The Champagne

[Alipius]

This is most important to myself, and to My Cabinmate. I've only been on Silver Sea, and there it was never the same as the last time.

 

We have found that some French ones may be quite pricey but not, well, all that quaffable.

 

And, quaffability is the essential aspect; to the extent that if I found, through this enquiry, that it isn't one we like, I'd probably bring a case on at embarkation (in two months time on the Pride for a 12-day), which would be a heck of a nuisance.

 

I would therefore be very grateful to know the present one on Seabourn.

[tyfh]

This is most important to myself, and to My Cabinmate. I've only been on Silver Sea, and there it was never the same as the last time.

 

We have found that some French ones may be quite pricey but not, well, all that quaffable.

 

And, quaffability is the essential aspect; to the extent that if I found, through this enquiry, that it isn't one we like, I'd probably bring a case on at embarkation (in two months time on the Pride for a 12-day), which would be a heck of a nuisance.

 

I would therefore be very grateful to know the present one on Seabourn.

 

 

But I see that you will be on the cruise that is leaving Shanghai on 7/29?? This is the cruise that we will be on ...

[lord of the seas]

The House Champagne on Seabourn yachts is Nicolas Feuillatte, which is fine but there are many luxury and vintage brands available to purchase from the wine list.

[margbem]

In March this year on the Legend we had Nicolas Feuillatte and Heidsieck Monopole as the house champers.

[Alipius]

Aah, thank you very much for that, Margbem and Lord of the Seas.

 

I notice you didn't say how much you enjoyed the Nicholas Feulliate and I must say that, as a result of having it on a Cruise on Silver Sea a year or so ago, I find it a very dry number and indeed too dry for during-the-day use, being too much of a purist's Champagne: but is otherwise very enjoyable with the meal, and often by far the most preferrable wine to order of a night-time to have with Dinner when having Fish or Chicken simply because of its dryness - and instead of the still wine then on offer.

 

Because of its dryness, on this next Cruise on Seabourn I would utilise the recommended approach of a Post I saw later on the Silver Sea forum of putting a dollop of something such as Creme de Cassis in the bottom of the glass when drinking it during the day (i.e., Kir Royale); and thereby putting into it the sugar Dosage the manafacturers should have simply put there in the first place.

 

Here is a review of it from champagnegallery.com.au.

 

"The brand was founded in 1971 by French-American businessman Nicolas Feuillatte, who is still their brand ambassador today. As they have access to such large holdings of vineyards combined with state of the art technology in the winery, they are capable of producing some very fine Champagne. Only Grand and Premier Cru fruit is used in Nicolas Feuillatte and represents the heights that the Centre Vinicole can achieve. There has been a dramatic increase in the quality of the entire range over the last few years. Head cellar master Jean-Pierre Vincent has transformed this formerly commercial brand with a new lease of life which can often surprise."

 

Champagnegallery.com.au gives it the same 90/100 as it gives Moet and Veuve Cliquout.

 

As for the Heidseick Monopole, I notice some reviewers very much enjoy it - but I still have 5 left of a case of 6 bought some time ago.

 

Thank you both once again.

[lord of the seas]

thereby putting into it the sugar Dosage the manafacturers should have simply put there in the first place.

 

 

 

.

 

I must correct you when you say that the manufacturers should have put more sugar into the Champagne in the first place.

The type of Champagne is Brut which is dry and meant to be.

I think that the type of Champagne that would suit you more during the day would be a Demi Sec, which has a little more sugar.You will find it available from the wine list,if not the Bar Manager will try to get you some if you ask.

[Seabourn-nail]

My opinion: Never add something to champagne..... it simply has to be to your liking or not. I like Champagne a lot, but not too bubbly, lately I've enjoyed the one Seabourn serves me.....

Marja

[Chairsin]

Both champagne's were available on our recent cruise -- we prefer the Monopole and after the first day Daniel, the bartender, automatically served us the Monopole.It is a matter of preference. Would I prefer Tattinger? Yes. But I am very satisfied with Seabourn's

[johnnycruise]

My opinion: Never add something to champagne.....

 

A very agreeable opinion!

 

johnny

[tyfh]

Aah, thank you very much for that, Margbem and Lord of the Seas.

 

I notice you didn't say how much you enjoyed the Nicholas Feulliate and I must say that, as a result of having it on a Cruise on Silver Sea a year or so ago, I find it a very dry number and indeed too dry for during-the-day use, being too much of a purist's Champagne: but is otherwise very enjoyable with the meal, and often by far the most preferrable wine to order of a night-time to have with Dinner when having Fish or Chicken simply because of its dryness - and instead of the still wine then on offer.

 

Because of its dryness, on this next Cruise on Seabourn I would utilise the recommended approach of a Post I saw later on the Silver Sea forum of putting a dollop of something such as Creme de Cassis in the bottom of the glass when drinking it during the day (i.e., Kir Royale); and thereby putting into it the sugar Dosage the manafacturers should have simply put there in the first place.

 

Here is a review of it from champagnegallery.com.au.

 

"The brand was founded in 1971 by French-American businessman Nicolas Feuillatte, who is still their brand ambassador today. As they have access to such large holdings of vineyards combined with state of the art technology in the winery, they are capable of producing some very fine Champagne. Only Grand and Premier Cru fruit is used in Nicolas Feuillatte and represents the heights that the Centre Vinicole can achieve. There has been a dramatic increase in the quality of the entire range over the last few years. Head cellar master Jean-Pierre Vincent has transformed this formerly commercial brand with a new lease of life which can often surprise."

 

Champagnegallery.com.au gives it the same 90/100 as it gives Moet and Veuve Cliquout.

 

As for the Heidseick Monopole, I notice some reviewers very much enjoy it - but I still have 5 left of a case of 6 bought some time ago.

 

Thank you both once again.

 

Do they make a boxed version?

[MARIANH]

My opinion: Never add something to champagne.....

Marja

Unless it is more champagne

[Alipius]

Ooops, sorry to do this Lord of the Seas but, on a Champagne label, and strange as it may seem, 'Brut' always indicates a sweetish wine. The sweetest, in fact. A 'Brut' can have up to 12 grams of sugar per litre. Indeed, on a Champagne label, I know of no designation for a sweeter drop. The term 'Demi-Sec' has not been used on Champagne for zonks, or at all as far as I know. I certainly do not know of a single Champagne producer which uses it. Elsewhere perhaps, but not on Champagne. They almost always add some sugar along with some top-up wine after the second fermentation because the second fermentation leaves the wine bone dry. As far as I know, none of the makers in recent times have said just how much sugar they use, perhaps because it can also be seen to be used as a mask; and, in that regard, Krug seemed to want to let it be known that they put in no Dosage at all - and there are others who have now actually started to label theirs as 'Zero Dosage'.

 

So, apart from these, the only way you can tell is by tasting it. And, if it is too dry and you put in a bit of sugar (by way of Cointreau or Creme de Cassis), you're only doing what the maker might have done and, if you put in just enough, you might find you have yourself a 'Brut'!

[Seabourn-nail]

I'm quite sure I drank Demi Sec Chanpagne before... I prefer Brut though!

Marja

 

[johnnycruise]

The OP's assertions are incredibly inaccruate - perhaps due to an incomplete wikipedia entry.:confused:

 

"Brut" is not a sweet wine. Champagne is generally labeled from driest to sweetest, brut > extra dry > demi-sec. There are extremes on either end of the scale (ultra brut is very dry and "doux" is very sweet), but such extremes have limited popularity and availability. Three famous champagne houses, Laurnet Perrier, Moet et Chandon and Veuve Clicquot, all market demi-sec champagnes. The OP may consider sampling an "extra dry" champagne such as Moet et Chandon Imperial (formerly known as White Star, and not to be confused with Moet et Chandon Brut Imperial). The extra dry style satisfies the urge for a bit of sweet without compromising the flavor of the wine by adding liqueurs.

[mdmourges]

Perhaps you should just bring this along....

 

Mark

[lord of the seas]

Ooops, sorry to do this Lord of the Seas but, on a Champagne label, and strange as it may seem, 'Brut' always indicates a sweetish wine. The sweetest, in fact. A 'Brut' can have up to 12 grams of sugar per litre. Indeed, on a Champagne label, I know of no designation for a sweeter drop. The term 'Demi-Sec' has not been used on Champagne for zonks, or at all as far as I know. I certainly do not know of a single Champagne producer which uses it. Elsewhere perhaps, but not on Champagne. They almost always add some sugar along with some top-up wine after the second fermentation because the second fermentation leaves the wine bone dry. As far as I know, none of the makers in recent times have said just how much sugar they use, perhaps because it can also be seen to be used as a mask; and, in that regard, Krug seemed to want to let it be known that they put in no Dosage at all - and there are others who have now actually started to label theirs as 'Zero Dosage'.

 

So, apart from these, the only way you can tell is by tasting it. And, if it is too dry and you put in a bit of sugar (by way of Cointreau or Creme de Cassis), you're only doing what the maker might have done and, if you put in just enough, you might find you have yourself a 'Brut'!

 

Alipius,

You a writing complete rubbish,but as you see you have given many of us a good laugh.:D

[MARIANH]

Ooops, sorry to do this Lord of the Seas but, on a Champagne label, and strange as it may seem, 'Brut' always indicates a sweetish wine. The sweetest, in fact. A 'Brut' can have up to 12 grams of sugar per litre. Indeed, on a Champagne label, I know of no designation for a sweeter drop. The term 'Demi-Sec' has not been used on Champagne for zonks, or at all as far as I know. I certainly do not know of a single Champagne producer which uses it. Elsewhere perhaps, but not on Champagne. They almost always add some sugar along with some top-up wine after the second fermentation because the second fermentation leaves the wine bone dry. As far as I know, none of the makers in recent times have said just how much sugar they use, perhaps because it can also be seen to be used as a mask; and, in that regard, Krug seemed to want to let it be known that they put in no Dosage at all - and there are others who have now actually started to label theirs as 'Zero Dosage'.

 

 

 

So, apart from these, the only way you can tell is by tasting it. And, if it is too dry and you put in a bit of sugar (by way of Cointreau or Creme de Cassis), you're only doing what the maker might have done and, if you put in just enough, you might find you have yourself a 'Brut'!

 

Oh dear Alipius you seem to be somewhat adrift.

 

On the basis that this is not a "wind up" ( but I am not sure!), perhaps a few facts will put you straight.

Brut is dry champagne , containing not more than 15g/ litre residual sugar. Extra sec is slightly sweeter, containing between 12 g and 20g / litre residual sugar. Sec is medium sweet, containing between 17g and 35g / litre residual sugar. Demi - sec is sweet champagne containing between 33g and 50g/litre residual sugar.

 

As in most things in life, you usually get what you pay for, although with champagne it tends to be a law of diminishing returns. However if you can afford Krug, Dom Perignon , Cristal etc go for it - you should not be disappointed. As to Seabourn "house" champagnes, in my experience they have been ( understandably) at the lower end of the price spectrum. But they seem to be acceptable to many Seabourn cruisers. For myself, I have no qualms about drinking them as a refreshing cocktail with say a little creme de cassis ( Kir Royale) or peach juice ( Bellini). In fact, I will be doing just this on our upcoming ( 20 June) Baltic cruise on the Sojourn - Cheers.

 

And finally, Alipius - if it's not French it's not champagne!

 

Regards

[T&T Vikings]

Oh dear Alipius you seem to be somewhat adrift.

 

On the basis that this is not a "wind up" ( but I am not sure!), perhaps a few facts will put you straight.

Brut is dry champagne , containing not more than 15g/ litre residual sugar. Extra sec is slightly sweeter, containing between 12 g and 20g / litre residual sugar. Sec is medium sweet, containing between 17g and 35g / litre residual sugar. Demi - sec is sweet champagne containing between 33g and 50g/litre residual sugar.

 

As in most things in life, you usually get what you pay for, although with champagne it tends to be a law of diminishing returns. However if you can afford Krug, Dom Perignon , Cristal etc go for it - you should not be disappointed. As to Seabourn "house" champagnes, in my experience they have been ( understandably) at the lower end of the price spectrum. But they seem to be acceptable to many Seabourn cruisers. For myself, I have no qualms about drinking them as a refreshing cocktail with say a little creme de cassis ( Kir Royale) or peach juice ( Bellini). In fact, I will be doing just this on our upcoming ( 20 June) Baltic cruise on the Sojourn - Cheers.

 

And finally, Alipius - if it's not French it's not champagne!

 

Regards

Actually, in France there are 7 variations of dry/sweet champagne, all with residue of sugar:

 

Brut Natural/Brut Zéro- less than 3.gr.sugar/ltr.

Extra Brut -less than 6.gr.sugar/ltr.

Brut -less than 15.gr.sugar/ltr.

Extra Sec/Extra Dry 12 to 20.gr./ltr.

Sec 17 to 35.gr./ltr.

Demi Sec 33 to 50.gr./ltr.

Doux more than 50.gr./ltr.

 

Enjoy your Champagne !

T&T

[MARIANH]

Actually, in France there are 7 variations of dry/sweet champagne, all with residue of sugar:

 

Brut Natural/Brut Zéro- less than 3.gr.sugar/ltr.

Extra Brut -less than 6.gr.sugar/ltr.

Brut -less than 15.gr.sugar/ltr.

Extra Sec/Extra Dry 12 to 20.gr./ltr.

Sec 17 to 35.gr./ltr.

Demi Sec 33 to 50.gr./ltr.

Doux more than 50.gr./ltr.

 

Enjoy your Champagne !

T&T

 

Good to see you confirmed the residual sugar values for the four more commonly available variations

 

As to the other three, I am sure you will agree that, saving Extra Brut perhaps, not too many people will be familiar with them or indeed wish to be! None of these three was available on my last Seabourn cruise in November 2009.

 

Perhaps I should report back on the current position when I have been on the Sojourn in June - if anyone is interested.

[margbem]

Also, if you ask for a Bellini you will get it made with Prosecco, which is the correct way! Enjoy it, however you drink it.

[MARIANH]

Also, if you ask for a Bellini you will get it made with Prosecco, which is the correct way! Enjoy it, however you drink it.

 

In my experience, the Bellinis served on Seabourn are invariably made with the house champagne and there is no addition of raspberry or cherry juice as in the Harry's bar original version. Of course it is all a matter of taste but I much prefer champagne to cheap italian sparkling wine for the base.

 

No doubt if you insist, the helpful bar staff will conjour up the original/ classic version but I personally will stick with champagne. Alla salut or perhaps more appropriately -a votre sante!

[Chairsin]

If I am not mistaken the original Bellini was not just peach juice but fresh squeezed white peach juice?

[T&T Vikings]

"The Bellini" is originally made with prosecco instead of champagne, it is nevertheless widely regarded as the best champagne cocktail in the world.

 

One part fresh frozen white peach puree to three parts prosecco and serve in a very cold glass:p

 

Enjoy it- with or without using champagne

T&T

[tyfh]

"The Bellini" is originally made with prosecco instead of champagne, it is nevertheless widely regarded as the best champagne cocktail in the world.

 

One part fresh frozen white peach puree to three parts prosecco and serve in a very cold glass:p

 

Enjoy it- with or without using champagne

T&T

 

What a learning experience! I have enjoyed your "back-and-forth". I have had a Bellini at Harry's Bar in Florance, but it didn't have the red color .. and cost $24.00 per glass. I wouldn't know the difference between Prosecco and Champagne, but I know a good drink when I have it! Thanks for the education!

[T&T Vikings]

What a learning experience! I have enjoyed your "back-and-forth". I have had a Bellini at Harry's Bar in Florance, but it didn't have the red color .. and cost $24.00 per glass. I wouldn't know the difference between Prosecco and Champagne, but I know a good drink when I have it! Thanks for the education!

 

Glad you enjoyed it, it´s just fun.

 

"The Bellini" is a very easy to make "champagne cocktail" and you are allowed to use a little sugar or simple syrup if the puree is too tart or a tad sour.

 

BUT! it´s a NO NO! to use yellow peaches or other unnecessary ingredients.

 

Anyway enjoy it, it is very popular in this house:)

T&T