China Making Life Difficult for Cruise Lines?

On Oceania's cruise line board, we are getting posts that the Chinese government has required one ship to...

... change its itinerary by adding a stop at a non-Chinese port between two Chinese ports. (Specifically, the round the world cruise was required to stop at Jeju, S Korean before sailing between Shanghai and Beijing, the original itinerary.)

... and another ship to change it's itinerary by delaying its entry into the port of Tianjin by well over 24 hours. (Specifically, the ship due to end a cruise on March 4 in Tianjin didn't arrive in port until the 5th.)

Another poster has added "China is making it difficult for all cruise lines, not just Oceania."

I looked at the titles of the threads on the first page of the Asia Port of Call board and I'm not seeing anything to suggest this is being discussed here.

Can anyone add anything to the information we're seeing on the Oceania board?

This has also happened with Crystal Serenity. They have to leave Shanghai one day earlier then planned.

Keith

They actually recently introduced a visa exemption for cruise ship transiting in Shanghai allowing to stay up to 6 days without a visa. Sounds like China is making it easier for cruises.

But if you have 2 stops in a row in China as in the first case above, then it is no longer a transit and a visa is required.

They actually recently introduced a visa exemption for cruise ship transiting in Shanghai allowing to stay up to 6 days without a visa. Sounds like China is making it easier for cruises.

But if you have 2 stops in a row in China as in the first case above, then it is no longer a transit and a visa is required.

Your reply focuses on the ability of visitors (and and cruise visitors) to visit Shanghai, Jiangsu, and Zhejiang and elsewhere in the Yangtze River Delta Region for up to 144 hours visa free. The specific example was about an itinerary with stops in Beijing/Tianjin following a port call in Shanghai. The text of the web site whose URL appears below reads, "During the layover period, passengers can move around the three places but not permitted to visit other cities of China." Since the itinerary always included a port call in Beijing/Tianjin, every cruiser set sail with the necessary visas. Despite every traveler being prepared to enter the port of Tianjin, the Chinese government, would not let the ship dock there on the agreed-upon date consider. As a result, the passengers had to scramble to figure out things to see/do in an unexpected stop in S. Korea. And they had to miss every pre-arranged Beijing tour the day they were in S. Korea.

How can this be considered easier?

http://www.travelchinaguide.com/embassy/visa/free-transit-144hour.htm

Yes you need a visa to visit China just like Chinese need a visa to visit the US. My point is that the Chinese government has been trying to make things easier recently with the allowance of transits for cruise passengers. The US does not allow visa-free transits, even at airports.

So my point is that the current trend is China making things easier, not more difficult

As to what you are referring to, it is not clear to me that these circumstances are due to requirements of the Chinese government. This what the cruise company is saying. Possibly the cruise company making a change and making the government a scapegoat. I had a colleague like this, whenever something was going wrong he would tell the client that it was the government's fault. Easier than taking the blame especially when you do not have to provide any evidence to your clients of what really happened.

Yes you need a visa to visit China just like Chinese need a visa to visit the US. My point is that the Chinese government has been trying to make things easier recently with the allowance of transits for cruise passengers. The US does not allow visa-free transits, even at airports.

We're basically talking past one another. I'm not disputing the visa facts. I simply come to a different conclusion when I look at the statistics, albeit with a far-from-complete sampling.

I looked at the 2016 itineraries for Oceania with calls in China and the answer is one out of two. In 2017, the answer is zero for two.

March 15, 2016, there's a cruise from Singapore to Shanghai that will sail without needing a Chinese visa.

The Shanghai to Syndey on April 3 cruise makes port calls in Beijing/Tianjin so those cruisers will still need a visa.

In 2017, the Singapore to Shanghai makes port calls at Dalian and Beijing. Ditto for the itinerary Hong Kong to Shanghai. The Shanghai to Bangkok itinerary calls at Xiamen. At least based on current regulations, those cruises will still need visas.

In 2016, Princess has two itineraries with port calls in China. One, Beijing to Singapore, will still require a visa. One, Singapore to Shanghai, won't.

In 2016-17, RCCL has scheduled 185 cruises in Asia. The vast majority never dock in what used to be called mainland China, although some number of cruises are 2,4, or 5 night cruises out of Hong Kong. Several 4 night cruises depart from Shanghai and never visit another Chinese port.

Clearly, for a very small segment of the visiting public, things will get easier a visit. I'm just not inclined to drop the confetti and pop the champagne corks with such a small segment benefiting from the visa changes. You're enthusiastic. Other posters' mileage may vary.

As to what you are referring to, it is not clear to me that these circumstances are due to requirements of the Chinese government. This what the cruise company is saying. Possibly the cruise company making a change and making the government a scapegoat. I had a colleague like this, whenever something was going wrong he would tell the client that it was the government's fault. Easier than taking the blame especially when you do not have to provide any evidence to your clients of what really happened.

Here's what a poster said in the Oceania board's discussion of these Chinese itinerary problems: "There may be something else at play with the Chinese Government. Within the next few months every major line (NCL, RCCL, Princess, Carnival, etc.) will have mega ships home-porting in China. The Chinese market is HUGE. This will put pressure on dockage, chandler services, shore excursion suppliers and other providers.

One-of stops by smaller ships may not be as important as they once were."

I'm inclined to believe we're already seeing evidence of this with these recent Oceania and Crystal problems. But none of us -- you, me, or the above poster -- can prove what's really going on. Lacking any facts, my opinion isn't any more right than yours and vice versa. We each have to draw our own conclusions based on what we know of the parties involved.

Very soon, China will come up with their own cruise line.

Awhile ago, I took a land based tour in China (not a very long duration) while I was visiting a friend in Hong Kong - couldn't resist the opportunity to visit China! Hold on, there was a boat included - we sailed up the Pearl River from HK into China (arrived in Guangzhou first) so there's a *slight* connection :D

Our welcome into China was mostly uneventful and I passed through immigration alright but I guess someone must have either made a mistake or said something because there was a loud kerfuffle of sorts - rather unsettling when arriving into a communist country with armed soldiers looking very serious in immigration - that's become fairly common now, but there's just something VERY different...I knew instantly I was in a different place.

The tour went very well - every single tour, no matter the operator, is controlled by the government - and so it was confusing when my van was pulled over in a GIANT traffic intersection (really - the biggest I've ever seen!) by a lone traffic controller standing on a podium. He proceeded to examine the documents of our driver and guide (again, certified!) and question them for over 45 minutes, maybe longer. We were never questioned, nor our documents examined but of course, we were all at a standstill. After it was finally over, our guide explained - "this just happens, nothing can be done about, they just decide to check on things" along with truly *fascinating* things we learned from our guide about living in China. He took a chance by telling us such interesting things but I'm glad he did. After I returned home I poured through books - memoirs, biographies...all the stories I could find about 20th Century China, especially the Cultural Revolution and Modern Day China....what goes on. Have things improved? Sort of. But it's what they want us to see, taken to shops they wanted us to shop in (until I convinced our guide to take us to a jewelry factory that was NEVER on the tour...cool.)

I was indeed fascinated and I'm glad I went - I turned out to be an attraction unto myself -at a shrine to Sun Yat Sen in the countryside, I was THE only blonde person and we were the only six Westerners in site - I became a living photo opportunity for countless Chinese but it was fun - I love meeting locals and that's the point of travel. While I'm so glad I had the opportunity to visit China and glad things have "improved" it is still a country with a communist government - it is what it is. They can do whatever they want, whenever they want. Unless there was a modern day "democratic revolution" I doubt I'd ever return - I'd feel too guilty but that's just me. I think everyone deserves the opportunity to discover things for themselves just like I did but...

Anything can and will happen. Will it? Probably not...it does benefit China for things to go wrong - in other words, you'll likely get to come into port most of the time in the manner promised (visa waiver or with visa) because indeed the cruise travel is surely important to China but rest assured - they have their hand in ANYTHING going on within their borders. Learning about China was fascinating - not just ancient China, but modern China too.

I'm sure most cruises will likely NOT be affected or changed - visas ARE important but barring major changes to immigration rules or, the other option, some sort of POLITICAL ACTIVITY in China or North Korea (or ??) the only thing likely to really affect a change of port is the same as ever: weather! The best way to keep up with what *might* be going on in China is just with a nationally known paper on your phone or tablet as your trip approaches (NY Times, Washington Post etc) and the immigration link another member posted earlier in the thread in case you aren't sure if your cruise line is up to date or just want to be sure it is correct. Everyone wants their trip to be hassle-free and planning a trip in China is just a *bit more* out of the ordinary than visiting other countries for the above reasons....I was quickly shown this on my tour in very simple, benign ways..."Welcome to China" so I just thought I'd share.

Some travelers get phased by nothing, others by very little, still others are phased very easily - countless years on our sister site Independent Traveler and now here have shown me that our members are all wonderful but all very different...China is a place where you need to know what you're heading into. Fascinating, interesting, historic, different, in ways we can imagine and coming from a western world, ways we cannot - in one day port stops you might notice, OR you might not and that's hopefully what you were expecting...I guess sometimes it can be like getting bad weather is all. You never know.

Mostly of course I think it will be lovely and wonderful - just stay very up to date with China...maybe this will all settle down, until it does, stay connected.