Barcelona vs. NCL's new vaccine announcement

[krittykat]

23 hours ago, SpacemanSpiff said:

 

And, just for grins, I pulled up that website, and look what it says for Greece, with an update date of today:

It is always good to check every so often. I swear they change rules every month. I check this site instead of relying on NCL since this will be updated before NCL will update theirs. 

Either way, our cruise to Spain/Portugal and Italy in October should be smooth sailing - no testing either way for us since we are vaccinated and boosted.  Big hassle/logistic nightmare out of the way. 

[krittykat]

23 hours ago, ugagrad97 said:

Correct.  That's my whole point.  NCL's rules do not jive with the rules of the country.  Of course they can set their own rules too.  It's their ship.  But if they're dropping vaccine requirements, pending only local restrictions, I'm not sure why they're saying someone not vaccinated cannot travel from Barcelona.  That is not what I read when I research Spain's rules.

NCL overall rules can't specifically jive with just one country. They can make their rules but may have to adapt some rules for the specific countries they are traveling too.  
Per NCL, for Spain
 

Country Requirements

• Itineraries that include Spain require a booster, for all individuals  18 years or older, if their original vaccine course was taken more than 270 days prior to embarkation.   (if you have received a booster -- the 270 days no longer applies)
• For itineraries which require boosters, in lieu of a booster 270 days after the primary series, guests may present a government recognized or official medical Certificate of Recovery.
  • For European Citizens, this would include an EU Green Pass or comparable certificate.
  • For all others unable to present an EU Green Pass (i.e. US Citizens) a doctor’s note, plus a laboratory confirmed PCR or antigen test result with the proper information (i.e. Name, Date, Date of Birth, Positive Result, etc.) will be accepted   (this applies to unvaccinated though it is not clear)

 

Per Spain's specific guidelines on ReOpen EU site (this is recommended site to check regulations for all EU countries rules)
 

All travellers aged 12 and over, regardless of their country of departure, must provide one of the following documents:

• Proof of full vaccination
  Validity: between 14 and 270 days after the last scheduled dose of the primary vaccination series was administered. After 270 days, vaccination certificates must include a booster dose. For people younger than 18, vaccination certificates with a full primary schedule have no expiration date.
  Only vaccines authorised in the European Union and by the World Health Organization (WHO) are accepted. Certificates with other vaccines will also be considered valid if the last dose was administered with an authorised vaccine.
   
• Negative result to a pre-departure molecular test (valid 72 hours) or rapid antigen test (valid 24 hours and included in the list of rapid tests approved by the European Commission).
   
• Proof of recovery from COVID-19
  Validity: from day 11 after the first positive molecular test and up to 180 days after the sample date. The rapid tests accepted are those approved by the European Commission.
  Travellers who provide certificates of recovery different from the EUDCC and from the equivalent documents must also provide the negative test result confirming their recovery from COVID-19.
   

  Travellers entering Spain by air must provide these documents as a valid 'EU Digital COVID Certificate' (EUDCC) or equivalent documents, meeting the criteria listed above. If they do not hold an EUDCC, nor equivalent documents, they must fill in the Spain Travel Health Control Form, and manually enter data on vaccination, recovery from COVID-19 or negative test result, meeting the same requirements listed for the EUDCC.

•  

   

  For travellers entering Spain by sea, any type of official certificate meeting the requirements listed above is accepted. These travellers do not need to fill in the Spain Travel Health Control Form. (this would apply to cruising unless you are flying in / out of Spain)

While NCL's language is not exactly the same as Spain's guidelines - they essentially read the same.  
Proof of vaccination - you are good to go (meeting the timelines or boosted)
Not vaccinated? - either negative test or proof of recovery

 

[ugagrad97]

6 minutes ago, krittykat said:

NCL overall rules can't specifically jive with just one country. They can make their rules but may have to adapt some rules for the specific countries they are traveling too.  
Per NCL, for Spain
 

Country Requirements

• Itineraries that include Spain require a booster, for all individuals  18 years or older, if their original vaccine course was taken more than 270 days prior to embarkation.   (if you have received a booster -- the 270 days no longer applies)
• For itineraries which require boosters, in lieu of a booster 270 days after the primary series, guests may present a government recognized or official medical Certificate of Recovery.
  • For European Citizens, this would include an EU Green Pass or comparable certificate.
  • For all others unable to present an EU Green Pass (i.e. US Citizens) a doctor’s note, plus a laboratory confirmed PCR or antigen test result with the proper information (i.e. Name, Date, Date of Birth, Positive Result, etc.) will be accepted   (this applies to unvaccinated though it is not clear)

 

Per Spain's specific guidelines on ReOpen EU site (this is recommended site to check regulations for all EU countries rules)
 

All travellers aged 12 and over, regardless of their country of departure, must provide one of the following documents:

• Proof of full vaccination
  Validity: between 14 and 270 days after the last scheduled dose of the primary vaccination series was administered. After 270 days, vaccination certificates must include a booster dose. For people younger than 18, vaccination certificates with a full primary schedule have no expiration date.
  Only vaccines authorised in the European Union and by the World Health Organization (WHO) are accepted. Certificates with other vaccines will also be considered valid if the last dose was administered with an authorised vaccine.
   
• Negative result to a pre-departure molecular test (valid 72 hours) or rapid antigen test (valid 24 hours and included in the list of rapid tests approved by the European Commission).
   
• Proof of recovery from COVID-19
  Validity: from day 11 after the first positive molecular test and up to 180 days after the sample date. The rapid tests accepted are those approved by the European Commission.
  Travellers who provide certificates of recovery different from the EUDCC and from the equivalent documents must also provide the negative test result confirming their recovery from COVID-19.
   

  Travellers entering Spain by air must provide these documents as a valid 'EU Digital COVID Certificate' (EUDCC) or equivalent documents, meeting the criteria listed above. If they do not hold an EUDCC, nor equivalent documents, they must fill in the Spain Travel Health Control Form, and manually enter data on vaccination, recovery from COVID-19 or negative test result, meeting the same requirements listed for the EUDCC.

•  

   

  For travellers entering Spain by sea, any type of official certificate meeting the requirements listed above is accepted. These travellers do not need to fill in the Spain Travel Health Control Form. (this would apply to cruising unless you are flying in / out of Spain)

While NCL's language is not exactly the same as Spain's guidelines - they essentially read the same.  
Proof of vaccination - you are good to go (meeting the timelines or boosted)
Not vaccinated? - either negative test or proof of recovery

 

Curious why then they even need to single Spain out on their country specific guidance.  Is it because a vaccinated guest with an expired booster might think they don't have to test and they're trying to prevent that misunderstanding?  So you really think an unvaccinated person can take a Med cruise with just a test?  I mean, that's the way I read Spain's rules.  But you're the first to point out that NCL's last bullet should be (could be) interpreted for a completely unvaccinated individual. 

 

On their website, that last bullet point is actually indented UNDER the second bullet, which implies a guest has his/her "primary series," so that's where I was getting tripped up.

[krittykat]

1 minute ago, ugagrad97 said:

Curious why then they even need to single Spain out on their country specific guidance.  Is it because a vaccinated guest with an expired booster might think they don't have to test and they're trying to prevent that misunderstanding?  So you really think an unvaccinated person can take a Med cruise with just a test?  I mean, that's the way I read Spain's rules.  But you're the first to point out that NCL's last bullet should be (could be) interpreted for a completely unvaccinated individual. 

 

On their website, that last bullet point is actually indented UNDER the second bullet, which implies a guest has his/her "primary series," so that's where I was getting tripped up.

If you look under NCL's Safe Sail section, you will see that they single out more than just Spain. 
Updated on 8/8/22  https://www.ncl.com/travel-requirements-by-country
you will see there are a number of specific requirements for certain countries including Bermuda, Canada, Bahamas, Greece, Puerto Rico, etc.
These accommodate the additional/specific requirements of each of these countries. 
While NCL has a broad range policy, they still have to comply with the stricter regulations of the Country visited or they are not allowed to dock and disembark passengers. 
It is definitely a do your research before you travel sort of thing.

I initially got tripped up with the primary series and booster language myself but was able to get it clarified that the primary series of vaccinations is the 1st/2nd shot (or 3rd if you are immunocompromised like me).  If you did not receive a booster, then that 2nd shot must be within 270 of the cruise.  If you have received a booster, that time frame requirement does not apply. 
 

Until just recently, the issue of unvaccinated travelers was not an issue since NCL was not allowing them to cruise but they will be after the beginning of September. 
But now, with the advent of unvaccinated cruisers, you will need to look at the country's rules on unvaccinated tourists.   For European travel, I like the ReOpen EU website because it is kept up to date.
Spain currently has 3 options  - 
vaccination proof (like discussed above)
Pre departure negative test (72 hours for PCR, 24 hours for antigen)  the website gives a link to acceptable specific tests
or 
Recovery from Covid document
So, if you are not vaccinated, you have the other 2 options - negative test or recovery letter. 

We traveled to Amsterdam last year for a river cruise. One of our destinations was Germany who had the same requirements last year (no longer applies for now).  Got to learn all this information and how to find countries rules.   Fun times.

Hope this helps. 

We are looking forward to our cruise to Spain, Portugal, France and Italy in October.  
 

[ugagrad97]

21 minutes ago, krittykat said:

If you look under NCL's Safe Sail section, you will see that they single out more than just Spain. 
Updated on 8/8/22  https://www.ncl.com/travel-requirements-by-country
you will see there are a number of specific requirements for certain countries including Bermuda, Canada, Bahamas, Greece, Puerto Rico, etc.
These accommodate the additional/specific requirements of each of these countries. 
While NCL has a broad range policy, they still have to comply with the stricter regulations of the Country visited or they are not allowed to dock and disembark passengers. 
It is definitely a do your research before you travel sort of thing.

I initially got tripped up with the primary series and booster language myself but was able to get it clarified that the primary series of vaccinations is the 1st/2nd shot (or 3rd if you are immunocompromised like me).  If you did not receive a booster, then that 2nd shot must be within 270 of the cruise.  If you have received a booster, that time frame requirement does not apply. 
 

Until just recently, the issue of unvaccinated travelers was not an issue since NCL was not allowing them to cruise but they will be after the beginning of September. 
But now, with the advent of unvaccinated cruisers, you will need to look at the country's rules on unvaccinated tourists.   For European travel, I like the ReOpen EU website because it is kept up to date.
Spain currently has 3 options  - 
vaccination proof (like discussed above)
Pre departure negative test (72 hours for PCR, 24 hours for antigen)  the website gives a link to acceptable specific tests
or 
Recovery from Covid document
So, if you are not vaccinated, you have the other 2 options - negative test or recovery letter. 

We traveled to Amsterdam last year for a river cruise. One of our destinations was Germany who had the same requirements last year (no longer applies for now).  Got to learn all this information and how to find countries rules.   Fun times.

Hope this helps. 

We are looking forward to our cruise to Spain, Portugal, France and Italy in October.  
 

Thanks.  I understand all of this.  I have done my research on Spain.  I just wasn't interpreting the NCL rule the same way you did because of the "primary series" language in their second bullet point. 

 

The bottom line, though, is NCL can still do whatever they want with their ships.  So while I know I can go to Spain without any vaccine (and just a test instead) via Delta airlines, that wasn't how I interpreted NCL's rules. So I'm not convinced they will allow us on the ship.  They can deny me and my party boarding on their ship if they don't think I've complied with THEIR rules.  One would hope that on September 3rd, NCL comes out with clear instructions for everyone who works at every single one of their ports worldwide, focusing particularly on the ports that have different local rules, and that something like this wouldn't happen. But until we pass September 3rd and some people have real world experience (or if they amend their website), we don't really know how NCL views that last bullet point.   For me, I would like NCL to amend their language on the website to make it crystal clear before I book a cruise with unvaccinated persons in the party.  We are looking at September so it would not even be just the deposit at this point.  The entire balance would be due.  That's too much money on the hook.

 

Have fun in October.  Sounds like a great trip.  We're looking at a similar trip but must be just a few days less because we aren't looking at one that includes Portugal.  We're looking just the 7 day round trip out of Barcelona on the Epic. 

[krittykat]

24 minutes ago, ugagrad97 said:

Thanks.  I understand all of this.  I have done my research on Spain.  I just wasn't interpreting the NCL rule the same way you did because of the "primary series" language in their second bullet point. 

 

The bottom line, though, is NCL can still do whatever they want with their ships.  So while I know I can go to Spain without any vaccine (and just a test instead) via Delta airlines, that wasn't how I interpreted NCL's rules. So I'm not convinced they will allow us on the ship.  They can deny me and my party boarding on their ship if they don't think I've complied with THEIR rules.  One would hope that on September 3rd, NCL comes out with clear instructions for everyone who works at every single one of their ports worldwide, focusing particularly on the ports that have different local rules, and that something like this wouldn't happen. But until we pass September 3rd and some people have real world experience (or if they amend their website), we don't really know how NCL views that last bullet point.   For me, I would like NCL to amend their language on the website to make it crystal clear before I book a cruise with unvaccinated persons in the party.  We are looking at September so it would not even be just the deposit at this point.  The entire balance would be due.  That's too much money on the hook.

 

Have fun in October.  Sounds like a great trip.  We're looking at a similar trip but must be just a few days less because we aren't looking at one that includes Portugal.  We're looking just the 7 day round trip out of Barcelona on the Epic. 

I completely understand where you are coming from. I expect NCL will update their site after Sept. 3.  I hope you and your family get to cruise. 

This whole COVID thing has made everything crazy.