sacsayhuaman (which is even higher than Cusco) and have you climbing all over the ruins around Chincheros. I was getting sick again. So I stayed on the bus, enjoyed the "non strenuous" activities. BUT I forgot my coca tea and wasn't smart enough to ask some of the locals where to get some. Back to the hotel-drank GALLONS of coca tea and went back to bed. The next morning, I was going to MP-what the trip was all about. I HAD to be well.

I realized that I could not climb to the guard tower on that trip. I could not climb Wayna Pichu. I could not hike to the Sun Gate. But IF I took it easy, I could have a very enjoyable day and see a lot. And that is how I found the rock that hangs over the middle of MP and sat and watched the llamas for an hour. Nobody else was there and other than a couple I ran into a couple years ago who followed me to the rock, I have never seen anyone else stop there. I saw all the tour guides herding their clients along. Was soooo glad that I wasn't in any of those groups.

After I decided I wanted to import from Cusco/Puno and started going to the area with some frequency, I drink coca tea from the minute I get off the plane to the minute I leave. I have never had AMS again. BUT I also take it VERY easy the first day or two. After I started going to MP almsot every trip, I started really watching the tour guides. They round everyone up at the entrance, take them through the ruins and take them back to the entrance. Not only do they go straight through and only hit the highlights BUT on a day trip, you have about 6 hours between trains.

Tour guides use up 2-4 of the 6 hours. What do you do then??? You are back at the entrance. MOST people simply get on the bus and go down the hill to Agua Calientes. Nasty, dirty little area. That is one reason I advise doing it yourself. Pick out your route from your guide book. Keep track of the time so you don't miss the bus down the hill or the train back to Cusco. And just wander around, guide book in hand. DON'T climb if you don't want to. Do this at your own pace. If you REALLY want some extra detail that you think you need, stand at the back of one of the tour groups. You get to hear but you don't have to "continue on" your journey if you want to explore further or like me, just want to go slower or sit down and rest.

To each his own. You may have a valid point, but I still believe doing it yourself with a good guidebook will allow you to stop if you need to and look at what interests you more than with a guide. I spend a lot of time looking over the edge down to the river and also in the area of the communal baths. I think it is just fascinating how they used the bath water to water the fields and the canals they built. And I have NEVER seen a guide point out the block and tackle "eye" that is just across the path from the bath. How they did that???? Truly ingenious.

greatam · May 27, 2009