cindivan

October 31 sailing on Allure.  St Thomas/St Maarten/CocoCay.   Have not received this email but am very hopeful this will be enforced on our sailing.  

Wondering - how does this affect the FL/Desantis/$5000 fine law?

I just saw this on the RC website for cruises leaving through August.  This is new this week??

When indoors, CDC guidelines require all guests 2 and older to wear masks unless they are actively eating or drinking. The CDC does make allowances for guests to remove their masks in venues and events dedicated to fully vaccinated parties.

RC is now requiring vaccinated passengers cruising out of FL to now wear a mask anytime outside of our room or when not actively eating/drinking?  That definitely changes our perspective.   I understand embarkation and disembarkation requiring masks.  Our traveling party had agreed it was probably safer on a ship where it's probably a higher vaccination rate than anywhere else we go. The testing and small amount of cases onboard don't bother me.  It's probably lower than most grocery stores.  But going back to masks required the majority of the time?  We got vaccinated for many reasons, and don't want to be lumped in with those that chose not to just because RC says so.

Yikes, not sure if an AI doesn't sound better than that.  More FCC I guess if it doesn't change.  I guess we have some a month or so to see how it goes (perhaps leaving Oct 31)

23 minutes ago, John&LaLa said:

 

We got a decent price through Air2Sea. 

Will pay for it with final payment 

We have already made final payment.   And we are trying to meet up with my sister and her husband in CLT on the way there and haven't had much success with needing specific flights on Air2Sea.   And *pretty* sure we will be cruising, but we have so much FCC out there don't need to add 2k+ credit on flights that we might not take.

We are sailing on the Allure October 31.  We are all vaccinated and very excited.  Cautiously optimistic.  Haven't booked our flights yet, but working on our costumes!

51 minutes ago, Babr said:

Things won’t improve until more people get vaccinated or acquire immunity through having the disease. In the meantime, people need to practice public health measures to mitigate exposure and spread.

And having Covid possibly/probably isn't as effective of getting it as a vaccine.  There is a lot we don't know, but I don't think it's accurate to say having had Covid is the same as getting the vaccine.   

On 7/6/2021 at 10:01 AM, tampadee said:

CDC is no longer collecting data on breakthrough Covid cases.  It is unknown how effective the vaccine is against variants.  

 True but misleading. A lot is unknown about covid in general. CDC stopped tracking breakthrough cases because they are such a small percentage and very low chance of serious symptoms/complications/hospitalization/death. 99.2% of US June covid deaths were unvaxxed people. 
 

https://healthfeedback.org/claimreview/unvaccinated-individuals-now-account-for-the-vast-majority-of-covid-19-hospitalizations-and-deaths-in-the-u-s-according-to-available-data/

2 hours ago, Colorado Babe said:

I hope folks who state they-will cancel will start soon especially those in suites so we can book some more cruises soon. 

Check out cruises a few days before final payment is due. That’s when we will make our decision.  

57 minutes ago, lovescats5 said:

Maybe that positive test came because the person had to fly to get to a ship.  Why do the people who object to getting a vaccination made to be the bad people.  Even if you have been vaccinated you can get, give the virus.  Maybe the un-vaccinated person got it from you.  First we should wear a mask, then no mask, then a mask, then 2 masks.  AT what time do we hold the government accountable for the dis-information they have been giving since day 1, not to mention the news media.  

Can you provide a peer reviewed study that shows that vaccinated people have been contagious and given the virus?  Probably not. I don’t think it’s a known factor either way. 
 

Studies have shown vaccinated people who do get the virus are typically asymptotic and usually only discover they are positive because of required asymptomatic testing for a job, college, etc. 

Either way, to state vaccinated people who do get covid can be contagious and give the virus to others *might* be true. Maybe not. Odds are certainly lower.  Lots of disinformation both ways.

https://www.cdc.gov/quarantine/pdf/CDC-Conditional-Sail-Order_10_30_2020-p.pdf
 

page 33 of that document (which could change tomorrow of course, but currently the rule) states that if a ship reaches the number of infected passengers (currently 1.5%) or infected crew (currently 1%) the following must occur. 
 

 I can’t get the document to copy paste, but you can use the link and scroll to page 33

Number 3 is one that spells out what people have been claiming/wondering. The cruise heads back to home port and all crew and passengers are either isolated (if sick) or quarantined (not sick)

 

16 minutes ago, Blauelini said:

I feel bad for the RC staff onboard the ships that will have to monitor and control the vaxxed vs. the unvaxxed vis-a-vis,  the different protocols between the groups. This being America,  I forsee the unvaxxed after 1 day forgoing masks, social distancing and everything else, especially when at the bars. Typically the anti-vaxxers are also the anti-maskers. They scream your violating their "rights" and it's all "fake" and no worse than the flu. They dare anyone to infringe on their God given rights while yelling `Merica!. I forsee many verbal altercations between vaxxed and unvaccinated people. Human dynamics of who we have become in this nation over the last year in this highly divided country will play out on these cruises. It's going to be a mess unfortunately. 

Social media will be exploding with videos of angry cruise passengers  if cruise lines think they can enforce different rules for vaxxed/non-vaxxed.  
 

Ugh. Our family decided to realize FCC with RC is a sunk cost unless they extend it until CDC relaxes their restrictions of quarantining passengers and returning to port if cruises pass the 1.5% threshold. Not scared of covid anymore. Just don’t want to be stuck in my room
 

I wonder how many people who currently are opposed to MRNA technology in the covid vaccine will maintain that feeling if the same technology is used to fight cancer and that is the best course of action recommended by medical professionals for the treatment of themself or a loved one. “Nah.  Too new.  That technology is only 50 years old.”

1 hour ago, not-enough-cruising said:

Someone's decision to not get the flu vaccine didn't turn my cruise from a carefree experience to a masked, socially distant experience

Or cut my cruise short and/or make me quarantine in my stateroom if I’m not sick. 

5 hours ago, FOXTROT said:

It is illegal to require anyone to get an experimental drug. You can start by researching the Nuremburg Code & then try various government laws. Then start researching various laws against HIPPA & Disability Acts. The Chinese Virus vaccines are still experimental & schools can require them but they will loose when challenged.

No one is requiring anyone to cruise, go to a certain school, have a particular job. I’m so tired of that argument. That and people using loose when they should use lose.  

5 minutes ago, harkinmr said:

I was responding to your concern about the CDC threshold of infection provision. You commented on your October cruise and I just said that that provision may or may not still apply. That provision has nothing to do with masks or other protocols. 

Ok thanks. Final payment is due end of July so I guess we will have some time (4 weeks-ish from the US without meeting the 95%) to see how it all rolls out. I have way too much FCC to bet any more on the CWC thing when it’s so unknown. So sad because I’m so ready to go!  

1 minute ago, harkinmr said:

There’s no saying that will be the case in October, but it is the policy now. Could it change? Certainly. But I think it’s inaccurate to say there’s any assurance that being infected, or a close contact of someone who is infected, will not have a negative impact.  I would hope that RCI will be upfront with cruisers about what will be the procedures in the event of any level of infection.  A lot of emphasis on the word “hope”. 

I’m not sure I understand your point.
 

Sure, I could still get covid after being vaccinated. Life has no guarantees (Except for death and for most of us taxes,  not my quote obviously).   I will wear my mask into businesses that ask for me to wear it.   But I’m loving not wearing it and don’t need to virtue signal anyone by wearing it when I don’t have to. I made a personal choice to get vaccinated and not pushing that on anyone. But I don’t want to wear a mask on a cruise and possibly get quarantined in my room when there are a lot of other vacation options put there. 

35 minutes ago, harkinmr said:

And you know this is the policy how?  This is not in writing anywhere on RCI's website.  The only reference to a COVID-19 infection is in the terms and conditions where it says you, and any close contacts, can be quarantined or disembarked.  It also says that if a certain threshold of cases appear on board, either in passengers or crew, that the cruise can end and a return to port may be necessary.  The Conditional Sail Order clearly states that upon meeting this threshold of cases, all passengers can be quarantined in their cabins until the ship returns to port.  Testing would be required of anyone that is a close contact of the infected person and on shore quarantine might be required.  There has been no change in that language to date and I don't believe the RCI has disclosed exactly what would happen in the instance of an outbreak.  So what you have said is not the case.

If that is the case in October we will be canceling and maybe *someday* we will use all the FCC we have. Or not. Ugh. Can’t imagine being quarantined in my room. 

16 minutes ago, Etta1213 said:

Has Royal said those vaccinated will be identified some way and allowed to be free of masks? I'm a bit behind regarding this recent development. (Our upcoming b2b is out of Galveston, not a FL port.)

 Very unclear right now what the policy will be. RC just did their 180 yesterday so a lot is unknown. CDC has different rules for ships that don’t have 95% vaccinated passengers. It will be interesting to see for sure!

1 minute ago, RoyalC said:

Just like Norovirus. We all better stay home. Actually the more that stay home the better- lower prices!

Has there ever been a quarantine/ship not allowed into ports because of norovirus?

4 minutes ago, catlady66 said:

What was the point of getting vaccinated if it won’t protect you from unvaccinated?  

It does protect you from you from covid. Just won’t protect you from possibly being quarantined in your room or stuck at sea of ports won’t let you in if there is an outbreak. 

18 minutes ago, Beachammo said:

 

Here is some math....

 

100% of the unvaccinated will test negative before getting on the ship. The only way they'll get it is from a nontested vaccinated carrier.

 

 

7 minutes ago, Goodtime Cruizin said:

 

Naw... here's what I see happening. 

 

All will be encouraged to cruise. Vaxed or Non-Vaxed

Vaxers will have more freedom of protocals on the ship. (no masks, less restrictions)

Non-vaxers will have more restrictive protocals. (masks, more restrictions) 

Thus making more attractive to get the vax before your cruise.

Once your vax record this is shown/uploaded 'voluntarily' ,  you'll be allowed to go 'freely' w/ a different type/color of 'tracelet'. RCL is very good at this. As an example, the majority of guests buy the Deluxe Bev Pkg because they price the single drinks at high prices, thus one generally decides to buy the package. It's a buying decision. Well, vaxing or non vaxing is going to be a 'comfort' decision. 

 

It's my belief that the real issue with most cruisers will be the ability to enjoy a cruise w/o invasive covid protocals, and not the issue of 100% vaxed cruises. If they make too uncomfortable for non-vaxers to go on a cruise, they won't go or they vax up. If they make comfortable & covid free protocals for vaxed cruisers, they'll get on a ship & go. 

 

It appears thar RCL has decided to actually police the cruisers. It should be very interesting to see how the herd the masses from one another and keep the vaxers & non vaxers seperated.

 

 

I will gladly deal with tan lines from a vaxxed bracelet than a mask. It will definitely be interesting to see how RC thinks they can enforce rules with those not vaxxed vs vaxxed.   I foresee a lot of videos with angry people on social media being told they have restrictions if RC really tries to differentiate. 

Just now, RoyalC said:

How do you feel about the rest of the United States now being wide open without masks at full capacity at stadiums and restaurants, etc., no distancing required?

If I’m exposed to someone who has it when I’m at dinner or an event, I can go home and hopefully not get it. But won’t be forcibly quarantined which could possibly happen on a ship. That’s the big difference to me 

10 minutes ago, Biker19 said:

And you know this how?

You’re right.  100% can’t be proved either way. Just higher probability with each unvaccinated passenger.  
 

I’m not scared of getting it. I just don’t want to be quarantined or stuck on a ship if there is an outbreak. Which is more likely with less passengers vaccinated. 
 

Poor Jon Rahm. I can imagine the PGA took lots of precautions and he still lost his chance of winning a huge tournament because he was exposed earlier this week, tested positive and had to drop out when he was leading.   
 

https://www.reuters.com/lifestyle/sports/rahm-forced-out-memorial-after-positive-covid-19-test-2021-06-05/

I doubt RC will be as protective or proactive. Which begs the question of what happens when there is an outbreak. I’m not canceling my October cruise yet, but an island vacation is definitely sounding better. Time will tell. It will be interesting to see how outbreaks are handled. 

2 hours ago, Beachammo said:

I don't understand why people feel a 95% vaccinated cruise is safer? Vaccinated people are not being tested before boarding....they can just as easily bring covid on board. With over 2k on board....you'll still have many that will get sick and cause shutdowns.

 

If everyone unvaccinated and vaccinated test negative before boarding that would be the best solution.

The odds of a vaccinated passenger get it/being contagious are exponentially lower than someone who is not vaccinated. Then it’s just math/probability of potential outbreaks with each additional person who is not vaccinated. 

2 hours ago, Cruise a holic said:

Yes!  Do not want to be stranded out to sea because some people get sick!  

That’s my concern. Without vaccine requirements there 100% will be outbreaks. How will it be handled by the cruise line and ports?  Will I be stuck in my room?  Will we be allowed back to port?

3 hours ago, jrapps said:

Royal originally said that everyone 12+ must be vaccinated, even if they weren't hitting 95%. Now that anyone over 12 can go un-vaccinated, that could increase the risk of an outbreak on the ship. 

But does Royal have to abide by the CDC test cruise rules now that they aren’t requiring passengers and most likely won’t hit the 95% requirement?  So confused how Royal can just bypass the 95% CDC requirement.