Safety at Sea

[Leucothea]

Some friends of mine might be coming over to New York in September and were a little concerned about the fact that they would be sailing on a "sensitive" (for lack of a better word) date in September. Is there any risk at all I wonder? I know QM2 is very "well known", etc... I told them not to worry, but I had never thought about it before.

[Underwatr]

There's always a visible police presence associated with a ship arrival or departure in New York - boats, helicopters, etc. I don't think it would vary much by date - or need to.

[Leucothea]

There's always a visible police presence associated with a ship arrival or departure in New York - boats, helicopters, etc. I don't think it would vary much by date - or need to.

 

I don't suppose anything could happen in the middle of the Atlantic. I think my friends were a bit spooked by these recent airplane disasters and the plane that was shot down.

[Salacia]

Some friends of mine might be coming over to New York in September and were a little concerned about the fact that they would be sailing on a "sensitive" (for lack of a better word) date in September. Is there any risk at all I wonder? I know QM2 is very "well known", etc... I told them not to worry, but I had never thought about it before.

 

Everyday we wake up, there is a likelihood something will happen: maybe something good, maybe something bad - or most likely, just another normal day.

 

But in direct reply to your question: people will remember certain dates on the calendar and associate those dates with increased risk. I think that's a normal reaction. And it is a credit to everyone who goes about their business on 9/11 as they would despite any concerns.

 

On a more practical level, if any specific terrorist threat was detected (and the boffins are pretty good on picking up chatter), my guess is that the ship will would not sail.

 

Just my personal observation from someone who was in NY on 9/11 and more importantly, had several family members working in lower Manhattan that day - We will not cower.

 

Leucothea, I wish your friends a pleasant voyage. We'll keep the lights on for them :) Regards, Salacia

[Leucothea]

Everyday we wake up, there is a likelihood something will happen: maybe something good, maybe something bad - or most likely, just another normal day.

 

But in direct reply to your question: people will remember certain dates on the calendar and associate those dates with increased risk. I think that's a normal reaction. And it is a credit to everyone who goes about their business on 9/11 as they would despite any concerns.

 

On a more practical level, if any specific terrorist threat was detected (and the boffins are pretty good on picking up chatter), my guess is that the ship will would not sail.

 

Just my personal observation from someone who was in NY on 9/11 and more importantly, had several family members working in lower Manhattan that day - We will not cower.

 

Leucothea, I wish your friends a pleasant voyage. We'll keep the lights on for them :) Regards, Salacia

 

Thank you. I hope your family members are safe. I was living in downtown NYC on 9/11 (Village), and as it did for all of us, it shook me to the core. But you're right, to cower is wrong.

Edited August 10, 2014 by Leucothea

[Salacia]

There's always a visible police presence associated with a ship arrival or departure in New York - boats, helicopters, etc. I don't think it would vary much by date - or need to.

 

I'm remembering boarding a Holland America ship, leaving from Manhattan during Fleet Week a few years ago. Security was definitely stepped up. I've seen security increased in various places in NYC on several occasions, some of which are date specific.

 

But, yes, NYC is always on high alert - that's the new normal. But sometimes they pull out all the stops and make their presence known. More often than not, it is an exercise, but sometimes it is response to a possible threat - i.e. abandoned bags, cars parked on bridges with no driver present, a car parked illegally in Times Square, etc.

 

So, just my experience, but the response does vary by date (so called anniversaries call for enhanced security). Actually, enhanced security in NYC is quite fluid, and from my observation, NYPD appears to be well trained to respond to a threat, as does the USCG (no doubt there are other military services but I've only observed NYPD and USCG exercises).

Edited August 10, 2014 by Salacia

[cunardaddict]

Some friends of mine might be coming over to New York in September and were a little concerned about the fact that they would be sailing on a "sensitive" (for lack of a better word) date in September. Is there any risk at all I wonder? I know QM2 is very "well known", etc... I told them not to worry, but I had never thought about it before.

 

Security is very tite on QM2 as Cunard is aware of the current situation.

[BlueRiband]

Umm....if they're this worried why did they book? It's not like the date is a surprise to anybody. :confused:

[capnpugwash]

It would take a massive amount of explosive material to damage the QM2 so that being a threat is pretty minimal.

 

If they decided to try and take over the ship they would need a very large group of people and its safe to say that customs would pick up on that before anyone gets on the ship.

 

If anything did kick off Im confident that UK or US special forces would be able to be on the "ground" in 4 hours or less and thanks to the size of the ship find it pretty easy to neutralise any threat.

 

The only thing I would be worried about exploding aboard is your belly if you make to many trips to the dessert counter ;)

 

How very comforting; could you kindly share the experience upon which you have based this postulation?

[capnpugwash]

1) The dangers airlines face are not applicable to a ship as the liquid explosive that everyone's worried about would do very little damage to a thick hull on a boat

 

2) Every port uses watch lists and algorithms and anything looking remotely shady shows up for further investigation. The checks you see boarding are a very small part of what's done in the bigger picture.

 

To take a ship as large they would need small teams on every floor and that needs a lot of men.

 

3) Special forces, air drop - 4 hours easily from the US or UK.

 

So, in a nutshell, no experience. Merely your opinion.

[capnpugwash]

Part of our business is security so I would say i'm pretty well qualified in how these things work. I do however feel that on a public forum, giving out exact information or reveal our involvement in any security measures would be a bit silly.

 

Very wise, I'm sure.

[brigittetom]

 

But, yes, NYC is always on high alert - that's the new normal. But sometimes they pull out all the stops and make their presence known.

 

Twice sailing out of Brooklyn there was definitely stepped up security. It never actually occurred to me that there was a higher risk. I just thought we were special.

[Salacia]

Twice sailing out of Brooklyn there was definitely stepped up security. It never actually occurred to me that there was a higher risk. I just thought we were special.

 

You are special !;)

[Salacia]

Ok, as long as the topic is safety at sea, I'm wondering why we haven't heard more concern about the transmission of the Ebola virus on cruise ships? Much concern has been about contagion on air flights, but I haven't read anything regarding the risk of transmission on cruise ships.

A popular concern for cruise ship passengers has been the Noro virus which spreads widely in certain environments. (And yes, most of us have had it on land or at sea at some point in our lives.)

 

Ebola virus shares similar modes of transmission as well as exhibiting the same initial symptoms in those infected. But Ebola is more often deadly. I expect there will be a statement from the Cruise Lines International Association (CLIA) in the coming days regarding safeguards they have put in place.

Edited August 11, 2014 by Salacia

[cunardaddict]

Ok, as long as the topic is safety at sea, I'm wondering why we haven't heard more concern about the transmission of the Ebola virus on cruise ships? Much concern has been about contagion on air flights, but I haven't read anything regarding the risk of transmission on cruise ships.

A popular concern for cruise ship passengers has been the Noro virus which spreads widely in certain environments. (And yes, most of us have had it on land or at sea at some point in our lives.)

 

Ebola virus shares similar modes of transmission as well as exhibiting the same initial symptoms in those infected. But Ebola is more often deadly. I expect there will be a statement from the Cruise Lines International Association (CLIA) in the coming days regarding safeguards they have put in place.

 

Salacia, Cunard does not call at ports of countries where Ebola is a risk. I would assume that the source of passengers also does not include this country. Flying certainly is a riskier way of travelling.

[cunardaddict]

I don't suppose anything could happen in the middle of the Atlantic. I think my friends were a bit spooked by these recent airplane disasters and the plane that was shot down.

 

Well, don't fly over war zones.

 

Everyone who travelled on a Cunard ship around the Arab Peninsula knows now, how security aspects are handled.

[Salacia]

Salacia, Cunard does not call at ports of countries where Ebola is a risk. I would assume that the source of passengers also does not include this country. Flying certainly is a riskier way of travelling.

 

Cunardaddict, that's exactly my point. People travel by various modes of transport. A person flying from one country could board a ship in another country days or weeks after traveling from an outbreak area while being asymptomatic. As to whether or not flying is a riskier mode of traveling, I'm not sure I agree with that. Eight hours on a plane verses 8 days on a ship?

 

BTW, recently I read that people can be infected with the Noro virus, but be asymptomatic - yet able to shed the virus and infect others.

Edited August 11, 2014 by Salacia

[cunardaddict]

Cunardaddict, that's exactly my point. People travel by various modes of transport. A person flying from one country could board a ship in another country days or weeks after traveling from an outbreak area while being asymptomatic. As to whether or not flying is a riskier mode of traveling, I'm not sure I agree with that. Eight hours on a plane verses 8 days on a ship?

 

BTW, recently I read that people can be infected with the Noro virus, but be asymptomatic - yet able to shed the virus and infect others.

 

It's the numbers of possible virus carriers that form the risk. It would be purely accidental on on cruise ship. Buying fresh fruit will bring a higher risk.

 

Life is deadly - for everyone.

[Salacia]

It's the numbers of possible virus carriers that form the risk. It would be purely accidental on on cruise ship. Buying fresh fruit will bring a higher risk.

 

Life is deadly - for everyone.

 

Of course it would be accidental! No one would intentionally spread such a disease, would they? But it only takes one carrier that spreads the virus. Surely you have read accounts of well intentioned people who unknowing infected others?

 

http://www.latimes.com/world/la-fg-nigeria-ebola-death-american-air-travel-20140729-story.html

http://allafrica.com/stories/201408080625.html

http://www.cnn.com/2014/07/29/health/ebola-outbreak-american-dies/

 

 

But no, I don't think fresh fruit carries a higher risk, unless one consumes a fruit bat (one suspected carrier of Ebola).

Edited August 11, 2014 by Salacia

[cunardaddict]

Of course it would be accidental! No one would intentionally spread such a disease, would they? But it only takes one carrier that spreads the virus. Surely you have read accounts of well intentioned people who unknowing infected others?

 

http://www.latimes.com/world/la-fg-nigeria-ebola-death-american-air-travel-20140729-story.html

http://allafrica.com/stories/201408080625.html

http://www.cnn.com/2014/07/29/health/ebola-outbreak-american-dies/

 

 

But no, I don't think fresh fruit carries a higher risk, unless one consumes a fruit bat (one suspected carrier of Ebola).

 

I really wonder why US people still take the risk of leaving the house and meeting other carrier of virii and bacteriae.

[balf]

QM2 is of course unsinkable.

 

David.

[Leucothea]

Salacia, Cunard does not call at ports of countries where Ebola is a risk. I would assume that the source of passengers also does not include this country. Flying certainly is a riskier way of travelling.

 

I think the only likely way such virus could be a risk on a Cunard ship would be if it was intentionally brought there. Someone booking at the last minute--- although there is no way to tell if disease symptoms are really Ebola or something else until it has become debilitating. Or perhaps through bringing aboard infected meat, since this originated from animals and meat.

[turquoise 6]

Some friends of mine might be coming over to New York in September and were a little concerned about the fact that they would be sailing on a "sensitive" (for lack of a better word) date in September. Is there any risk at all I wonder? I know QM2 is very "well known", etc... I told them not to worry, but I had never thought about it before.

I thought you were talking about the Hurricane season :D in New York and the east coast .

[Im_Reading]

I really wonder why US people still take the risk of leaving the house and meeting other carrier of virii and bacteriae.

 

Considering the more likely scenario of being bored to death discussing "provenance and social history" it is miraculous anyone leaves their cabin at all.

[Tess of the Sea]

I think the only likely way such virus could be a risk on a Cunard ship would be if it was intentionally brought there. Someone booking at the last minute--- although there is no way to tell if disease symptoms are really Ebola or something else until it has become debilitating. Or perhaps through bringing aboard infected meat, since this originated from animals and meat.

 

Biological terrorism? The world is a volatile place, but I suppose there is no use worrying about it too much.

 

I saw the film "Melancholia" the other day, about a huge planet colliding with the earth. Now that might be worrisome.