Need help in scheduling flights with awards

Hi everyone,

I am new to Cruise Air board and new to using points. I have been reading a lot of blogs lately and have trouble understanding what they are saying. Nevertheless, I am trying to use points to fly to Sydney next year for a cruise that finishes in Auckland. We'd like to stop somewhere in between. I have thought of Hawaii, Cook Islands and Fiji. I think that I am having trouble figuring it all out...like what airlines fly into those places. I have United miles

(about 315,000) so it would have to be a Star Alliance member but I am just lost trying to figure out a routing and where would be good, and not too expensive, to stop.

Can anyone give me direction on to how to figure all this out?

Jane

You can do award searches here:

http://www.united.com/web/en-US/apps/booking/flight/searchAward.aspx

Rules for award routing here:

http://www.united.com/web/en-US/content/mileageplus/awards/travel/types.aspx

You can have one stopover per roundtrip, and two open jaws are permitted for each roundtrip, so US-SYD, AKL-US is allowed.

You often see availability for this routing on UA, NZ, SQ, CA, and TG.

Some of these routings have an overnight stop in Singapore, Bangkok, Beijing, etc. Do you want just an overnight stop, or longer?

You need to decide on your dates, and where you'd like to stop before you really can start searching. Choose the "multi destination" option to start your search.

You can do award searches here:

 

http://www.united.com/web/en-US/apps/booking/flight/searchAward.aspx

 

Rules for award routing here:

 

http://www.united.com/web/en-US/content/mileageplus/awards/travel/types.aspx

 

You can have one stopover per roundtrip, and two open jaws are permitted for each roundtrip, so US-SYD, AKL-US is allowed.

 

You often see availability for this routing on UA, NZ, SQ, CA, and TG.

 

Some of these routings have an overnight stop in Singapore, Bangkok, Beijing, etc. Do you want just an overnight stop, or longer?

 

You need to decide on your dates, and where you'd like to stop before you really can start searching. Choose the "multi destination" option to start your search.

Remember to be creative in routings. While not immediately apparent, routing via Canada doesn't add much to the distance, and and Air NZ have YVR-AKL and Air Canada fly YVR-SYD

I would like to stay a few days in whatever locale we choose. I am not adverse to be creative, in fact, I love creativity.

I have been on the UAL website, the NZ websites. I even went on the Singapore Airline site but I balked a little at flying from IAD to London to Singapore to Sydney. I think it was about a 48 hours trip.

I did consider flying into Fiji and then back to LAX and then IAD but I would have had to fly in Air Pacific (or something like that) and that airline had horrible reviews.

What's your suggestion for my trip?

What's your suggestion for my trip?

Since you have been to the airline websites, you should have (or can get) familiarity with the route map/structure for the various Star Alliance airlines and how their Pacific services are arranged. Look at the various hubs, then at some of the minor spoke cities that could be used for stopovers/connections without backtracking (often a no-no for routings).

Now, make a list. Yes, put it down on paper and rank them in order of desirability. Would you rather spend time in Singapore or Bangkok? Tokyo or Honolulu? Los Angeles or San Francisco? This is YOUR trip....what do YOU want to do? Now also figure how much time (min/max) that you would want to spend in SYD and AKL on the two ends of your cruise.

After you get some feel for your desires, then comes the tough part. Reconciling the two big elephants in the room. One is your need to fly on specific (or nearby) dates to/from a specific cruise. Right there, you have thrown a big spanner into the works. Specific date and city award seats are the toughest thing to find. Then comes your desire for a stopover on the way. You may find the two goals to be incompatible. Or that one or the other has to budge.

Also note that flights from the USA to Australia/NZ are some of the toughest awards to come by (along with to South Africa). You may very well have to just take what is available. You may also have to travel on separate dates -- Mrs FT and I will be on an award itinerary next winter that has us on the same flights but one day apart. Why? Because there wasn't partner availability for two seats on the same day. So we will meet up at the destination. Are you that flexible? Would you consider that? Questions you may need to answer. Same with that routing through Europe. If that was the only thing available, would you book it?

I pose all of these questions because you may very well need to make quick decisions if you find award inventory. Seats may not last for you to take days (or hours, perhaps minutes) to decide what you are willing to take, and willing to experience. Know in advance what is your minimum, desired and optimal booking.

Is this the simple solution you are probably looking for? Nope. Is it giving you the lay of the land so you can go forward? I hope so.

Finally, remember that you can use the 24 hour connection rule for all international itineraries, so you can maximize connections into virtual stopovers. (FYI, there is a difference. International stopover means, in simple terms, a break in travel of more than 24 hours. International connection is a change of flights within 24 hours).

We have had a terrrible time trying to use miles back from Auckland to USA. We will be traveling the end of Dec. We got our flight to Bangkok with no difficulty at all. I have some time yet, but I'm beginning to believe we will be paying big bucks to get home from our cruise. Good luck

When all else fails, telephone your airline to get help with the bookings. Yes, they likely will charge you for doing so, but it can be worth it.

I had a mess of a booking I wanted to make using AA miles and gave up and telephoned AA. Problem solved in a few minutes. I have a lot of experience using airline miles, but this trip was too complicated for me to work out in a reasonable amount of time.

Very glad I called (and paid) to get help from AA.

Another good site that will give you airline routing ideas and information:

http://www.staralliance.com/en/

Just remember, you can search other airline's webpages all you want (AC, SQ, etc) but just because you see award availability there, doesn't mean it's open for you using your UA miles.

Air Pacific is not a *A airline. It's not even a UA partner, so you can't use your UA miles to book flights on Air Pacific.

I have been calling UA and after waiting for an hour on several occasions, they say nothing is available. in fact there is only one date open in late January, I'll keep trying cause the tickets are about $1700 economy class, per ticket.

I have been calling UA and after waiting for an hour on several occasions, they say nothing is available. in fact there is only one date open in late January, I'll keep trying cause the tickets are about $1700 economy class, per ticket.

Both you and the OP need to get REAL creative to get award seats. A subscription to Expertflyer is your friend ($5.00 per month for the generic version, $10 for the full blown version) AND it will take you some research to figure out how to work the program. But you won't be without it once you figure out how to snag those elusive award tickets in the future.

You MAY (most likely) be flying the LONG WAY around. It comes down to saving about $3400 or taking some extra time and maybe a couple of plane changes and going someplace that may be out of you comfort zone.

You most likely can get tickets from NZ to Bangkok, Hong Kong or Beijing, THEN fly home. You may even have opportunities to fly through the Middle East. I can see award tickets from Auckland to Kuwait City on Air New Zealand, then UA from Kuwait City to Washington DC. Getting home to Florida, even if you had to buy the ticket, is very cheap in the scheme of things. You will have to spend the night to make the connection but I can recommend some very nice hotels at decent prices.

NO BOOZE in Kuwait but something you may never see again. The Freedom Tower in Kuwait City makes you darn proud of being an American. It was built as a monument for the help we gave the Kuwaiti's in 1991. I have a picture that hangs in a very prominent spot in my living room done by a Kuwaiti artist (there are copies to be found). Bedouin sitting on his camel watching the American tanks run the Iraqi tanks out of Kuwait. I get a lump in my throat every time I look at it. As a general rule, the Kuwaitis LOVE Americans. The shopping centers are as luxurious (if not more so) than those in Dubai. And it is one of the more moderate countries in the Middle East. Visa on arrival at the airport-takes about 1/2 hour and $18.00.

I can currently see the same scenario on Thai through BKK-Auckland to Bangkok, then home to the USA.

Just got to be a little creative. Nonstop Australia/New Zealand to the USA is very often hard to come by.

To the OP, There are plenty of saver award seats available. I am assuming you are talking about your cruise 02/06/13 to 02/20/13. I don't know your home airport because you didn't list it, so I did a search departing and returning to IAD.

I found 11 flight combinations with 40,000 award seats leaving 02/03/13 (IAD-SYD). I found 10 flight combinations for saver seats returning on 02/21/13. And, even changing the dates a few days before and after the ones I chose, show many other possibilities.

What is your departure and returning airport and exactly what dates do you want to travel?

Have you tried doing an award search on UA yourself? You don't need an agent to start. Simply choose the "multi-destination" option.

yenta - as you don't list your dates or departure/arrival airport, can't offer many suggestions. It does appear your cruise is over December 28? That's a very, very difficult time to find award tickets to/from NZ (if that's where your cruise ends). I see two standard award tickets from AKL-FLL for those dates at 80,000 miles each. If you can fly AKL-PBI I see two saver award tickets for Dec 28, at 40,000 miles each. Go to UA's webpage and do a search.

Thanks again for the help. Again, I have no problem being creative, it's just the learning curve that I am having trouble with. Once I figure out where to go, I can always go to UAL and have them help me out, for a fee of course!

Here's my question of the day: what am I doing wrong. I am trying to go to the Thai Airline website - http://www.thaiairways.com/ - that I got from the Star Alliance site. For departure, I do not see Washington DC (IAD). Do they not fly from the US?

Second question: can I mix and match. For example (and I am using these airports for illustration only): Can I fly UAL to LAX and then fly NZ to Sydney. Can I then fly from Auckland on Thai to Bangkok and then another airline home to DC?

Here's my question of the day: what am I doing wrong. I am trying to go to the Thai Airline website - http://www.thaiairways.com/ - that I got from the Star Alliance site. For departure, I do not see Washington DC (IAD). Do they not fly from the US?

Yes, they fly from the US, just not from IAD. They fly from LAX.

Second question: can I mix and match. For example (and I am using these airports for illustration only): Can I fly UAL to LAX and then fly NZ to Sydney. Can I then fly from Auckland on Thai to Bangkok and then another airline home to DC?

Yes, if you can find available award tickets, and the routing follows award ticket rules. Circle trips are not permitted; for example, you cannot fly from San Francisco to Hong Kong, to Auckland and back to San Francisco. You cannot backtrack. You have to be within the maximum permitted mileage, within a valid, published routing.

Lots of info here:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/united-mileageplus-consolidated/1328581-can-you-not-cross-both-oceans-roundtrip-asia-award.html

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/united-mileageplus-consolidated/1323049-can-i-do-surface-sector-round-trip-award-ticket.html

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/united-mileage-plus-pre-merger/1182682-change-award-routing-rules-effective-11-feb-2011-a.html

Yes, IAD is my home airport thought there are many around that are a little closer that I could fly (CHO, RIC, BWI, SHD). We can even fly out of Detroit (DTW) because we usually visit family in January. We'd like to leave the end of January to give us some time in Sydney prior and also if we have having a great stopover before Sydney (like Fiji, Bangkok, Singapore, Bali, or Hawaii). We can also do the same on the return if it doesn't work out on the front end. We'd like to leave Auckland around the 24th. Still, we are flexible.

I do appreciate you looking and seeing that there are seats available. I think it would be cool to go to Kuwait or some of the cities I listed above.

I am certainly spending a lot of time on the computer but I fear I might be wheel spinning not knowing exactly what I am looking for - but it is an education.

Forgive me for asking but how are you able to see "award seats"? Is there some software I should get that would help me?

Thanks again, I DO appreciate it.

Jane

janeschwalm@gmail.com

Since you are in "research mode" you might enjoy reading Gary Leff's blog re: award tickets to Australia & NZ.

With a bunch of miles in your account, it is tempting to dream about a trip to exotic destinations as you make your way to Sydney. However, you may not be able to put together your "dream trip" - you may very well have to take whatever award itinerary you can find.

One way to search for award itineraries is to visit the United website and select the "Award Travel" button when it asks if you want to search by "Price", "Schedule" or "award travel". I doubt there is much for you to gain by checking the web sites of Thai or Singapore. The ANA airlines web site is useful but you have to join their FF program to use it and there is a steep learning curve involved; you might want to stick to the United site.

When looking for an award, you have to be creative, as you seem to be aware. Creativity means not limiting your search to flights from IAD to SYD. Search for the long-haul flights first: LAX, SFO, HNL, YVR to SYD, for example, then find a way to get to the gateway city from IAD. You will have to construct your intinerary leg-by-leg; the customer service rep you speak to may not be able and willing to do an exhaustive search.

If you're willing to pay (>$100 per ticket) you can retain a search firm to find you award tickets.

I doubt there is much for you to gain by checking the web sites of Thai or Singapore.

Agree, except perhaps if you want to see what routing they offer. You won't be able to find award tickets using UA miles by looking at their webpage.

The ANA airlines web site is useful but you have to join their FF program to use it and there is a steep learning curve involved; you might want to stick to the United site.

Do you think so? I think it's pretty easy to use for basic searches. I use it all the time. Joining their FF program takes about five minutes.

Agree that the long haul flights are the most difficult to find, and often, you have to piece together your trip, leg by leg.

OP currently has many choices of award flights for her dates and basic routing. IMO, she should decide where she wants to stop on this trip and just pay the $25 fee to UA to discuss this with an agent, because it can be really time consuming. You have to learn the basic award ticket rules (allowable routing, etc.) and then try and find what you want.

OP - there are other programs you can use (KVS, expertflyer) but you have to put the time in to learn how to use them.

6rugrats,

I am happy to put the time in and learn from it. I just don't know some of the technical terms (like allowable routing) so I feel stymied by it. I WANT to learn so when I talk to a UAL rep, I'll be knowledgeable enough to know what should be happening and what shouldn't be. I don't want anyone to pull the wool over my eyes.

Can you piece together a trip with different airlines combined? I'm guessing you can. I know that I am allowed a stopover on each leg but other than that is it just changing planes? I tried going on NZ today and the message just came up that it was too complicated and I needed to contact an agent.

I know I am repeating me, but thank you for all the pointers. I have been reading a number of blogs and trying to educate myself so I don't sound too dumb and that I can understand your responses.

Jane

janeschwalm@gmail.com

Yes, you can use different airlines, if you can find the seats. When you think you've figured out what you would like, advise you to join Flyertalk.com and go to this forum:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/united-mileageplus-consolidated-681/

There are posters there who know everything about booking award tickets and who will search for availability for you, especially if you ask nicely.

Thank you again for all your suggestions and help. You and the others are an invaluable resource for this board. Happy Travels

Jane

Good luck! When you book something, come back and post what you found. Don't forget to use flyertalk.com as a resource. People on the UA forum are a little grumpy due to the merger right now, but there are some very, very helpful posters there.

A big Thanks for the help. I just got off of the phone with United, after 2 1/2 hours, but I was successful. We are flying Auk to NRT to EWR to Orlando where we will get a good nights sleep and rent a car and drive home the following day.

A big Thanks for the help. I just got off of the phone with United, after 2 1/2 hours, but I was successful. We are flying Auk to NRT to EWR to Orlando where we will get a good nights sleep and rent a car and drive home the following day.

Congratulations! (Although hoo, boy... what a trip..)

Just for the nitpicking record, AUK is Alakanuk, Alaska, an Eskimo village on the lower Yukon River (been there.) Auckland NZ is AKL.

Just for the nitpicking record, AUK is Alakanuk, Alaska, an Eskimo village on the lower Yukon River (been there)

As Kipling wrote: "You're a better man than I am, Gunga Din!" (though I have made it to Dutch).

Wanted to update everyone and let you know that I was able to snag award flights to Sydney and home from Auckland. We are flying from IAD to SFO on United business class. From SFO to Seoul on Asiana, again on Business Class. Two hours after we arrive, we have a change of planes and continue over night to Sydney on Asiana again on Business Class. We were not so lucky snagging business on our way home from Auckland. We are in economy to LAX on Air New Zealand. Then economy from LAX to IAD on economy again. I would rather arrive refreshed in Sydney and tired when I arrived home than the reverse.

Thanks for all your suggestions and help.

If you have enough miles left to book business on the return, keep looking. You never know when availability will pop up. If it does, you can always change your ticket.