Psychiatric service dog

I just had someone tell me that they wanted to cruise to Alaska but the cruise line told them they would not accommodate a psychiatric service dog, only seeing eye dogs. I believe that this is in violation of the ADA and the customer service rep must have been misinformed. I told them to call back and escalate. Sorry I am not sure which line, didn't get that much detail.

Has anyone ever heard of any cruise line currently denying psychiatric service dogs? If so what did it take to get things cleared up?

Though some cruise line may accept Psychiatric Service Dogs, they are not in violation of ADA law by refusing. Psychiatric Service Dogs fall into a grey area both with ADA Law and the Department of Transportation and are currently in not included in thier definition of a service dogs. Refer to this link

http://doglawreporter.blogspot.com/2010/07/cruise-lines-must-accommodate-service.html

I think most cruiselines don't allow psychiatric service animals anymore. I remember reading a Royal Caribbean special needs brochure from a several years ago (probably 2003/2004) that said for service animals all that was required was a doctor's note on office letterhead and certification that the animal had current shots. I think they ran into issues with comfort-type dogs because of that. Some people would get a dog because their psychiatrist/psychologist/therapist tells them that it will help their mental well-being. The person gets a dog and calls it a "service" dog even though the dog has no special training. It's been years, but I've seen a couple of dogs that were poorly behaved and made me wonder what they were doing onboard. They would bark and jump on people, which I have never seen a trained service animal do. One of the women that I saw with the poorly-behaved dog openly admitted that she had her doctor provide a note that her dog was a service dog because she could not bear to be gone for 2 weeks without it. That was in 2004 and by the middle of the cruise, I was ready to throw both the woman and her nasty dog overboard. They were everywhere!

Is a "true" psychiatric service dog required to pass a formal training program and be licensed, like a seeing-eye dog or a physical-assistance dog?

Since I've been sailing RC and HAL lately, I checked their current requirements for service animals. Neither of them allow comfort dogs onboard. They only allow trained assistance-type service dogs. Based on the link in xxoocruiser's post, it does not appear that the cruiselines are violating the ADA by denying comfort animals.

I just had someone tell me that they wanted to cruise to Alaska but the cruise line told them they would not accommodate a psychiatric service dog, only seeing eye dogs. I believe that this is in violation of the ADA and the customer service rep must have been misinformed. I told them to call back and escalate. Sorry I am not sure which line, didn't get that much detail.

 

Has anyone ever heard of any cruise line currently denying psychiatric service dogs? If so what did it take to get things cleared up?

If in fact the cruiseline indeed is "only (accommodating) seeing eye dogs" then yes, they're in violation of the ADA...as they must allow fully licensed and trained service dogs on board (which include "seeing eye dogs").

But psychiatric service dogs -- unless they are specially licensed and trained -- are not generally accepted by cruise lines. If your friend's dog has some sort of certification from a specialized school, he/she might try copying that and sending a copy to the cruise line and ask that they reconsider.

Too many people have labelled their pets "emotional support dogs" and brought them aboard..with unpleasant results...and the cruise line just won't accept that anymore.

The requirement that cruise lines accommodate all service dogs does seem to have changed according the ruling in the link above.

According to the recent ruling it references, It looks like it may be that they are trying to still require accommodation of trained service dogs and weed out the people who bring along their pets as comfort animals. But it makes me wonder about people who have highly trained dogs for their pyschiatric disorders? Will cruise lines still allow them?

For example, (This is a different person than the one who told me they were not allowed to bring their phychiatric service dog along,) I have friend who was shot two times in Vietnam and has PTSD. He has a trained and certified service dog. His dog had to pass obiedence and service certifications so he too is frustrated with people who try to pass off untrained pets as service dogs.

I wonder if his dog would still be allowed on board. His dog is specially trained to perform a specific task. His dog can sense when he is suffering from anxiety or panic, and the dog is trained to lead him to a quiet place and calm him down. That to me sounds like it meets the definition for accommodation. People who just have a doctors note saying they need the pet for comformt would not be in the same situation. However, how would my friend with the highly trained dog be able to get his Psychiatric service dog on board? Any ideas?

The requirement that cruise lines accommodate all service dogs does seem to have changed according the ruling in the link above.

 

According to the recent ruling it references, It looks like it may be that they are trying to still require accommodation of trained service dogs and weed out the people who bring along their pets as comfort animals. But it makes me wonder about people who have highly trained dogs for their pyschiatric disorders? Will cruise lines still allow them?

 

For example, (This is a different person than the one who told me they were not allowed to bring their phychiatric service dog along,) I have friend who was shot two times in Vietnam and has PTSD. He has a trained and certified service dog. His dog had to pass obiedence and service certifications so he too is frustrated with people who try to pass off untrained pets as service dogs.

 

I wonder if his dog would still be allowed on board. His dog is specially trained to perform a specific task. His dog can sense when he is suffering from anxiety or panic, and the dog is trained to lead him to a quiet place and calm him down. That to me sounds like it meets the definition for accommodation. People who just have a doctors note saying they need the pet for comformt would not be in the same situation. However, how would my friend with the highly trained dog be able to get his Psychiatric service dog on board? Any ideas?

Again -- if your friend has a "highly trained dog" -- has some sort of proof on paper that his dog has passed some sort of specialized training -- then he should send in that proof along with his request, and see what happens.

The requirement that cruise lines accommodate all service dogs does seem to have changed according the ruling in the link above.

 

According to the recent ruling it references, If you are referring to the rule in the link I previously attached as the "Recent Ruling", it's important to note that this rule does not go into effect until November 2010. And at the "Proposed Rule" is open to comment from other agencies until October 2010. All this is stated in the beginning of that article. . Until such time that the Rule is change and effective the definition of a "'Service animal' means any guide dog, signal dog, or other animal individually trained to work or perform tasks for an individual with a disability, including, but not limited to, guiding individuals with impaired vision, alerting individuals with impaired hearing to intruders or sounds, alerting persons with seizure disorders to the onset of a seizure, providing minimal protection or rescue work, pulling a wheelchair, or fetching dropped items." as stated in [5 This definition remains unchanged from the 2007 proposed rules and is identical to the definition under regulations issued by the Department of Justice and contained in 28 CFR 36. 104, though as discussed further below in the link , the DOJ has proposed changing this definition.

 

 

This posting doesn't mean that I agree with the current definition, it's that at this point though some cruise lines may make a reasonable accommodation , until there is further clarification and if at some time the new proposed rule goes into effect, the cruise lines are well within the law to not allow pyschiatric service animals and emotional service animals. One can always try challenging this the current definition.

Sounds like the abuse by some morons is going to make it more difficult for those who truly need these service animals.

For example, a man who has epilepsy (sp?) gets a full 20 minute warning before an attack.

Another cruise acquaintance has a golden retriever for her son with Autism. He is leashed to the dog and this prevents him from running away. (or running into traffic etc)

The person who was trying to book the Alaska cruise informed me it was NCL, and said that the service rep was insistent that only Seeing Eye dogs were permitted.

I told her to push back because she said her dog does have a certification for his service work, so I am betting that the service person was simply misinformed as to what qualifies as a service dog and doesn't realize that dogs can be trained to help people with many disabilities other than blindness.

I also suggested that she look into some of the other lines that cruise Alaska.

If I hear more I'll let you know.

The person who was trying to book the Alaska cruise informed me it was NCL, and said that the service rep was insistent that only Seeing Eye dogs were permitted.

 

I told her to push back because she said her dog does have a certification for his service work, so I am betting that the service person was simply misinformed as to what qualifies as a service dog and doesn't realize that dogs can be trained to help people with many disabilities other than blindness.

 

I also suggested that she look into some of the other lines that cruise Alaska.

 

If I hear more I'll let you know.

Having cruised on NCL a couple of times -- I use a wheelchair but do not have a service dog -- I know, because I've SEEN them -- that NCL accepts qualified service dogs on board, and not just "seeing eye dogs".

But once again, your friend needs to be able to produce the paperwork certifying her dog as a service dog (everyone needs to do this, not just people claiming their dog is a psychiatric service dog!), and talk to the special needs department of any cruise line, including NCL..

and not just depend on an answer from a service representative on the first call.

I have a small (10 pound) Medical Response dog and have had past problems with NCL. A few years ago I was scheduled to go on one of the last cruises on the Norway. Everything was fine. I had turned in all of the paperwork that they had requested and luckily brought everything with me. When we tried to board they tried to keep me and my dog off because she was not a "seeing eye" dog. They kept us waiting until one of the last people there and if my husband hadn't threatened them with a law suit I think that we would still be waiting. I hadn't had her long and was timid with the rules then. Not now! I'd say if the dog has legal papers then they should have access. That said I'd try and find out the laws that pertain to the special circumstances and go for it. Seems when they think they can keep us out they will. Personally I'd try another line!

I have traveled with NCL with my guide dog for the deaf without any issues. Mind you our guide school is Internationally Certified.

I think where the problems have come in is because there are quite a number of individuals who use the "excuse" that their pet is a service animal, only because they don't want to leave their little precious dog/cat/pig (yes, a woman claimed her pig was a service animal) at home. I've experienced this on a couple of cruises, where passengers claimed their Yorkie or whatever was a service animal, but upon asking, you realize that the person just didn't want to leave their home without the animal. I'm not saying the OP's question relates to this, but the actions of a few ruin things for those who really need it.

The question is:

Is the dog trained to do tasks that directly mitigate the person's disability? Or is the dog just well-behaved on a leash for its presence, comfort, emotional support, etc.?

If the dog actually does thinks that helps the person do things they cannot do or have a hard time doing because of their disability (i.e. if they need helping picking up items/getting items across a room, a dog that is trained to retrieve items on command counts, but if they don't need help with that, a dog that is trained to retrieve does not count), it is a service dog and is allowed in public places, including cruise ships leaving from the U.S.

If the dog is on a leash, makes the person happy, keeps the person up and productive because the dog needs to be walked and fed, etc. then it is not a service dog, it is an emotional support animal, and it is not allowed in public places (except airplanes) and cannot go on the cruise ships.

Proof of certification is not required, but you must be able to say with truthfulness that the dog is required because of your disability and what tasks the dog has been trained to do that directly mitigate the disability. You will also need certain vet paperwork for the countries/country the ship goes to, including for getting back into the U.S. Each country has different requirements, but Canada (assuming the cruise ends/stops in Canada to fulfill the foreign country requirements for cruise ships) I think is fairly simple.

Note that Canada does have different access laws than the U.S. and they are by province, not country-wide. Not all provinces give access to psychiatric service dogs (only physical disability service dogs) and at least one that I have heard of is allowed to charge a pet fee at hotels (unlike in the U.S.), if you're staying over in Canada post-cruise at all.

The OP stated in post #9 that the dog is a certified psychiatric service dog so I cannot see why NCL would not allow it onboard. I think certified service dogs, no matter their function, should be allowed. I think the issue is with "service dogs" that aren't certified but have been designated as such by a physician.

I have a coworker whose daughter is autisitic and can become upset in public settings. Her pediatrician recommended that they get a dog to help keep her calm in some situations so the family bought a sheltie mix for her. They brought the dog to a company picnic recently. While it was reasonably well-behaved for a dog in a crowd of strangers, it was obvious that it had no training and became excitable (running and tugging its leash, jumping on people, barking etc.). I politely mentioned to my coworker that he might need to send the dog to a training refresher course since it was not behaving like a "typical" service dog. I then found out that the dog had no formal training (not even obedience school). They had a letter from the pediatrician that stated the dog was an emotional support dog and that was supposedly all they needed in order to bring the dog into public areas. The picnic was held in a local park so having a dog present in that situation wasn't an issue. Although they were the only ones who brought their dog to the picnic, there were other families at the park with dogs.

While I agree that the dog was helpful in keeping the daughter calm in a potentially unnerving situation, I don't agree that the dog should be considered an actual service dog. I wouldn't want it onboard a ship based on its behavior at the park. I have not seen the dog in any other situations so it might have simply been exuberant that it was outdoors and behaves much better when at the mall or in a restaurant.

According to my coworker, a trained emotional support dog whose primary job is to remain calm in order to keep their daughter calm, would cost thousands of dollars, which insurance doesn't cover. To get around that, they chose a dog known for having a calm temperment and got a letter from their pediatrican. I noticed that petting the dog did help their daughter when she began to get upset due to the heat and crowds at the picnic. The dog appeared to be providing some emotional service, but it simply wasn't trained to provide that service. At times, it did tug the leash and bark because it wanted to go play and not be petted.

I can understand why emotional support dogs would be such a gray area. It does seem like overkill to have to pay thousands for a certified dog whose job is to be still so it can be petted. However, I think basic obedience training, as a minimum, should be a requirement before a physician will write a letter designating that an animal is for emotional support.

CCI provides service dogs (skilled companion teams) to families with children with autism and downs syndrome. We had one of each in our training class. Both families graduated as skilled companion teams and got the dogs free of charge.

The OP stated in post #9 that the dog is a certified psychiatric service dog so I cannot see why NCL would not allow it onboard. I think certified service dogs, no matter their function, should be allowed. I think the issue is with "service dogs" that aren't certified but have been designated as such by a physician.

Certification doesn't mean anything. Some ppl go online to scam Web sites and pay some money to get "service dog certification" for a dog nobody at the Web site has ever seen (you could get certification for a dog that doesn't even exist!) and a person nobody at the Web site even knows if they are disabled or not. An untrained pet belonging to a non-disabled person could get a vest and ID card this way. So, don't pay much attention to certification.

The only dogs that are service dogs (here in the U.S.) are ones that have been individually trained to do work or perform tasks that benefit the disabled person and are directly related to the disability, plus the dog needs to have been trained to behave impeccably in public spaces.

A doctor cannot make a dog a service dog or not, as doctors have no training in the dog arena. A doctor can say a person is disabled and recommend they get a trained service dog and they might be able to say they have seen the dog help the person (just like many friends, family, or ppl in the public can say), but they cannot declare any dog a service dog.

I have a coworker whose daughter is autisitic and can become upset in public settings. Her pediatrician recommended that they get a dog to help keep her calm in some situations so the family bought a sheltie mix for her. They brought the dog to a company picnic recently. While it was reasonably well-behaved for a dog in a crowd of strangers, it was obvious that it had no training and became excitable (running and tugging its leash, jumping on people, barking etc.). I politely mentioned to my coworker that he might need to send the dog to a training refresher course since it was not behaving like a "typical" service dog. I then found out that the dog had no formal training (not even obedience school). They had a letter from the pediatrician that stated the dog was an emotional support dog and that was supposedly all they needed in order to bring the dog into public areas. The picnic was held in a local park so having a dog present in that situation wasn't an issue. Although they were the only ones who brought their dog to the picnic, there were other families at the park with dogs.

That is not a service dog nor is it allowed to go in public places where pets are not allowed. Service dogs do not act like that, even outside in a park or anywhere else, while they are working. All service dogs are trained - that is the requirement of the law and what makes a dog a service dog.

Emotional support dogs are not service dogs. They cannot go places pets are not allowed with just two exceptions: no-pets housing and airplane cabins, both with a doctor's note (the one for planes has to be specific and no older than a year old, plus the person has to notify the airline in advance that the dog will be with them).

This dog does NOT belong in public and they have no legal right to bring it in public and you need to tell your co-worker this. They are breaking the law.

While I agree that the dog was helpful in keeping the daughter calm in a potentially unnerving situation, I don't agree that the dog should be considered an actual service dog. I wouldn't want it onboard a ship based on its behavior at the park. I have not seen the dog in any other situations so it might have simply been exuberant that it was outdoors and behaves much better when at the mall or in a restaurant.

Dogs for emotional support, calming, petting, etc. are not service dogs. Period. And a service dog would have behaved just the same at the picnic/park as they do anywhere else when they are working (store, restaurant, etc.).

According to my coworker, a trained emotional support dog whose primary job is to remain calm in order to keep their daughter calm, would cost thousands of dollars, which insurance doesn't cover. To get around that, they chose a dog known for having a calm temperment and got a letter from their pediatrican. I noticed that petting the dog did help their daughter when she began to get upset due to the heat and crowds at the picnic. The dog appeared to be providing some emotional service, but it simply wasn't trained to provide that service. At times, it did tug the leash and bark because it wanted to go play and not be petted.

Emotional support dogs have no training beyond the typical pet. Any dog can be an emotional support dog. They do not cost thousands of dollars; you can pick one up for cheap at your local shelter.

Petting the dog, feeling better, feeling calmer, etc. does not make the dog a service dog. The dog is required to do something it has been trained to do that directly mitigates the disability in order to be a service dog. (It also must behave in public.)

I can understand why emotional support dogs would be such a gray area. It does seem like overkill to have to pay thousands for a certified dog whose job is to be still so it can be petted. However, I think basic obedience training, as a minimum, should be a requirement before a physician will write a letter designating that an animal is for emotional support.

It isn't a gray area. The law is clear on the definition of what a service dog is (and the revised version that was recently released is even clearer when it specifically states dogs for emotional support are not service dogs). There just are people like your co-worker who ignore the law and try to pass their pet/emotional support dog off as a service dog and then try to tell everybody it is legal and okay when it is not.

A doctor's letter for an emotional support animal doesn't give the animal the access a service dog has (it really is the person who has the access, not the animal, by the way). The only thing it does is get the dog in no-pets housing (if needed) and, if the letter fits the requirements the DOT has set for flying, gets the dog in airplane cabins.

Psychiatric service dogs, on the other hand, are not there for emotional support. They have been trained just like any other real service dog to do things that help the person deal with the effects of their disability.

The new "definition" of a service animal goes into effect 6 months after publication in the Federal Register, or on Jan. 26, 2010.

Here's the details, including quotes from the DOJ or what is (and isn't) considered a service animal.

http://barrierfreetravels.com/serendipity/archives/588-New-ADAAG-Nixes-Snakes,-Monkeys-and-Emotional-Support-Animals.html

Candy

The new "definition" of a service animal goes into effect 6 months after publication in the Federal Register, or on Jan. 26, 2010.

 

Here's the details, including quotes from the DOJ or what is (and isn't) considered a service animal.

 

http://barrierfreetravels.com/serendipity/archives/588-New-ADAAG-Nixes-Snakes,-Monkeys-and-Emotional-Support-Animals.html

 

Candy

Don't you January 26, 2011 ?

Your blog provides the information for which I was looking and I will pass it on to my friend with a psychiatric service dog. It does sound like the dog has to be especially trained in some active way to assist those with psychiatric disabilities.... and I think the example of sensing a panic attack and leading the person to a quiet area would fall under that definition.

In a related issue... did anyone see the NatGeo special "And Man Created Dog"? It had a segment about an Iraq Veteran who had both PTSD and a back injury. Physically, his dog served him in many different ways including picking up objects so that he did not have to bend over. It also helped to provide him balance when he was walking. For his phychiatric needs the dog helped him on many different levels....I think they even said the dog could sense his heart rate and calm him down??? All very interesting.

I have two dogs that I would never think of bringing on a cruise, though I did have dream once that I did, and it was a disaster. I love my dogs and they are great company for me at home, but they "Go to Grandma's" when we cruise.

Also, CCI [Canine Companions for Independence] trains Service Dogs for the Wounded Warrior Program.......these are dogs who assist our Service men and women returning from overseas and active duty. These folks may need a Service Dog both for physical mitigation of problems or for psychological needs.

These dogs are being given full access into the public arena.

If you know of anyone returning from active duty who may need the assistance of a Service Dog have them contact CCI.