Question on when to get back to ship

[sparks1093]

9 hours ago, jsn55 said:

 

It means that you will have available (not necessarily carrying with you every minute) the travel documents you need to be on the cruise- if you are using a passport, your passport. If you are using birth certificate/government ID then those. If you are using a passport card then that. Now, it is possible on a closed loop cruise that a passenger might have more then one form of identity/citizenship. My DW and I both have Enhanced Drivers Licenses and we bring our passports with us, so if we lost our passports we would still be able to remain on the ship since we have another acceptable document. Here is what one cruise line has to say (bolded for emphasis):

 

Proper travel documentation and eligibility to travel is required at the embarkation and throughout the cruise. In addition to immigration and customs requirements, the U.S. government and others place restrictions on the carriage of Guests whose names appear on government watch lists or who are deemed legally ineligible to travel. It is the Guest’s sole responsibility to ensure his/her legal eligibility to travel and to bring and have available at all times all required travel documents. 

[jsn55]

9 hours ago, sparks1093 said:

It means that you will have available (not necessarily carrying with you every minute) the travel documents you need to be on the cruise- if you are using a passport, your passport. If you are using birth certificate/government ID then those. If you are using a passport card then that. Now, it is possible on a closed loop cruise that a passenger might have more then one form of identity/citizenship. My DW and I both have Enhanced Drivers Licenses and we bring our passports with us, so if we lost our passports we would still be able to remain on the ship since we have another acceptable document. Here is what one cruise line has to say (bolded for emphasis):

 

Proper travel documentation and eligibility to travel is required at the embarkation and throughout the cruise. In addition to immigration and customs requirements, the U.S. government and others place restrictions on the carriage of Guests whose names appear on government watch lists or who are deemed legally ineligible to travel. It is the Guest’s sole responsibility to ensure his/her legal eligibility to travel and to bring and have available at all times all required travel documents. 

Um ... OK, if I boarded with certain documents, I will definitely have them with me on the cruise.  I would assume anyone knows that you bring your room key and ID when you venture off the ship.  

[sparks1093]

30 minutes ago, jsn55 said:

Um ... OK, if I boarded with certain documents, I will definitely have them with me on the cruise.  I would assume anyone knows that you bring your room key and ID when you venture off the ship.  

Someone said that they took their passport off the ship with them and if it got lost or stolen they would sort it out once they got back aboard. I was pointing out that it may not be as simple as that since once the ship finds out that your travel docs are gone they will disembark you.

[K32682]

16 hours ago, sparks1093 said:

Someone said that they took their passport off the ship with them and if it got lost or stolen they would sort it out once they got back aboard. I was pointing out that it may not be as simple as that since once the ship finds out that your travel docs are gone they will disembark you.

 

What you are saying is that if your passport is stolen a cruise line will toss you off the boat in a foreign country without travel documents despite you having your cruise card, other identification and a copy of your passport in your cabin safe and/or on your phone? I am quite confident that won't happen.

 

If you don't want to carry your passport then don't. 

 

  

Edited December 26, 2022 by K32682

[sparks1093]

19 minutes ago, K32682 said:

 

What you are saying is that if your passport is stolen a cruise line will toss you off the boat in a foreign country without travel documents despite you having your cruise card, other identification and a copy of your passport in your cabin safe and/or on your phone? I am quite confident that won't happen.

 

If you don't want to carry your passport then don't. 

 

  

I have read of that exact thing happening. The law of every country that I'm aware of has a requirement that all providers of travel ensure that passengers have the correct travel documents available and if they don't then they cannot transport the traveler, barring any exceptions. In the case I read of it happened in Europe and the passengers were put ashore after their passports were stolen. You can be as confident as you like and if you won't even factor any of this into your decision that's fine, what you do has no impact on me. I'm just sharing information. (And the cruise line won't desert you, the port agent is there for this and would assist you in getting you either back to the ship or home, as need be.)

Edited December 26, 2022 by sparks1093

[K32682]

2 hours ago, sparks1093 said:

I have read of that exact thing happening. The law of every country that I'm aware of has a requirement that all providers of travel ensure that passengers have the correct travel documents available and if they don't then they cannot transport the traveler, barring any exceptions. In the case I read of it happened in Europe and the passengers were put ashore after their passports were stolen. You can be as confident as you like and if you won't even factor any of this into your decision that's fine, what you do has no impact on me. I'm just sharing information. (And the cruise line won't desert you, the port agent is there for this and would assist you in getting you either back to the ship or home, as need be.)

 

What you said was "will" meaning all cruise ships will drop you in a port without documents if you lose your passport. Can you please provide a link to a story where this actually happened? 

[sparks1093]

40 minutes ago, K32682 said:

 

What you said was "will" meaning all cruise ships will drop you in a port without documents if you lose your passport. Can you please provide a link to a story where this actually happened? 

Actually I said "will likely" and based on the contract language that I quoted I expect in most cases that would be the most likely outcome. The story was posted on CC several years ago and I don't have a link. As I said, I am simply sharing information. 

[Z'Loth]

Unless told otherwise, once you board the ship, you put your passport in the ship safe and carry a scan of your passport front page on your mobile device. If something goes wrong, an authorized person from the ship will open your safe and grab the passport to provide to the port agent. 

[K32682]

22 hours ago, sparks1093 said:

Actually I said "will likely" and based on the contract language that I quoted I expect in most cases that would be the most likely outcome. The story was posted on CC several years ago and I don't have a link. As I said, I am simply sharing information. 

 

The contract language does not specify what happens if you lose your travel documentation during the cruise only what is required to get on it. Even if your unconfirmed tale of passengers being thrown of cruise ships and abandoned for having lost their passports has a shred of validity there is no obligation to inform the crew that you've lost your official documents. Don't ask, don't tell and sort it out when you get to your final port.  

[sparks1093]

38 minutes ago, K32682 said:

 

The contract language does not specify what happens if you lose your travel documentation during the cruise only what is required to get on it. Even if your unconfirmed tale of passengers being thrown of cruise ships and abandoned for having lost their passports has a shred of validity there is no obligation to inform the crew that you've lost your official documents. Don't ask, don't tell and sort it out when you get to your final port.  

You are free to read the contract language as you like, but I'm pretty certain that there is a line in it somewhere that says "failure to observe these terms and conditions can result in disembarkation" or words to that affect. I also suspect that if someone were to not report the loss of travel documentation to the cruise line that there are two likely outcomes (the first being much more likely than the second)- 1) the passenger would need to be cleared in secondary inspection by CBP at disembarkation and 2) the passenger would be put on a no sail list by the cruise line for not complying with the contract and possibly subjecting them to fines and sanctions. And once more, I am simply sharing information. If you don't want to consider it then don't. The odds still remain in your favor anyway.

[sparks1093]

1 hour ago, K32682 said:

 

The contract language does not specify what happens if you lose your travel documentation during the cruise only what is required to get on it. Even if your unconfirmed tale of passengers being thrown of cruise ships and abandoned for having lost their passports has a shred of validity there is no obligation to inform the crew that you've lost your official documents. Don't ask, don't tell and sort it out when you get to your final port.  

Since it's a slow day due to the holidays I searched and found this. For what it's worth, of course and again, in the spirit of sharing information: Lost Passport While Traveling? It Doesn’t Have to Completely Ruin a Vacation (travelmarketreport.com)

 

[K32682]

6 hours ago, sparks1093 said:

Since it's a slow day due to the holidays I searched and found this. For what it's worth, of course and again, in the spirit of sharing information: Lost Passport While Traveling? It Doesn’t Have to Completely Ruin a Vacation (travelmarketreport.com)

 

 

Your article notes that it wasn't the cruise line or its contract that prevented the couple from returning to the ship but the Italian authorities and the lack of a second photo ID. Had they not reported the loss to the Italian police and instead returned to the ship without informing the crew or had a second photo ID they might not have had an issue.  

 

Here's another version of the story with some additional details most notably it was the cruise line who told them to bring their passports with them while onshore. 

 

 https://www.thesun.co.uk/travel/9462981/regent-seven-seas-cruise-kicked-off-stolen-passport/

 

Furthermore, any dunderhead who leaves his passport in a bag under a seat in a restaurant when he goes to the toilet gets is perhaps too dense to be travelling beyond his own borders. 

 

 

Edited December 27, 2022 by K32682

[sparks1093]

12 hours ago, K32682 said:

 

Your article notes that it wasn't the cruise line or its contract that prevented the couple from returning to the ship but the Italian authorities and the lack of a second photo ID. Had they not reported the loss to the Italian police and instead returned to the ship without informing the crew or had a second photo ID they might not have had an issue.  

 

Here's another version of the story with some additional details most notably it was the cruise line who told them to bring their passports with them while onshore. 

 

 https://www.thesun.co.uk/travel/9462981/regent-seven-seas-cruise-kicked-off-stolen-passport/

 

Furthermore, any dunderhead who leaves his passport in a bag under a seat in a restaurant when he goes to the toilet gets is perhaps too dense to be travelling beyond his own borders. 

 

 

Yes, of course the laws of Italy pertain, the cruise lines make that clear in the contract- they are required by law(s) to ensure that all passengers have the proper travel documents available throughout the trip and it makes absolute sense they will cite the law over their contract. They would rely on the contract should the dunderhead in question attempt to sue them for leaving them behind.

 

Let me ask you this. What happens if a passenger loses their passport while on a flight to another country? They are usually put on a plane returning to their home country immediately. A simple google search will show you that. The same thing pertains to losing one's passport while on a cruise. The cruise line, by a multitude of laws, cannot continue to carry you as a passenger without the proper travel documents. I don't know how other Consulates work but I'm fairly certain that if you show up at a US Embassy/Consulate to get a replacement passport they are going to want to see a police report if you say it was stolen. Having secondary ID won't cut it, except in the case of a closed loop cruise as I mentioned. If you need a passport to be on the ship then you can have 10 other IDs and it won't mean a thing. I've already discussed the likely outcome of hiding this fact from both the authorities and from the cruise line, it is definitely not something that I would recommend.

 

Again, you can interpret all of this as you wish, the only reason I'm even responding is because others are also reading this and they deserve to see both sides of the debate. The risk of losing your passport while in port is low and that means the risk of this happening is also low. The risk is also low of missing the ship for most people. But if one misses the ship with their passport onboard they still know where their passport is, even if the crew doesn't retrieve it and give it to the port agent. The ship can overnight it from the next port in a worse case scenario. If a passport is lost you at the minimum are going to need to pay to replace it and at the worst you will be left behind in port. The port agent will assist you in getting home in any case.

[K32682]

3 hours ago, sparks1093 said:

Yes, of course the laws of Italy pertain, the cruise lines make that clear in the contract- they are required by law(s) to ensure that all passengers have the proper travel documents available throughout the trip and it makes absolute sense they will cite the law over their contract. They would rely on the contract should the dunderhead in question attempt to sue them for leaving them behind.

 

Let me ask you this. What happens if a passenger loses their passport while on a flight to another country? They are usually put on a plane returning to their home country immediately. A simple google search will show you that. The same thing pertains to losing one's passport while on a cruise. The cruise line, by a multitude of laws, cannot continue to carry you as a passenger without the proper travel documents. I don't know how other Consulates work but I'm fairly certain that if you show up at a US Embassy/Consulate to get a replacement passport they are going to want to see a police report if you say it was stolen. Having secondary ID won't cut it, except in the case of a closed loop cruise as I mentioned. If you need a passport to be on the ship then you can have 10 other IDs and it won't mean a thing. I've already discussed the likely outcome of hiding this fact from both the authorities and from the cruise line, it is definitely not something that I would recommend.

 

Again, you can interpret all of this as you wish, the only reason I'm even responding is because others are also reading this and they deserve to see both sides of the debate. The risk of losing your passport while in port is low and that means the risk of this happening is also low. The risk is also low of missing the ship for most people. But if one misses the ship with their passport onboard they still know where their passport is, even if the crew doesn't retrieve it and give it to the port agent. The ship can overnight it from the next port in a worse case scenario. If a passport is lost you at the minimum are going to need to pay to replace it and at the worst you will be left behind in port. The port agent will assist you in getting home in any case.

 

Neither the Canadian or American governments require a police report. Canada treats lost and stolen passports the same.

https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/canadian-passports/security/lost-stolen-inaccessible-damaged-found.html

 

The American government wants to see a police report only if the theft was reported and the report is available. There is no requirement to do so.

https://eforms.state.gov/Forms/ds64.pdf

 

The contention you'll be thrown off the boat if your passport is stolen seems more like grasping for another fanciful excuse to not carry a passport ashore instead of a valid reason. In any event there is no obligation to report to the crew and you can sort the matter out once onboard which might be preferable depending on your location.  

 

What this boils down to is whether you have sufficient confidence in yourself to securely carry your documents or are so frightened at the prospect of losing your passport that you are prepared to rely entirely on the crew if you miss the boat. The crew is under no obligation to leave your documents with the port agent and may not if the captain decides an immediate sailing is required.

[sparks1093]

38 minutes ago, K32682 said:

 

Neither the Canadian or American governments require a police report. Canada treats lost and stolen passports the same.

https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/canadian-passports/security/lost-stolen-inaccessible-damaged-found.html

 

The American government wants to see a police report only if the theft was reported and the report is available. There is no requirement to do so.

https://eforms.state.gov/Forms/ds64.pdf

 

The contention you'll be thrown off the boat if your passport is stolen seems more like grasping for another fanciful excuse to not carry a passport ashore instead of a valid reason. In any event there is no obligation to report to the crew and you can sort the matter out once onboard which might be preferable depending on your location.  

 

What this boils down to is whether you have sufficient confidence in yourself to securely carry your documents or are so frightened at the prospect of losing your passport that you are prepared to rely entirely on the crew if you miss the boat. The crew is under no obligation to leave your documents with the port agent and may not if the captain decides an immediate sailing is required.

I sincerely do hope that you never find out first hand, but as I've said the risk is a low one either way. 

[ldubs]

Keep checking back to see if we have exhausted all the "what ifs".   😀

 

I asked Mrs Ldubs.  Apparently sometimes we take PP's ashore and sometimes we don't.   I'm OK with that.  

[wcook]

On 12/15/2022 at 9:28 AM, sparks1093 said:

where the OP was at Senor Frogs

I suspect Señor Frog is responsible for more pier runners than broken down tour vans. 

Edited January 2, 2023 by wcook

[calweiss]

We just returned and had a great time.

On our trip there was a family (not ours as I listened to all of you) that thought the ship would wait for them as they did not call and just assumed they would wait🤔-When they returned the plank was almost up and their passports were left with Immigration.

Thankfully they were let on but they had to beg for them to stop. Unless it is a cruise excursion it is safe to just be on time as they do not wait