Concordia News: Please Post Here

[cruiserfanfromct]

According to the Italian press, Schettino asked to speak again to the court today -- request denied by judge. Stay tuned....

[Ken711]

If I remember correctly' date=' Titan from the very begining said that this plan was not a 100% plan. There was a chance it may not work.

 

As you correctly pointed out Ken, she may yet break her back.

 

AKK

 

PS.I thought the bags were going to be filled with sand???[/quote']

 

It's a grout mix that hardens into concrete.

[balf]

 

 

David,

 

Oh really? That's why we wrote it down:

 

 

The Declaration of Independence: A Transcription

IN CONGRESS, July 4, 1776.

 

http://www.archives.gov/exhibits/charters/declaration_transcript.html

 

Writing it down doesn't make it true and both our nations know enough about slavery to tell the difference.

 

David

[balf]

David ... You may not have seen it but in a recent poll the Falkland islanders said they do not consider themselves Brittish but a Falklander ! .. says it all really.

 

If the Argentines were to invade the channel islands who we gonna call Ghostbusters? certainly have no armed forces to send a bit like WW2 when the UK left them to their own devices under the Germans.

 

 

 

MDSue .... :)

 

I don't know how old you are, but I can well remember that when the fleet sailed from Portsmouth many military experts were of the opinion that the operation would fail :and it well could have. So to say Thatcher did it to get re elected is somewhat far from reality. And WW2, I can remember that as well, and you are not seriously suggesting that it was possible at that time to re take the Channel Islands are you.

 

David.

[sidari]

"It's been proved that the Concordia was left without power from 9:48 pm onwards," three minutes after the ship gashed its side on a rock off the Tuscan island of Giglio during a badly-judged nighttime "salute" to the inhabitants"

 

So the ship did not lose power right away as many have claimed which could well be the reason why people ended up in Lifts/Elevators, how far could the ship have travelled in those 3 minutes and how much could have or had been done in order to help get the ship turning around if any ?

[Tonka's Skipper]

 

Writing it down doesn't make it true and both our nations know enough about slavery to tell the difference.

 

David

 

Well maybe Uintal is going a bit over the top. However impressment of American sailors off their vessels at sea, before the war of 1812 and not releasing them until the end of the war, is preetty dam close.

 

Of course they didnt let the British seamen go( they were impressed by press gangs) until the end of the war either, so it could be said your enslaved Americans and Brits!

 

AKK

Edited October 19, 2012 by Tonka's Skipper

[Tonka's Skipper]

It's a grout mix that hardens into concrete.

 

 

AHHHH....ok that makes sense!

 

AKK

[balf]

 

Well maybe Uintal is going a bit over the top. However impressment of American sailors off their vessels at sea, before the war of 1812 and not releasing them until the end of the war, is preetty dam close.

 

 

 

AKK[/quote

 

You are falling into the trap of applying today's culture to events in the past. Both of our nations were well into slavery, even George Washington was, but at the time most people would have seen nothing wrong or immoral it.

 

David.

[Tonka's Skipper]

 

Well maybe Uintal is going a bit over the top. However impressment of American sailors off their vessels at sea' date=' before the war of 1812 and not releasing them until the end of the war, is preetty dam close.

 

 

 

AKK[/quote

 

You are falling into the trap of applying today's culture to events in the past. Both of our nations were well into slavery, even George Washington was, but at the time most people would have seen nothing wrong or immoral it.

 

David.[/quote']

 

You are correct..........we often do judge historical events by todays standards, it can be a problemm......but impressment of seamen was wrong then as it would be today...........and just because slavery is the norm then, still doesn't make it right by any standards.

 

AKK

[BlackHawk1]

Is it really necessary to hijack this thread. What has the above discussion to with the Concordia......................all that has be accomplished it make this a useless thread.

[Max49]

"It's been proved that the Concordia was left without power from 9:48 pm onwards," three minutes after the ship gashed its side on a rock off the Tuscan island of Giglio during a badly-judged nighttime "salute" to the inhabitants"

 

So the ship did not lose power right away as many have claimed which could well be the reason why people ended up in Lifts/Elevators, how far could the ship have travelled in those 3 minutes and how much could have or had been done in order to help get the ship turning around if any ?

 

We know the speed of the ship was reduced by about half immediately. I believe the crew or at least Schettino was in denial or at least hopeful that there was not catastrophic damage. Remember him telling the CG, it was merely an electrical issue and worst case scenario they may need a tug boat? I also believe he wanted to get outa there as in hit and run, so I'd say he just headed out to see until it stopped and luckily the current helped blow it back to shore.

 

What could have been done? Well, I guess he could have immediately taken it into shore and not wasted that 3 minutes.

We all know how I feel about Schettinos actions that night but I can easily understand why a good decision could'nt be reached in 3 minutes but then he had his crew lie to the CG after the passengers used their cell phones to report trouble.

I feel bad for Schettino defenders, we can't find one thing that the guy did right that night.

[Max49]

"So the ship did not lose power right away as many have claimed which could well be the reason why people ended up in Lifts/Elevators"

 

I believe Schettino stalled on admitting a serious problem or ordering 'abandon ship' for about an hour. Have we heard any thing about Schettino or any of the crew scampering to get the people trapped in the elevator out? If not, this was not a trained crew and they're captain was incompetent.

If a power outage renders the elevators useless, I'd think that checking the elevators would be #1 on the things the crew should do and surely they'd have an emergency elevator evacuation procedure, would'nt they?

[sidari]

Ken ... Thanks for the info, seems a long way to June next year.

[sidari]

Max ... 3 minutes would have easily have been taken up waiting for a response from those below to get back on to the bridge to inform them of the level of damamge even by telephone, they may well have not been able to get near to the damage site inside the ship due to the amount of water rushing in.

 

I have not seen or heard anyone say that they heard the collision but felt a sever shuddering before the lights went out, as for people in the Lifts/Elevators i would think that they would have been forgotten about by staff who were busy trying to move passengers about the ship. The staff would have had no way of knowing if people were in the Lift/Elevator cars.

 

As i have posted previously not everyone knows how to move a Lift/Elevator car and i would guess that those that do would be either members of the Engineering staff or the Electrical department, even so it can take in some cases an hour to wind up or down the car to a floor because you have to first locate its position, then send at least 3 people to the head of the Lift/Elevator shaft with radios which may or may not have worked that night and then release the brake while the car is wound up or down once you know where the counterweight is.

 

Knowing where the counterweight is in that situation would likely be impossible without the use of flashlights.

[Max49]

I understand 3 minutes would not have been enough time to even assess the situation.

I don't understand that they can build these cruising cities but they don't have any back up power or even a plan just to get the elevator car to the nearest floor.

With all the warnings on everything these days it's wonder they don't have a sign in the lift that says "If electricity goes out while you're in here, you may never get out".

[sidari]

Max ... as far as i know the Lifts/Elevators on land work in the same way as they do on a ship, as soon as there is a power loss or other fault the brake system is applied in order to stop the car crashing to the ground floor or below.

 

The brake system can be overidden manually usually by using a lever supplied inside the motor house at the head of the shaft and then re applied manually once the car is at the desired position.

 

With a ship listing to one side i would guess that it would be almost impossible to get the car to move in either direction with or without power.

 

The back up power is usually enough for emergency lighting and to power systems on the bridge.

Edited October 20, 2012 by sidari

[balf]

, even so it can take in some cases an hour to wind up or down the car to a floor because you have to first locate its position, then send at least 3 people to the head of the Lift/Elevator shaft with radios which may or may not have worked that night and then release the brake while the car is wound up or down once you know where the counterweight is.

 

Knowing where the counterweight is in that situation would likely be impossible without the use of flashlights.

 

So you are saying that if people are in the lift when there is a sudden power outage it can take an hour for them to be released if the correct staff are available. How scary is that?

 

David

[balf]

Is it really necessary to hijack this thread. What has the above discussion to with the Concordia......................all that has be accomplished it make this a useless thread.

 

You are of course correct and if we stick to the subject the tread will be a much more pleasant place to be. Posting "red rag" comments certainly do not help.

 

David.

[sidari]

David ... On land it can sometimes take even longer if you have to wait for a Lift Engineer to attend because in some areas of the UK the Fire service no longer attend these kind of incidents! thanks to Cuts in Funding by the wonderful government.

[balf]

18,000 tons of cement to be exact. Below another fine interview article with Nick Sloane the head salvage master.

 

Will this have to be removed at the end of the operation?

 

David.

[Ken711]

Will this have to be removed at the end of the operation?

 

David.

 

Yes, it's planned to be removed.

[Max49]

I think 'pathetic' is an understatement if passengers were trapped in the elevator for hours while all the crew was doing was telling the passengers it was merely an electrical problem and the captain is requesting that you all go back to your cabins.

[sidari]

Max ... who would know they were there ? apart from the Glass Lifts if they could be seen with a flashlight in the atrium part of a ship. There would be no way of knowing people were in there if they were stuck higher up, or in the Lifts that are fully enclosed.

[Tonka's Skipper]

Will this have to be removed at the end of the operation?

 

David.

 

 

I beleive that is one reason they are doing in in bags and not a big lump!

 

AKK

[Max49]

Well, it's not a very pleasant thought, but with 4000 passengers on board it should have been someones job to think about.