Teacher wants us to CANCEL Dec. cruise!

[Nicki_p100]

One of my DD's teachers has said she has NO tolerance for school days missed due to vacations, and does not want to hear from ANY student about "going to Florida". She said school must be a first priority for every student.

 

My daughter is in her first year of highschool, grade 9. Since it was a new school for her I called last March, before I booked airfare, and verified that it was not during an exam period (after the Christmas break), and that it would be ok to miss time before Christmas. I was told it was ok, and that students do it all the time.

 

I agree school is important, but I also know families do indeed "do this all the time". My DD in past years was one of only 5-10 students in the class in the week before Christmas as many families went on Vacation.

 

I have not spoken to the teacher yet. I am wondering if anyone has had this problem before, and what was the solution.:(

[kitty9]

First of all, your headline is very misleading and, quite honestly, incorrect. The teacher isn't forcing you to cancel your cruise. From your post, it sounds like she doesn't like it when kids are pulled out of school for vacations---and she has that right to feel that way, but that in no way can a teacher force you to cancel your vacation. To be honest, I don't know of one teacher, and I know lots of them, who like it when kids miss school because of vacations---they just smile and say "Go ahead" because if they said anything else, they know that the parents would probably visit with lawyers and try and have the teacher brought before the school board. She will probably not give your DD her lessons in advance or do anything out of the ordinary to help you and your DD make up lessons, which is her right, but she cannot "force" you to cancel your trip.

 

I'm probably not the one to comment about this situation because I'm a former teacher, but a teacher can run a classroom anyway they see fit, as long as it doesn't break district rules. I know my cousins who are teachers, are not tolerant of kids who are pulled from school for vacation. They tell parents and students at the beginning of the year that if a child misses school for a vacation, missed assignments receive a zero, no makeup tests are allowed, so those grades are an F. Their school districts back up their teachers because so many parents seem to be pulling their kids out of school for a lot of days. Since there are so many times when school is out, many teachers don't feel missing school for a cruise is a viable option. Plus, you must realize, many school systems have very strict rules for absences, due to the No Child Left Behind Act. Schools are penalized when there are too many unexcused absences and many districts have very strict rules about how many unexcused absences are allowed in a school year---with that number not higher than 2. I know the school districts around here don't allow any unexcused absences for vacation, and warn the parents that their children will receive failing grades during the time they are gone from the classroom. What can you do? Talk to the teacher, but you probably won't get very far, if this is her policy. There's not much you can do, but I wouldn't ask the teachers to prepare her lessons ahead of time or ask for any special considerations because it sounds like you won't be getting much encouragement.

[Love2cruisegirl]

Nicki p100-

 

Two years ago, my husband & I came up on super airfare for visiting his brother in Hawaii. We had not been to visit in 2+ years and decided to take advantage of the good prices. I immediately approached my daughter's teacher (she was in Kind. and school would only have been in session about 3 weeks prior to trip)-explained we would be visiting cultural locations (not just doing the beach thing)-and arranged for all homework to be completed while gone. Also, I asked the teacher if my daughter could prepare a report detailing our trip (included pictures and a journal that my daughter wrote in daily while gone). I was proactive in speaking with her & voiced MY concerns about my daughter being out a week and then had my ideas ready to show her we had indeed thought about the educational side of our trip. It really worked out well...I know that this was for kindergarten & not for high school but the teacher said she appreciated our planning.

[Nicki_p100]

Thank-you for your reply Darcie. It is nice to hear from a teacher on this issue, and I do appreciate it.

The teacher did indeed say, "cancel your vacation". Her threat was any student absent for a vacation would fail the class:eek:. While she can't force me to cancel, she has my DD quite shaken up over the whole issue. She does well in school and has taken the teacher's comments to heart. She believes we should cancel the cruise, since the teacher said so. Can the teacher fail a student based on an absence, and not based on the academic work? It is one thing to give a zero for missed work, but to fail the class? Is that possible?

I do appreciate that it is disruptive to a lesson plan, which is why I did call ahead. It seems there is only one teacher with this issue in the school.

I can't loose the $1,500 in airfare; I don't know if we could afford to re-book if we did cancel. I think the issue is further complicated by a change in the schedule for the Christmas break this year. The dates for our board's break have been changed to start on Dec 26th, and extend a week longer into January.

 

I don't know what to do, we have planned and saved a long time for this vacation and now I have my DD crying she doesn't want to fail her class, but I can't get a refund on the airfare. I don't know how to approach the teacher— I agree she does not sound open to discussion. :(

[TrentS]

Oh I'd have a very serious, and most likely rather loud discussion with that "teacher"... And then I'd have my child put into another class!... It sounds to me like the teacher is a jealous B#%@$! :mad:

[eyzwdeshut]

Take the issue to the principle. See if it can be adjusted. Lots of parents take their kids out of school for vacations. I'm sure they don't get failed for that reason. If she's a good student she should be able to make up the work & make a good argument for missing the time.

[SWEETNLOW2005]

I can certainly understand the teacher point of view. But not to give your child her missed assignments is cruel. I think she is going over board. I would speak with the teacher and if we couldnt reach an agreement I would simply have my child taken out of her class. If she is such a good teacher WHY would she want any child to FAIL. That defeats her purpose as a teacher. My mother is a teacher and have students leave all the time and has no problem. She makes sure the parents have all the assigenment and any projects that are due during this time. You shouldnt have to explain anything to that teacher other than the fact your child will be out for xxx days due to family issues. This is your family personal life. Who can say what is right and what is wrong on anyone personal life issues. Kitty 9 you are wrong about schols being penalized . They have a count during the school year cant remember exactly what is called, and based on the number of students in attendence that day. This is how each school receive funding from the government. I can ask my mother the exact name for that day. Anyway do what you have to and dont cancel your cruise.

[DannyMac]

Its none of her business!!! I have 32 yrs. teaching/coaching and "said teacher" needs an attitude adjustment.

[canuckof5]

Ok, two things in the UK where my cousin is had to get WRITTEN permission from ther teacher and principal as YOU ARE NOT allowed to pull kids out of school with out permission..for ANY reason ..she could not book a vacation until she had that permission in writing, so there are schools that do not allow you to take kids out for any reason without permission...

 

 

Ok, we are pulling my kids out for 4 days b/4 Christmas and yes they will miss lots of work but they will have the Holidays to do the work.

 

I think you did a GREAT thing to make sure they had no exams...My dh always works Christmas Holidays so we are taking the kids out a bit early and will be flying home Christmas day...

 

I will say our kids are allowed to miss 10 days all year b/4 they are kicked out the class so the 4 days will count towards that...But we sign that agreement at the start of the year..

 

If you plan on getting the work from the teacher and run into trouble I would head up the rant chain and head to the Principal and then school board if need be...

 

good luck..and happy sailing ;)

[Polish Falcon]

#1 Get your hands on the school's Official Student Handbook...

#2 Read the vacation Policies...

#3 Write a Letter to the Principal - Noting something to the effect that out of the classroom experiences are important,

 

HERE IS THE "KEY PHRASE" THAT YOU MUST USE -

 

"MULTICULTURAL EXPERIENCE'S "!!!!!!!!!!****************************

 

You MUST use this Phrase!!

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

All Teachers Must Honor and Grant your child the opportunity to "Experience Multicultural Events Not Available In The Classroom".

[canuckof5]

The teacher did indeed say, "cancel your vacation". Her threat was any student absent for a vacation would fail the class:eek:.

:(

 

Ok, thats isn't right at all and I would speak to the principal..she can't fail the class over being away ...maybe this teacher needs to take a anti-bully class for herself...:mad:

 

If your dd is going to have problems with this teacher I would have her moved to another class....

 

But I would tell your dd it will be ok..give her a huge hug and I'm sure once people in charge hear of this things will be all ok...

 

Keep us posted..

sending you both hugs :)

[LMCruise]

I'm sorry, but I think this teacher is wrong. Yes, as a teacher he/she should discourage it, but ultimatly it is up to the parent to decide what is best for their child. Missing a week of school is not enough to totally change the way a high school student views academics. Good students will be good students, and poor students will be poor students.

 

A good student will prepare for this week and it will be a challenge much like an adult faces in the work force. I'm sorry, but there has NEVER been a time I went on vacation from work when I didn't have something that needed to be done. Did my job performance suffer? Perhaps momentarily, but the SANITY I gained from my time off made me all that much better in the long run. Work/school isn't EVERYTHING. We need a balanced life including socialization, cultural diversity, and time with our families. These are things travel can give us.

 

Yes, it would be better to schedule vacations around the school year. But in the real world this isn't always possible. When there are multiple members of a family sometimes a compromise is necessary.

 

I hate to say this for fear of being flamed, but in high school I missed the MAX amount of days allowed by law almost every semester. My parents had no problem with this, and yes, I was allowed to skip school and stay home when I didn't feel like going. By the time I was in high school, my parents knew exactly what I could handle.

 

It hurt me really bad.

 

So bad, in fact, that I graduated as valedictorian and had a full ride academic scholarship to the college of my choosing, where I also graduated first in my major. My sister graduated third in her high school class with a 99.8 GPA out of a 100. She now has her M.D.

 

Good parenting involves flexibility for the child. While teachers are just trying to prevent bad parents from being worse parents, a blanket rule doesn't always apply. We shouldn't keep perpetualizing "one bad apple spoils the bushel."

[sceptic]

It's quite common for unexcused absences (non-medical, etc.) to be treated more harshly than excused absences. For example, if a child in high school missed three days because of illness, the child would have three days after returning to school to make up any missed assignments and tests/quizzes would be made up generally before or after school. (This is from experience in three school districts in two states).

 

Unexcused absences, on the other hand, are different. The standard policy is that missed work is just that - missed. If there was a test, you got a 0.

 

All of this is in writing somewhere- either at the school or district offices (or on their website - check it!)

 

An individual teacher cannot treat your child more harshly than the district/school rules, but can (if the teacher chooses) give the child whatever sort of break she chooses. Makeup work, assignments ahead of time, etc. These are basically negotiable. However, the teacher is under NO obligation to do anything more for your child than the rules state. But if the teacher says that she will do more to your child (in terms of punishment) than the rules allow, she is wrong and subject to discipline.

 

Magic words like "multicultural experience" are meangingless in such matters - the teacher who is prone to give kids a break will smile with a wink and nod and okay it - but they'd have likely okay'd it anyway. Those that are tough numbers will shrug. Too d#mn bad.

 

BTW, the easiest teacher we had was our daughter's first grade teacher. We went to Hawaii for almost two weeks during school year. The teacher just said, "write a note that she sick - we get money from the district if it's excused." So upon return my note of excuse for missing two weeks of school was:

 

"Please excuse my daughter's absence. She wasn't feeling well. But now she's feeling better."

[Nicki_p100]

Wow, thank you everyone for your advice! I do feel better at least, after reading your posts. I don't want to cancel the cruise. I can't believe it is so difficult. :(

I am willing to make homework a part of the vacation, or to complete it before we depart. Even to offer to do extra homework, just as Love2cruisegirl mentioned in the form of a journal, or essay on the cultural experiences. I did not think I would find a "cancel or fail" attitude in the teacher.

 

Thank-you so much to everyone who has replied, for all the helpful advice. Talking to the teacher, and moving on up from there seems to be the thing to do. I love your advice SWEETNLOW2005, if it was for a shorter time (it is a week long cruise) I would consider just saying it is a family issue and she will not be in school. I do know 1 or 2 parents with kids in the school, so I will ask their input too.

I am off to read the "Official Student Handbook" to find the school policy on vacation time.

Keep your fingers crossed and please continue to post any thing that may be helpful in my future discussion with the teacher.

[nybumpkin]

Last year, our two oldest sons missed a total of 8 days of school when their grandfathers passed away - one in October (4 days) and one in February (4 days). Our district's attendance policy states that even if it is an excused absence, students are responsible to make up the missed work. Needless to say, given the circumstances our sons' teachers were very accommodating and provided as much as they could in advance; however, even though it was an excused absence, the kids were doing homework while the rest of the family was preparing for a funeral. Since DD is in high school, check to see whether the school has a "homework hotline" or posts homework assignments online. Our middle school and high school have these options. I realize it may be difficult to call in to a hotline while you're on a cruise, but it may give DD the opportunity to make up assignments in a timely manner. (At the high school level, the teacher isn't going to want to see alternative work, such as a journal of the student's travels - they want to see the assignments they gave.)

[love2vacation]

One of the best things we did was take our daughter on a cruise last year the week after her spring break. She was a senior in HS then. She learned so much on this trip as she had never been out of the US before this trip. She did her homework on the plane and on her spring break prior to leaving. The teachers just delt with it and seemed pleased at her good fortune.

 

Your daughter sounds like she is very conscientious about her school work and she is to be commended for wanting to follow her teacher's rules. Just an observation, but it sounds like this teacher might be a little burned out.

I agree that approaching it as a learning experience for your child can go a long way to making the absence easier for the teacher to tolerate. You didn't say what class this is, but maybe you can work our something "extra" for your daughter to work on and submit to the teacher that would relate to this particular class.

 

As a previous poster indicated, a teacher can run her classroom anyway she wants but hopefully you have a good principal who will back you up on this issue. Checking out the school district policy might be a good idea along with the school policy or handbook.

 

Good luck, and enjoy your cruise.

[HappyCampers3]

My son is in the 9th grade and we leave in three weeks for a family cruise. I spoke with the principal last year when we booked the cruise and he said it was fine and to send a trip slip in at the beginning of this school year and that he would remember and have no problem signing it. Sure enough, my son took the slip in the second day of school this year and he had it back within the hour, signed by the principal. He will miss six school days. My son has also talked with each of his teachers and they will each have a lesson plan prepared for him to do while he's gone. Seems all his teachers are ok with it. This is the second time we've taken him out of school for a cruise without any problems. With all the crap that goes on in school, why in the world would any teacher have a problem with a family spending quality time together?

[barbyma]

Not that you need any more advice (everyone's been so helpful!), but I just wanted to add that this teacher CANNOT grade your child, legally or morally, on ANYTHING except academic performance.

 

What she CAN do, however, is arrange it so that your daughter misses enough to affect her grade. My added advice is to make certain that, no matter what the teacher says, the principal knows exactly what your daughter was told and your stand on the matter so that he/she can be certain your daughter isn't jipped on her grade in the end.

[LMCruise]

With all the crap that goes on in school, why in the world would any teacher have a problem with a family spending quality time together?

 

Because some people want to control everything...BWAHHH HAAA HAAA HAAA!

 

If only more familes would spend quality time together, instead of allowing the school and its teachers to raise their children. Nothing against teachers, as I totally respect what they do and the impact they have on children's lives.

[SSSkipper]

Family spending quality time together.......priceless!! :)

 

I have taken my two children out of school for cruises and have never been given any problem by their teacher or principal. I am taking my daughter out of school for a ten day cruise next month. I will make sure she makes up all her work and she also has a tutor to help her. I am taking her to Bermuda and she will see where I lived for two years, when I was her age. I have wonderful memories of Bermuda as a child and now I get to share that with her....

 

Enjoy your cruise and enjoy all the family time you can, as one never knows when a loved one can be taken suddenly.

[myangel]

Another opinion.....

We own a restaurant in a tourist area in Florida, and have two teenged sons: one a senior and one a sophmore in high school. We have been taking our kids out of school a week in september (school starts here in early August) for about 4 years now. Our school district has a "family leave" policy that may be used for no longer than 5 days in a school year. We fill out a form, and the teachers sign it with the childs grade up to that point. they do make up any assignments missed during that week. I strongly believe that a week with your parents on a family vacation is much more of a "learning, bonding, quality time" experience than staying in school for that week and not going. We work very hard and we are blessed that we are able to close down our buisness for a week every year to have family time. I wouldn't trade these memories for anything!

[Chat Noir]

Wow...what subject is this in? We once lived in a school district that planned 3 'family days' in the school year. No questions asked. I can understand some concern if it is a class that the lesson builds upon each day, but that can be worked around. Otherwise, life if full of 'exceptions' and she should get over making a good student stress over something that will be not only fun, but educational.

[Tania]

I'm a teacher and strongly disagree with parents who take their children out of school for a beach vacation. There are many holidays for the family to choose from to have a "family" vacation. A vacation out of the country is a different matter as it will undoubtedly be educational and not playing on the beach.

 

Many of my students have been pulled out for vacations over the years. The worst situation was when children were pulled for a 2 week Florida vacation right AFTER the regular 2 week March break. These children were not the strongest of students and played catch up until June.

 

The decison however belongs to the parents' as they are ultimately responsible for their children's education. It is ridiculous for a teacher to make the statement that children will fail if they miss 5 days of school. My students always receive classwork that they will be missing whether the parents ask for it or not. Over the last 28 years, MOST of the work has returned INCOMPLETE!

[TropicalParadise]

my quick rationale for taking kids out of school for a trip:

 

If teachers can give students assignments over school vacation then I can take my child on vacation during school time.

[MrsPete]

I'm a high school teacher, and I'm not a big fan of students missing school for vacations. I'll throw out a few things to consider:

 

High school is not like elementary school. High school moves fast -- especially if you're in a block-scheduling school. The teacher has only 90 days to prepare the student for the state End-of-Course test, and if the students do badly, the teacher (and the school) looks bad. The school system puts a great deal of pressure on teachers to help their students to score well (school scores are compared in the newspaper, school-wide bonuses are awarded to top-scoring schools, and teachers whose students do poorly on a consistant basis can be fired).

 

While I think the teachers is coming on too hard, I understand where she's coming from. I understand perfectly. She knows that her test scores are likely to be better if her students are present every day. In her mind, you're asking her to risk her reputation as a teacher so you can go on vacation.

 

This situation is particularly bad for 9th graders (at least in my state) because almost all their classes culminate in state End-of-Course tests. Thus, they're the very ones who can afford to miss class the least.

 

When her senior year begins, colleges and scholarship agencies will see your daughter's transcript, and life choices will be made based upon her 9th, 10th, and 11th grade scores. They matter.

 

Is she interested in going out for sports, yearbook staff, etc. in future years? If so, the coach or advisor may well ask, "How many days of school did you miss last semester?" on an application. All other things being equal (and I know that things are never truely equal in real life), the kid who rarely misses a day will get the spot on the team. Why? Because the coach or advisor needs to know that he or she is recruiting kids who will be there all the time, and vacation absences are a red flag. Ditto for summer honors programs. At my school, kids who miss more than a certain number of days (for any reason) are not eligible for the senior class trip. Is she willing to make these sacrafices for this cruise?

 

How many days does your daughter typically miss in a school year? If she usually misses only 1-2 days, then you're probably all right. On the other hand, if she's the type who picks up strep throat every time it comes around, then the vacation absences may really put her over the top. At my school, any student who misses over 8 days in the 90-day semester must present his or her absences to an appeal board who considers WHY the student was out and determines whether to grant credit for the class. A student who just plain missed every Friday would probably be told to repeat the class; a student who had the flu for a week (with doctor's note) and who went out of state for a grandparent's funeral would probably be granted an appeal.

 

Here's my biggest gripe with students being out for vacations: The vast majority -- I'd say 90% -- DO NOT MAKE UP THE WORK THAT I PREPARE FOR THEM. It's infuriating to use my time after school to put together packets of material and never see them again. This happens even when parents call ahead of time, even when parents promise me that the work will be made up, even if I give the student additional time after the trip . . . the work just isn't made up . . . ever. And students miss class discussions, the teacher's detailed explanations -- these are things that can't really be made up.

 

In all honesty, I can say that EVERY student (even the honors students) I've ever had go on a vacation has suffered some loss of grade because of that missed time. Some of them have lost a few points, some have lost much more. Sure, students miss days because of sickness all the time, but that doesn't seem to have the same impact on the grades. It seems that students EXPECT that they should make up work after an illness, but they seem to view a vacation as TIME OFF.

 

Can the teacher fail a student (for the whole class) because she went on a one-week vacation? No. Class grades must be based upon the whole semester's work, not just one week. The teacher cannot be vindictive and target one student's grades because of a vacation. But she can make it difficult to make up the work, and she can give zeros for work missed, and she can say "read chapter 10 yourself" instead of offering to re-teaching the lessons; those things can certainly LOWER the class grade. If your daughter happens to have an A, then that might be an acceptable to you. But what if she is only earning a C or a D? There's not much room to drop, and right now in September it's hard to say just how well she's going to do in the class 80 days from now.

 

I wouldn't try to put the idea that a cruise is "multicultural" or educational. We all know that most kids will spend more time on the beach than they'll spend exploring the port's local museums. I think you'll lose points with the teacher if you try to make the cruise something that it isn't. Plus, the teacher is concerned with how her class will score on those End-of-course tests (remember, scores in the newspaper, principal calling her in to discuss her class' grades); she cares about your daughter learning HER CLASS MATERIAL, not the history of the Bahamas, regardless of how interesting that topic may be.

 

Should you go? I have no idea, but I think you should review your school's attendance policy and talk to the teacher. If you decide to go, make sure that all the work is made up IMMEDIATELY and expect some loss of grade (it's the "cost" of the trip).