commodoredave

4 hours ago, Joc123 said:

I promised myself not to comment on this subject but there is something I’ve always wondered about - when tipping is not required but given anyway, it is always stated that it’s for exceptional service or the person has gone above and beyond.

What has been done that has been so exceptional? What was done that was above and beyond?

 

 I understand the importance of tipping in USA and Canada because that is the way it is but I do not understand why citizens from these countries insist on tipping when it is not part of the culture or required.

 

 

Good question. For me, exceptional service is when my room steward, butler, waiter or bar tender anticipates my needs and/or makes helpful recommendations and suggestions. Yes, that doesn’t happen on every cruise from every crew member. And sometimes I do not tip anyone, and other times I do. And occasionally, and rarely, when all staff meet my expectations, I also give to the crew fund as well as individuals. 
While I cannot speak for others who tip, that is my criteria.

1 hour ago, saminina said:

The error is in taking filthy tipping habits from mass market lines with you as you move up the ladder. 

If you read my signature, you would understand that I have taken mostly ultra-luxury cruises for many years. In fact, I started sailing with Seabourn before they were acquired by Carnival. Having said that, I have met many wonderful people on the mass market ships we have sailed with who would never descend to the level of calling someone else’s tipping preference as “filthy”. 

2 hours ago, BasandSyb said:

 

The person who does your laundry has noted this for a high heat wash and extra starch. The kitchen staff…

Thanks. That’s exactly why no one should contribute to the crew fund. It is a waste of money that has no correlation to the service one receives and only rewards mediocrity.

I believe the purpose of tipping is to reward exceptional service. The reason I rarely give to the crew fund is that my contribution would go to everyone, including those staff who may be underperforming, which is counterproductive and demotivating to other staff who are outstanding. This is why I mainly tip individuals. Having said that, I have on occasion also given to the crew fund when my entire cruise has been excellent. Otherwise, I just tip individuals.

4 hours ago, frantic36 said:

We get it you like to tip because it makes you feel better.

 

The concern I have is that some in the service industry favour those who like to tip and don't treat others equally even when we ware told not to tip. I personally have not had a problem with most crew on Seabourn but as I said I don't like it when crew specifically mention how they like being front staff to get tips. I avoid them from then on.

I would never tip in advance as that is bribery. If I tip, it is on the final night of the cruise and only in special circumstances where it is warranted. I also understand that tipping is not required as basic gratuities are included in the cruise fare of most luxury lines. It is a personal choice.

7 minutes ago, Laylam said:

Or start paying fair wages in the USA....I am bowing out of this now. (A PROMISE)

I think there’s a happy medium where service staff make a better basic living wage but there is still room for someone to tip for exceptional service. 

8 minutes ago, marazul said:

That is the point! When people earn decent wages, you tip little or nothing. It is the mandatory, guilt driven tipping culture that is wrong. Nothing stops you or anyone else from rewarding exceptional service. Ordinary, competent, but not exceptional service deserves fair wages by the employer.  Not practical blackmail of the customers to make up for the lack of compensation that should be paid by the employer. 

 

And the question is, when the job description of Seabourn employees is to provide outstanding, attentive service to all (not just to you) and they are paid a better than a decent wage for their job, should you tip?  When expected exceptional without flattery is the norm, is it exceptional? 

If I consider it exceptional service worth an extra reward, that’s all that matters when it’s my money. Same for you. It’s a personal choice that is between me and the people I tip.

1 minute ago, Laylam said:

Waiters are paid a fair wage in Australia and it is possible they may be earning more than the average General Practitioner,

If that’s the case, maybe time to start tipping doctors in Oz! 😝

3 minutes ago, edgee said:

I believe the cruise director when he says that NCLH legal department has spoken. The reason they gave to senior management and passed down through the ranks is what it is. Agree that it is a crock, but believe he is passing down the message accurately and that is the way the company will operate regarding this matter. Yet they continue to pass on printed policies that say they will take action regarding chair hoggers' stuff, even though they won't.

It would be interesting to see if any recent cruisers have had any experience with the pool chair policy enforcement or not. It has been enforced on other luxury lines I have sailed with, but only after request. Is O an outlier or the mainstream?

16 minutes ago, marazul said:

 

I think a better analogy would be do you tip the store clerk who sells you a shirt? Or do you tip the checkout clerk at the supermarket? You might even be served by the same person often.  The answer is no, because they are paid a full (even if not generous) wage. Waiters should be paid full, fair wages, not have to depend on tips.

Yes, and the world should be free of war, pestilence and food insecurity!

Tips were created to reward excellent SERVICE from people who depend on it because their wages are low. When my service people earn decent wages, as waiters in some countries do, I tip little or nothing. I choose to recognize and encourage exceptional service. 

1 hour ago, edgee said:

No, the hotel director is Oceania's most senior hotel director, moving on from Vista to open up Allura. He knows exactly what the message is from corporate. Your international waters argument makes sense, but does not stop a few Miami based lawyers who make a living suing cruise lines and getting settlements.

The concept of a lawsuit for removing personal items from a pool chair is nothing less than nonsensical. Pay a Lawyer for a non- jurisdictional suit that at most if successful would result in a $500 award. If there is anyone out there that believes this I have beachfront land in Salvador for sale.

I agree with those who say this is ship rather than cruise line-specific. Our back-to-back cruises from Iceland to Norway on the Whisper 2 years ago was fabulous in every respect. However, our last cruise in April on the Muse in Japan had a number of disappointments related to poorly trained crew. The issue with SS is that they are consistently inconsistent. I hope this is more an issue of rapid expansion rather than cutbacks by RCG. We shall see when we sail again with SS next week on the Shadow. 

On 6/13/2024 at 12:46 AM, Laylam said:

I don't get the tipping culture either, it seems to me somewhat demeaning.  Would you tip your Doctor because of the relationship you have developed??

I hope doctors in your country are earning more than waiters! 😍

On 6/11/2024 at 4:35 PM, saminina said:

Long ago, there was an unwritten rule among passengers.  If you enjoyed the service, please express it thru crew fund donation.   You mentioned within the boundaries rules.   That precedent has been destroyed by people not understanding post by MJN1.

I've been on 85 cruises to every part of the world dating back to 1980. I've never come across an unwritten rule about tipping through the crew fund. In point of fact, I've heard the opposite from dozens of crew members who very much appreciate a tip for their exceptional service and not one has ever suggested I give to the crew fund instead. Having said that, I have on occasion done both -- given to the crew fund and a few individuals. I have always believed that tipping on cruise ships is a personal choice in both how to give and the amount to give. Do what you want and what makes you comfortable. There is no wrong way.

On 6/9/2024 at 6:25 PM, edgee said:

Agree, but would not be the first time Oceania has sent mixed signals to guests! 🙄

Frankly, I don't see why removing personal items from a pool chair in international waters would have any legal impact back on land in the USA. I'm guessing the hotel director is a bad communicator or misunderstood the directive from HQ,

23 minutes ago, Techno123 said:

And yet some of the old timer Silversea customers are still saying they won't sail with them again particularly with the move to a more 'casual' dress code and increase in cost of La Dame and Kaiseki especially considering how much SS charge in the first place😜😂

 

I have never been loyal to a brand - I like SB, RSSC & O and will be trying the Silver Nova early next year. I agree with you about choice. For me it's destination followed by cost/value that factors in my decision. I like gratuities and drinks included. Not bothered about tours in Europe but like them for the more exotic/risky destinations. I haven't yet been on a cruise I didn't, overall, enjoy even if there were one or two bumps in the road.

Yes, some of the longterm SS customers still have concerns. Dress code - not an issue for me. Increased cost for specialty restos - an irritant I avoid as I have that choice. Like you, I have no favourite cruise line. I set my expectations accordingly, and try to enjoy what each line does best. I really like trying new lines like Explora which impressed me. Trying Emerald Yachts in February. And O after that. 

11 hours ago, Sthrngary said:

@njhorseman Your point is well taken.  Therefore when we find a brand that provides the approach to cruising we want, has an Itinerary we want at a time, that we want to go, we book it. When that brand changes their approach and some of things we liked get lost or changed, we have to reevaluate future bookings. Our money, our choice. 

 

In my humble opinion this is why there are so many brands that go to the same places.  A great example is Oceania.  I choose them because I did not like all the items provided by Regent Seven Seas that made their price so very high.  Items I would not use and therefor was a waste.  Lost value and money to me.  So I choose the sister company Oceania.  Then Oceana changed their approach not to be as much as a "A La carte" cruise line by bringing in Simply More.  

 

Some folks loved it, some likes it, other did not like and some hated it.  The ones that hated it or did not like it simply moved on to another brand.  But not before the complaints as if they owned the company and how upset they were that the company that they were loyal to let them down. And that like this topic and pages of talk about chair hogs is a venue called Social Media.  

 

I like everyone else have an opinion.  If the brand changes and you don't see the value, leave.  No fanfare needed.  Simply find a better brand for you and be happy.  Your money, your decision.  The brand can't please everyone every time. Brand loyalty does not mean when the brand does not suit you needs any more. 

 

Cruise well and enjoy every moment. 

One luxury cruise brand has taken an interesting approach to try and please a diversity of passenger preferences. Silversea now offers 3 different cruise options- door to door which includes everything including air and transfers; port to port which does not include air and transfers; and essential which does not include air, transfers and excursions. This approach, arrived at after much criticism from loyal passengers, has won me back as a customer. In contrast, I stopped sailing with Regent some 10 years. The bottom line here is that luxury lines don’t need to offer one size fits all — choice is wonderful!

6 hours ago, frantic36 said:

This is the Seabourn board.

 

I know they use the money on Seabourn for providing parties for the whole crew for example they are providing food truck options for crew in Darwin on the 12 June since we have to deal with bio-security checking the ship and staying off for many hours. This includes guest and crew. I also have encountered crew who have had to return home unexpectedly and yes Seabourn paid for their flights but crew fund helped them as well. 

 

I just like to think my money helps those like laundry, security, guys cheerfully clean stairwells and stop as you walk past etc. I had someone a few days ago tell me it is great being at the bar dispensing because you get tips. I really dislike that attitude and am still not sure how to handle it as I don't find him any more worthy than others.

Yes, I know this is the Seabourn board but gave an example of what I was told  by a HD on Silversea. I am hoping it is the same on most luxury lines including SB. As for any additional tips,  the only right way is the way that makes you comfortable. 

3 hours ago, Sthrngary said:

@commodoredave Hi Dave, how are you?  You hit it out of the ball park.  But it goes far past the VIP area's.  Here are some examples.  If you want early boarding, Pay me a fee.  If you want to stay in the private sundeck, like the Vibe Beach Club, pay me a fee.  If you want to utilize the Thermal Spa, payment a fee.  If you want to stay in the private VIP area like Haven, Retreat and Yacht Club, pay me a fee. In Disney world, if you want the express line with little or no wait, pay me a fee.  Same with Universal.  Delta, if you want to check bags, pay me a fee. My list can go on, and ON.  

 

I don't believe this is the brands creating folks like Chair Hogs.  I do think it is their was of adding more revenue.  Increasing their bottom line. We have not even talked about increasing the fee for gratuities.  

 

This and other reason is why I have started to go Book, Premium-Plus and Luxury brands.  I compared all the stuff I would receive (Perks and Amenities) and still have to pay for area's like Haven, Retreat and Yacht Club.  I then had what call a "Total Price".  I then would convert it to total cost per person, per day.  I then would look at in my case three different cruise lines that were considered Premium-Plus or Luxury.  Crystal Cruises, Oceania Cruises and Explora Cruises.  The results were amazing. 

 

80% of the time, when you compare the total price per person, per day, the Premium-Plus and Luxury brands were actually less then the VIP areas on Mainstream Brands like NCL, Royal, Celebrity, and MSC.  I literally had to check my figures three times because I thought I made a mistake.  Sure there was some things lost like Water Slide, Go Carts Tracks, and Virtual reality.  Give and take is simply the reality of the world we live in.

 

Now, are their still rude guest.  Yes, you hear the all the time at guest services.  They put on quite the show.  Are their still Chair Hogs and folks that save entire rows for their families for the big shows, then their family's don't show up. Answer, ABSOLUTELY.  Just far less, less of an issue and makes ones vacation better.  Hope all that makes sense. 

 

Cruise well and enjoy every moment. 

Hi Gary. What a pleasure to hear from you. Your comments are right on the mark. I wish more people had your insight and common sense. Thank you!

6 minutes ago, EJL2023 said:

Yeap,  a quick search on here and you can find people complaining and knowing that staff is accepting tips to do it on Seaborn and Silversea! And Oceania forum needs to get with the program, they’re called Chogs per the delightful folks on those forums!

Based on my experience, you are correct. However, some cruise lines do more than others to enforce the no saving chair rule, although no one does enough.

6 hours ago, LouChamp said:

Aloha. I have been blessed to cruise since 1971 and between flying, sailing and staying at the best and worst of hotels and dining similarly in restaurants the reality is a handshake gets it done. The best tables, the best seats in Las Vegas, the best rooms, and sorry to say loungers too. Having been born and raised in Manhattan that is the real world.  Back in the day when you embarked you could reserve loungers as you would your table in the restaurant. I guess for whatever reason the lines haven't done this yet.

I recall sailing with Home Lines in the 1980s when all passengers officially had an option to reserve a pool lounger for a fee. The Europeans on board thought it was normal, but most others did not, and it was eventually phased out -- as had the class system before it. Now that chair hogging has become more commonplace, I wonder if cruise lines will look at ways to generate more revenue from our displeasure by charging for chair reservations again. In a way, some cruise lines have begun this process by creating private areas (Haven, Retreat, Sanctuary, etc.) of the ship for guests willing to pay extra for the exclusivity -- private restaurants, private pools, sufficient supply of pool chairs, etc. And if paying to reserve pool chairs becomes official, might it resolve the issue created by chair hogs?  

17 hours ago, Mahogany said:

Does anyone know how the Gratuities Included part of the cruise fare works? Do the behind-the-scenes staff benefit? And I read that the Crew Fund provides parties, not cash.

According to Silversea, the included gratuities are shared with behind-the-scenes staff. I have not yet seen anything from Silversea that officially details what the money is used for, although some members have said it is used to help those in need and to have parties. At the end of the day, tipping is a personal choice -- in deciding to tip or not, in determining how much to give, and deciding how to give (to individuals, to a crew fund, or both). There is no right or wrong way to tip. Do what makes you comfortable. 

9 minutes ago, saminina said:

I have never/would ever extend a gratuity to an individual.   Today, anything goes obviously.

 

In contrast, I would never miss an opportunity to provide an extra reward for exceptional service. And I must say the reaction from those receiving it has always demonstrated that it is much appreciated.

Included gratuities are supposedly shared with all staff, including those behind the scenes. Therefore, if you wish to provide an extra reward to a few specific individuals such as a room steward, waiter or bartender, you can do so directly -- that is what I do on all the luxury lines. However, if you want to reward the overall level of service on a ship, you can give some cash to the crew fund. Or, you can do both. At the end of the day, it's really about what makes you feel most comfortable, 

1 minute ago, admranger said:

Same.

 

I'm easy to spot:  Exceedingly handsome, charming, and modest.  🤣

We must be related!