Journey Is A Sick Ship

[WCAB]

Was on the ship last week. Staff was constantly picking up and cleaning. In the buffet area you had to hold onto your plate, knife and fork or they were there cleaning it off the table. I also saw mopping and sweeping during the day. I really did not see any signs of anything being dirty.

 

Carol

[gosport11]

the worst place for norvo is the supermarket trolleys!!!!!:mad:

[Susan-M]

But there's no sympathy for the OP...

 

I think the OP set himself up when he described Journey as a floating sewer. JMO.

[crzfanatic]

I think that my partner might have had this on one of our cruises. He was pretty sick for 24 hours and then it was over. He certainly didn't care about the quality of room service since food was the last thing on his mind. Even so, I can't imagine that the room service food was that bad since can't you get anything from the dining room served in your cabin? Am I wrong about that?

 

Andy, glad not to have gotten this yet...

[greeneg]

Here is the straight skinney, via the CDC.

 

http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/diseases/submenus/sub_norwalk.htm

 

 

Bottom line: Use good handwashing technique and you won't really have to worry much.

[Dale Jr]

I think the OP set himself up when he described Journey as a floating sewer. JMO.

 

I'm sure he was upset when he made those comments. Still why the need for several people to insult and ridicule his opinion when it doesn't jive with their own. As somebody fairly dear to you all once said "....opinions are like noses... everybody has one...."

[antsnanny]

Here is the straight skinney, via the CDC.

 

http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/diseases/submenus/sub_norwalk.htm

 

 

Bottom line: Use good handwashing technique and you won't really have to worry much.

 

Hi,

I'm going on the Journey today and I will keep everyone posted in the next few days. My plan is plenty of hand cleaner and handwashing. I have a few hand cleaners to keep with me. I work at a hospital and spoke to the person who runs the "Infection Control" department and she said the most important thing is to wash your hands often for at least 15 seconds being careful to get under nails etc. SHe also said to use a paper towel to open the door when leaving the restrooms. In addition to that be careful not to put your hands anywhere near your face. Viruses enter the body through our mouths, eyes, and nose. She also noted that sometimes people touch the rim of their glasses and thats of course would take the virus from you hands to the glass and right into your mouth. Lysol is good she said it takes 10 minutes to fully kill germs.

Hopefully the staff will stop those who fill old water bottles with the water in the buffett area. (thats my pet peve)

I'll post in a few days.

Nancy

[rkeate0804]

nancy...have a great cruise...thanx for the info and will be looking forward to your update.......kathie

[blambition]

Nancy,

Wishing you a wonderful trip. Thank you so much for keeping us updated, we sail the week you get back. I hope everything is perfect for you and your fellow travelers and Azamara is back on track. Enjoy the new menus and all she has to offer.

Vicki

[azamara1]

My husband and I were on the Azamara cruise to Bermuda this same week. My belief is that his description of the ship and it's conditions were greatly exaggarated. If there were unsanitary conditions on board our party of four did not notice them. This was not a rampent sickness, but affected a few of the guests. The fact is that these type of things can happen anywhere and anytime to anyone! I suppose I would be somewhat angry if I fell ill, but to blame the cruise line, ship, food, service, medical staff is simply immature behavior. I was taught at a young age that sometimes unfortunate events occur; it's the way I accept and respond to these events that matters the most. We would not hesitate to sail Azamara again. They are new division of Celebrity and have some "fine tuning" to be done, but by no means was this cruise an unpleasant one.

BYE FOR NOW! :)

[Playful Mermaid]

On my way home now. Many on this cruise have been sick. They blame a NOROVIRUS, I vomitted all over the first tee at Port Royal GC and got quaratinted to my room for 48 hours ruining the trip. While imprisoned, the treatment from the crew was horrible. They sent me no food and when I asked I got cold rice and chicken. This ship is a nightmare from the get go. It is not clean at all. I looked at the old NCL ship as we were leaving Hamilton today and wish I had chosen that boat. My friend on board was also very ill. Many left the boat and chose to fly home. If you have a future trip planned on this floating sewer I suggest cancelling whatever the cost. Bayonne will never look so good to me. To say I am mad at the treatment I have received is an understatement.

 

HP

 

horseplayer - Sorry to hear about your bad experience. As one who has been thinking about having a better cruise experience on an upscale ship, I appreciate your comments. The lack of food from room service is not what anyone should be expected to just accept. I can assure you that anyone who went through what you described would be very mad. Have you contacted the cruise line to register your complaint? It is always great to hear from someone who was on a cruise and to receive their opinions.

Thanks for your comments.

[greeneg]

Many on this cruise have been sick.

 

This was not a rampent sickness, but affected a few of the guests.

 

There would appear to be a discrepency here.......guess it IS "all in the eye of the beholder."

[bububr]

FYI: If he was quarantined to his cabin it was for good reason.

 

As in a hospital, the ships doctors know what is best for the patients dietary needs. A bland diet for a couple of days is what is needed to help get over the NORO bug.

 

So the entire regular room service menu would be off limits in HP's case, instead a bland diet would be in order.

 

So while he may feel abused, and much of what I have read shows that only a few ever contacted this...he may have even been the carrier.

 

Being confined to his room protected the othe 600 passengers from contacting this short, violent illness. Being fed 'dog food" as he put it only speeded his recovery.

 

So what do you think he should get?

 

Post like yours only add to the confusion and fire of the OP.

 

The staff did what they could to contain a virus that was brought aboard the ship...It could have been from the OP...we just don't know.

 

Dave:eek:

 

BTW: I was always taught that those who pray the loudest, need it the most.

[gillianrose]

Noro is basically a bad stomache flu

 

Norovirus is NOT influenza (flu), stomach or otherwise. Influenza is a respiratory infection.

 

Norovirus causes ACUTE GASTROENTERITIS, and is classified as a FOODBORNE illness.

 

Gastroenteritis is an inflammation of the stomach and intestines. Gastroenteritis is not related to flu (influenza).

 

The primary method of acquiring norovirus is by EATING food or DRINKING be verages (usually water) that is contaminated with the virus.

 

At the top of the list provided by the National Institute of Health is "Eating food or drinking liquids contaminated by a food handler infected with the virus".

 

For the rest of the "transmission" list, you can read here:

 

http://www3.niaid.nih.gov/healthscience/healthtopics/norovirus/transmission.htm

[Napi's Mom]

Because I had this "problem" or one like it, as the term "Montezumas Revenge" indicated, for yrs we travelers have been picking viruses like these up on trips. The new ones like all "bugs" today are more resistant I think. To counter the possibility of similar problem, we receivced a bottle of pills from our Dr., a new drug that acts ONLY in the gastro. track to kill off these bacteria (As I have a problem with antibiotics causing worsr re-action than the orig. problem ) We did not need to use it , thank he Lord, but it's here for our next trip! Ask your Dr about it (Don't remember the name) As a side note IF you do have a problem...when I had it in Spain, they gave me cipro (SP?)but also Pepto- bismal, I thought this is SO oldfashioned...give me one of those new drugs. THEY didn't work but the Pepto did like a charm, some oldfashioned things are still good! We carry the little pink chewable pills always on trips.

NOT the best topic for discussion but forum is for travelers info:rolleyes:

[greeneg]

Here's the text from the link posted above:

 

You can get norovirus infection by

 

Eating food or drinking liquids contaminated by a food handler infected with the virus

Touching surfaces or objects contaminated with a norovirus, and then putting your hands in your mouth

Having direct contact with someone infected with a norovirus, such as caring for or sharing food or eating utensils with someone sick with norovirus

Eating improperly cooked contaminated shellfish, especially oysters

Eating improperly prepared uncooked fruits and vegetables

Drinking contaminated water

Noroviruses are found in the stool or vomit of people who are infected. If you have been infected with a norovirus, you can continue to transmit it to others even when you no longer have symptoms.

 

Obvious points:

 

1) You CAN acquire Norovirus Infection via contaminated food or water. This is probably not the most common vehicle on a cruise ship since one or two infected food handlers could/would infect people far out of proportion to their numbers. I also think it unlikely that a cruise line, ANY cruise line, would knowingly allow sick workers to handle food. The overall risks are simply too great for a company to knowingly accept. It is possible, however, that someone could pass the infection before they became clinically ill; patients are contagious prior to the appearance ( and after the disappearance) of symptoms. That, of course, is sheer bad luck and neither negligence nor malfeasance.

 

2) The more likely scenario is touching a contaminated surface, and then putting your hand to your mouth. The ships try to prevent this by spraying and wiping surfaces so often; they also encourage you to wash your hands thoroughly and oftern. This is the area where you are in control and the better your hygiene, the smaller the odds that you will become ill. This comment applies equally if not more so in regard to airport facilities and aircraft lavs.

 

3),4),5), and 6) are pretty obvious and don't merit additional comments.

 

The final point should be taken to heart; you are not well just because you think you feel better: you may well still be contagious and a threat to your shipmates. This is why you have to be quarantined longer than might first appear necessary. This is also why they ask you those questions before you get on the ship.

 

In most cases, Norovirus infections are brought on board by people who either do not know that they are getting sick, or think that whatever previous problem that they have had has resolved.

 

Unfortunately, Murphy says that "'Tain't necessarily so.."

 

I stand by my previous statements that the most important thing that you can do is to WASH YOUR HANDS.......often.

 

Good luck, all.

[gillianrose]

You CAN acquire Norovirus Infection via contaminated food or water. This is probably not the most common vehicle on a cruise ship since one or two infected food handlers could/would infect people far out of proportion to their numbers.

 

EXACTLY WHY it is a common vehicle for transmission on cruise ships and other places where large groups of people are fed.

 

You have an OPINION that states otherwise for reasons you gave in your response.

[greeneg]

You also CAN be struck and killed by lightning but it isn't the most common fatality in the United States, nor would I lose a great deal of sleep worrying about the possibility. I think that you missed my point which was if the source of the infection was food contamination, the number of affected passengers would be much higher than the usual 100-200 persons who seem to involved in these outbreaks. After all, one infected person serving in a buffet line would seem to be likely to infect many more that 10% or so of the potential patients on a large and crowded vessel. I am not denying that a sick food handler could not be the source of the problem, I just think that the scope of the problem would be much broader if that were the primary cause.

 

The other point that I was trying to emphasize was that, if, in fact as the CDC has postulated, the infection comes onto the vessel via a sick passenger, the one thing that you, as a individual can be responsible for and have control of, is your own precautions with regard to your handwashing technique. No, keeping your hands as clean as possible is not going to protect you from infection via a sick server, BUT it just might keep you from becoming sick from holding onto the handrail behind someone who is ill and didn't bother to wash theirs.

 

You have to deal with those things that you can have some control over and let the Cruise Line deal with those issues that it can control. If you don't approve of the Line's ability to cope with a situation, any situation, then I submit that you probably shouldn't be sailing with that particular company.

 

As far as my "opinion" is concerned, well, that's why they run horse races.

[Playful Mermaid]

You also CAN be struck and killed by lightning but it isn't the most common fatality in the United States, nor would I lose a great deal of sleep worrying about the possibility. I think that you missed my point which was if the source of the infection was food contamination, the number of affected passengers would be much higher than the usual 100-200 persons who seem to involved in these outbreaks. After all, one infected person serving in a buffet line would seem to be likely to infect many more that 10% or so of the potential patients on a large and crowded vessel. I am not denying that a sick food handler could not be the source of the problem, I just think that the scope of the problem would be much broader if that were the primary cause.

 

The other point that I was trying to emphasize was that, if, in fact as the CDC has postulated, the infection comes onto the vessel via a sick passenger, the one thing that you, as a individual can be responsible for and have control of, is your own precautions with regard to your handwashing technique. No, keeping your hands as clean as possible is not going to protect you from infection via a sick server, BUT it just might keep you from becoming sick from holding onto the handrail behind someone who is ill and didn't bother to wash theirs.

 

You have to deal with those things that you can have some control over and let the Cruise Line deal with those issues that it can control. If you don't approve of the Line's ability to cope with a situation, any situation, then I submit that you probably shouldn't be sailing with that particular company.

 

As far as my "opinion" is concerned, well, that's why they run horse races.

 

I have taken all of the precautions mentioned above and still managed to get the virus. The idea that it is always the passengers fault and is always brought on board by the passengers, as the quote from the CDC seems to indicate, is to me ridicolous. As has been mentioned before, you can get the virus from the food handlers, the food itself, the bartenders and by a host of other means. I still want to try Azamara and move up and get away from belly flopping contests, which seem to attract the attention seeking type. I feel very sorry for the OP and how this was handled and I hope they are able to work out a fair solution. Until you have been there, trust me, it is no fun.

[greeneg]

No question that norovirus is no fun and to be avoided if at all possible. That's what I really was trying to say, you can only concentrate on what you can do for yourself. In spite of anyone's best efforts, anyone can get the thing and be totally miserable at a minimum.

 

But, the only thing that you can do is to take the precautions, make the effort, be alert, and hopefully have a great vacation.

 

I have been there, on both sides of the bed....

[Maya-Tucker]

I have taken all of the precautions mentioned above and still managed to get the virus. The idea that it is always the passengers fault and is always brought on board by the passengers, as the quote from the CDC seems to indicate, is to me ridicolous. As has been mentioned before, you can get the virus from the food handlers, the food itself, the bartenders and by a host of other means. I still want to try Azamara and move up and get away from belly flopping contests, which seem to attract the attention seeking type. I feel very sorry for the OP and how this was handled and I hope they are able to work out a fair solution. Until you have been there, trust me, it is no fun.

 

And I for one venture to ask one question? Why is it rampant year after year on both Celebrity and now Azamara? Why doesn't it happen on either Oceania or Regent? Can anyone out there tell me why?

[cruiserbryce]

we have been considering trying one of these cruises...while its a bummer you had the experience you did sometimes the line cant stop the illness since the passengers have so much to do with it, but the service you described is a little disturbing. Hopefully that was an isolated incident and not an indication of what to expect in the future

[nlvc12]

And I for one venture to ask one question? Why is it rampant year after year on both Celebrity and now Azamara? Why doesn't it happen on either Oceania or Regent? Can anyone out there tell me why?

 

Please...it may happen on Celebrity/Azamara, but surely these are not the only lines to have a infestation on a regular basis. I think Carnival is the line I have read most frequently about having it aboard.

 

I think it occurs when several unfortunate situations occur simultaneously.

 

Nancy

[greeneg]

As least part of the explanation is that the larger the ship and its passenger and crew list, the more likely the probability that there is someone sick on board who can serve as a focus of infection.

 

I truly do not think that the major cruise lines, as much as their Bean Counters might like to try and cut corners, would take any risks with the health or general well being of their passengers. They do not want you to become ill; their aim is for you to feel well, have a good time so that you will spend more money with them now and again in the future. This is not to say that Management cannot do stupid things, they certainly can and do. However, most of those "sins" are tend to be those of " ommission" rather than those of "commission". Ships that are dirty, ill-maintained, poorly staffed are abberations and not in either the long or the short term interests of the line concerned. And management does understand this.

 

There used to be an old adage to the effect that one angry customer equated to about four or five happy ones. Even in their worst acts of stupidity, the lines are not out to make you unhappy. Do stupid things, yes. Do dumb things, yes. Go out of their way to have you experience a bad vacation, doubt it very much.

[Susan-M]

Why is it rampant year after year on both Celebrity and now Azamara?

 

Rampant? There have been occurrences, but rampant is a bit strong.:confused: How many people were affected on Azamara?

 

Below are the guidelines for reporting to the CDC .... some cruiselines may be affected but fall under the 3% rule.

 

It's not only Celebrity that has occurrences...the list includes quite a number of other cruiselines.

 

Cruise ship updates are posted when they include the following criteria:

fall within the purview of VSP (see about VSP),

are sailing on voyages from 3-21 days,

are carrying 100 or more passengers, and

are cruise ships in which 3% or more of passengers or crew reported symptoms of diarrheal disease to the ships medical staff during the voyage, and

are gastrointestinal illness outbreaks of public health significance.

CDC has not verified all of the case numbers represented in the following updates.

 

 

Another factor may be the general increase in norovirus in the U.S. -

New strains may be fueling surge in norovirus outbreaks

 

Aug 24, 2007 (CIDRAP News) – Norovirus outbreaks in the United States appear to have increased sharply since the beginning of last year, probably fueled by two new strains of the gastrointestinal pathogen, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) reports.

Here's a link to the full article: http://www.cidrapbusiness.net/cidrap/content/fs/food-disease/news/aug2407norovirus.html