Cap_D

Anyone know if they have tacos every day in the OVC on all ships?

Has anyone spoken to anyone in charge on the ship, e.g., a hotel director or captain? It's known Celebrity officers have time to be part of the entertainment and activities, including performing at the martini bar or in the theater. They'll often mingle, and ask about how ones cruise is going when they are around the ship. Captain Kate is posting on Instagram multiple times a week, and the twins are going to be front and center with the Ascent journey to FLL. Since the shipboard experience has deteriorated it seems that the issues go beyond the so called head butler that survived the purge, or the room steward / housekeeper, and shouldn't wait for a post cruise survey.

There's been many posts about diminished food and beverage due to changes in menus, lesser quality ingredients, inconsistent and poor execution, and more. Does anyone know if there has been any change in the head of food and beverage? Has anyone seen any comments about the changes (besides Laura's September 2023 deflection and denial (at least with respect to Luminae))? https://corneliusgallagher.com/

That's the problem with Retreat. There's isn't a whole lot of substance except a larger room, which is more like a room in any land hotel that is more than 1k a day. What existed before cutbacks may have been smoke and mirrors, but without it the room is just a room with access to a lounge (not a novel concept for anyone that travels on land), and a restaurant concept that seems to have become hit or miss for many reasons. For warmer weather climates there's access to a sun deck, but that is of little use in cooler weather especially since there are no heaters. Still no forward views from inside on Edge class, and certainly not for only Retreat. The laundry example above is a good one, as a housekeeper is unlikely to expedite anything whereas a butler would troubleshoot with an eye towards meeting the customers needs. I also take issue that size of the suite room should dictate the level of service.

Very unsurprising, but unfortunate. On Apex in March 2023 (before the cuts) the total Retreat staffing levels to deliver the marketed experience already seemed to be stressed. Not to take away from any of the hardworking crew, but considering the reduced cost of cruise ship labor as compared to landside, is Celebrity really saving that much by reduced headcount / mismanagement of Retreat, and making it harder to get in room beverages? (This has been bugging me since the cutbacks were made). I know, I know, there's debt to be paid down, etc. What's got a lot of us disappointed is these are not amenities and roles higher end hotels usually choose to skimp on, and apparently not what the higher end cruise lines skimp on either (and some don't have the additional revenue sources that Celebrity ships have).

@Baynanno1thank you for posting the video in appropriate threads. @terrydtx did you share your recent experience and I missed it?

💯%!

Have we heard from @terrydtx?

Zach has previously been a Celebrity fan, and young and new one at that. He's been making a great go at YouTube. So, this is significant.

It's personal when they take money months and years in advance, and inherently once you're on its not like one can leave for a different hotel room, restaurant, menus, service level, etc. And, as each day gets closer to a cruise, one can't find other options for the same time. They also penalize cancelations, and inherently can't accommodate changes due to limited capacity. There's a degree of trust needed, and Celebrity hasn't been meeting it's side of the equation. Hiding the webinar to only certain people, tracking logins with the CC number, avoiding food and other issues, not presenting a vision, and lying about menu changes and making lame excuses for cookies makes it worse. But, is reflective of a cultural rot at the corporate level and indifference to the customer experience. And, if they were to fold, they probably keep everyone's money.

Celebrity is not maintaining the status quo from 2022 or early 2023, or among the fleet, based on first hand experience and reports. Many current passengers bought what was being sold earlier in time, too. To the extent they have a cohesive plan on cutbacks and revenue, the rollout using deny, confuse, double talk, distraction, etc., also hasn't helped. It's not even close to being explained well at this point. All anyone wants is what they expected, which in part, was an experience start to finish when they are not insulted, gaslit, have to pull up screen shots of bullet points for features, and then find out that the crew is getting squeezed on total comp due to tip changes, the butler who was a last light of defense to getting what one wanted was fired, the meat is strange cuts from the freezer, the options are gone, and so on. Have never seen anything close and consistent on the Dis boards or sister RC board and went back deep before buying our first cruise in 2022. Many crap on Chapek at Disney, and other stuff their, but very little and nothing systemic about the experience being a waste of time and money, or general sentiment of regret. Same on the RC board. Lots of that here and elsewhere about Celebrity since 2023, and especially since May-ish. And, not during the 2021-2022 return to full capacity when supply chain and staffing were more legitimate reasons for product issues. Quite simply, Laura is presiding over an inferior product.

Well said. Making customers the bad guy or to have to overthink things is not what a vacation provider should be actively doing. One wants a hotel company to have thought through the hotel, one wants restaurants to think through the menu, a resort company to think through the lodging, food and beverage, and environment, and one wants a cruise company to think through all of that plus more categories like logistics, entertainment, etc., so the experience is as stress free and perfect as possible. Celebrity is requiring too much work, too wishy washy on what is included down to lying about menu changes and avoiding fessing up to cutbacks on quality, etc. And, at the same time trying to claim they want customers to think of being homey and warm cookies, which entirely misses the point of a vacation on a line that has been positioned and has designed ships for elevated experiences and service. Not toll house cookies.

Something has always seemed off about the homey warm chocolate chip cookies baked with your parents talk off. I agree they don't know who they are marketing to, or the experience they want to promote. Even accepting that baking cookies at home is a common childhood experience, that's not what anyone goes on vacation walking past a coffee bar on a ship designed to appear elegant should be reminded of (especially after a pandemic of baking with whatever one could find), nor should it play to remembrances of a trip to the mall or airport to a Mrs. Fields stand. Laura did acknowledge it could have been "merchandised" (her term) better, but continued to use the homey childhood line. Not even Disney does that to market or elevate cookies (there's a cookie place at Disney Springs outdoor mall that all the influencers peddle) to justify the price, and elevate the experience.

Forward lounge would be a win for many...might have to move the gym.

What type of room? Any price protection, special number to call, OBC, notice about the all included changing in October?

Just noting here that the Celebrity Webinar for Captains Club didn't address this topic.

Was there ever a time before Edge Class when there was any support for something like an IV?

I checked, and probably not. The hosts name is Andrea Shay, so close enough to have sounded wrong.

Retreat rooms that inherently are all included and premium package not getting in room refills on bottled water as a result of the elimination of butlers who did that function. This was perhaps discretionary, as an above and beyond or made to seem special by butlers. Regardless the marketing makes clear the butler was to get guests what they wanted, and when. Even Laura said they would get tea for guests, and that would not change. So, one can get tea, but reportedly not bottles of water or if there is it would be charged. The work around is guests going to bars and the retreat lounge and carrying back to rooms, which is "running around" in my view.

Did Laura get the host's name wrong towards the end of the webinar? It sounded like Laura called the host Deandra who is someone that retired a few weeks after Laura. The video interface didn't have the ability to go back, so I haven't been able to check.

My take is the recent criticism is still valid, and the company is now willfully being insincere or worse.... There's an inherent problem when despite the public facing website, all the PDF documents, the trade materials, and the app, plus the post sale documents still require a limited access and distributed webinar to ascertain what is included in a cruise that is purchased today but will be taken possibly years from today, and when that webinar still has information shared that doesn't ring true based on what is said, and given first-hand reports and common sense. They are doing as much as they can get away with, and do not appear focused on a cohesive hospitality experience even at the higher prices being charged. * * * And, any financial reporting showing revenue is inherently about the period it reports, not when someone experiences the product years from today or has their sailing canceled so the company can make more in a different market without so much as price protection. * * * I'm the so called target market, never sailed before 2022, have a well behaved child, willing to spend, want a clean beach experience, booked less than 4 weeks from sailing, and thought Retreat was terrific, seemed like company was aiming to provide a solid product with a certain level of quality (not always meeting it, but good effort).... went again last March before Laura was in charge (was worried due to ovc cuts), and then boom. One report and lame excuse after another, and no end in site. Have one more cruise booked (pricing fluke and probably will be jinxed), and one future cruise deposit with OBC that could still be used before the change in all included and I'm not sold on the future stewardship of the product. Worse people I know have gone on Celebrity with my endorsement, and had lesser food and experiences that match the reports on this board and elsewhere. Meanwhile any positive reports or one offs seems to be exceptions not the norm, and always have an undercurrent of work in progress or stop gap. Eliminating butlers (they were cut, which means eliminated), making people run around for water, odd cuts of beef, poor quality fish, OVC yo yoing at dinner, cookiegate (give everyone that wants one a hot fresh cookie and make people happy - they all should start hot and fresh at some point, right?), messing with all included and creating a race to the bottom, MDR, etc.... none of it fits into any plan to give people a fantastic experience at higher prices. And, the excuses..... they are as bad or worse than the cuts....

Agreed. I'm in the camp of a nicer beach experience would be terrific. But, CocoCay is only one way to accomplish that, and doesn't work for me. So far, the itineraries that include CocoCay skip the weeks when families have vacations as the island is filled with RC passengers. And, at 2k and up for 3 people in the Retreat the commitment to food quality and passenger satisfaction has to be shown to be going on the right direction. The Beyond is all summer sailings when other parts of the world are more desirable due to extreme temps and weather issues. Winter to Easter is the peak for family vacations to escape cold temps, although in 2025 Easter is later. Meanwhile, just for comparisons Disney has two islands (and definitely has thought of how to optimize guest experiences, no experiments with cookies just to toy with people), and so on. So CocoCay is looking overbuilt and used.

Easy. The perception is cutbacks, throttling options and access, etc. Nothing material or yummy (subjective, but would have applied to a free hot cookie) has been added. No announcements about anything positive, fun, creative or interesting. No standouts among included food.

Typically only open for lunch on sea days for 1.5 hours. Easy to miss generally, and closed for most of any cruise. And, charging for food slows the line, and is the opposite of wowing. As for charging generally, at over 1k a day in Retreat, the options should be available at Luminae (also only open for lunch on sea days) or included. The incremental revenue can not be much for something that is almost always closed (or goes unpurchased). Also, questionable how premium any of these items are.... Keep an eye on Eden Cafe cookies, which have been different and viewed as better by many. But, also only available for a small amount of time.

Thanks for sharing. Looking forward to more, and appreciate your thoughtful observations and analysis.