Doubt It

Hi dear folks!

Spring is here, yeh!

Any news what is happening on the Regatta? Covid wise.

Saw that the Regatta is code Orange on the CDC site.

Anyone know what is the current status?

I am more than happy to do a land based trip with hotels, car, train. Not being involved in any cruise where I could be "escorted" to a quarantine cabin for X days.

Not happening. Not.

I appreciate the issues for the cruise lines, but you are not quarantining me in an inside cabin, repeat not. 

Thank you kindly for all the posts after my query. Blessings on each of you.

The CDC on May 3 indicated that people should mask while travelling - would this apply to my dear friends voyage on the Regatta right now?

They left LA yesterday.

I note the reported covid in the specialities.......would the CDC directive require the guests to mask, also given the covid in the staff of the speciality?

Thank you very much.

My friends board Regatta tomorrow.

Is there a chance they will have to mask given the state of the vessel and the general increase in the virus?

Well have the Aug 27 Insignia France, to NYC transatlantic. Cancelling it.

Not paying big $ to be wearing masks and testing. Bull.

Moving my $ to road trips in Canada and the USA and having a great time without the testing bull. 

And the cruise industry is going down.

Will cancel the Oceania cruise in August.

A total scam and not paying for it.

Thank you very much for the information dear folks.

MisterBill99- I could not find the link you kindly provided.

I will provide same to my TA and see what happens.

Kindness and good wishes to all.

Thanks you to every dear person posting.

Your knowledge is amazing and for that I give much thanks.

Will do the "easy pass", as it does not work for me.

Blessings to each of you and may you and your families remain well and thriving!

😀

Blessings on everyone:

We have the cruise only fare with the airfare allowance listed - LTH28, we do not drink much nor buy anything aboard and often organize our own tours, so it seems not worth paying for - but if it is for No Cost, well that changes things. 

ORV - you are totally correct, we have a very connected TA indeed, oh yes, and he indicated to get the 3 perks, we still have to pay $900 more based on the current fare for our A1 category.

Seems a bit more unsettling than it needs to be.

Hi LHT28.

I asked the TA after I posted here.

The TA responded seconds ago saying I would have to pay the higher price, like $900 higher, to get the current promotion. That does not work obviously.

This seems ridiculous. I might as well just do the Cruise only fare and pay my own way, this is no advantage at all, especially in Cdn $ as you well know.

I guess being a booked guest means nothing. 

Greetings everyone:

Hope everyone did not OD on chocolate over Easter!

Your assistance would be appreciated. 

Q - What does the Best Price Guarantee mean regarding an existing booking - ie if there are promotions etc?

My Aug 27 sailing on Insignia is included in the current O promotion of all 3 - so does this apply to your a) current booked price, or b) to get the 3,  do you have to re-book at the higher price, which is $900 pp higher than the booked price.

Being rather unfamiliar with 0 - I would appreciate you darn experts to enlighten me!

Many thanks! 

HMR74 and Ride-The-Waves, your posts are excellent and spot on regarding the attitude of Celebrity.

Celebrity has been downgrading their product since about 2015. Their corporate attitude since this time has been to stiff the consumer, but then, it is the consumer who chooses to get stiffed. The new pricing scam is just another example of Celebrity arrogance.

I will wait and see what Celebrity offers on a consistent basis and measure them against their competitors and the premium lines, and that will take many years to determine. In the interim, myself and our travelling group, are ready to book numerous land trips, not a penny to the cruise lines.

Celebrity can charge what they like but that does not mean anyone has to purchase.

Greetings TeeRick:

It appears it is the provinces, ie the same approach as in the states.

The approach here in BC is different than for my sister who lives in Ontario. 

The other thing is that there has been no official statement from the provincial government as to the distribution priority list - ie no open and transparent communication. We learn things via the media and FB and Twitter posts. 

Not good at all. I am not impressed.

21 hours ago, phoenix_dream said:

I know we can analyze this to death and there is certainly no perfect answer, and logical reasons for a variety of approaches.  Did want to comment on one thing, cuz I guess I can't help myself🙂.  If we focus on vaccinating the most vulnerable (i.e., the 60+ year old working at the grocery store), then the issue of the virus spreading by the 20 year old to them is basically eliminated.  And I suspect you didn't mean anything against me by implying I said that a 20 year old grocery store clerk wasn't "deserving" of a vaccine.  Just to get my opinion on the record, I think everyone is deserving of a vaccine.  It is just a matter of what is the most practical priority of the doses that we have.

 

The more I think about this (and I think I need to start thinking about it less!), it seems like we had one of two top priorities - either prevent deaths, or keep the economy from crashing even more.  It seems to me that by and large we chose door #2.  One could argue against that and say that we are did choose option #1 by vaccinating long term care facilities in the first phase.  My cynical mind says that one is more about the optics.  All the news channels as well as statistics repeatedly (and rightly) identified those places as the places with the most deaths.  But if we really, truly, were working to prevent deaths as the top priority, the next phase would be those 60+ and those with serious health conditions.  That is unfortunately not the case.

phoenix_dream, Support your assessment 100%, thank you for posting.

The vaccine distribution does seem willy nilly in terms of any consistency from location to location.

For example, my 93 year old father is in a retirement home, I guess he will eventually get the vaccine. I however, just got an email from the retirement home saying I can get the vaccine asap as I visit my father. Not sure I am pleased with putting me first. 

I support as #1 priority the elderly and immune compromised before any one else. Not seeing this happening.

4 hours ago, Jeremiah1212 said:

 

Is it really that far off though? Within our social circle are people mostly mid 30's to mid 40's, a decently well traveled group with healthy travel budgets. If they have been on a cruise at all, it was 20+ years ago on a Carnival ship and they aren't getting on one again. Quite literally none of them have any desire to join us. In fact the only 'cruising' friends we have are people we have met on cruises and stayed in touch with over the years. The floating Petri dish comment comes up far more than those who say they can't wait to go on a cruise.

Jeremiah1212, that is the same situation with the people we know. All professionals, so have the $ to travel but they have not taken cruises in  the past  - they do land trips so they can see the places in detail. I am the only one who regularly cruises, they simply call cruising "fake".  This also speaks to other threads on Celebrity, about chasing the younger crowd, not sure about that either.

To the one, no one will consider a cruise and like you said, the Petri dish comes up repeatedly.

So, if they were not inclined to cruise before, then add in the Petri dish context, then add in the lingering effects of the virus, I would think there will be significant hesitancy for the public to cruise.

Not sure even the vaccines will dislodge people into being more amenable to cruising. People will long into the future make decisions that give them more flexibility and ways to manage distance, cruising is not that.

Time will tell of course. 

Well I am not so sure about the public's appetite for cruising.

At the nursing station at my father's retirement home, a discussion was underway with three PSW's. They were talking about travel and one stated no way would she ever cruise as cruise ships are petri dishes. The other two ladies jumped in and agreed and the passion in their statements was significant.

I asked them if they had ever cruised, each said no, but two said they had been thinking about it.

Those three ladies represented possible future customers for cruising, I doubt that they will consider cruising ever.

All three were totally against cruising as a vacation option.  These ladies are just 3 so I would extrapolate there are many other consumers who no longer will consider cruising.

Cruising has an uphill battle for customers.

On 12/24/2020 at 3:15 PM, D C said:

 

This is the literal fatal flaw in the distribution plan.  

 

It begs the question "what is the problem we're trying to solve?".  If we're trying to prevent deaths, then we should vaccinate those most likely to die if they fall ill.  If we're trying to protect the ability of hospitals to function, then we should lessen their workload by vaccinating those most likely to fall seriously ill.   

 

DW and I are not in high-risk demographics in any way.  She's slated to receive the vaccine soon as a result of her employment.  Neither of us would get the vaccine ahead of our loved ones in high-risk groups if given a choice. 

 

I'm afraid that we'll continue to watch the media dwell on the death toll of the disease, yet nearly every death will have been preventable once we hit ~50 million TEDs (thanks markeb)

 

 

DC, thank you so much for your comment - the issue is "what is the problem..."

You are totally correct and the current distribution plan I see in Canada and elsewhere is not based on this fundamental question.  As yes, TeeRick, it should be data driven - ie triage: highest % for death, those that take care of the 1st group, then the group that has the worst lingering issues after the virus:

1) Elderly

2) Hospital staff

3) Staff taking care of elderly

4) Immune compromised

So why is my 93 year old father in a retirement home not receiving the vaccine ahead of the staff?  He is more probable to die from the virus, therefore, he should be ahead of them.

My dad is also more probable to end up in the hospital from the virus, so there again, he should be first.

Not pleased what so ever with the distribution plan and I most certainly been politically active making my displeasure known.

Thanks to everyone for the sharing of their amazing knowledge and analysis.

Thank you ipeeinthepool, most interesting.

Well any company can do what they wish, it is up to the consumer to decide what their tolerance is and if they buy it. Time will tell about Celebrity's current fantasy marketing plan. Maybe they will be successful, maybe not. Sort of like Celebrity's past fixation of all things Goop etc.

The concept of Celebrity being premium luxury - seriously not. 🤣

With the information age, consumers have considerable information available before they purchase - that includes checking out cruise lines before purchasing. If the new Celebrity target market does a tad bit of research, they to will be laughing at the ridiculous notion of the concept of premium luxury label for Celebrity.  Assuming they research, few TA's will be able to upsell Celebrity at that label.

But then, the old saying applies "There is a sucker born every minute".  Celebrity assumes there are many suckers out there.....

As the old saying goes, "there is a sucker born every minute".

People need to take care of themselves first. There are many travel options out there, cruising is merely one.

With those prices and those before the virus, no wonder we have scaled back cruising in favor of land based trips - more bang for the buck and more real destination experience.

Cruise lines get real.

Get to your credit card company asap and make a dispute case and get a file number. The credit card companies count the days after a consumer has been given notice of cancellation. Do not wait.

Indicate that the FCC is being pushed on you and that you want a refund. PDF any correspondence from your TA or Ponant that showes the FCC push, attach it to your complaint.

Do not rely on Ponant period.  

Credit card disputes are powerful tools of the consumer. I even got a refund for a Air Canada flight when that despicable airline refused refunds to anyone. 

I have 2 friends in the US who work for 2 credit card companies - the credit card companies are discussing what to do about the cruise lines - as the cruise line behavior has caused them major cash flow problems. Suffice it to say my friends state that the cruise lines are public enemy #1 to the credit card companies.

Ports, less and less. 

Land trips oh yes, and if they happen to be a port stop, we check the impact of the cruise itinerary. The land trips is where you get the deep dive into a destination. Cruises not and especially if the cruise lines use the virus to not allow independent activity - that will equal - 0 cruises going forward.

It is up to each community (like Key West) to decide their future, particularly due to the impact of the ever larger ships, but that may change going forward.

I believe that Celebrity, and the other cruise lines, are deliberately choosing to sell a product that they know will not be provided. 

It works very well as the consumers in the bell curve seem to willingly purchase what is put in front of them.

Say in spring 2021 - what will be the on board product? Will the food and service be downgraded due to cruise line debt (likely). Will the ship likely arrive at the advertised ports (maybe). Will you be required to take only the cruise line shore excursion (likely).

So everyone who is booking - this scenario is ok with you?  I have to assume so.

Cruise ships were the first face of this virus - the interviews of the guests isolated to their cabins were blazed across the world. This is what people remember about cruising. As a matter of routine, I ask business associates and people I meet would they take a cruise, and to the one, it is No. This includes people who have previously cruised.

The activity on the CC board is not reflective of the general population.

14 hours ago, Ride-The-Waves said:

The cruise industry estimates 2020 losses at $20billion, $10 billion in the US alone, and that is not over.  Add in the new costs of sailing, to included expanded cleaning, fewer passengers to comply with social distancing, higher port fees (COVID-related), higher insurance costs, increased crew costs, and yes, I expect the price of cruising to increase.  That means we will be paying higher prices for similar cruises as before the pandemic.  Will sales occur?  Sure - just as always.  Will cruise lines package them as great bargains?  Yep!  Will we go?  Yep!  However, some may be sailing in a less expensive cabin and forgoing on board activities and purchases and fewer tours or eating fewer meals in special restaurants.  What I don't like is Celebrity's obfuscation of these increased costs into the "All Inclusive" pricing to imply one is getting a bargain where most of the pricing is related to recouping losses and hiding the increased costs.  I know its marketing and that Celebrity pretends its customers are dumb and don't notice...  However, we are not dumb and Celebrity should be fair and level with us on the reasons for the higher prices.

Ride-The-Waves, excellent post.

In the end it is very simple, buy what you want which includes each persons individual assessment of pricing.

I am not interested if Celebrity's high prices continue or not - if they price at a level I, I deem, acceptable they would be considered. Celebrity has not had my business in years due to their excessive pricing and constant lowering of on board product. Nothing I have seen thus far would incline me to purchase a Celebrity product.

I believe Celebrity is the most arrogant of the main cruise lines and it shows in their marketing and other approaches to business, and yes, like you said, Celebrity does view many of their customers as dumb and obedient.

The reason for their higher prices is because Celebrity believes there are many lemmings out there who believe their bull, and apparently there are.

morechances - you last paragraph is very important. Thank you for highlighting it.

The value of a cruise for us, and many, are the destinations. Any restrictions of access will simply eliminate cruising for us. I would arrange land travel and gain access without the entire risk of thousand's of other people impeding me, which frankly is a risk in itself.

There is also the issue of prejudice against cruise ships which will likely linger for a long time - the sanctions on cruise ship entry are likely to be more forceful than a single traveler arriving by train or plane.

Simply not interested in paying big $ to participate in the complexity that is related to cruise ships.