Question regarding back to back Alaska cruises

[stretchcruz]

I'm sure that Heidi can answer this in a way that I can understand. When we were onboard the Orion we booked an Alaska cruise, Seward to Vancouver. I wanted to do back to back cruises....Vancouver to Seward, Seward to Vancouver or vice versa but she said that we couldn't do it. So I just booked one. Something to do with the Jones Act? Thanks!!

[Heidi13]

12 hours ago, stretchcruz said:

I'm sure that Heidi can answer this in a way that I can understand. When we were onboard the Orion we booked an Alaska cruise, Seward to Vancouver. I wanted to do back to back cruises....Vancouver to Seward, Seward to Vancouver or vice versa but she said that we couldn't do it. So I just booked one. Something to do with the Jones Act? Thanks!!

 

This is an interesting question, as the Canadian Coasting Trade Act isn't as cut & dried as the US equivalent, which is the Passenger Vessel Services Act. The Jones Act is the US Cabotage Laws for cargo. Viking recently came afoul of the Canadian Act on the Octantis, when pax booked B2B cruises, which meant embarkation and disembarkation in a Canadian Port, which is contrary to the Act.

 

A quick summary of the Canadian Act - it states no foreign flag ship may transport passengers between Canadian Ports, if a Canadian Flag vessel is available. The owner of the Foreign-Flag vessel needs to request approval of the Minister of Transport, who must promulgate the request to determine if any Canadian tonnage provides or can provide the service. In the absence of Canadian tonnage, requests are normally approved. I worked this coast for 30 years and we have no Canadian tonnage for this route.

 

R/T Alaska cruises have taken place on Foreign-Flag cruise ships out of Vancouver since the 1970's, as I worked the Island Princess and then Sun Princess Alaska seasons in '79 & '80. Other cruise lines also offer R/T cruises from Vancouver and we have booked at least 4 B2B Vancouver - Whittier - Vancouver cruises on Princess over the years.

 

However, I am not privy to whether the cruise lines get a blanket approval, or each has to request approval of the Minister. If each cruise line must apply, all Viking need have done is submit a timely request.

 

For B2B from Seward, this is a closed loop cruise from a US port, so the US PVSA applies. Provided the cruise visits Vancouver, it is in compliance with the Act.

 

Summary - while the B2B out of Vancouver should be OK, it is not a definite yes, you should have no problems with a B2B from Seward.

 

 

[Heidi13]

13 hours ago, stretchcruz said:

I'm sure that Heidi can answer this in a way that I can understand. When we were onboard the Orion we booked an Alaska cruise, Seward to Vancouver. I wanted to do back to back cruises....Vancouver to Seward, Seward to Vancouver or vice versa but she said that we couldn't do it. So I just booked one. Something to do with the Jones Act? Thanks!!

 

If you can't get it resolved, please provide an update and I will send a note to the office in Basle to get them involved.

[stretchcruz]

Heidi, thank you. Last night I sent an email to the onboard Viking cruise consultant who told me no, not possible. And she was very adamant about it. No answer from her as of yet. I haven’t yet gotten my TA involved since it was the onboard consultant who told me no. I'll let you know.

[chengkp75]

Andy;

 

As you say, many lines do the round trip Vancouver to Alaska cruises, so I don't think the Coasting Trade Act applies.  I believe the Coasting Trade Act allows for transport by foreign flag ship as long as there is a foreign port in the voyage (making it a foreign voyage, not coastwise)(and not requiring a "distant" foreign port like PVSA).  The problem with the Octantis, I believe is that the Great Lakes are considered differently in the CTA, or wasn't there a different embark and disembark port?  Looked it up, it was about B2B, Thunder Bay - Milwaukee, Milwaukee - Toronto.

[Heidi13]

4 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

Andy;

 

As you say, many lines do the round trip Vancouver to Alaska cruises, so I don't think the Coasting Trade Act applies.  I believe the Coasting Trade Act allows for transport by foreign flag ship as long as there is a foreign port in the voyage (making it a foreign voyage, not coastwise)(and not requiring a "distant" foreign port like PVSA).  The problem with the Octantis, I believe is that the Great Lakes are considered differently in the CTA, or wasn't there a different embark and disembark port?  Looked it up, it was about B2B, Thunder Bay - Milwaukee, Milwaukee - Toronto.

 

Chief - It wasn't one we used on the coast, so I haven't looked at the Act since completing Masters back in 84.

 

Just checked the definitions and they have different standards for cargo & pax. For cargo, even visiting a foreign port is still considered coastwise trade, but not with pax.

 

Canadian Coasting Trade Act 2, d, 1

Transporting pax back to the original port is only coastwise trade if you haven't visited a foreign port.

 

Therefore, the Coasting Trade Act is not applicable to passengers.

[chengkp75]

24 minutes ago, Heidi13 said:

 

Chief - It wasn't one we used on the coast, so I haven't looked at the Act since completing Masters back in 84.

 

Just checked the definitions and they have different standards for cargo & pax. For cargo, even visiting a foreign port is still considered coastwise trade, but not with pax.

 

Canadian Coasting Trade Act 2, d, 1

Transporting pax back to the original port is only coastwise trade if you haven't visited a foreign port.

 

Therefore, the Coasting Trade Act is not applicable to passengers.

Thanks, Andy;

 

Sounds just like the Jones Act, even going from loading Miami to Bahamas to discharge NYC, if the cargo wasn't offloaded in Bahamas, then it is coastwise transport.

 

Sat my Chief's in '81.  Us old farts know some stuff!

[stretchcruz]

Here's the answer I got today. Now I'll see if I can get the onboard discount if I book it. Thanks guys for your input.

 

Good morning!

 

I have gotten word that there was a new update that told us that it is now possible as it returns to the same port that you started in!!!

 

 

Warm Regards,

 

I Viking I Viking Orion I  Onboard Travel Consultant I (Viking Customer Service) 888.663.8454 - option 4 for Existing Reservations I  I viking.com  

 

 

If you are onboard the ship, please visit me in my office, located on deck 2 midship, in the Atrium to be assisted promptly.

If you are at home, you may also reach out to your travel agent or Viking customer service at 888.663.8454 and press 4 for existing reservation

[stretchcruz]

I emailed my TA this afternoon to see what they could do. Since I have the email from the onboard cruise consultant, and I think (and you think) that she made a mistake, probably based on what Viking told her, I'm hoping for the onboard discount, shipboard credit, and better payment schedule. As you both said, round trip cruises have been operating from Vancouver for years. So we are hoping to add Vancouver to Seward to Seward to Vancouver! She did reference the problem with the Expedition cruises and Canada, so perhaps things got convoluted. Fingers crossed.

[stretchcruz]

Update:

 

My TA contacted Viking. We booked the cruise and got the onboard booking benefits. So we are cruising Vancouver to Vancouver. Yay! Thanks for all of your input. You guys were right!

[Heidi13]

11 hours ago, stretchcruz said:

Update:

 

My TA contacted Viking. We booked the cruise and got the onboard booking benefits. So we are cruising Vancouver to Vancouver. Yay! Thanks for all of your input. You guys were right!

 

Congratulation, enjoy Alaska. This is how we also booked Alaska cruises, since Vancouver is our home port.

[deec]

Dobie...that will be a great vacation!!!

[stretchcruz]

Yes, I can't wait. 22 days. Never been to Alaska and we'll avoid the long trip from Seward!!