MorganClark

4 hours ago, coastcat said:

After cancelling MSC Divina in October and NCL Bliss's Christmas week cruise, I've got four 2021 cruises booked: NCL Encore in August, Majestic Princess in September, and the pairing of Carnival Radiance (3-day) & Navigator OTS (4-day).

 

And then... someone posted a graphic of the NCL restart dates. Oh look, Bliss is returning to service at the end of October on the Mexican Riviera route. Prices aren't bad and I do have a CruiseNext and some leftover FCC... but no, that would be silly, right?

 

Now I have five 2021 cruises booked.

Dang @coastcat! I was tied with you at 4 cruises booked in 2021 (Adventure OTS in a week, Celebrity Edge 10/2, Oasis OTS 11/7 & Mardi Gras 12/18) but you just went ahead of me by booking your Norwegian Bliss cruise. Do I need to book #5 to regain the tie? Hmmm... 🤔

2 hours ago, saltsandknit said:

I have done a 15 day round trip Hawaii cruise on Princess and I would not do it again. We were caught in a storm going and it was rougher than skirting a tropical storm in the Caribbean. One evening we were asked to stay in our cabins except to go to dinner. I enjoyed the cruise after the first few days and I love sea days but 8 sea days more or less was too much even for me.

I totally respect your reaction to adverse sea conditions. Heck, I was a professional merchant mariner (now retired) and I am susceptible to sea sickness. But, there are remedies for sea sickness, you just need to be prepared before you leave the dock. Just my preference but I like sea days and longer cruises.

26 minutes ago, hallux said:

The PVSA allows closed-loop cruises (round trip returning to the embarkation port) with a stop in any foreign port.  To allow the "open jaw" or one-way cruise that embarks in one US port and disembark at a different US port, it needs to be a "distant foreign port".  Ensenada and Victoria are not distant enough to qualify for the one-way trips.

 

This is why the one-way Alaska trips either start or end in Vancouver.

Thanks. As the "fog" lifted all the way, I remembered the term closed-loop cruises. So, I would just have to stay on the ship longer on a Hawaii closed-loop cruise that departs SD (or LA) and makes the required stop in Ensenada (right @RumRunner2021?). I think @chengkp75said it was a 14 day cruise (5 days out to Hawaii, 4 days calling Hawaiian islands/ports and 5 days back to the U.S. west coast). Yeah, go ahead and "throw me in that briar patch"...

On 7/3/2021 at 12:42 AM, christinand said:

It still doesn't seem to me when i do the calculations that i would be paying 1/2 of what a couple pays though.

Normally, a couple would pay 200% (100% each). But with the 60% off the 2nd guest promo, the couple would pay only 140% (60% off). As a solo, you would pay 140% also. Much better than having to pay the full solo supplement where you would pay double (200%) without the promo.

As a solo myself, I have booked multiple cruises on other than Quantum class ships (i.e. Oasis & Voyager class) with this promo. On my booked cruises on Quantum class ships, I'm in a studio balcony.

3 minutes ago, RumRunner2021 said:

That would suit me just fine.  

Me 2. Isn't retirement great?

3 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

Well, if you are going to use a foreign flag ship, then you would need to round trip from the West Coast, so it would be 5 days out, 7 days in Hawaii, and 5 days back, for 17 days.  Most lines that do the West Coast to Hawaii, are 14 day, with 4 days in Hawaii.

I'm confusion. Couldn't a foreign flag cruise ship do a one way from SD (or LA) making a port stop in Ensenada to Hawaii (disembarking passengers in Honolulu) similar to how foreign flag cruise ships do one way cruises to Alaska from Vancouver? Oh wait, the fog is clearing; if the foreign flag cruise ship embarks passengers in a U.S. port (SD or LA) they have to return to that same U.S port and make a foreign port stop. Like foreign flag cruise ships do on those shorter 7 day Alaska cruises R/T from Seattle with the mandatory port stop in Victoria, BC. I think I got that correct...

3 minutes ago, RumRunner2021 said:

That's odd.  Has anybody else been "demoted?"  I was gold and stayed gold, even though my points were no longer in the gold range.

I've been demoted to "pup". 😉

6 minutes ago, SeaShark said:

 

As opposed to seeing the vacuum toilet system on the ship?

I rather just use the vacuum toilet system on the ship. 😉

25 minutes ago, RumRunner2021 said:

This is interesting stuff.  My personal preference would be that at some point NCL would just start sailing roundtrip from LA or San Diego with the obligatory stop in Mexico.  I would happily invest more time/$$$ in a few more sea days than that miserable round trip flight.

Actually, that's a great idea! Embark the foreign flag cruise ship in SD (or LA) which is a short sail to Ensenada, Mx to meet the foreign port stop requirement of the PVSA, then on to the Hawaiian Islands. I like it! And actually, I like sea days so no problem here. I think it is 5 sea days from the West Coast to Hawaii. Then, 7 days calling the Hawaiin Islands for a nice long 12 day cruise. 

1 hour ago, chengkp75 said:

NCL does have a significant investment in the compound on Fanning Island, Republic of Kiribati, which is the closest foreign port to Hawaii (about 700 miles due south).  NCL did operate foreign flag ships around Hawaii for years, calling at Fanning as their foreign port.  They may find that that is another, more attractive alternative to West Coast sailings.  Since HAL and Seabourn are still calling at Fanning, I assume the compound (power plant, vacuum toilet system, galley, water sports equipment) is still in operation.

How about a shore excursion on Fanning Island to see the vacuum toilet system! 😜

1 hour ago, chengkp75 said:

Having been a part of the NCL operation in the US flag fleet, from before it started until the day the Aloha reflagged to the Norwegian Sky, I'll give the straight skinny on all of this.  The deal struck with the US government, was that NCL would take the half completed Pride of America off the government's hands (the previous owner had gone bankrupt (the aforementioned American Hawaiian Cruise LIne), and the government had made loan guarantees), in exchange, the POA could be finished in a foreign yard, NCL would build one newbuild for flagging as US (Pride of Hawaii/Norwegian Jade), and NCL would reflag one existing ship into US flag (Norwegian Sky/Pride of Aloha).  The Hawaii and Aloha were not temporary until POA could get up and running, they were intended to be permanently US flag.  The schedule was revised when POA sank in Bremerhaven (I was to travel to  Germany to join her two days after), with the focus shifting to reflagging the Aloha quickly to get the service up and running, while the insurance and shipyard fought over who was to blame for the POA disaster.  Once the Hawaii and the Aloha reflagged to Bahamas, they permanently lost their exemption to the US built clause of the PVSA.  Further, POA (as were the other ships, too) is limited strictly to the Hawaii trade, or to carry passengers to/from a shipyard period.

 

In my opinion, NCL ramped up capacity in the Hawaiian trade far too quickly, and with the competition from the foreign flag lines increasing their capacity to Hawaii from the West Coast by 500% during the 4 years NCL was trying to operate 3 ships there, fares dropped to the point where NCL was losing $174 million a year, just on the Hawaii trade.

 

As much as I would like to see all cruise ships homeported in the US be US flag, I am enough of a realist to know that the Hawaii trade is a unique market, and a US flag ship would not work anywhere else.  As for Alaska, there is a reason that the cruises on POA are more than what the foreign flag ships charge for a cruise that is twice as long from the West Coast to Hawaii (and that use 4-5 times the fuel), and that is the cost of US flag operations.  The US Maritime Administration, mandated with supporting the US flag merchant marine, has determined that operating a simple cargo ship with a crew of 20-25, costs over 3 times what a foreign flag ship costs to operate, and of that increased cost, crew costs are nearly 5 times a foreign crew.  Imagine that scaled up to a cruise ship, and that is not even considering the US built clause, where building a new cruise ship in a US yard (if you could find one interested), would be 3-4 times the cost of building overseas.

 

The cost of stopping in Canada on the way to Alaska, is far outweighed by the savings that the cruise lines enjoy operating under foreign flag.  Just think of the liquor;  foreign flag ships buy all their liquor without any local, state, or federal tax, and can bring it to the ship from overseas without any customs duty.  POA buys Hawaii taxed liquor.  Further, the spare parts and supplies the ship uses can all be brought into the US from overseas again duty free, as it is "in bond" in transit to a foreign ship.

Thanks for the insightful ,& informative reply. You're better than Wikipedia, lol! I was right that the Pride of Hawaii is now the Norwegian Jade and the Pride of Aloha is the Norwegian Sky. What I didn't know, is that they were initially intended to be permanently assigned to Hawaiian waters. Wow, your point(s) contrasting the cost of operating a U.S. flag ship (especially a cruise ship) was eye opening. I'm surprised PoA is still around. @Karaboudjanhas a good question; what's next for the Hawaiian cruise market after PoA? I'm guessing NCL will not replace her with another U.S. flag cruise ship and just sail to/from Hawaii from/to Ensenada, Mx or Vancouver, BC.

23 minutes ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

 

I don't believe that is correct. The Jade did sail hawiaan islands round trip for years. This is what I found in a quick search. I'll dig deeper this weekend (this stuff is interesting to me).

 

When built, the ship comprised the third in a series of U.S. flagged ships operated by NCL America for the Hawaii market. At a cost of over half a billion U.S. dollars, Pride of Hawaii was the largest and most expensive U.S. flagged passenger ship ever built. Her design was originally planned to be a sister ship to Pride of America, utilizing parts from the Northrop Grumman Shipyard and the failed Project America series of ships.

I think I found the info. Pride of Hawaii is now Norwegian Jade. Pride of Aloha was (and is again now) Norwegian Sky. NCL America struck a deal with the U.S. Congress to temporarily reflag these 2 ships under the U.S. flag (both ships are foreign built - in Germany I believe) and operate solely around the Hawaiian Islands. I think the deal with Congress was until NCL America could get Pride of America up and running in Hawaii. Normally, to be U.S. flag, ships have to be built in the U.S. and crewed by U.S. citizens.

https://www.meyerwerft.de/en/ships/pride_of_hawaii.jsp

https://www.frommers.com/trip-ideas/beach-water-sports/ncls-pride-of-aloha-becomes-first-u-s-flagged-cruise-ship-in-decades

Maybe @chengkp75can weigh in here (he'll know)...

19 minutes ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

 

I don't believe the Jade was a temporary placement. I believe the Jade was built for the Hawaiian market and If I'm not mistaken, the POA and Jade both sailed Hawaii for years until NCL realized they weren't making money like they had hoped. I could be wrong, I'm going to have to look this up today 🙂

 

This was the Jade's entire decor:

Since Jade is foreign built & flagged, I don't think she could sail the Hawaiian Islands round trip from Honolulu like the PoA can (even though the PoA was started in a U.S. ship yard and completed in a foreign yard).

6 minutes ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

 

Here is a article on the sinking of the POA  for those who, like me, are curious 🙂

New cruise ship with troubled history sinks at German shipyard - Professional Mariner

 

Wasn't the Jade also approved for that itinerary? Back when NCL was running more than one ship out of Hawaii I'm pretty sure it was POA and Jade. In fact, the Jade's decor was very specifically Hawaiian (something they changed in the last Jade drydock)

Didn't NCL use 2 of there existing foreign flag cruise ships (Jade was probably one of them) until the PoA was completed and put into service? I'm sure NCL got a waiver. I think the 2 ships were temporarily named Pride of Hawaii and Pride of Aloha.

1 hour ago, hallux said:

It literally can NOT happen.  The POA is the only ship in the fleet (shoot - the only ship in any of the major cruise line fleets) that can sail the itinerary she does.

NCL needs to build another new cruise ship in a U.S. ship yard then flag her U.S. Seems to me, even outside of the Hawaiian Islands market (R/T Honolulu), there's a Seattle to Alaska market (& not having to originate in Vancouver or stop in Victoria). I know there's currently a PVSA waiver in place now that is allowing such cruises but the waiver is only temporary.

But, with the financial hit NCL has taken due to the shut down, this will not happen. I'm surprised NCL has enough $$ to complete Prima.

1 hour ago, dexddd said:

Not likely.  When they added the studios and suites they did so by converting conference rooms and barely used areas.

That's too bad. There are many solo cruisers that would like to sail PoA and not have to pay the solo supplement (as it's a pricey cruise to begin with). Oh well, I guess I'll have to "suck it up" and pay the supplement for an inside cabin...

3 hours ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

My dh doesn’t read the forum much so I feel pretty safe saying I like sailing solo just as much as with him (maybe more…..likely more lol). Total freedom- which is why I am only interested in solo balconies. I’m totally content to just sit and watch the sea for hours. I’m thrilled to learn celebrity is increasing solo capacity- as you know I’m sold on the quantum class solo balconies (they have lounge chairs too), but  I’m chomping at the but to try a SIV!  Thanks for the info 🙂

Thanks, I feel the exact same way you do; even as a solo cruiser, "I gotta have me a balcony" (or veranda in the case of Celebrity). I'm booked on Celebrity Edge and Apex. I'm also booked on multiple RCI Quantum & Quantum Ultra class ships (Anthem OTS, Odyssey OTS & Ovation OTS). I didn't know about the lounge chairs which is just "icing on the cake", right? I also think RCI is very "solo friendly" because of their constant "60% off the 2nd guest" promo which effectively lowers the solo supplement to 40%, enabling us solos to book regular balcony cabins (which I have done on all 4 of RCI's Oasis class ships). Also, even though Carnival can be considered "solo unfriendly", I found that on their newest Excel class ships (Mardi Gras & Carnival Celebration) they have "Jr. balcony" staterooms which Carnival prices lower than their regular balcony staterooms. The Jr. balcony staterooms are just slightly smaller (sq.ft) than the regular balcony staterooms (but I believe the balconies themselves are the same size).  And yes, I am also booked on Mardi Gras and Carnival Celebration in Jr balcony staterooms, lol. So, with these Jr. balcony staterooms on their new Excel class ships, Carnival is now becoming more "solo friendly" and they may not even know it, lol.

So, I wish you happy solo cruising! Wrt your husband, you know what they say; "absence makes the heart grow fonder".

2 hours ago, Molokai-Chuck said:

I believe that the Pride of America is in dry dock in Oregon at this time, is anyone aware of what will be done during this visit to dry dock?

Hopefully adding more studio cabins and a legitimate studio lounge.

7 hours ago, coastcat said:

Celebrity pricing for solos can be problematic. I did the math right after they moved to the Always Included model and noted that solos get a raw deal when the single supplement is at the standard 200%. Basically a solo is paying the added cost of two drink packages, two WiFi logins, and two daily service charges. If you want to take advantage of the perk upgrades, you’re still paying double and getting less in return. If I wanted to book anything other than a Single Infinite Veranda, I’d set my price point at a max of 170% single supplement to compensate. 
 

Technically NCL has the same issue due to Free At Sea. However, I still have the option of a Sail Away rate. Also, I’m only charged for one set of service/drink/dining gratuities. 

NCL’s included drink package has better booze options. Celebrity includes all those non-alcoholic drinks for which NCL requires the upgraded drink package. Either I pay extra for Blue Moon and Flor de Caña rum or pay out of pocket for espressos and bottled water. (or book an NCL Studio with access to free espresso!)

 

At the moment I’m more inclined towards the Princess price structure which allows me to add Princess Plus (tips, drinks, WiFi) at a per-person rate unlike Celebrity’s per-cabin rate. Not sure about the Princess experience - seems more traditional than my preference but in 58 days I’ll be onboard Majestic Princess…

I've never sailed with Celebrity but I am booked in a Single Infinite Veranda (SIV) on Celebrity Edge on Oct 2-9, 2021. As a solo cruiser, that's why I wanted to try one of those SIVs. It's interesting that Edge has 16 SIVs, Apex has 24 and Beyond will have 32. It appears Celebrity is increasing it's marketing towards  us solo cruisers.

1 hour ago, trbarton said:

All of the ships that I have been on have single beds that can be pushed together. I’ve never noticed anything in the middle where the beds are pushed together. They felt fine. 
 

Tom😀

I think they lay over some kind of mat or flat cushion over the two single mattresses when they're pushed together to make a queen. Eliminates the crack in the middle problem. "Just say no to crack".

On 7/5/2021 at 11:48 PM, seaman11 said:

Does anyone think they will add more cruises? Wanting to leave out of florida or texas but nothing looks that great to me so far.  

Hey @seaman11, if you would, shoot me an e-mail at:  martycp60@gmail.com

I've got a question I need to ask you offline. Thanks...

2 hours ago, kochleffel said:

 

It sounds a bit like the Radiance-class ships at Royal Caribbean, which have only three studio cabins, apparently where double inside cabins wouldn't fit.

 

Ironically, I was just looking at pictures of a Radiance-class ship; Jewel of the Seas. Wow, 3 whole studios, eh?

12 minutes ago, coastcat said:

Pride of America also has Studio cabins (just 4).

Yeah, imo NCL really needs to upgrade the PoA with more studio cabins and a legitimate studio lounge (not just a common room with  table and 4 chairs). Either that or just do away with those 4 measly studio cabins altogether.

46 minutes ago, trbarton said:

Which ships have the Studio Staterooms?

 

Thanks!

 

Tom😀

That was answered on the thread you started.  Prima will have studio staterooms (I am booked in one on a future cruise).

41 minutes ago, WorkNCruise said:

Epic

Breakaway 

Getaway 

Escape 

Bliss

Encore

 

Not the Joy though because it was originally built for the Chinese market.

 

Not sure about the Prima or its future twins.

Prima does. I've got one booked.