Anti-Norovirus Hand Cleaners

[happycruiser3]

Both are OK and effective.:)

 

As with all ingredients, do look up any side effects. From the few short internet searches I have done on these ingredients, I believe that these products are not recommended for children (in case of accidental ingestion) or asthmatics...

 

Thankyou for your quick reply, much appreciated.

 

A comment from a medical friend is to also try and avoid the public toilet facilities onboard (not always possible).

 

Best wishes :)

[BonnieVA]

Just querying the spelling again of the chloride we need to look out for. I think some are suggesting the second product is okay.

 

Thankyou for the information, would hate to come down with noro for my next cruise. Have always been careful and so far avoided any problems.

 

Many thanks :)

 

I'm just as confused as most on this subject. I happened to notice that people were speaking of 2 similar, but different, ingredients so I wanted to draw everyon'e attention to that.

 

I still don't understand, though, why the makers of these products - if one of these 2 ingredients is in their products - do not make claims to being anti-viral. Instead, they just tout being anti-bacterial. It makes me wonder if these 2 ingredients truly do kill noro. Can anyone help me understand this?

[Lobbylin]

Why not astmatics?

 

I am not a medical person, I am simply posting some of the comments I read when I did internet searches on these ingredients:)

[Lobbylin]

I'm just as confused as most on this subject. I happened to notice that people were speaking of 2 similar, but different, ingredients so I wanted to draw everyon'e attention to that.

 

I still don't understand, though, why the makers of these products - if one of these 2 ingredients is in their products - do not make claims to being anti-viral. Instead, they just tout being anti-bacterial. It makes me wonder if these 2 ingredients truly do kill noro. Can anyone help me understand this?

 

If you do searches on these ingredients, you will see they are related and used in hundreds of different products, not just sanitizers.

 

It probably does say what you want to confirm, i.e that is it anti-viral, but just not using those specific words, but instead using more tecnhical language.:)

 

http://www.chemicalland21.com/lifescience/phar/BENZALKONIUM%20CHLORIDE.htm

[bobsig]

I'm just as confused as most on this subject. I happened to notice that people were speaking of 2 similar, but different, ingredients so I wanted to draw everyon'e attention to that.

 

I still don't understand, though, why the makers of these products - if one of these 2 ingredients is in their products - do not make claims to being anti-viral. Instead, they just tout being anti-bacterial. It makes me wonder if these 2 ingredients truly do kill noro. Can anyone help me understand this?

 

 

Maybe I can help - I have a background in the pharmaceutical industry.

First, the U.S. FDA does not allow anti-viral claims on any hand sanitizer type products. Why? Because viruses come in several types, such as "enveloped" and "unenveloped", because food particles can still remain on the hands, because moisture on the hands can reduce effectiveness, etc. and no one hand sanitizer eliminates ALL viruses.

 

Norovirus is an "unenveloped" virus that requires high concentrations of alcohol to kill as opposed to lower concentratons of other chemicals, such as bleach, and certain other chlorides, acids, alkyds,oxidizers etc. "Enveloped" viruses are easer to kill with either.

 

So, what is the conclusion? The most effective is simply wash your hands with soap and water. This removes the food and fecal particles which are the primary carriers of norovirus. Then, ADDING a hand sanitizer increases the destruction of any left over viruses. Using an anti-microbial wipes, such as Wet Ones, substantially increases the chance of removing particles as opposed to just rubbing alcohol over your hands.

 

Below is a study performed at Emory University on the effectiveness of various alcohol based hand cleaners on Norovirus. Note that the most effective was Purell 447F and Micrell. Both are over 70% ethyl alcohol, so that is what you want use if alcohol based. Purell replaced 447F with VF481 which is even stronger. However, VF481 is only available outside the U.S. currently. Notice that the most effective method requires the rinsing of your hands. The removal of those nasty particles is the key!

https://www.handwashingforlife.com/files/2007-IAFP_Human_Norovirus_Fingerpad_Final_072007.pdf

 

Last, those of you with type-O blood have to be a little more careful than the rest of us. Studies show that people with type O have a slightly higher inherited predisposition to infection by norovirus while those with B and AB blood types have a slightly less predisposition to infection.

 

Just remember - WASH YOUR HANDS !!!

[BonnieVA]

If you do searches on these ingredients, you will see they are related and used in hundreds of different products, not just sanitizers.

 

It probably does say what you want to confirm, i.e that is it anti-viral, but just not using those specific words, but instead using more tecnhical language.:)

 

I've done tons of searches & my brain says "enough", lol.

 

But, for example, Wet Ones do not claim to be anti viral or anti-microbial. I'm almost certain they simply claim "anti-bacterial". When I checked out the Soapopular web site I'm pretty sure they also only claim anti-bacterial. I have yet to find a product w/ the Benzethonium Chloride or

Benzalkonium Chloride that claims "anti-viral" or "anti-microbial".

 

But I am giving up on my searches & taking everyone's word - both here & on the internet elsewhere - that they do kill noro.

[BonnieVA]

Maybe I can help - I have a background in the pharmaceutical industry.

First, the U.S. FDA does not allow anti-viral claims on any hand sanitizer type products. Why? Because viruses come in several types, such as "enveloped" and "unenveloped", because food particles can still remain on the hands, because moisture on the hands can reduce effectiveness, etc. and no one hand sanitizer eliminates ALL viruses.

 

Norovirus is an "unenveloped" virus that requires high concentrations of alcohol to kill as opposed to lower concentratons of other chemicals, such as bleach, and certain other chlorides, acids, alkyds,oxidizers etc. "Enveloped" viruses are easer to kill with either.

 

So, what is the conclusion? The most effective is simply wash your hands with soap and water. This removes the food and fecal particles which are the primary carriers of norovirus. Then, ADDING a hand sanitizer increases the destruction of any left over viruses. Using an anti-microbial wipes, such as Wet Ones, substantially increases the chance of removing particles as opposed to just rubbing alcohol over your hands.

 

Below is a study performed at Emory University on the effectiveness of various alcohol based hand cleaners on Norovirus. Note that the most effective was Purell 447F and Micrell. Both are over 70% ethyl alcohol, so that is what you want use if alcohol based. Purell replaced 447F with VF481 which is even stronger. However, VF481 is only available outside the U.S. currently. Notice that the most effective method requires the rinsing of your hands. The removal of those nasty particles is the key!

https://www.handwashingforlife.com/files/2007-IAFP_Human_Norovirus_Fingerpad_Final_072007.pdf

 

Last, those of you with type-O blood have to be a little more careful than the rest of us. Studies show that people with type O have a slightly higher inherited predisposition to infection by norovirus while those with B and AB blood types have a slightly less predisposition to infection.

 

Just remember - WASH YOUR HANDS !!!

 

That was fantastic! Thanks so much! Now I understand ... it basically comes down to the fact that the govt will not allow anti-viral claims.

 

What I also gather from what you've said is that we don't really need to spend a lot of $ on expensive products ... Wet Ones should be fine after washing.

 

We are BIG hand washers. We've taught our boys how to do a thorough job (whether or not they always do is up for question :rolleyes:). What I want is a product to use just before eating. We wash our hands before leaving the cabin but I know we touch so many other things between then & eating. So I want something for after we've ordered our food & handed the menus over. Wet Ones should do the trick. I know there's still no guarantee but I'd like to try our best while on vacation. And, no, I'm not this paranoid year round ... just while travelling!

[Lobbylin]

That was fantastic! Thanks so much! Now I understand ... it basically comes down to the fact that the govt will not allow anti-viral claims.

 

What I also gather from what you've said is that we don't really need to spend a lot of $ on expensive products ... Wet Ones should be fine after washing.

 

 

I agree, it's fascinating reading!!

Thanks bobsig for the explanation:)

[happycruiser3]

I agree, it's fascinating reading!!

Thanks bobsig for the explanation:)

 

 

I second the big thanks to Bobsig, it's good to know that with reasonably easy steps, e.g washing hands frequently and using Wet Ones as often as possible we should have a fighting chance of avoiding the "nasties". Fingers crossed.

 

Many thanks and best wishes :)

[Lobbylin]

I know the product works, we recently cruised on the SAGA Ruby to Egypt, and prior to sailing we were informd of and out break of Noro virus on the Ship. I then contacted SAGA who purchased over 400 bottles so each cabin had a suppply of Purell VF481. The cruise was for 30 days, with no problems reported.

 

Interesting concept.... I hope someone from the cruiselines is reading this:D

You delivered me my order last week;)

[Lobbylin]

Hi, Purell have introduced a new formula called VF481 which is active against Noro Virus. see http://www.handhygiene4u.co.uk

 

All the best - handhygieneuk

 

If you post too many messages I think you will find they will be zapped!!

Be warned.....;)

[Dianneon2]

Re Purell VF 481. I know it's not available in the States. What about Canada? Thanks. Dianne

[bobsig]

Re Purell VF 481. I know it's not available in the States. What about Canada? Thanks. Dianne

 

My understanding it is not available in Canada since it is not FDA approved. This is covered under a Mutual Agreement of Understanding between the two countries: http://www.fda.gov/oia/agreements/HCFDAMOU111803.html

 

BTW, as I have stated before, removal of particles by HAND WASHING in conjunction with a hand sanitizer is the most effective method for deterring the spread of norovirus.