Beardface
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Posts posted by Beardface
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There are few people booking right now. Those who are booking are going to book regardless of price, because they don't need to be convinced to come back.
Once lines start opening back up, and ships start sailing, expect the deals to hit in earnest. These lines aren't going to want these ships sailing at 50% capacity, they'll need them filled, and they know they're going to have to incentivize people to come back. Deeply discounting prices will be one of the first ways they'll do it.
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7 minutes ago, firefly333 said:
Spirit class. It's a nice class with the most space per person. I took miracle to alaska and it's a very nice class.
Magic to me is a upgraded conquest class, with a extra dining or two. The ship after magic had a few more bells and whistles, but magic has italian food, which I dont like ha.
Sunshine is a older ship they upgraded and squeezed in more cabins... then renamed.
Are these all 7 days?
They have 7 day offerings, but we'd also settle for 5 if the price was right. Sunshine can get us 5 days for as low as $200pp before taxes/fees.
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1 minute ago, firefly333 said:
I'd pick the one closest to drive to. Is sunshine the closest? I'd try that one first. Dont make it over complicated.
Norfolk, actually. Its only about 2.5 hours from here. Charleston is a little under 4 and Baltimore would be around 5, but my brother in law lives in Silver Spring, so while that is the longest drive, it might have more perks, so to speak.
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38 minutes ago, bury me at sea said:
You didn't mention your child's age, but if she's old enough to enjoy the kids club and other activities with new friends or family, I'd choose the Magic.
If she will be in diapers she won't be allowed in any pool.
She'd be 3 to 3 and a half by the time we went. Wanted to get past the 2s before we took her on a vacation just so we could somewhat reason and bargain with her in public to avoid complete meltdowns, which is why we didn't bring her on our MSC cruise in February.
As for the itineraries, the ones we are looking at are all essentially trips to the Bahamas and back. Don't really want to go too crazy with an itinerary with a 3-4 year old, we'll save that for when she's a little older.
And I should probably mention that while it looks like we can book any of the other 3 pretty much year round, the Magic only sails out of Norfolk in late Sept/Oct. Given hurricane season, especially around here, I'm a little hesitant there.
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So like many of you, my wife and I are thinking about the possibility of jumping on an affordable vacation in the 2021 season after all of this Coronavirus outbreak is hopefully behind us. Our next trip is going to be the first we are going to take our kid on, so our goal right now is to try and keep it within driving distance for us. And with that in mind, Carnival is the obvious choice on which line to sail.
So I figure asking the experts here. For a first time Carnival cruiser bringing their kid on her first cruise, which would you recommend:
Carnival Sunshine out of Charleston, SC
Carnival Pride out of Baltimore, MD
Carnival Legend out of Baltimore, MD
Carnival Magic out of Norfolk, VA
We're clearly not looking to book anytime soon (at least not looking to do so until the ships are actually sailing again), but looking to do some research now so we can be ready when that time comes.
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On 4/24/2020 at 3:08 PM, Av8tor said:
From what I can see on YouTube videos, it appears that the ship's bars have Heineken, Heineken Light and New Castle Brown ale on tap. Can anyone confirm this for me? If so, I'd be a VERY happy camper (sailor?)! 🍺 😎
Among others, yes.
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1 minute ago, BermudaBound2014 said:
It's all about supply and demand. Until this shakes out, I expect both reduced pricing and quality. Cruisers are loyal to cruising, but make up a VERY small portion of the travelers. It's doubtful the big three will all survive.
If I was NCL I'd already be working internally to roll out a completely new business model by the time everything opens back up. Nickel and diming only works when demand out paces supply, because people are going to be happy enough to be taking part that they won't mind the extra payments here and there. In a time where demand has cratered, the nickel and diming culture they have adopted is going to effectively put up a forcefield around their ships. Yeah, they'll have NCL loyalists who will book just because its NCL, but coming out of this, the average consumer isn't going to want to put up with that BS anymore.
If anything, I would not be shocked if the concept of specialty dining goes away in the short term, with those venues included with your booking. The lines that will succeed in bringing passengers back the quickest will be the ones who offer the sailing options that are as close to all-inclusive as it gets, including a drastic rollback, if not flat out elimination of the concept of the drink package, at least for the time being.
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11 hours ago, scpirate said:
Booked for 1/2022 on another cruise line.i booked before all this commotion.anyway I did a mock booking last night to see if prices dropped.they actually went up $500 and no o.b.c. what so ever.i believe there are going to be price increase for sure along with cutbacks on food and entertainment.i also believe they will put all these new ships being built on hold.
And this is why I would strongly suggest anyone who is looking to cruise to wait until we have a hard date on when things are going to open back up, and to see that ships are actually sailing again. The second these lines realize people just how much the demand has cratered and that ships are sailing at 2/3 capacity at most, they'll have to adjust to bring the prices back down.
Right now, there is no incentive for them to change their pricing structure. They know that regardless of where the price is set, the large majority of the people who will be cruising want to see ships sail and want to see measures in place before they book. Anyone they get to book now, knowing there is an indefinite ban on the industry here in the US (yes, its 100 days, but it came with a very ominous "we can also extend this if we feel like it" disclaimer) they are pretty much viewing as a sucker who will pay whatever price they set.
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3 minutes ago, sidari said:
BF ... There was more likelyhood of the infection in the US having come from people flying in from China and Europe, despite being told in early January about the virus it was shrugged off as just another form of flu.
Only when deaths began to increase did the blame game begin, people need to look closer to home as to why their respective bodies did nothing and let money rule over common sense.
I'm not saying I believe that to be the case, and I agree with your sentiment. Unfortunately, in situations like this, the truth doesn't matter, its all about perception, and right now we're already seeing the push to make the perception of cruising inherently dangerous that should be avoided. Major news outlets have already run OpEd pieces rhetorically asking "should we let the cruise industry die". There's a push to put all of the blame on the US outbreak on them, and when cruising starts back up, there's going to be significant push back (to the point where I would not be shocked to see crowds of protesters outside ports in NY and others) to allowing cruise ships to sail in any city. And if you go on one, do not be surprised if your own community tries to shun you because of the fear they're being fed about the industry.
That is the battle these cruise lines are going to face in getting people back on their ships. And raising prices will be the quickest way to see the industry collapse upon itself.
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2 hours ago, Até said:
Her template seems to come from Genting's plan for starting up cruises again. I have to think cruising is going to get more expensive if cruise lines have to take on these measures. Any lines that wants to stop at US ports are going to have to make similar changes.
Any cruise line that raises prices coming out of this is going to be in financial crisis for a while. The demand for this kind of vacation in the short and medium term future is going to be bordering on an all-time low. There have been many articles and authorities outright saying that the cruise industry is the leading candidate for how COVID-19 infected the United States. There is going to be a significant anti-cruise community (that already existed due to the myriad of environmental issues these ships cause the planet) going forward that is going to actively and effectively try and scare people away from these vacations with hopes of bankrupting the industry, using the fears over this virus as leverage to make it happen. Cruise lines are going to have to slash their prices if they hope to survive.
I'll say this, coming out of this whole ordeal, they're going to have to lower their prices for me to go again anytime soon. The potential risk just isn't worth the price when I could get similar bang for my buck elsewhere.
And lets be realistic for a second... These cruise lines were making money hand over fist before this all happened, and instead of building up a slush fund to get them through a potential financial crisis, they instead invested heavily into stock buybacks, inflating their stock price to pad the pockets of executives and shareholders, so if some of these lines go belly-up, they only have themselves to blame.
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American's expect a certain experience in cruising that MSC just doesn't provide. Its a European line, after all, and there's definitely a bit of culture clash between the Americans and Europeans on these ships, especially for cruises out of Miami where Americans expect the experience to be catered toward them, and it just isn't. Also, the whole 'customer is always right' mindset that Americans have come to expect in their daily lives just doesn't exist. While other lines may try to sugarcoat situations, MSC will be blunt with you and not mince words when they can't do what the customer wants.
With that said, if you accept these things to be true, and expect the Euro experience, MSC is a great line. I personally did not have any bad Customer Service interactions leading up to my trip. In fact, their representatives went well out of their way to help me out when they noticed something was off on my booking, after doing a once-over after I called them about something else. And the crew on the ship was great. If I had any complaints, it was mainly about the other people on the trip, and there is very little that the lines themselves can do to prevent that.
I also think MSC thought they could just bring ships to the US and not adjust anything and things would be ok. When the Seaside started sailing here, pretty much every show was opera based. And I don't think their stateside Customer Service dept was really ready for the demand they got hit with. But they went through their growing pains, and the experience is much, much better for it in the end. But their online reviews, and a lot of the slander they still get on this website, still suffer from those early days where they missed the mark a bit.
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I was on the Seaside the week following @Caledonia Boy on that same itinerary. Ocho Rios denied us just long enough for all excursions to be canceled, but outside of that, the sailing went off without a hitch.
I mean, I'm sorry that OP felt worried enough that they decided to cancel the cruise, but there is very explicit language in the contract you sign when booking that if you cancel after final payment has been made, you forfeit the entire payment. The only way to get any kind of reimbursement at that point is to have and use your Travel Insurance to recoup some of that cost. And even then, being worried about the possibility of getting sick is generally not one of the covered criteria.
Now, I get some frustration that about 2 weeks later everything was shut down and FCCs and refunds were issued, but those were for sailings that were not going to happen, and have not happened. OPs ship sailed. All other lines were still sailing. No other line was offering refunds or FCCs at that point. Quite frankly, expecting a reimbursement for your own decision to cancel at that point is probably asking too much. You're pretty much hosed by the contract you signed and submitted, especially when the ship did sail on time.
And yes, the Meraviglia sailed on March 1st. She actually left Miami around 6pm, a little earlier than normal and was supposedly at around 80% capacity.
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Yeah there were a couple threads on this last week
One of the takeaways here is that MSC has the majority of their fleet on 2 week sailings, so when they made decisions, they kind of do it 2 weeks at a time. So if they knew they probably wouldn't be able to sail by mid-May, it just made sense to cancel through the end.
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1 minute ago, HappyInVan said:
I see no evidence to support your claim ... "They knew about it back in November, and by the end of December ordered all research into it destroyed about a week before they went public. "
The Straits Times article quoted ...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caixin
What the ST actually said was ...
"Two days later on Jan 3, the National Health Commission issued its gag order and said the Wuhan pneumonia samples needed to be treated as highly pathogenic microorganisms - and that any samples needed to be moved to approved testing facilities or destroyed.
One virologist told Caixin that even the Wuhan Institute of Virology (WIV) under the Chinese Academy of Sciences was not qualified for the tests and told to destroy samples in its lab."
In fact, the article goes into some detail about the history in December. Pretty in line with what's outlined in the wikipedia summary. The additional information is about the role of private genome testing companies.
On December 27, just 4 days before Wuhan CDC informed WHO ...
"In an unusual move, the company did not send back results, but instead called the doctor on Dec 27. "They just called us and said it was a new coronavirus," Dr Zhao said."
The first case of someone suffering from Covid-19 can be traced back to 17 November, according to media reports on unpublished Chinese government data.
The report, in the South China Morning Post, said Chinese authorities had identified at least 266 people who contracted the virus last year and who came under medical surveillance, and the earliest case was 17 November – weeks before authorities announced the emergence of the new virus.
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6 minutes ago, HappyInVan said:
Is there any evidence to back your amazing claims?
Fact is that after Wuhan CDC informed WHO on December 31st. There have been WHO observers in China. WHO and China produced a joint paper in mid-February...
In fact, Chinese researchers have published many findings. On January 12, Chinese institutions and University of Sydney published the first genome studies.
http://virological.org/t/novel-2019-coronavirus-genome/319
Researchers worldwide have been in consultation with their Chinese colleagues and medical specialists
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019%E2%80%9320_coronavirus_pandemic#History
I'll go with the official version. Local authorities were forced to acknowledge the disease in late December. Failed to contain the disease. Beijing stepped in and imposed a quarantine on Wuhan by January 23th.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019%E2%80%9320_coronavirus_pandemic_in_mainland_China
There's uncertainty about when Beijing knew about the problem. But, Beijing acted decisively and the epidemic is over. They've done their jobs.
Western scientists knew about the threat in January and they must have alerted their governments. For example, USA imposed travel restrictions on China on February 3rd.
https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/coronavirus-us-travel-restrictions-monday/index.html
Those leaders must be held responsible for failing to contain the disease in February and March. They have yet to do their jobs.
In fact, the world has been treated to the farce of politicians publicly contradicting their medical advisers. The results are plain to see for those who have clear vision.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_response_to_the_2019%E2%80%9320_coronavirus_pandemic
Test results from multiple labs in December suggested that there was an outbreak of a highly infectious virus. However, the results failed to trigger a response that could have prepared the public, despite being fed into an infectious disease control system that was designed to alert China's top health officials about outbreaks.
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Around that time, local doctors sent at least eight other patient samples from hospitals around Wuhan to multiple Chinese genomics companies, including industry heavyweight BGI, as they worked to determine what was behind a growing number of cases of unexplained respiratory disease. The results all pointed to a dangerous Sars-like virus.
That was days before China notified the World Health Organisation (WHO) on Dec 31 about the emergence of an unidentified infectious disease, two weeks before it shared the virus' genome sequence with the world, and crucially, more than three weeks before Chinese authorities confirmed publicly that the virus was spreading between people.
Concerns about the new disease were initially kept within a small group of medical workers, researchers and officials.
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On Dec 30, Dr Li Wenliang was one of several in Wuhan who sounded the first alarms and released initial evidence online. Dr Li, who was punished for releasing the information, would perish from the disease five weeks later, after contracting it from a patient.
On Jan 1, after several batches of genome sequence results had been returned to hospitals and submitted to health authorities, an employee of one genomics company received a phone call from an official at the Hubei Provincial Health Commission, ordering the company to stop testing samples from Wuhan related to the new disease and destroy all existing samples.The employee spoke on condition of anonymity, saying the company was told to immediately cease releasing test results and information about the tests, and report any future results to authorities.
Then on Jan 3, China's National Health Commission (NHC), the nation's top health authority, ordered institutions not to publish any information related to the unknown disease, and ordered labs to transfer any samples they had to designated testing institutions, or to destroy them. The order, which Caixin has seen, did not specify any designated testing institutions.
It was Jan 9 when the Chinese authorities finally announced that a novel coronavirus was behind Wuhan's viral pneumonia outbreak. Even then, the transmissibility of the virus was downplayed, leaving the public unaware of the imminent danger.
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2 hours ago, hamrag said:
One could argue that China feels more attractive than the US of A right now....and Europe, for that matter! 😉
Don't get me wrong, there are A LOT of things that could have been handled better in the US than it was, and we should have had a handle on this long before we did.
But don't forget just how unbelievably badly China bungled this, allowing it to reach epidemic status before they alerted the rest of the planet what was going on. They knew about it back in November, and by the end of December ordered all research into it destroyed about a week before they went public. And there are estimates based on sulfur emissions (a byproduct of cremation) in China during this outbreak that they are are likely under reporting the number of cases they had (and possibly still have) by over 40x. And lets not forget that this all originated in a wet market, the kind of market the rest of the global economy has been begging them to shut down for decades because of fears this exact scenario would play out.
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The thing I miss most is the general excitement within the cruise industry. Always excited about the next ship (I was lucky enough to see the Scarlet Lady come in right before debarking the Seaside, and even the crew was excited over seeing her). Always excited for everyone else flying down and boarding. Excited for someone getting a trip booked and final payment made. Excited in vlogs getting posted to YouTube.
Since the middle of January, that excitement has just been gone. Everyone has been worried, and now the entire industry is in shutdown. Vloggers who used to have so much excitement and joy in their streams are now filled with frustration, angst, and sadness.
This virus will be behind us before we know it. There is a rough stretch that we have to go through between now and then, and when we come out of it, things will be different. But, we will get past it, and that excitement will return. I just wish I knew for sure when everything will be opening back up for good. Because I cannot wait to get my next trip booked and I cannot wait to bring my daughter on her first.
And just in general, I can't wait for the vlogs to start back up and being able to see the joy of the industry kick in again. Can't wait to hear about the Project Leonardo ships for NCL that are based on the same design as the Seaside. Can't wait to see what the Carnival Mardi Gras is going to have for passengers to enjoy. Can't wait to find out more information on the Icon Class from Royal. Can't wait to hear more about the World Class from MSC and more info about the Yacht Club only ships that are in development. And I can't wait to check the marine tracker and not see every ship globally parked in the same place for effectively weeks on end.
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17 hours ago, BermudaBound2014 said:
I'm slightly more hopeful. I feel like meds will make a huge difference. If we can get meds which are reliable and keep Covid19 under control, things will likely bounce back quickly even without a vaccine. Plus, you have the herd immunity thing.
With that said, I'm no longer counting on our Antarctica cruise in Jan of 2021.
The problem is that there is no known medicine out there right now that treats COVID-19, at least not directly. We can treat the symptoms, but once you get it, there currently is no way to help your body fight it off, medicinally, which is why it is SO bad and SO risky for people with weakened immune systems. If we could treat it directly, and have a medicine out there that could actively fight the virus inside the body, this global situation would not nearly be as dire as it is right now, but we just don't have it.
This is why we are seeing these projections out there that these social distancing measures could last until the end of the year, if not beyond. Until we can treat the virus directly, or develop a vaccine that has you create the antibodies that will help prevent you from getting it, there's not much more we can do. And I've read a study that says, because of how easily this virus transmits through a crowd, you'll need upwards of 60% of your population to have caught it and recovered for herd immunity to kick in.
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I just get the feeling that, even if most of our normal lives resume, I can't see any kind of venues where large crowds gather reopening until a vaccine is released. This disease spreads too easily and is too deadly to really bring people into large crowded situations until this is under control.
So my guess is that things like Conventions, Concerts, Sporting events, Resorts, Cruises, etc will all be closed until then.
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On 3/24/2020 at 2:00 PM, drsel said:
Prices will have to go up because the cruise lines have to make up the huge losses
Hard disagreement.
The demand for cruising is going to crater over the short term. For the general public, CV-19 was basically sold as a virus that started in China, and made its way into the US through all the cruise ports. They look at what happened on the Diamond Princess and the Ruby Princess, and they're going to stay away. And just in general, people who liked to casually cruise are going to be apprehensive about being on a ship in the water and the hygiene associated with that. Not because of the ships themselves, but because of how unhygienic they have seen other people on these ships in the past. That is going to negatively impact demand as well. And all of this is before you realize the US just saw 3.3 million people file for unemployment this week, completely and utterly obliterating the previous weekly high since the 60s by around 500%. And its not like a lot of these jobs are going to be immediately coming back, so people are going to have to make tough decisions with their money, and that's probably going to rule out going on a multi-thousand dollar luxury vacation on a cruise for a hefty chunk of the population that was hit by this economic downturn.
All this means is, the cruise lines will HAVE to adjust. If they raise their prices, they'll destroy their demand more than it was already hurt. In the short term, they'll have to drastically drop prices to kick start the industry again. The demand just isn't going to be there to sell out these ships on a consistent basis. And unless you see these lines start selling and mothballing some of their ships, they have to fill them, or they'll lose money on every sailing. All this points toward prices needing to fall, at least for the short term.
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3 hours ago, jenlburt said:
Does anyone know if the umbrellas ended up being included in the YC area?
They are included and they're already set up between pairs of loungers by the beach
With that said, if you plan to swim, bring swim shoes. Lots of dead coral is still being washed up on the shores, and while MSC is working hard to clear it daily and weekly (seriously, there are multiple large mounds all over the island where they are piling them up) I would guess its going to continue for a while, given what work just went on there (and what the island used to be).
Oh, and the YC beach is not protected from sharks. Which was fun to find out when a couple swam by us in the water a few weeks ago.
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32 minutes ago, Fogfog said:
saw a post on social media from a spokesman of another line--asking about interest in "cruise to nowhere" things
and interest
In the past it wasn't possible because of maritime law right? Or trade law?
So I believe there would have to be changes in the US law for any "cruise to nowhere"
Does anyone know what that is?
Customs says 'cruises to nowhere' were never legal
“Due to recent changes in how ships are cleared into and out of the United States by U.S. officials, certain short-duration cruises without a foreign port of call are subject to itinerary changes beginning in 2016,” Carnival said in a statement. “Unfortunately, this means that we will not be permitted to operate cruises-to-nowhere.”
Norwegian Cruise Line’s statement said basically the same thing, adding that three two-day cruises on the Norwegian Breakaway in early 2016 “were affected by this change and will be cancelled, with guests receiving a refund.”
But according to U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP), the federal agency that controls the entry and exit of foreign nationals to the U.S., it is simply enforcing longstanding rules.
The majority of cruise ship crew are foreign nationals, and many hold D-1 visas, making them eligible to, in the words of a CBP statement, “serve as a crew member on a vessel only if the crew member ‘intends to land [in the U.S.] temporarily and solely in the pursuit of his calling as a crewman and to depart from the United States with the vessel.’”
CBP said it “has long explained that ‘cruises to nowhere’ do not ‘depart’ [the U.S.] because they do not land in a foreign port or territory. Therefore, D-1 visa holders are not eligible to serve as crew members aboard ‘cruises to nowhere,’ and such cruises must be staffed by U.S. citizens or lawful permanent residents authorized to work in the United States.”
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For the time being, a chocolate ship is the only way you are going to be able to get a ship model on MSC. When we were on the Seaside a month ago, they were down to about 5 of the metal ships left because their manufacturer was from China and their exports got cut off from the virus, and they did not have any idea when the flow would restart.
MSC and its 'Fair-weather' friends
in MSC Cruises
Posted
Having recently sailed on MSC, having come from multiple cruises on other lines, I definitely think there is a subset of the Cruise Critic Community who have decided to just try and negatively impact MSC's reputation. Its a good line, Ocean Cay is legitimately a gem in the Caribbean that will only get more publicity and popularity down the line after everything opens back up. Its cheaper, but you don't really feel like you're paying for an inferior product. The food and entertainment is good.
The problem is that none of the above is catered toward the American customer. That's not a bad thing, not everything has to be cookie cutter just like everything else, and its actually refreshing to be on a line that actually feels different. But its different, not worse. Unfortunately, for this certain segment of the CC Community being different and not specifically catering to them = bad.
And the thing is, almost every time you see someone trying to defend MSC on here and trying to say they are legitimately no different than the competitors, its immediately met with "oh, just you wait, they really suck its only a matter of time, you'll see" or other statements that essentially consist of 'I have nothing concrete to back up my claim, but I'm going to share it as a fact anyway.'