Cap_D

I see someone else posted recently. Please use that thread. Thanks. https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2978163-celebrity-molester/

The perp admitted it to the FBI agent. And, Celebrity does not deny it.

This story has been in the news. https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/cruises/2023/12/06/celebrity-cruise-crew-member-molested-children/71825427007/ "A Celebrity Cruises crew member admitted to molesting children at the youth center on board its Celebrity Silhouette ship, the Federal Bureau of Investigation said."

On Apex we had terrific service at Luminae with Arturro, and Yuksel as the MD in March.

FYI. https://creative.rccl.com/Sales/Celebrity/Deployment/CEL_2025_26_Itinerary_Reference_Guide.pdf

FYI. I believe the Caribbean for 25/26 was just released. Edge class pricing seems to come out to the same as the XCel pricing from November, or a bit higher due. My comparison didn't take into account port differences, and others variables, but just the per day cost of a SS after the discounts. 2025 Easter is on April 2025, although I think the Apex departs on its TA the week earlier (don't hold me to that). I've not looked, but I assume the week before Thanksgiving, the first week of December, and second week of January could be a bit lower as those seem to be when warm weather vacations that predominately North Americans (e.g., cruises, Orlando parks, etc.) are less busy. And, of note, there's plans to home port Edge class ships at Port Canaveral (no where near Orlando airport, IMO) and Miami, in addition to FLL. I'm not sure who goes to Orlando parks, drives an hour, and then would do a week on a ship, but suppose that's the thinking overall at RCCL. Suppose Miami is better for passengers arriving from outside the U.S. locations. In any event, all the ships seem to make up their time and still get to the same collection of ports in Caribbean and Bahamas. And, fwiw, the holiday weeks when school children are out do not include stops at CocoCay (presumably due to capacity with RCL getting priority). Another general observation, with XCel on the calendar, what's out now seems to reflect the full extent of Celebrity's fleet for at least a few years until / if they have another class of ships at the end of the decade. So, one can see the patterns, where they want the Edge class ships, and how they use the older (or much older) ships.

Ditto. And, FWIW, the PDF of the final invoice is emailed usually between 10:30 to Noon after embarkation when one may be on a plane, focused on what was missed, and so on. It's easy to not want to click on the document. And, with OBC on the decline, there's a greater chance the errant charge will be to the card on file, and not even from any excess OBC.

Also, when ordering or accepting food at Eden or any venue it can be necessary to clarify what is being provided. Waiters will sometimes bring extra food, another entree, etc. I have not read of charges tied to food that has been brought to the table with the appearance of it being provided as included or gratis, but it would not surprise me to see it. And, specialty dining means someone is paying twice already.

In other news, new deployment dates will be released tomorrow. Hopefully they remember to include the Caribbean and proof the dates. A presentation that I heard indicated they had a glitch and needed an additional day or otherwise the announcement would have been today.

While I understand this has been cleared up.. I was surprised no one wrote "You won't go thirsty"....

Unreal. The amount of sloppiness at Celebrity is no way to run a business. There is no quality control.

I forget if one can do a three person booking for Aqua, and the answer may be no. But, if you can determine the difference between the total for 2 person booking and 3 person booking, after the discounting is done, in the same room/class that will give you a rough approximation of the non-room related costs, of which some is the dedicated restaurant and whatever WiFi and drink package, if any, is bundled. Then you can take the number of days, and then come up with some way to account for breakfast and dinner. This may work better for Retreat; and may be able to be done for a non -Aqua or Retreat room to determine the value of the MDR and other non room specific costs (Seems to be about $96 - $140, when pricing a 2 person and 3 person in non-Aqua on November 30, 2025 Xcel, porthole seems to be higher for 3rd person compared to 3rd person in concierge class room). Of course, resort menus for the costs of full breakfasts, dinner items, drinks, etc. are easily found for a relative comparison. As noted above, there may be an almost priceless value to the maitre'd and waitstaff regardless of the Blu menu and ingredient mix.

Jim or anyone, did I miss the update on the spontaneous toilet explosion? And, great photos with or without tweaks. Dinner looked great. I know the ship gets replenished (sometimes more successfully than than others), and they have high tech refrigerators, humidity control, etc. But, has anyone ever determined or been told if the menus are based on a general freshness to spoilage schedule? I have not, but am curious how the menu fits with provisioning or is it luck that there is still fresh x on day whatever it is. A raw squash (on the menu) could last for months, some romaine lettuce or bags a week or so (thinking of warehouse club purchases where we've had romaine hearts for about a week or tad longer).

I know many (myself included) have been focusing on the Butler cuts, another very real and meaningful issue seems to be the overloading of the housekeeper/steward/host person. They've gone from cleaning and an occasional hello, to being customer relations, food and beverage minibar specialists, with more rooms, and varied room types. Usually this person and role even on a cruise ship is the equivalent to housekeeper at a hotel (whom may not be same person each day is often not someone one interacts with), with an added aspect of some limited customer interaction that may be done by the bellhop at a hotel (where to get ice, thermostat, etc), and often a function of the duration of the cruise and frequency of being back at the room. This wouldn't justify anything related to price or marketing, but there needs to be room housekeeping staff added.

Very cool, and a terrific example of a wow moment. Not so much the Daniel B part (he is just licensed to be a name), but that the pastry chef was willing to do this and capable.

Depending on edge class ship, about 150, number includes Aqua SS, and CS gets the number up to 180 (which still have butlers or at least different intentions compared to SS), with total of about 200 suites. *above I may have used a 180 number. Example of how current amenities promoted at: https://creative.rccl.com/Sales/Celebrity/General_Info/Flyers/Edge_Series_Accommodations_The_Retreat_and_Staterooms.pdf; not exactly same as booking portal (realize there are some disclaimers, plus as we are commenting on whatever is actually available onboard). Ascent numbers available in fact sheet PDF linked on this site: https://www.thecelebritycommitment.com/ships/celebrity-ascent/. Edge and Apex have somewhat different numbers and ratios as the ships were a tad shorter and less rooms overall and in Retreat. But, most Edge class Retreat guests are in SSs of some type. Butlers for 150 may not be practical, though that was the design and intended delivery mechanism, and for some things may have made difference. Meanwhile the above linked document on amenities still indicates a butler will unpack for a SS (just saying).

💯% plus the room attendant, host, housekeeper seems to have a lot more rooms, more to do, etc, and no more time or training to do it in, everything else is likely more overloaded, and varying or diminished quality may mean you would need more and not less services or troubleshooting on your own or accept the reality. So, SS is effectively self service like rest of ship. I presume there are exceptions or squeaky wheel examples, but the norm is not anything better from the reports despite what Celebrity said in one off inquires about the cutbacks. And, past was far from always perfect operationally.

Example: SS were sold as having dedicated butler service, people paid, service discontinued, some people still solicited for final payment (no update/disclosure provided post NRD). To the extent the marketing was updated in August, the butler and team is also a farce. There may be a head butler in name, that if there is engagement simply says the equivalent to you're on your own, and then you're left with the housekeeper, phone to same services as anyone else on board (and follow-up that occurs), and waiting in line in the Retreat lounge. That's not team delivery of services, that's self service. A housekeeper is not a butler, or troubleshooter no matter how nice they may be at pointing out where the soap is and how the thermostat works, let alone timelines of cleaning and turndown. So, don't advertise and then charge for services not made available. But, cutting service on a 3000 plus passengers (400 plus Retreat guests) doesn't help enhance the experience when Retreat was designed with a point person in the told that was cut. The butler or someone with some access to the system and knowledge, plus ownership, whether using a team or not, may increase the chance of a positive experience.

And, for those not fluent in the numbers, on Edge class it's about 180 rooms / 80% of the Retreat rooms that are paying for the services of the Retreat experience regardless of room size (arguably prior to any differentiation in service levels, which to this day is not consistently presented across current direct marketing and compensated influencers) and getting only the services of what in a normal hotel is called a housekeeper and desk concierge in the lounge. Room size alone has only recently in practice and intent been a differentiator for service. (Yes the upper suites should be pampered, but that's not the issue). Although someone in an upper suite outside of their room still has to go to their room or a house phone to access the Butler, and wait like anyone else for their food in the Retreat Deck or drink in the understaffed Retreat Lounge. It's also in doubt if anyone in Retreat recieved to their room breakfast items connected to the physical Luminae from the Luminae room service breakfast menu that is promoted at time of booking. Two additional asides, on a sky suite the cost for primarily Luminae or wherever the Aqua Sky suites dine, and anything else that is per person, wifi and drinks package, can be backed into by doing a 3 person booking and comparing to the 2 person booking amount. Take the per day cost and subtract. That's what people are paying more for plus the slightly larger room.* I'd also add that Retreat was busting st the seams before LHB since the return to sail. Many times it was sold out, but staffing was generally higher (the butlers hadn't been fired yet), and the housekeeping room attendant role may have been covering fewer rooms. The net outcome was there were less issues with unmade rooms, higher chance of personalized contact to make one feel like they were getting something etc. But, what exactly that may have been was not as much luxury as it was troubleshooting and handling of requests in a more seamless manner without the passenger having to work as much for it. Now it's much closer to the equivalent of standing in line at guest relations, taking a gamble on room service delivery, someone intuitively listening and offering a suggestion or taking care the issue, etc. In our cruise ending the day after LLP resigned we had already felt some of the above in Retreat in a CS, but with some capacity to recover when issues like room service orders never materializing before an excursion, a butler that was often frazzled, and having to do a lot of self help were raised with everyone involved. So, CS wasn't perfect, and maybe now it's possibly marginally better since there SSs were abandoned. Yet, our conclusion has been that our 2023 CS experience on the service side was not better than our SS service in 2022, when Retreat was at full capacity. And, if anything the SS butler in 2022 was at the top of his game, and presenting snacks, options, offers to do things at us so that we could have the best experience he could help facilitate ship wide. Now that is definitively gone as there are only opportunities to engage with the overworked housekeeper (whom on land you wouldn't even know or need to know), and be told by a head Butler to do it yourself. But, at full capacity in 2022, Retreat butlers and overall was better service on an SS, and we did feel pampered. In Q2 2023 CS, not so much until we had to speak up. *I have no idea how to fully price an RCCl Oasis or Icon class ship suite with access to the restaurant and lounge since the drinks packages and other stuff is not included, there was no OBC (as there was in retreat), and definitely no butler until one gets to the few upper suites. Relatively speaking an SS or CS on Celebrity was a bargain compared to Royals equivalent sized rooms, as it was evident there was going to need to be additional out of pocket cash spent on items to catch up to what was included in Retreat. Now, it's still impossible to price out RCCL, but the differential has definitely shrunk on price and level of service. Notably the OBC also effectively meant specialities were included for SS and CS rooms assuming Luminae was used for half or more of the dinners. So that creates a sense of tailoring and freedom that some may have used. We also had plenty for excursions since our third person was not eligible for the expensive ones due to age and height. Celebrity has gone down on service, up on price. Yet, we were mostly buying for service, and minimum requirements for room. Not solely on price, although celebrity SSs are now clearly overpriced, deceptively marketed, and placing people in less than ideal situations where the decreased service impacts the experience.

If Jim or anyone else were to use the QR code or in a direct contact with the Hotel Director were to ask to meet with LHB and entourage it would be interesting to know how that response is received. And, thanks to anyone in advance if they do have the opportunity to talk LHB's ear off and not let her claim she doesn't know the business, loves chocolate desserts, or whatever talking point she tries to use. There's hardly anything that I've read or observed myself about the current state of the guest experience, or concerns that reserved customers have, that seems out of line or unreasonable to convey or be addressed by Celebrity. Much ot it's basic stuff. Like stock enough wine, staff enough housekeepers so they don't always appear like they have been working all day and rooms are made up in a timely manner, staff more food runners, have a real single point of contact and adapt to needs of SS and all Retreat customers, stock sugar, be truthful in advertising and marketing, etc

Wow. That is some big news. Maybe she's bringing the wine from Miami, the 4 oz filets for the childrens menu, frozen cookie dough and warmer, pillow chocolates, and seapass card reader to charge for each? Not to impose on your vacation, but could you slip her a thumb drive of all of your very reliable critiques and those of others from this board. Time to use that QR code again! Now that you know the hotel director on a first name basis..... my mind wanders late here in North America.... couldn't be a better ambassador than you and Iain. Ummm is that the leg when @terrydtx joins up with the ship, too? I can't recall. Looking forward to the next few days of discussion.... Edit/PS: Meanwhile over on Instagram LLP has been promoting a book she wrote on leadership, empowering others, etc. (perhaps for discussion on another thread).

Good move to remove. The chair is a magnet for stubbing ones toes day and night. It did make for a good clothing rack when I returned to the room after my wife and child were asleep in the evening. Jim, hope you feel better. As you know, there's plenty of flavored syrups and mixes at each bar if you find yourself needing to make your own vitamin water or slushy with added salt. The vitamin water zero will blend okay if you don't mind them adding a bit of neutral sugar base, or a splash from a carton bar mix that matches the flavor to help with the emulsification. Using carbonated water gets one closest to a Slurpee. I've had good results with the QR code, too. It cuts out a lot of the game of telephone, voicemail message in the room with the light, notes on the dresser, and so on.

Thank you, @Georgia_Peaches and @twins_to_alaska.

Indeed. The filet and a salad, and whatever else from the menu, make for a nice dinner for a child or adult. Very welcome news. We had it on Apex in March/April, but had read it's been hit or miss in terms of availability and cutbacks.

I don't think they thought about efficient drink delivery in the Retreat. It's kind of an afterthought. What I do find helpful is the Edge class Retreat lounges don't look like other places on the ship, aside from the carpet and general design influences. I guess it looks like a living room for the staterooms (SS and CSs). So, it's not the same look as the martini bar, world class, Cafe, Eden or any of the food venues, and obviously the rest of the ship is enjoyable and as much or more a draw at different times of day. (A concern I have about Yacht Club, from what I've seen on YT and trip reports is the rest of the ship). One doesn't need Retreat on Celebrity is perhaps the point, IF they keep up the rest of the ship, service, and food. And, given the differential that may be needed to justify Retreat pricing, management seems to be willing to play with the rest of the ship. The Ascent seafood extravaganza is encouraging (although lunch didn't seem to be toyed with like dinner and then MDRs), waiting for drinks at the Martini bar, and other issues seem like widespread staffing issues that one way or another impact everyone. I don't have enough info about other mass market lines to know if it's the norm or not for ships to frequently need more crew at venues. (I do read often seating at NCL live music venues is sparse, like Eden can get on a busy night, and have seen Edge class theater shows with standing room only and could have used a matinee or something to ease the demand.).