QE2 rebuild!

[KenC]

No, we just want all Cunard's ships to be successful.....I'm sure you agree....:rolleyes:

 

Peter

 

You could have fooled me ;)

 

Ken

[guernseyguy]

You could have fooled me ;)

 

I'm sure we all look forward to hearing how the QV - with 13% more space per pax - compares with the crowded QE2.......;)

 

Peter

[KenC]

I'm sure we all look forward to hearing how the QV - with 13% more space per pax - compares with the crowded QE2.......;)

 

Peter

 

Peter

 

you know very well that it's not just a matter of figures but how usable the space is, how much it is used and where it is located - for instance, how many people use the Theatre during the evening on QE2 compared to how many will be in the Royal Court Theatre on QV?? I've been on QE2 twice and have found her crowded - been on 2 versions of a Vista and found them not so.

 

Ken

[bobby1119]

QE2 Rebuild!!

 

steve

 

Very clever and downright frightening:eek::eek::eek::eek:

[dougnewmanatsea]

Unfortunately SAGA Ruby hasn't got that long left either:(

She should be around for quite a while yet. Perhaps you are confusing her with SAGA ROSE which will be retired in 2010.

 

RUBY should have another 10-15 years in her.

[pnhmrk]

Perhaps you are confusing her with SAGA ROSE which will be retired in 2010.

 

I am sure that I am. Which one was the Caronia? That's the one I meant.:o

[guernseyguy]

I am sure that I am. Which one was the Caronia? That's the one I meant.:o

 

The Saga Ruby was Caronia - and has many years left in her.

[cunardqueen]

Originally Posted by dak

Very clever, but there's still no forward observation lounge

 

David

This is now what is in place of the Observation lounge.. see attachment...

And the box on the front is the bottom attachment.... and no portholes either!!

Cheers

Myles

[Kindlychap]

This is now what is in place of the Observation lounge.. see attachment...

And the box on the front is the bottom attachment.... and no portholes either!!

Cheers

Myles

 

 

Are those your enormous plans? Do they cover the whole ship?

 

Matthew

[Wadadli1]

Are those your enormous plans? Do they cover the whole ship?

 

Matthew

 

Didn't you see there is an entire room for Vegetable Prep! Obviously, they are looking out for your good health and proper diet. Though that may lead to needing a Bilge Prep room later on....

[kryos]

Why would that be?

 

Surely one doesn't use lifts in an emergency?

 

Matthew

Some of the elderly or infirm passengers may have no choice. On a longer voyage, such as a World Cruise, you would have a substantial number of them.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[Kindlychap]

Some of the elderly or infirm passengers may have no choice. On a longer voyage, such as a World Cruise, you would have a substantial number of them.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

 

Okay. Point taken. But the only lifts that should be used in an emergency on QE2 are the E stairway lifts - as they are the only ones with back up power supplies.

 

Matthew

[SeaFlint]

This might SOUND drastic, but I know it has been done. In fact, it was done back in the early 80s on a cruise ship a cousin of mine was on.

 

One way to increase the size of the QE2 (which sounds like one of the "problems" to solve) without having to completely re-arrange her, would be to cut her in half (or thirds or quarters) and insert sections.

 

In these sections you could add the elements necessary for compliance as well as a few more cabins. This would minimize the changes required to the rest of the ship, leaving most of her as close to she is now as possible.

 

Of course, it would add to her l.o.a. and it would change her look a bit. But, not too dramatically, I think. At the end of the day, I think it would change her the least. AND if it would buy her another 40 years while not changing most of her, wouldn't most people back such a refit?

 

Probably no more expensive than any other refit, either.

[travel-to-go]

Twice the posts doesn't equal twice the opinions!

[travel-to-go]

This might SOUND drastic, but I know it has been done. In fact, it was done back in the early 80s on a cruise ship a cousin of mine was on.

 

One way to increase the size of the QE2 (which sounds like one of the "problems" to solve) without having to completely re-arrange her, would be to cut her in half (or thirds or quarters) and insert sections.

This is exactly what was done to one of the RCCL ships. ( For some reason my mind is stuck on Rhapsody of the Seas, but I'm not sure without looking it up)

 

Of course, these are cookie cutter ships where you can just slide in a pre-fab section, I am not sure the QE2 would lend herself to this solution so easily. She is also a bit older than other ships, and you might not want to take such a drastic step, though I really don't know if hat compromises anything or not. I also do not know if that is impractical due to however the engine room is constructed, (or other critical parts) so I have no idea there whether this would be viable.

 

Any of our complete plans types on here know the answer to that?

 

 

Karie,

who isn't sure if it would be financially viable either.

[Kindlychap]

This might SOUND drastic, but I know it has been done. In fact, it was done back in the early 80s on a cruise ship a cousin of mine was on.

 

One way to increase the size of the QE2 (which sounds like one of the "problems" to solve) without having to completely re-arrange her, would be to cut her in half (or thirds or quarters) and insert sections.

 

In these sections you could add the elements necessary for compliance as well as a few more cabins. This would minimize the changes required to the rest of the ship, leaving most of her as close to she is now as possible.

 

Of course, it would add to her l.o.a. and it would change her look a bit. But, not too dramatically, I think. At the end of the day, I think it would change her the least. AND if it would buy her another 40 years while not changing most of her, wouldn't most people back such a refit?

 

Probably no more expensive than any other refit, either.

 

You'd then lose the ability to traverse the Panama Canal. Pretty crucial in a ship designed to do world cruises.

 

Matthew

[cunardqueen]

Are those your enormous plans? Do they cover the whole ship?

 

Matthew

 

Yes those are the plans we speak of in hushed tones;) As we are on the same cruise later in October l could always ask you to my cabin to see my plans, but some people might get the wrong idea, and l wont mention names here Malcolm:)

Im very proud of my plans! There are actually 5 sheets with 3 decks to a sheet and each sheet measures 3ft x 5 ft.

Nick was v e r y surprised when l told him l had a set, Dont know if people are aware just how detailed they are....

[cunardqueen]

I also do not know if that is impractical due to however the engine room is constructed, (or other critical parts) so I have no idea there whether this would be viable.

 

Any of our complete plans types on here know the answer to that?

 

Well lm no expert but they would suggest that if you were to cut and shut her into thirds it would be fore and aft of the engine room,probably aft is better. Its one thing to cut a side out of her to put new kitchens in, Its another matter entirely to slice her, remember her hull is thicker than most other ships and it was Clyde built,Wouldnt doing that weaken the hull, and when it was stuck back together again, would it be as strong as it was before? But of course if it extends her life lm sure most people are up for it so to speak.

[calikak]

One thing that might complicate matters is the ruling a year or two ago from the US Supreme Court on cruise ship compliance with the Americans with Disabilities Act. It sounds like the US government is going to require compliance from any ship (foreign-flagged or not) embarking passengers in the US, which means QE2 would be subject to the law.

 

Now, "existing construction" (things built before the law went into effect) won't have to comply with all the new standards. But the normal rule under the ADA is that if you do substantial renovations, then you do have to ensure that renovations address accessibility (although not necessarily to the same extent as on a brand new ship). So if QE2 does go through a major refit, one thing they may have to take into consideration is the ADA rules. This could mean creating better accessible routes; upgrading public WC's to have accessible stalls; adding accessible cabins; etc.

 

On the other hand, the rules for cruise ships haven't been finalized yet, and may not be before a QE2 refit, in which case they might not come into play. There's a lot of complicated legal questions when you're dealing with the ADA that I'm sure Cunard's lawyers are thinking about as they decide whether to do a major refit on QE2.

 

For those who are curious, the draft rules are here:

 

http://www.access-board.gov/pvaac/revised-draft.htm

 

And for the very curious, the notice of proposed rule making from the Department of Transportation, which describes why they're making the rule and what ships it would apply to, is here:

 

http://a257.g.akamaitech.net/7/257/2422/01jan20071800/edocket.access.gpo.gov/2007/E7-362.htm

 

Yes, I am a nerd...but I have a good excuse, I practice law in an area related to all this accessibility stuff. :D

[travel-to-go]

 

For those who are curious, the draft rules are here:

 

http://www.access-board.gov/pvaac/revised-draft.htm

 

And for the very curious, the notice of proposed rule making from the Department of Transportation, which describes why they're making the rule and what ships it would apply to, is here:

 

http://a257.g.akamaitech.net/7/257/2422/01jan20071800/edocket.access.gpo.gov/2007/E7-362.htm

 

Yes, I am a nerd...but I have a good excuse, I practice law in an area related to all this accessibility stuff. :D

 

Thanks,Beth

No need to make apologies or excuses for being interested. As a person with handicaps and a former (official) advocate for persons with handicaps, I have become acutely aware of just how may barriers of various kinds we throw in the way of people. In most cases, it isn't deliberate or mean-spirited, but just that people do not think about it. They don't understand, for instance, that not clearing curb cuts of snow and ice is a barrier to many in wheelchairs that is as effective as a brick wall in keeping them from proceeding.

If you have ever tried to drag your luggage through slush, or indeed, tried to drag it through a heavy fast-closing door behind you, you know how difficult it can get. Imagine never being able to "lose that suitcase"

 

I had already printed out the article right here in Cruise Critic a while back.

 

Karie,

who tries to be acutely aware of both the difficulties and the dignity of those who are differently able.

[guernseyguy]

.....I entirely agree that (much) more needs to be done for people who find it challenging to get about.....though the QE2 does seem to attract her fair share of mobility scooters. On a humorous note, a columnist on the Sunday Mail had a go at the 'Health & Safety' perspective:

 

So that's why Nelson said: 'Kiss me, Hardy'

 

(The scene is the deck of the recently renamed British flagship, HMS Appeasement.) "Order the signal, Hardy."

"Aye aye, sir."

 

"Hold on, that's not what I dictated to the signal officer. What's the meaning of this?"

 

"Sorry, sir?"

"England expects every person to do his duty, regardless of race, gender, sexual orientation, religious persuasion or disability. What gobbledegook is this?"

"Admiralty policy, I'm afraid, sir. We're an equal opportunities employer now. We had the devil's own job getting "England" past the censors, lest it be considered racist."

 

 

Read on:

 

 

http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/live/articles/columnists/columnists.html?in_article_id=451590&in_page_id=1772&in_author_id=&in_check=N

[calikak]

If you have ever tried to drag your luggage through slush, or indeed, tried to drag it through a heavy fast-closing door behind you, you know how difficult it can get. Imagine never being able to "lose that suitcase"

Karie,

who tries to be acutely aware of both the difficulties and the dignity of those who are differently able.

 

I totally agree--the ADA doesn't just help people with disabilities, it's also a luggage-dragging traveller's best friend! :D I always notice the lack of the ADA when I travel out of the US, because we all get used to those handy wheelchair ramps and doors being light enough to be easily opened.

 

And since I got into my line of work, I now notice accessibility issues even more (it's hard to turn my brain off), so I tend to notice if a ship meets the current land-based accessibility guidelines. Princess's ships are almost universally accessible in the public areas (haven't seen any designated accessible cabins, so I can't comment on those), with toilet stalls that are large and have grab bars, accessible seating in the performance venues, ramps to get over the door jambs for exterior doors, etc. They're not perfectly in compliance with ADAAG, since they also have to worry about SOLAS and other maritime laws, but it's clear accessibility was a major consideration in designing the ships. I was surprised when we went on Carnival Liberty (a very new ship, owned by Princess's parent company) that the accessibility wasn't better--restrooms labelled as the wheelchair-accessible ones were small with no room to maneoever and no grab bars. My favorite was the feminine hygene product dispenser that had a manufacturer's label on it saying it was ADA compliant--but they'd mounted it so high on the wall that nobody in a wheelchair could have reached it. You really do have to think about accessibility from the perspective of someone with a mobility impairment when you're designing a space, otherwise it's easy to get it wrong, even with the best of intentions. I mean, I doubt someone at Carnival said, "Let's mount the feminine hygene product dispenser on the wall too high for a person in a wheelchair to be able to reach it, because we're mean!"

 

Anyway, back to QE2...I would guess that the main accessibility-related issues that could cause increased costs in a refit would be the design of public WC's, the addition of accessible cabins, and possibly some accessible route issues--are there any areas of the ship that cannot be reached by lift?

[SeaFlint]

You'd then lose the ability to traverse the Panama Canal. Pretty crucial in a ship designed to do world cruises.

 

Matthew

 

do that?

[Kindlychap]

Would greater l.o.a. do that?

 

I am ready to be corrected, but wasn't she designed to be as large as possible and still be able to fit in the locks?

 

Matthew

[guernseyguy]

wasn't she designed to be as large as possible and still be able to fit in the locks? Matthew

 

Yes.