TIpping

[Dave994]

so why the change of heart?

being on two cruises you should know service is almost always awesome

 

your DW wouldnt let you remove your second...Was service bad? or good :)

 

 

the staff works hard for seven days without a day off ,theres no overtime pay.They work like I work for my/our families

 

Just think about it from my perspective.I have thought about your perspective

 

No change of heart. I would rather tip people in person. I didn't know I had that option until I found cc.

 

You really do have reading issues. I will

Repeat this one more time. I have a degree in hospitality Management and I worked in hotels and restaurants for 16 years as everything from a dishwasher to manager. I have seen your perspective many a time.

 

Service was better on the first than the second one but it was not carnival. Had an amazing bartender on the first named Milos who made some amazing drinks. Tipped him $50 at the end of the cruise.

 

I don't have a problem tipping. I just don't like to be told how much to tip and when to tip.

[mikel24m]

No change of heart. I would rather tip people in person. I didn't know I had that option until I found cc.

 

You really do have reading issues. I will

Repeat this one more time. I have a degree in hospitality Management and I worked in hotels and restaurants for 16 years as everything from a dishwasher to manager. I have seen your perspective many a time.

 

Service was better on the first than the second one but it was not carnival. Had an amazing bartender on the first named Milos who made some amazing drinks. Tipped him $50 at the end of the cruise.

 

I don't have a problem tipping. I just don't like to be told how much to tip and when to tip.

 

Have no reading issues :)

 

A degree in hospitality management is awesome for a bachelor degree ..two years really

 

20 years at one employer is my degree .work ethic 101

[Tutankhamen]

Have no reading issues :)

 

A degree in hospitality management is awesome for a bachelor degree ..two years really

 

20 years at one employer is my degree .work ethic 101

Not that it matters, but what do you do Mike? You are in a union, correct?

[mikel24m]

Not that it matters, but what do you do Mike? You are in a union, correct?

 

I am a union Bartender

[Tutankhamen]

lol h82, did you seriously just yell at me??:eek: I am cracking up!:p

 

I think so!!

[Dave994]

Have no reading issues :)

 

A degree in hospitality management is awesome for a bachelor degree ..two years really

 

20 years at one employer is my degree .work ethic 101

 

So 4 more years than me? I guess you win.

[Tutankhamen]

I am a union Bartender

 

Nice! Sorry if I missed that post.

 

Just fell in love with a new cocktail. Del Frisco's Double Eagle Steak House V.I.P Signature drink. Vodka-infused Pineapple Martini. :)

 

Now back to the regular programing.....

[mikel24m]

So 4 more years than me? I guess you win.

 

never try to win ,just a different view

[Dave994]

never try to win ,just a different view

 

Gotcha. And thanks for downplaying my degree. Guess I shouldn't have studied so hard if I knew it was useless in your eyes.

[mikel24m]

Gotcha. And thanks for downplaying my degree. Guess I shouldn't have studied so hard if I knew it was useless in your eyes.

 

never said useless ,Your an educated man and I am not

 

 

Im sorry

[halos]

Clearly you didn't see enough from my posts Halo. I have a degree in hospitality Management. I worked service industry jobs for 15 plus years.

 

When the new tipping rate was released, JH came out and said the reason why was because the staff deserve a raise. I agree they do, I just happen to think Carnival should pay for it out of my cruise fare.

 

Did you ever work for tips??:confused:

My daughter has a bachelors degree in hospitality and is a hotel revenue manager...has worked in the service industry since she was 14 but never in a 'tipped 'position.

 

The gratuities on CCL hadn't been raised in YEARS.....anyone who complains about the fact that they went up (such a miniscule amount) in order to (in John's words) give the staff a raise, should sit back and consider if they'd like to go for years with no raise.

 

If you don't like the tipping thing, don't cruise or have the tips removed when you do. Personally, I think that would be awful, but that's just me.

 

Carnival COULD pay crew out of your cruise fare, but then they'd have to charge more for your fare. Either way you are going to pay it just like we are all paying for expensive fuel. I think because it isn't listed as a seperate charge people are OK with it...ostrich mentality. :rolleyes:

 

The fact is all the little cuts that people (including myself) complain about are a direct consequence of increased costs and CCL passengers being 'frugal' (to be nice) and consequently CCL responding to the demographic. CCL passengers are going to drop off if fares are increased because if Cruise Critic posters are any indication of the majority of CCL passengers, the VAST majority of them cruise this line because they feel it's cheap.

 

You don't want a 'gratuity' charge added to your S&S at the end of the cruise?? Then be prepared to be a larger fare or have something else cut.

 

The Beards know that CCL passengers will look at a higher fare and decide immediately to NOT book. That is why the gratuity is outside the fare

 

As far as you feeling you are paying the crew's salary, the reality is you pay it no matter what. Just like you are basically paying the salary of the employees of any and every business you spend money with.

That's how it all works.

[Tutankhamen]

Dave, your turn.

[Dave994]

Dave, your turn.

 

I am done. And for the record Halos, 9 of the 16 years were in tipped positions. Mostly server and bartender.

[cruisenanny]

Did you ever work for tips??:confused:

My daughter has a bachelors degree in hospitality and is a hotel revenue manager...has worked in the service industry since she was 14 but never in a 'tipped 'position.

 

The gratuities on CCL hadn't been raised in YEARS.....anyone who complains about the fact that they went up (such a miniscule amount) in order to (in John's words) give the staff a raise, should sit back and consider if they'd like to go for years with no raise.

 

If you don't like the tipping thing, don't cruise or have the tips removed when you do. Personally, I think that would be awful, but that's just me.

 

Carnival COULD pay crew out of your cruise fare, but then they'd have to charge more for your fare. Either way you are going to pay it just like we are all paying for expensive fuel. I think because it isn't listed as a seperate charge people are OK with it...ostrich mentality. :rolleyes:

 

The fact is all the little cuts that people (including myself) complain about are a direct consequence of increased costs and CCL passengers being 'frugal' (to be nice) and consequently CCL responding to the demographic. CCL passengers are going to drop off if fares are increased because if Cruise Critic posters are any indication of the majority of CCL passengers, the VAST majority of them cruise this line because they feel it's cheap.

 

You don't want a 'gratuity' charge added to your S&S at the end of the cruise?? Then be prepared to be a larger fare or have something else cut.

The Beards know that CCL passengers will look at a higher fare and decide immediately to NOT book. That is why the gratuity is outside the fare

 

As far as you feeling you are paying the crew's salary, the reality is you pay it no matter what. Just like you are basically paying the salary of the employees of any and every business you spend money with.

That's how it all works.

Ding Ding DING. Exactly. Perfectly said Halos, every word of it.

[Dave994]

 

The gratuities on CCL hadn't been raised in YEARS.....anyone who complains about the fact that they went up (such a miniscule amount) in order to (in John's words) give the staff a raise, should sit back and consider if they'd like to go for years with no raise.

 

If you don't like the tipping thing, don't cruise or have the tips removed when you do. Personally, I think that would be awful, but that's just me.

 

Carnival COULD pay crew out of your cruise fare, but then they'd have to charge more for your fare. Either way you are going to pay it just like we are all paying for expensive fuel. I think because it isn't listed as a seperate charge people are OK with it...ostrich mentality. :rolleyes:

 

The fact is all the little cuts that people (including myself) complain about are a direct consequence of increased costs and CCL passengers being 'frugal' (to be nice) and consequently CCL responding to the demographic. CCL passengers are going to drop off if fares are increased because if Cruise Critic posters are any indication of the majority of CCL passengers, the VAST majority of them cruise this line because they feel it's cheap.

 

You don't want a 'gratuity' charge added to your S&S at the end of the cruise?? Then be prepared to be a larger fare or have something else cut.

 

The Beards know that CCL passengers will look at a higher fare and decide immediately to NOT book. That is why the gratuity is outside the fare

 

As far as you feeling you are paying the crew's salary, the reality is you pay it no matter what. Just like you are basically paying the salary of the employees of any and every business you spend money with.

That's how it all works.

 

I was almost done...

 

I don't have an issue with them raising the Gratuity amount. I am sure the staff earn it. I do have an issue how they distribute it however and I will be sure to make sure the right people get the money they deserve.

 

I do have an issue also with calling it a "raise" as a raise comes from an employer.

 

I understand why they do it this way, but I also realize that the real issue is that Carnival made 2.2 BILLION in profits last year all the while expecting us to pay their staff their well deserved wage. This bothers me and I would think it should bother you and Mike as well, but it seems like your more concerned with how I tip.

 

And yes, I am paying the salary of the staff of the cruise. I get that...but that comes out of my fare. Thus ending my commitment to the staff correct? Beyond that it's up to Gerry to pay them the wages out of that.

 

If I choose to tip based on service that is an entirely different thing btn me and the worker and has no relation to the crap wages they get paid as again, I fulfilled my portion of it by paying for the cruise.

 

For example...my last cabin steward was really nice and helpful and so I tipped him $20 at the end of the cruise. If I had not seen him during my trip I would not have provided that tip. That makes sense right?

 

Carry on....

[mamaskittles]

Did you ever work for tips??:confused:

My daughter has a bachelors degree in hospitality and is a hotel revenue manager...has worked in the service industry since she was 14 but never in a 'tipped 'position.

 

The gratuities on CCL hadn't been raised in YEARS.....anyone who complains about the fact that they went up (such a miniscule amount) in order to (in John's words) give the staff a raise, should sit back and consider if they'd like to go for years with no raise.

 

If you don't like the tipping thing, don't cruise or have the tips removed when you do. Personally, I think that would be awful, but that's just me.

 

Carnival COULD pay crew out of your cruise fare, but then they'd have to charge more for your fare. Either way you are going to pay it just like we are all paying for expensive fuel. I think because it isn't listed as a seperate charge people are OK with it...ostrich mentality. :rolleyes:

 

The fact is all the little cuts that people (including myself) complain about are a direct consequence of increased costs and CCL passengers being 'frugal' (to be nice) and consequently CCL responding to the demographic. CCL passengers are going to drop off if fares are increased because if Cruise Critic posters are any indication of the majority of CCL passengers, the VAST majority of them cruise this line because they feel it's cheap.

 

You don't want a 'gratuity' charge added to your S&S at the end of the cruise?? Then be prepared to be a larger fare or have something else cut.

 

The Beards know that CCL passengers will look at a higher fare and decide immediately to NOT book. That is why the gratuity is outside the fare

 

As far as you feeling you are paying the crew's salary, the reality is you pay it no matter what. Just like you are basically paying the salary of the employees of any and every business you spend money with.

That's how it all works.

Beautifully thought out and well written post.:)

However, of course, I do disagree :o.

I do not think Carnival cruisers would look at a cruise fare $ appx 120 more with the words GRATUITIES INCLUDED and race to find another line.

This would ensure the workers get paid, and leave plenty of opportunities for the cruiser to reward great service.

Of course human nature, being the beast she is, would rear her ugly head and many ( not all and certainly not few) workers would give less than their all if the gratuities were included.

This is another deterrant to the cruiseline adding the non-refundable service charge.

I do not like the the policy as it stands because it is no longer a contract, if you will, between Carnival cruise staff and the passangers. It is now a corporate machination that increases profits at the expense of both pax and staff.

I could go into another whole argument re: real money versus paper money and while Carnival has your tips in their account ( till the end of the pay cycle for staff ) it is their money and can be traded as such and counted in their bottom line. There is more to it, but suffice to say Carnival isn't a bit concerned that their staff needed a raise. Had they been they would have increased the miniscule base pay.

 

Again I do tip and very well. I just choose the time and place and amount.

[AZbeachboy]

Did you ever work for tips??:confused:

My daughter has a bachelors degree in hospitality and is a hotel revenue manager...has worked in the service industry since she was 14 but never in a 'tipped 'position.

 

The gratuities on CCL hadn't been raised in YEARS.....anyone who complains about the fact that they went up (such a miniscule amount) in order to (in John's words) give the staff a raise, should sit back and consider if they'd like to go for years with no raise.

 

If you don't like the tipping thing, don't cruise or have the tips removed when you do. Personally, I think that would be awful, but that's just me.

 

Carnival COULD pay crew out of your cruise fare, but then they'd have to charge more for your fare. Either way you are going to pay it just like we are all paying for expensive fuel. I think because it isn't listed as a seperate charge people are OK with it...ostrich mentality. :rolleyes:

 

The fact is all the little cuts that people (including myself) complain about are a direct consequence of increased costs and CCL passengers being 'frugal' (to be nice) and consequently CCL responding to the demographic. CCL passengers are going to drop off if fares are increased because if Cruise Critic posters are any indication of the majority of CCL passengers, the VAST majority of them cruise this line because they feel it's cheap.

 

You don't want a 'gratuity' charge added to your S&S at the end of the cruise?? Then be prepared to be a larger fare or have something else cut.

 

The Beards know that CCL passengers will look at a higher fare and decide immediately to NOT book. That is why the gratuity is outside the fare

 

As far as you feeling you are paying the crew's salary, the reality is you pay it no matter what. Just like you are basically paying the salary of the employees of any and every business you spend money with.

That's how it all works.

 

This is eactly what I have been saying. The lines use this as a hedge to advertise lower rates. I say pay staff a decent wage and no tips. Let me decide if I want to pay the higher rate or not. I dont want the cruise lines trying to trick me. And again, if you follow the contract for the maritime agreement, cruise lines do have to pay a minimum if the workers do not get enough tips. They need to face up to their responsabilities. Let them do that and I will (tip extra for good service.) I just dont like the hedging scheem they have come up with.

[boo214]

This is eactly what I have been saying. The lines use this as a hedge to advertise lower rates. I say pay staff a decent wage and no tips. Let me decide if I want to pay the higher rate or not. I dont want the cruise lines trying to trick me. And again' date=' if you follow the contract for the maritime agreement, cruise lines do have to pay a minimum if the workers do not get enough tips. They need to face up to their responsabilities. Let them do that and I will (tip extra for good service.) I just dont like the hedging scheem they have come up with.[/quote']

try seabourne. no tricks, tips included, everything included. much more expensive.

[AZbeachboy]

try seabourne. no tricks, tips included, everything included. much more expensive.

 

I have thought about that. But I have traveled Paul Gaugin and Holland America when they had no tipping. They were a bit more expensive, no much but there. The Gaugin is a smaller ship and a different type of cruising.

 

My issue here is not with tipping but with the marketing of the cruise and how Carnival and other lines tries to get over what they sale. This was especially true when they marketed as all inclusive. It really was not, you still had to tip.

 

HA use to fit in that catagory until they merged with Carnaval Corp. Even then I would gave a little something extra for great service.

[boo214]

Beautifully thought out and well written post.:)

However, of course, I do disagree :o.

I do not think Carnival cruisers would look at a cruise fare $ appx 120 more with the words GRATUITIES INCLUDED and race to find another line.

This would ensure the workers get paid, and leave plenty of opportunities for the cruiser to reward great service.

Of course human nature, being the beast she is, would rear her ugly head and many ( not all and certainly not few) workers would give less than their all if the gratuities were included.

This is another deterrant to the cruiseline adding the non-refundable service charge.

I do not like the the policy as it stands because it is no longer a contract, if you will, between Carnival cruise staff and the passangers. It is now a corporate machination that increases profits at the expense of both pax and staff.

I could go into another whole argument re: real money versus paper money and while Carnival has your tips in their account ( till the end of the pay cycle for staff ) it is their money and can be traded as such and counted in their bottom line. There is more to it, but suffice to say Carnival isn't a bit concerned that their staff needed a raise. Had they been they would have increased the miniscule base pay.

 

Again I do tip and very well. I just choose the time and place and amount.

I guess that means stay away from seabourne or other lines where tipping is included cause the service is not good.

[AZbeachboy]

Beautifully thought out and well written post.:)

However, of course, I do disagree :o.

I do not think Carnival cruisers would look at a cruise fare $ appx 120 more with the words GRATUITIES INCLUDED and race to find another line.

This would ensure the workers get paid, and leave plenty of opportunities for the cruiser to reward great service.

Of course human nature, being the beast she is, would rear her ugly head and many ( not all and certainly not few) workers would give less than their all if the gratuities were included.

This is another deterrant to the cruiseline adding the non-refundable service charge.

I do not like the the policy as it stands because it is no longer a contract, if you will, between Carnival cruise staff and the passangers. It is now a corporate machination that increases profits at the expense of both pax and staff.

I could go into another whole argument re: real money versus paper money and while Carnival has your tips in their account ( till the end of the pay cycle for staff ) it is their money and can be traded as such and counted in their bottom line. There is more to it, but suffice to say Carnival isn't a bit concerned that their staff needed a raise. Had they been they would have increased the miniscule base pay.

 

Again I do tip and very well. I just choose the time and place and amount.

 

Are you implying that some workers do not have enough pride in their work to do it right regardless of lack of incentive? My Goodness! Although I do agree in principle with you, I dont think a slacker would be with the cruise line long.

[mamaskittles]

Are you implying that some workers do not have enough pride in their work to do it right regardless of lack of incentive? My Goodness! Although I do agree in principle with you, I dont think a slacker would be with the cruise line long.

I agree a slacker would not be with the line long.

I also know that given the current demographic Carnival is focusing on, the notion of going above and beyond will not have the same impact.

I mean if gratuities are added into a budget priced cruise, many ( not all, not few ) will just let the cruiseline pay the staff. The staff will have no monetary incentive to exceed expectations.

They will do their jobs and meet the expectations of the current corporate mindset and customer base. Of course since expectations have become much less in recent years, that is not hard to do.

This not an insult. I do not expect the cruiseline to pay these people wads of cash. I believe if they do their job without complaints from customers they will do fine.

Keep in mind we are not talking about surgeons, engineers and rocket scientists, we are talking about cabin stewards and wait staff. Lovely people, some extremely well educated, all hard working, but with NOT technically difficult positions.

Luckily for Carnival, Some cruisers will always tip extra and some workers will always be extraordinary.

BTW this is moot because Carnival will never go to all inclusive they are headed to a la carte all the way.

 

To BOO : There is a great difference between SeaBourne and Carnival. The customer demographics are on different spectrums and the salary I am sure reflects that. Additionally the SeaBourne customer demands excellent/exceeds expectations service at all times and tips accordingly.

[AZbeachboy]

I agree a slacker would not be with the line long.

I also know that given the current demographic Carnival is focusing on, the notion of going above and beyond will not have the same impact.

I mean if gratuities are added into a budget priced cruise, many ( not all, not few ) will just let the cruiseline pay the staff. The staff will have no monetary incentive to exceed expectations.

They will do their jobs and meet the expectations of the current corporate mindset and customer base. Of course since expectations have become much less in recent years, that is not hard to do.

This not an insult. I do not expect the cruiseline to pay these people wads of cash. I believe if they do their job without complaints from customers they will do fine.

Keep in mind we are not talking about surgeons, engineers and rocket scientists, we are talking about cabin stewards and wait staff. Lovely people, some extremely well educated, all hard working, but with NOT technically difficult positions.

Luckily for Carnival, Some cruisers will always tip extra and some workers will always be extraordinary.

BTW this is moot because Carnival will never go to all inclusive they are headed to a la carte all the way.

 

To BOO : There is a great difference between SeaBourne and Carnival. The customer demographics are on different spectrums and the salary I am sure reflects that. Additionally the SeaBourne customer demands excellent/exceeds expectations service at all times and tips accordingly.

 

 

Nice reply.

[petro772]

If I choose to tip based on service that is an entirely different thing btn me and the worker and has no relation to the crap wages they get paid as again, I fulfilled my portion of it by paying for the cruise.

 

For example...my last cabin steward was really nice and helpful and so I tipped him $20 at the end of the cruise. If I had not seen him during my trip I would not have provided that tip. That makes sense right?

 

Carry on....

If I'm not mistaken, you are missing one small detail. If auto tips are removed, and you give cash to individuals, that money is not kept by the person but added to a pool of all the money received by those who have had auto tips removed. In this case, the room steward didn't get to keep the $20. ;)

[mamaskittles]

If I choose to tip based on service that is an entirely different thing btn me and the worker and has no relation to the crap wages they get paid as again, I fulfilled my portion of it by paying for the cruise.

 

For example...my last cabin steward was really nice and helpful and so I tipped him $20 at the end of the cruise. If I had not seen him during my trip I would not have provided that tip. That makes sense right?

 

Carry on....

If I'm not mistaken, you are missing one small detail. If auto tips are removed, and you give cash to individuals, that money is not kept by the person but added to a pool of all the money received by those who have had auto tips removed. In this case, the room steward didn't get to keep the $20. ;)

 

I am sorry but this is not true. It has been posted here over and over and John Heald the brand ambassador to Carnival has stated that the staff keeps the tips handed to them. I know if I hand my cabin steward $50 in the privacy of my cabin he/she is not running to the head of housekeeping to turn it in. There is no common sense in that.

If at the end of dinner day 3, I hand my waiter a $20 and then choose to remove auto-tips day 6, and then hand him a $20 on day seven, is he going to go to his room and dig out the first $20 to turn it in ?

When you think about it there is no way that anyone in management could keep track of who tips who in cash. I agree in advance there may be some sort of honor system in place but I doubt it.

That would only make sense if all tips were pooled. I mean if all tips, pre-pay, auto-tip, and cash are pooled together and then divided up amoungst all of the staff using whatever formula Carnival decides is appropriate then perhaps the "they have to turn over every penny " argument holds water.We know this is not the case because if you remove auto-tips and do not give cash your particular cabin steward/wait staff get nothing.

And BTW who do they turn this money over to. The purser, the maitre'd the head of housekeeping, funship freddie. :eek:

Too many questions too little real information.