RCCL leaving Bayonne?

I can't find any listings for Port Liberty, Bayonne, NJ past 3/7/10. Either no dates or N/A. Is Royal Caribbean leaving Bayonne?

They won't release those dates until spring of 2009. Most of the sailings are up to April 2010 but not all

They would be crazy to not have a ship leaving out of Bayonne. We are finding many of the cruises pretty close to full. I know we love not worrying about airfare.

But I agree with previous poster - just too far in the future to post those itineraries.

I can't find any listings for Port Liberty, Bayonne, NJ past 3/7/10. Either no dates or N/A. Is Royal Caribbean leaving Bayonne?

You've made an enormous leap to a conclusion that is totally unsupported by the evidence. :rolleyes: As Sue L and others have pointed out, the schedules for dates beyond March 2010, with the exception of those for Oasis of the Seas, have not yet been released and probably won't be available until March or April of 2009.

Royal Caribbean has made a significant investment in developing Port Liberty and is much more likely to expand and improve its facilities there than to abandon the port. They have successfully filled Explorer since it began sailing there and Celebrity also has cruises out of there, so the chances that they are leaving are slim or none.:)

You've made an enormous leap to a conclusion that is totally unsupported by the evidence. :rolleyes:

I don't think you need to be taking shots at the OP here. He asked a question out of curiousity, not everyone is always so informed.

I remember a while back there was a rumor that Royal Caribbean was leaving Los Angeles. So I decided to go check this out for myself. And sure enough, I saw the ship was leaving Los Angeles. I even took pictures to prove it ...

Good bye ...

So imagine my surprise when the following week they came back ...

But then the ship left again. So this time I followed the ship. It went to Puerto Vallarta ...

But then it came back - again. So you really can't tell if they are leaving or not.

We were on the Explorer last week. During the Platinum/Diamond reception Captain Ryan said RCCL is planning on building a new terminal in Bayonne.

That cracked me up:D

Great pictures of the lovely Vision!

I don't think you need to be taking shots at the OP here. He asked a question out of curiousity, not everyone is always so informed.

Not trying to take a crack at the OP, but merely pointing out that it is a bit premature to reach such a dramatic conclusion based on such a lack of solid evidence. He could just as easily asked the question about the Explorer's schedule in 2010 without suggesting that the current lack of such information indicated that the ship would be leaving Bayonne. Jumping to conclusions is not something that I would encourage.:rolleyes:

Cruizer2, thank you for the chuckle...great sense of humor!

Cruizer2,

Thanks for the laugh! Great photos!

OP....I've had personal conversations with Xaviar, past hotel director, also Jorge, present hd, as well as Jordbeourne, chief engineer, and Capt. Erik. All have told me that they need a second ship at Cape Liberty, as the Explorer sails at full capacity.

I don't know anymore than that, but it would seem that there's no cause to pull out of this port.

As others have said, they are constructing a new terminal there. :)

You've made an enormous leap to a conclusion that is totally unsupported by the evidence. :rolleyes: As Sue L and others have pointed out, the schedules for dates beyond March 2010, with the exception of those for Oasis of the Seas, have not yet been released and probably won't be available until March or April of 2009.

Royal Caribbean has made a significant investment in developing Port Liberty and is much more likely to expand and improve its facilities there than to abandon the port. They have successfully filled Explorer since it began sailing there and Celebrity also has cruises out of there, so the chances that they are leaving are slim or none.:)

Actually the evidence is clearly on the OPs side.

Evidence a) In April 2009 the Explorer has 3 Caribbean cruises scheduled

Evidence b) all Caribbean itineraries (including Oasis) are published through April 2010 (I count 23 published itineraries ranging from 4 nights to 13 nights)

Evidence c) Explorer has only one Caribbean sailing scheduled for April 2010 and all cabins are listed as N/A

While we do not know if the Explorer will sail out of Cape Liberty beyond March 2010 I think it is totally ridiculous to tell the OP that he/she has no evidence. He/she has more evidence than just a port renovations.

Maybe RCI sails the Explorer, maybe a different ship, maybe none...who knows.

EDIT: to add - a ship sailing full is no reason to keep a ship in a certain port as we have learned with the Monarch. RCI, just like any other cruise line, is looking for ways to make up for the lack of onboard spending. First measure is always the reduction of fuel, cutting service etc.

The 9-Night Explorer itinerary calls for almost 5 sea days and the chance of sailing at reduced speed without missing a couple of ports is almost non existent. In my opinion at this point the Explorer Caribbean itineraries beyond March 2010 are on the negotiation table.

One way to make a statement: tell all your fellow cruisers to actually spend a dollar or two on the Explorer. Otherwise you may end up with 9 Night Canada cruises all summer long which by the way have only been released to October 2009.

You've made an enormous leap to a conclusion that is totally unsupported by the evidence.

Big difference between asking a question and drawing a conclusion.

EDIT: to add - a ship sailing full is no reason to keep a ship in a certain port as we have learned with the Monarch. RCI, just like any other cruise line, is looking for ways to make up for the lack of onboard spending. First measure is always the reduction of fuel, cutting service etc.

There is more than one reason the Monarch was pulled from Los Angeles. First of all, it is going to replace the Sovereign of the Seas which is leaving the fleet. In fact, the Monarch will also soon leave the fleet.

Second, you will note that the Vision of the Seas is also being pulled out of Los Angeles. The reason that these two older ships are being pulled is because of the new polution standards for ships (and cargo trucks) in the Los Angeles Harbor. Otherwise Royal Caribbean could have simply moved the Vision to the 3/4 day run when the Mariner showed up.

I also disagree with you regarding "evidence". Evidence would be the Explorer listed as leaving from a different port. The fact that a schedule is not published at all for the Explorer means just that, its schedule is not yet published (for who knows what reason). If the Explorer is listed as leaving from Miami, then that would be evidence. If there is no schedule for the Explorer at all, then that is not evidence of anything beyond a schedule that has not been finalized. It is not evidence of a ship moving to a new home port.

There is more than one reason the Monarch was pulled from Los Angeles. First of all, it is going to replace the Sovereign of the Seas which is leaving the fleet. In fact, the Monarch will also soon leave the fleet.

 

Second, you will note that the Vision of the Seas is also being pulled out of Los Angeles. The reason that these two older ships are being pulled is because of the new polution standards for ships (and cargo trucks) in the Los Angeles Harbor. Otherwise Royal Caribbean could have simply moved the Vision to the 3/4 day run when the Mariner showed up.

 

I also disagree with you regarding "evidence". Evidence would be the Explorer listed as leaving from a different port. The fact that a schedule is not published at all for the Explorer means just that, its schedule is not yet published (for who knows what reason). If the Explorer is listed as leaving from Miami, then that would be evidence. If there is no schedule for the Explorer at all, then that is not evidence of anything beyond a schedule that has not been finalized. It is not evidence of a ship moving to a new home port.

Not really. If the Explorer would be pulled into a different itinerary in April 2010 which has not been released yet such as a TA and Repo she can't be listed with any port.

The point of my post was not if and when the Explorer leaves but simply a response to someone who rudely attacked the OP by concluding OP has no evidence to back up. OPs evidence is, at this point, superior to this bla bla about port renovations and that the Explorer is not listed on any port. Guess what, the Navigator has two cruises listed in April 2010, as well as the Voyager. No listings for the rest of April 2010. Because? They do TAs and those come out in April 2009. All, let me spell it out, A-L-L Caribbean itineraries for April 2010 have been released - exept the Explorer. Maybe the Explorer stays where she is maybe she is doing a TA and will be replaced or not.

So as you can see, the attempt to contradict the OP, rudely or nicely, has very little merit considering that the majority of evidence lays with the OP.

As a matter of fact, the way the Explorer is listed (with one 9 Night cruise for April 2010) looks similar to the Voyager and Navigator listeing (2 sailings and then nothing) and both are doing TAs.

The move of the Monarch? We do not know why she was moved. It was certainly not because the Sovereign was leaving. It is a neat scapegoating. The Sovereign could have been replaced by a Vision Class, very easily. But she was not. When the Monarch leaves, she has to be replaced by something elses, unless RCI gives up the 3/4 market out of PC. It will be a Vision Class, most likely.

The move of the Monarch was rumored to be a financial reason. It was said she runs losses. Ask Critterchick. That was the official reason - moving the Monarch to make her more financially lucrative. Having sailed on the Monarch I can tell you she is extremely fuel efficient (floating doesn't use much fuel) and according to cruisers like Critterchick the Monarch was always full. Leaves us - again - with the lack of onboard spending.

The pollution standard is a brand new excuse. Haven't heard that one yet. But if that would be the reason they easily could have upgraded either ship. This of course makes only sense if both ships run a profit waranting such upgrade. I guess they did not (despite sailing full) which brings us back to the main reason-lack of onboard spending.

In the 80s and 90s the break even point for cruise ships was 75% of sold inventory. With dumping prices the focus is more on onboard spending then it ever was. Onboard spending used to be added bonus not a major income source.

No ship is safe in any home port. Revenue is down, they'll move it, even the Explorer, if neccessary.

FL-Cruiser, the only problem I note with your theory is that the 9/12 nt. caribbean itin. sailing from bayonne have many more sea days than most, where onboard spending is at a maximum, so I'm not quite sure how onboard spending would be a problem with ships sailing from Bayonne. Also, if explorer is indeed leaving, wouldn't one believe a new ship would be replacing it?? (construction of new pier!)

The OP's original post was poorly worded. Inexperienced posters don't realize that these threads stay up for week (s) at a time and many readers here just skim the titles.

Thus the phrase "RCI leaving Bayonne?" is extremely misleading, which was NEGC's (Bill) point. A skimmer would see the headline and think RCI was shutting down operations at MOTS.

A better title would be "Why no NJ sailings for the Explorer after April 2010". This is clearly a question, and no skimmer would draw a false conclusion.

Bill is one of the more logical thinkers here.

Not trying to take a crack at the OP, but merely pointing out that it is a bit premature to reach such a dramatic conclusion based on such a lack of solid evidence. He could just as easily asked the question about the Explorer's schedule in 2010 without suggesting that the current lack of such information indicated that the ship would be leaving Bayonne. Jumping to conclusions is not something that I would encourage.:rolleyes:

LOL, can you imagine how many people called RCCL because they just read the title and not the entire thread...:eek:

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Boy, CC'ers can make a conflict out of anything.

Stick to the good stuff like formal nights, smuggling booze, and the proper nautical terms for a ship.;)

FL-Cruiser, the only problem I note with your theory is that the 9/12 nt. caribbean itin. sailing from bayonne have many more sea days than most, where onboard spending is at a maximum, so I'm not quite sure how onboard spending would be a problem with ships sailing from Bayonne. Also, if explorer is indeed leaving, wouldn't one believe a new ship would be replacing it?? (construction of new pier!)

One would think that more sea days would mean more onboard spending but in a world where low cruise fares opened the door for budget cruisers I could see that sea days don't equal to more onboard spending.

Like I said, my argument is not and was not if the Explorer leaves but rather opposing one of the 'more logical posters' (The Big Booper) who somehow lost the logic and lifted his 'evidence' of port renovations' above and beyond the OPs reasoning which can easily be backed by multiple cases of evidence.

Fact is that RCI is shifting and repositioning its ships over the next years:

- Oasis, Allure, Independence out of Port Everglades

- Navigator in winter time in Miami instead of Port Everglades

- Freedom to Port Canaveral

- Monarch to Port Canaveral

- Mariner to LA

- Vision to Europe and South America

- Radiance in 2009/2010 partially in San Diego.

RCI increased its inventory in the Caribbean with Oasis and Allure. Technically it would be in RCI's interest to stop sailing the Caribbean from any port other than the Florida ports. It would force people to fill the increased inventory down here.

It will be interesting to see what will happen when the Monarch goes, then the Majesty goes and the addition of Oasis and Allure.

I would reckon that any home port outside Florida is unsafe, just like New Orleans, Philadelphia etc have learned that lesson once.

Boy, CC'ers can make a conflict out of anything.

Stick to the good stuff like formal nights, smuggling booze, and the proper nautical terms for a ship.

I think it is a nice discussion. Just because some disagree?

Disagreement is part of life.

I like this thread.:)

One would think that more sea days would mean more onboard spending but in a world where low cruise fares opened the door for budget cruisers I could see that sea days don't equal to more onboard spending.

 

I like this thread.:)

Exactly!!

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RCCL just has not released the dates yet. They are NOT leaving Bayonne:)

Right now I am not commenting on any possible fleet re-deployments by RCI, but..........................

Friend of mine (retired teacher, part time TA), took 8 people on the Noordam January 2008. He was told by several senior officers that HAL would not be doing the NYC-Caribbean routes after Spring 2008 because the elderly HAL clientele did not spend enough on the ship during seadays to justify the long 1000 + mile stretch up and down the east coast from Manhattan to the Caribbean islands, especially with sky rocketing fuel prices.

I assume that the younger and more active RCI crowd would not spend all their time snoozing in the shade of the promenade deck as the ship does it's long run from NYC-Bermuda-St. Martin, etc. Who knows?

I still hold to my earlier statement, the title of this thread is totally misleading. I don't think the OP realized that false rumors would be started from a quick read of the title (His one and still only one post here.)

I assume that the younger and more active RCI crowd would not spend all their time snoozing in the shade of the promenade deck as the ship does it's long run from NYC-Bermuda-St. Martin, etc. Who knows?

Agreed, that was exactly my point in my other post and it seems most logical, this is one reason why RCI continues to drop ports from itin. (I know, fuel saving is a reason there too!) Also, this is the entire concept behind Oasis, the ship is the destination, keep people on it and they'll spend muchos dinero.

In defence of he OP, I was looking at the April 2010 cruise that was listed as it would work great for my kids' spring break, and was watching prices, when one day all category are listed as N/A, so something is going on....

Now if they give us the liberty instead, I would be very very happy.