Camera Questions

[Ronrocks!]

Since I've been asking stupid questions for the past two days I may as well ask one more. Lets say I finally decide on the XTi or Sony. What type of memory card should I use? I read the article on how much to bring (alot) but I am not sure if thier is a difference in what kind? Do they come with a camera case or do I need to kiss up to the wife more for that? (I have a feeling my kisser is going to be sore after this trip) Also, I have adobe photoshop Album Starter Adition 3.2. Is that good for anything like cropping pictures, etc?

[dmz]

I will be on the side lines taking photos of the soccer team. While I would love a cheaper camera, I don't think it would go over well if I asked the girls to stop in the middle of a break away so I can get a picture. So yes I will need something that can take multiple shots. I can't ever see me taking more than 15 shots in one sequence.

 

Daytime, with good light?

 

The kit lens that comes with most cameras will work fine for this. However, it won't zoom in very much if you're at a distance. If I were shooting this, I'd want to be zoomed in on the players--capturing the action up close. Pictures of the whole field while the team plays... well, they're kindof boring. A really good tip for improving the composition of pictures -- "get closer". Even with a point and shoot.

 

As for how rapidly the camera can shoot -- that's a function of the camera body. As was already mentioned, most of the cameras can shoot 3 shots per second or better.

 

 

The theatre is very dark and most of my shots will be from 30 to 50 yards or more. The shots will be from pitch black to the stage with all the lights.

 

This is very difficult shooting. At that distance, even if it were allowed, a flash will be useless.

 

Have you tried taking pictures of this with a point and shoot? What were the results?

 

What are your expectations with an SLR?

 

Since you gave an approximate distance for this one, lets look at "focal length" and what it gives you. The Canon kit lens starts at 18mm and goes to 55mm. This range is reasonably good for general purpose photography.

 

But lets look at how it would work in a theatre environment. And I'll compare it to one of Canon's consumer-grade telephoto lenses (the Canon 70-300mm IS).

 

From 120 feet away (40 yards), here is what you'd get:

- zoomed to 18mm, you would cover an area on stage that would be about 150 feet wide, and 100 feet tall

- zoomed to 55mm, you would cover an area on stage that would be about 49 feet wide, and 32 feet tall

 

- Zoomed to 70mm, you would cover an area on stage that would be 38 feet wide, and 25 feet tall

- Zoomed to 200mm, you would cover an area on stage that would be 13 feet wide, and 9 feet tall

- Zoomed to 300mm, you would cover an area on stage that would be 9 feet wide, and 6 feet tall

 

Again, I would want the zoom lens, so that I could get up-close.

 

 

As far as the cruise I will of course be taking still shots on formal night, around the pool, etc. I hope to get some beautiful shots of the sunset and sunrise. Or perhaps the moon off the water.

 

The kit lens would work just fine for this.

 

 

I can give a Canon recommendation (since I know their stuff). Others can pipe in for other Manufacturers if they want.

 

Get the XTi. You may as well get the kit lens (18-55) because it doesn't cost much more when purchased together. This will be good for your cruise. Possibly get the new 18-55 IS... it's only marginally more expensive, and includes image stabilization. It's brand new, so I haven't heard much about it yet.

 

Then save up for the Canon 70-300 f/4-5.6 IS (*not* the 75-300). It's about $550 at B&H Photo right now. This is Canon's best consumer-grade telephoto lens, and it will be excellent for your soccer photographs, and as good as you're going to get for indoor theatre without spending a fortune.

 

End-user reviews of the 70-300: http://www.fredmiranda.com/reviews/showproduct.php?product=294

 

Photographs taken with the 70-300: http://www.pbase.com/cameras/canon/ef_70-300_4-56_is_usm

 

 

B&H product pages:

 

XTi (body only) - http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/457506-REG/Canon_1236B002_EOS_Digital_Rebel_XTi.html

 

XTi (w. 18-55 kit) - http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/457541-REG/Canon_1236B001_EOS_Digital_Rebel_XTi.html

 

18-55 IS - http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/519475-USA/Canon_2042B002_18_55mm_f_3_5_5_6_EF_S_IS.html

 

70-300 IS - http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/397663-USA/Canon_0345B002_70_300mm_f_4_5_6_EF_IS.html

[dmz]

Lets say I finally decide on the XTi or Sony. What type of memory card should I use? I read the article on how much to bring (alot) but I am not sure if thier is a difference in what kind? Do they come with a camera

 

Canon's use CompactFlash (CF) cards. I don't think the camera comes with any. They've come WAY down in price in the last couple of years. I just did a quick search, and found 1 GB cards ranging from $15-30. Depending on your settings, that will hold several hundred pictures or more. It might be more convenient to get a larger card to hold everything, but you run the risk of putting all yours eggs in once basket.

[Ronrocks!]

Daytime, with good light?

 

The kit lens that comes with most cameras will work fine for this. However, it won't zoom in very much if you're at a distance. If I were shooting this, I'd want to be zoomed in on the players--capturing the action up close. Pictures of the whole field while the team plays... well, they're kindof boring. A really good tip for improving the composition of pictures -- "get closer". Even with a point and shoot. I try to get as close as I can and only take action shots of the girls when they have the ball. It's hard with the current camera though. (HP R967) I almost have to guess where they will when I take the picture.

 

As for how rapidly the camera can shoot -- that's a function of the camera body. As was already mentioned, most of the cameras can shoot 3 shots per second or better.

 

 

 

 

This is very difficult shooting. At that distance, even if it were allowed, a flash will be useless.

 

Have you tried taking pictures of this with a point and shoot? What were the results? I used my HP for last years production. It looked like I was taking a picture in a tunnel. All dark with a bright light at the end. So I had someone sneak up in the isle and take a few pictures. Even those didn't turn out too great. This year I will be sitting 3 rows back center.

 

What are your expectations with an SLR?

With the SLR I hope to be able to take some action shots. Take photos that I can print out in 8X10 and frame for my wall. I would also love to be able to take a family picture that I can have blown up to go over my fireplace. We live on the beach and near historical downtown Charleston so I would love to get some pictures of the buildings and plantations here in Charleston.

Since you gave an approximate distance for this one, lets look at "focal length" and what it gives you. The Canon kit lens starts at 18mm and goes to 55mm. This range is reasonably good for general purpose photography.

 

But lets look at how it would work in a theatre environment. And I'll compare it to one of Canon's consumer-grade telephoto lenses (the Canon 70-300mm IS).

 

From 120 feet away (40 yards), here is what you'd get:

- zoomed to 18mm, you would cover an area on stage that would be about 150 feet wide, and 100 feet tall

- zoomed to 55mm, you would cover an area on stage that would be about 49 feet wide, and 32 feet tall

 

- Zoomed to 70mm, you would cover an area on stage that would be 38 feet wide, and 25 feet tall

- Zoomed to 200mm, you would cover an area on stage that would be 13 feet wide, and 9 feet tall

- Zoomed to 300mm, you would cover an area on stage that would be 9 feet wide, and 6 feet tall

 

Again, I would want the zoom lens, so that I could get up-close.

 

 

 

 

The kit lens would work just fine for this.

 

 

I can give a Canon recommendation (since I know their stuff). Others can pipe in for other Manufacturers if they want.

 

Get the XTi. You may as well get the kit lens (18-55) because it doesn't cost much more when purchased together. This will be good for your cruise. Possibly get the new 18-55 IS... it's only marginally more expensive, and includes image stabilization. It's brand new, so I haven't heard much about it yet. I thought the XTi had image stabilization with it. Wait that may have been the Sony. I've looked at so many I am getting crossed up.

 

Then save up for the Canon 70-300 f/4-5.6 IS (*not* the 75-300). It's about $550 at B&H Photo right now. This is Canon's best consumer-grade telephoto lens, and it will be excellent for your soccer photographs, and as good as you're going to get for indoor theatre without spending a fortune.

 

End-user reviews of the 70-300: http://www.fredmiranda.com/reviews/showproduct.php?product=294

 

Photographs taken with the 70-300: http://www.pbase.com/cameras/canon/ef_70-300_4-56_is_usm

 

 

B&H product pages:

 

XTi (body only) - http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/457506-REG/Canon_1236B002_EOS_Digital_Rebel_XTi.html

 

XTi (w. 18-55 kit) - http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/457541-REG/Canon_1236B001_EOS_Digital_Rebel_XTi.html

 

18-55 IS - http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/519475-USA/Canon_2042B002_18_55mm_f_3_5_5_6_EF_S_IS.html

 

70-300 IS - http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/397663-USA/Canon_0345B002_70_300mm_f_4_5_6_EF_IS.html

 

 

So do any of you pros have any ideas on where to take good pictures on the ship? We'll be on the Mariner the week before Christmas. Any thoughts or ideas on what a would make a great backdrop for pictures? I assume that most areas of the ship will have enough light.

[Ronrocks!]

Canon's use CompactFlash (CF) cards. I don't think the camera comes with any. They've come WAY down in price in the last couple of years. I just did a quick search, and found 1 GB cards ranging from $15-30. Depending on your settings, that will hold several hundred pictures or more. It might be more convenient to get a larger card to hold everything, but you run the risk of putting all yours eggs in once basket.

 

I'll probably set the quality to high. I also plan to take my laptop so I can download the pictures at night.

My HP has a 2.0 GB card made by SanDisk will that work??

[dmz]

I'll probably set the quality to high. I also plan to take my laptop so I can download the pictures at night.

My HP has a 2.0 GB card made by SanDisk will that work??

 

The HP takes SecureDigital (SD) cards. They aren't compatible. But I'm sure you'll still use the HP as well. I still have a p&s that I take when I don't want to carry an SLR with me.

 

Canon and Nikon SLRs take CF Cards. Not sure about Sony. I know Sony p&s take Sony Memory Stick cards.

 

The prices are all very similar. So it doesn't matter that much.

[dmz]

So do any of you pros have any ideas on where to take good pictures on the ship? We'll be on the Mariner the week before Christmas. Any thoughts or ideas on what a would make a great backdrop for pictures? I assume that most areas of the ship will have enough light.

 

Well, I'm not a pro. I'll be going on my first cruise this December as well. (Caribbean Princess).

 

If you're shooting low-light, brace yourself up against a wall, or a doorframe. A good rule of thumb for shooting handheld is to try and keep your shutter-speed above 1/<focal length>. So, if your lens is @ 30mm, try and keep your shutter-speed over 1/30 of a second. It depends on how steady your hands are (and how much coffee you've had). You'll likely be on the ship at night, and it will be all colourfully lit up. It will be hard to capture some of that if you use a flash.

 

Might be worthwhile getting a cheap tabletop tripod (e.g., an Ultrapod: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/239963-REG/Ultrapod_PD02010_Ultrapod_2_Black.html )

 

You can also crank the ISO up a lot higher on SLRs and still get useable images (that don't look really grainy).

 

Low-light is one of the areas that an SLR really shines over a p&s. But you're pushing the envelope here. Photography is all about exposing the film (now a sensor) to light. Well, when you don't have much light, you really have to know what you're doing to make the most of it.

[ISTDS]

Also, I have adobe photoshop Album Starter Adition 3.2. Is that good for anything like cropping pictures, etc?

 

I have never used PS Starter Edition. But if you are thinking about a DSLR, IMHO You might want to Get software that is more flexible.

Take a look at Photo Shop Elements now in V6 or Paint Shop Pro Now in V12.

Both have a learning Curve, But will do most anything you will need to do. There is also a free program that a lot of people swear by "Gimp" I personally have never used it.

 

Hope this helps

 

ISTDS

[pierces]

So do any of you pros have any ideas on where to take good pictures on the ship? We'll be on the Mariner the week before Christmas. Any thoughts or ideas on what a would make a great backdrop for pictures? I assume that most areas of the ship will have enough light.

 

Take a look at some of the regular poster's galleries (click on the Travel Gallery image in my signature for mine), look for images that you like (it's inspiration, not plagiarism;) ) and just wander the ship looking for stuff. I usually get up for the sunrise and try to photograph interesting areas of the ship without crowds afterwards. On the week before Christmas, the ship will be decorated...especially the Promenade!

 

The Sony A100 uses Compact Flash. It comes with an adapter for Memory Stick Duo , but if you don't already have some, skip it. Compact flash is the better choice. Check Amazon or B&H Photo for SanDisk Ultra II or Extreme III Compact Flash. The Extreme III is a faster card, but the cameras you're looking at will perform pretty much the same with either. The difference will be download speed to your computer. There's about a $7 difference between the Ultra II ($58) and the Extreme III ($65) 4GB cards. If it were me, I'd go for the Extreme III. B&H Photo has a rebate available that would make the Extreme III about $50 if you bought two. (I agree with DMZ on B&H...I've been buying from them for 30 years!) Two will cover your worst day of shooting (one really, but you know how I feel about running out!)

 

As for lenses, the ranges that DMZ posted are about right. I just published an article on lenses and what all the alphabet soup associated with them means. It's here if you're interested: http://www.pptphoto.com/ArticlePages/AddingLenses.htm

 

As I mentioned before, you can't really go wrong with any of the top brands. The difference between the A100 and the XTi is pretty small. They each have features that are better on one that the other and those differences are small too. The Sony uses body stabilization so all your lenses are stabilized and the Canon offers a wider range of lenses for now. Whichever one you end up with, you have some nice folks here that can help with specific questions and advice.

 

Once again, it comes down to the camera itself. Go out and "feel" them. The suggestion was made a couple of times to take your own card down and snap some pictures with the cameras. Since whatever you get will use CF, buy one first. Play with the controls. See which one works best for you.

 

Dave

[dmz]

 

I just published an article on lenses and what all the alphabet soup associated with them means. It's here if you're interested: http://www.pptphoto.com/ArticlePages/AddingLenses.htm

 

Nice article. A possible addition: something on what you actually get with IS, and its limitations. I find a lot of people think that IS will make everything sharp--only to find the people in their shots blurry. (The whole subject motion topic.)

 

On the topic of memory cards... My parents just have a point & shoot. They went on a Mediterranean cruise this summer, and before they went, I bought them a new, large memory card. About 2/3 of the way into the holiday, the camera was stolen--with about 800 pictures on it. So now, really large memory cards make me nervous. (They can also fail--it's not common, but it *can* happen.) That's what led me to recommend multiple smaller cards. If you lose one, you don't lose everything.

[pierces]

Nice article. A possible addition: something on what you actually get with IS, and its limitations. I find a lot of people think that IS will make everything sharp--only to find the people in their shots blurry. (The whole subject motion topic.)

 

Excellent idea! I'll get on that right away! Thanks!

 

On the topic of memory cards... My parents just have a point & shoot. They went on a Mediterranean cruise this summer, and before they went, I bought them a new, large memory card. About 2/3 of the way into the holiday, the camera was stolen--with about 800 pictures on it. So now, really large memory cards make me nervous. (They can also fail--it's not common, but it *can* happen.) That's what led me to recommend multiple smaller cards. If you lose one, you don't lose everything.

 

A new concern!:mad: Mine has usually been about failure, which is why I stick with SanDisk. (It could just as well have been Lexar, but I started with SanDisk and have never had a failure.) I copy off the images nightly (Epson P-2000 or laptop, depending), full or not, and leave a copy on the card 'til they are safely on my home system and backed up. I use 4GB cards and shoot full-rez extra-fine JPEG most of the time. I have one 8GB Extreme IV that I got a while ago for about $100 on a rebate deal from B&H (They were a day late on their usual price increase whenever a rebate is available!:D ), but have settled on 4GB as a standard for now.

 

Small vs. large is relative as well. 4GB is huge on my little SD800IS pocket camera, but not so large on the A700 if I shoot RAW or RAW+JPEG. I also use the Costco formula to determine card size...they introduce a certain size card at $79 and carry it until demand and need for increased capacity drives the price down to $39, then they double the capacity and re-introduce at $79! Kinda like Moore's law and computers, eh?

 

Dave

[dmz]

Do the ships provide (an economical) way of backing up memory cards? Not everyone has the luxury of taking a laptop or other portable storage device with them (like the Epson P-XXXX).

[Ronrocks!]

Do the ships provide (an economical) way of backing up memory cards? Not everyone has the luxury of taking a laptop or other portable storage device with them (like the Epson P-XXXX).

 

Can't you just pack them in your suitcase? How big are the cads?

[dmz]

Can't you just pack them in your suitcase? How big are the cads?

 

Oh, the cards are small. I was asking if the cruise ships provide any kind of way to copy the data off the cards (back them up) while you're on the ship. Your HP has SD cards. Most (all?) DSLRs take Compact Flash.

 

[pierces]

Do the ships provide (an economical) way of backing up memory cards? Not everyone has the luxury of taking a laptop or other portable storage device with them (like the Epson P-XXXX).

 

The RCI and Celebrity ships we've been on offer a burn-to-CD service. I've seen $4.99 to $10.00 per CD.

 

If you shoot a three or four (or more) gigs of photos on a trip, a $200 EZ-DUPE portable burner or something like it would pay for itself pretty quickly. The Epson units are a bit pricey, but being able to review images closely and organize them without the mass and bother of a laptop makes it worth it to me. I haven't taken a laptop on a cruise since my wife gave me my P-2000 in 2005. Since she gave it to me as a gift, it was free...right?:confused:

 

BTW, I added to the article expanding on stabilization. Great suggestion! Thanks!

 

Dave

[donaldsc]

Do the ships provide (an economical) way of backing up memory cards? Not everyone has the luxury of taking a laptop or other portable storage device with them (like the Epson P-XXXX).

 

The problem with this approach is that a CD holds only about 700 meg while a typical card holda 1 or 2 gig. You end up backing up the card to several CDs which is a real pain. If you do not want to bring your laptop, you can buy a standalone hard drive with a capacity og 80 gig or so for less than $100. This would be a better solution.

 

DON

[Ronrocks!]

Oh, the cards are small. I was asking if the cruise ships provide any kind of way to copy the data off the cards (back them up) while you're on the ship. Your HP has SD cards. Most (all?) DSLRs take Compact Flash.

 

 

 

Oh you said "backup"....I thought you said "packup". I thought maybe I was missing something...lol.

[Ronrocks!]

I just watched a demo on the Canon XTi on Best Buy. Looks like a nice camera but I must admit I am a little bit intimedated by it. All the settings and things...

[pierces]

I just watched a demo on the Canon XTi on Best Buy. Looks like a nice camera but I must admit I am a little bit intimedated by it. All the settings and things...

 

Keep in mind that all the DSLRs have a Program mode that will make all those settings for you! They aren't the ultimate answer to Life, the Universe and Everything, but they will provide you wit a lot of great pictures as you grow to understand what all the settings can do for you.

 

Dave

[pierces]

The problem with this approach is that a CD holds only about 700 meg while a typical card holda 1 or 2 gig. You end up backing up the card to several CDs which is a real pain. If you do not want to bring your laptop, you can buy a standalone hard drive with a capacity og 80 gig or so for less than $100. This would be a better solution.

 

DON

 

Could you post a link? I've seen external HDs for that price, but not with the ability to read memory cards. They are usually just for external storage via USB and cameras can't see them as such.

 

Dave

[dmz]

I just watched a demo on the Canon XTi on Best Buy. Looks like a nice camera but I must admit I am a little bit intimedated by it. All the settings and things...

 

You *can* use it on full automatic mode. But to get the most out of it, you should take a class and learn some photographic theory (notice I didn't say "learn how to use the camera").

 

I learned on a full-manual film SLR back in highschool. I've never used the Sony SLRs, but I imagine I could pick one up and start using it very quickly. All of the same concepts apply.

[Ronrocks!]

You *can* use it on full automatic mode. But to get the most out of it, you should take a class and learn some photographic theory (notice I didn't say "learn how to use the camera").

 

I learned on a full-manual film SLR back in highschool. I've never used the Sony SLRs, but I imagine I could pick one up and start using it very quickly. All of the same concepts apply.

 

I plan to take a class when I get back from the cruise. I'll have almost 3 weeks to learn as much as I can before my cruise. (that's if I pick up the camera tomorrow) So I'll have to learn what I can from the manual or tutorial. Not to mention just playing around with it. If for some reason I can't figure it out it's nice to know it has a manual mode to fall back on. I wonder if I can take black and white pictures with this camera?

[dmz]

I wonder if I can take black and white pictures with this camera?

 

There *is* a setting for this in the camera, but I wouldn't use it. The reason is simple: you can convert to black-and-white afterwards on the computer. If you do it in the camera, you're stuck with it.

[Ronrocks!]

There *is* a setting for this in the camera, but I wouldn't use it. The reason is simple: you can convert to black-and-white afterwards on the computer. If you do it in the camera, you're stuck with it.

 

If I take the picture in color can I convert it on the computer with my Adobe Photo Album Starter? My HP came with a easy share program that allowed me to crop and "auto fix" pictures. Is something like this compatable with pictures on the Canon or Sony?

[pierces]

If I take the picture in color can I convert it on the computer with my Adobe Photo Album Starter? My HP came with a easy share program that allowed me to crop and "auto fix" pictures. Is something like this compatable with pictures on the Canon or Sony?

 

Any JPEG can be manipulated by almost (99.99%) any editing program.

 

Check out Picasa by Google. It's free and is an amazing tool for organizing your photos. It also has some surprisingly effective editing tools built in. Even special effestc like B&W conversion and soft focus.

 

Look here: http://picasa.google.com/download/thanks.html

 

Dave