Independent Tours - Mahogany Bay cruisers

[Oz9591]

I emailed Carnival last night for clarification on where to meet my independent tour operator. They didn't respond, so I called the company that we have gone on tours with in the past. Here's the latest update on where to meet Independent tours that have been prebooked for Roatan...hopefully it will be beneficial to others in the same situation.

 

Per Carnival Corporate policy, no independent tour operators will be allowed to greet/pick-up customers at the Mahogany Bay dock. We will be required to exit the dock gate and walk up the hill to the main public street to meet the operator. My wife is in a wheelchair so this sounds like it could be quite a challenge!

 

In their defense, Carnival Corporate is also in the business to sell cruise excursions, so their policy is to NOT recognize any prebooked/internet-booked tours (they are considered competition, I guess!) This will affect everyone who books a cruise excursion, transportation, scuba dive, island tour, zipline trip, etc. outside of the Carnival excursion department!

 

I am hoping that we, as Carnval/Princess/HAL/etc. customers, will be able to help drive the conversation and have our voices heard. Here are some good places to start:

 

gdavis@carnival.com (Graham Davis, Director of Port Operations) or director@mahoganybaycc.com (Michael Reimers, General Manager)

 

Anyone travelling with an independent over the opening weeks of the Carnival dock, please send us some pictures, and fill us all in on how difficult or easy it was to locate/meet your tour operators. Depending on how long the walk is, we may switch our upcoming Crown Princess cruise to the NCL Jewel, since it still docks at the Port of Roatan. Ironically, it is developed/managed by Royal Caribbean...but still has kiosks available for the "local guys" to meet their customers.

 

I feel that the cruise line is already getting my cruise money, alcohol money, etc. and I don't see the need to give them all of my "in port" money, as well! I have always preferred going on a small, private or semi-private excursion instead of a bus full of fellow-cruisers.

 

Is it just me?

[Roatan1]

I am hoping that we, as Carnval/Princess/HAL/etc. customers, will be able to help drive the conversation and have our voices heard. Here are some good places to start:

 

gdavis@carnival.com (Graham Davis, Director of Port Operations) or director@mahoganybaycc.com (Michael Reimers, General Manager)

 

Anyone travelling with an independent over the opening weeks of the Carnival dock, please send us some pictures, and fill us all in on how difficult or easy it was to locate/meet your tour operators. Depending on how long the walk is, we may switch our upcoming Crown Princess cruise to the NCL Jewel, since it still docks at the Port of Roatan. Ironically, it is developed/managed by Royal Caribbean...but still has kiosks available for the "local guys" to meet their customers.

 

I feel that the cruise line is already getting my cruise money, alcohol money, etc. and I don't see the need to give them all of my "in port" money, as well! I have always preferred going on a small, private or semi-private excursion instead of a bus full of fellow-cruisers.

 

Is it just me?

Thank You,

It is the Island and its people that make Roatan what it is, This type of thing will only hurt the locals and honduras already is above 50% unemployment with many who are working making less than $10 per day. Why bother even leaving Miami or Tampa if all you seek is Americanized tourist beach? If you enjoy this type of thing then thats great but please don't kid yourself by thinking that it helps the local economy anyway, it hurts it and can put many out of business who cannot afford the extravagant fees to be included on a ship sponsored tour

[lovevacadays]

I agree that it is sad. Yes, Carnival is a business that also sells excursions but it seems like they are trying to create a little "monopoly" within the Roatan area of their dock which seems like a disservice to their customers.

[gypsygirl]

I really feel terrible about what Carnival is doing to the independant operators. We have booked with Victor Bodden before and had a tour booked with him again. I use a walker and my husband has bad legs. There is no way we can walk up a hill to get to the street. I feel so bad cancelling with Victor. These are poor people trying to make a decent living and the giant is stepping on them.

[Roatan1]

I really feel terrible about what Carnival is doing to the independant operators. We have booked with Victor Bodden before and had a tour booked with him again. I use a walker and my husband has bad legs. There is no way we can walk up a hill to get to the street. I feel so bad cancelling with Victor. These are poor people trying to make a decent living and the giant is stepping on them.

Then DO NOT Cancel with Victor, Get ***** the case of those you already paid thousands to. Tell them how you feel. Have some ligaments

[MDSue]

I am personally disgusted at Carnival for not making any effort to accommodate local guides. I have never witnessed this behavior in any port I've visited. They already get my cruise fare, and my money from their "cruise-sponsored" shops. Many people buy ship pictures and art from their auctions.

Do they feel the need to have a piece of every pie?

On my next cruise to Roatan, I will be looking for another line.

Shame on them!

[crewsweeper]

I am personally disgusted at Carnival for not making any effort to accommodate local guides. I have never witnessed this behavior in any port I've visited. They already get my cruise fare, and my money from their "cruise-sponsored" shops. Many people buy ship pictures and art from their auctions.

Do they feel the need to have a piece of every pie?

On my next cruise to Roatan, I will be looking for another line.

Shame on them!

What you msut understand is that 90% of the cruisers on any given cruise ship want the "all-inclusive resorts" stop that the ships offer. They feel that if the ship is sponsoring it, the tour/excursion/beach will be acceptible to their needs. Most of these folks have never traveled outside the US before and are scared to death that someone is out there to rip them off and leave them stranded. So they are willing to pay the premium for the perceived safety. Cruise lines then accomodate their passsengers needs. The biggest complaints abotu Roatan have been there's nothing near the pier area (Coxen Hole). Mahogany Bay remedies that.

 

You get the same thing in Cozumel where only "approve" cabs can wait at the pier and independents must wait outside the area and you have to walk around to get there.

 

So yes it is difficult for those of us who are more experienced traveling and wish to get a more "local" flavor of places we visit and don't find the cruise line tours all that enticing or reasonably priced. But Victor, Rony and other independents will do just fine as ship traffic will pick up from one ship 2 or 3 times a week to 3-4 ships. These folks are very adaptive.

[klmorg]

Yep, it's true. Just got this email regarding an independent excursion we have planned in January:

 

"Please note the below important information regarding your Roatan Tour, & the new cruise terminal in Roatan. Almost all Carnival and Princess ships will be using this new terminal from mid to late November 2009.

 

Meeting Instructions for Ships using the new Mahogany Bay Facility, which includes all Carnival and Princess vessels.

 

Please exit the gated cruise terminal area via the covered gangway. Make an immediate left, and follow the paved road past the security gate. Continue down to an assembly area, just at the bottom of hill (paved) . Here, you will find one of our representatives holding a sign for Island Marketing / South Shore Adventures, and they will have a copy of this exact confirmation . Please ensure you match confirmations in order to guarantee you are with the correct driver. This is a 250 yards, 5 minute walk

 

Royal Caribbean and Norwegian Cruise Line ships will continue to use Coxen Hole."

[MDSue]

What you msut understand is that 90% of the cruisers on any given cruise ship want the "all-inclusive resorts" stop that the ships offer. They feel that if the ship is sponsoring it, the tour/excursion/beach will be acceptible to their needs. Most of these folks have never traveled outside the US before and are scared to death that someone is out there to rip them off and leave them stranded. So they are willing to pay the premium for the perceived safety. Cruise lines then accomodate their passsengers needs. The biggest complaints abotu Roatan have been there's nothing near the pier area (Coxen Hole). Mahogany Bay remedies that.

 

You get the same thing in Cozumel where only "approve" cabs can wait at the pier and independents must wait outside the area and you have to walk around to get there.

So yes it is difficult for those of us who are more experienced traveling and wish to get a more "local" flavor of places we visit and don't find the cruise line tours all that enticing or reasonably priced. But Victor, Rony and other independents will do just fine as ship traffic will pick up from one ship 2 or 3 times a week to 3-4 ships. These folks are very adaptive.

 

 

I think the cruise lines need to accomodate the desires of all the cruisers, not just the newccomers who are worried about ventruing out on their own. I personally have done both cruise sponsored and independent tours and want the opportunity to do either.

While Carnival is financing this new port, they will inevitably make plenty of money on what seems like will be a very nice destination. However, they are doing a huge disservice to the local people and tour operators who will not sign exclusive contracts with them [and therefore costing us much more money for the same product]. This is, IMHO, an unacceptable form of extreme greed and displays a total lack of concern for anything other than their deep pockets.

I am a huge cruise fan and the majority of my posting are positive, but this move is over the top disturbing to me.

In Cozumel, regular cab drivers are able to come and go into the port areas, the just have to be licensed. It is not exclusive to cruise tour guides.

[CMM]

oz9592 Quote

"Anyone travelling with an independent over the opening weeks of the Carnival dock, please send us some pictures, and fill us all in on how difficult or easy it was to locate/meet your tour operators. Depending on how long the walk is, we may switch our upcoming Crown Princess cruise to the NCL Jewel, since it still docks at the Port of Roatan. Ironically, it is developed/managed by Royal Caribbean...but still has kiosks available for the "local guys" to meet their customers."

 

We will be in Roatan on Nov 27 and will return home on the 29th. I will try to post then myexperiences. We are in our 40's with teens and do not anticipate this to be an issue for us, but will keep in mind what it will be like for those with mobility issues and try to post.

[thinfool]

This is not meant to support Carnival at all. It is a huge corporation with only one goal...to make money. While you may not agree with their methods, their efforts to extract every last quarter from their passengers are at least understandable.

 

The heretofore unmentioned culprits in this discussion are the local and national officials who had to have signed off on Carnival's plans before construction began. They should have had the welfare of the local people/merchants at heart before allowing CCL to have it's way with Mahogany Bay.

 

They must bear a large part of the blame for this travesty. :(

[MDSue]

This is not meant to support Carnival at all. It is a huge corporation with only one goal...to make money. While you may not agree with their methods, their efforts to extract every last quarter from their passengers are at least understandable.

 

The heretofore unmentioned culprits in this discussion are the local and national officials who had to have signed off on Carnival's plans before construction began. They should have had the welfare of the local people/merchants at heart before allowing CCL to have it's way with Mahogany Bay.

 

They must bear a large part of the blame for this travesty. :(

My guess is that Carnival will hire the locals that sign exclusive contracts to them, for a much lower rate of pay then they could make on their own, or costing the cruise customers much more.

I agree that this should have been negotiated before Carnival was allowed to build, but either way it will bring plenty of dollars to Roatan.

I continue to strongly disagree with Carnival's heartless tactics. They should be working with the local population and reputable tour guides not against them.

I've sent an email to Carnival to voice my thoughts. I'm sure they are hoping the furor will die down and people will happily book cruise sponsored tours instead.

[Naomi John]

Per Carnival Corporate policy, no independent tour operators will be allowed to greet/pick-up customers at the Mahogany Bay dock. We will be required to exit the dock gate and walk up the hill to the main public street to meet the operator. My wife is in a wheelchair so this sounds like it could be quite a challenge!

 

I may not understand, but can the Independent Operators meet people just outside the dock gate? Is is possible for them to have Transport waiting just outside the gate for use? I have never been to Isle de Roaton, do not know how the space is outside the the port/dock is set up or if this is possible. But, if they will allow the local taxi's to be there, why not other transportation? Or the independent operators could contract with local taxi's, they have to up their price a little, but I'm sure it will be a better deal then the cruise ship price.

 

Also, one person said "up a hill", another post said "down a hill". Does anyone know which is correct?

[crewsweeper]

I may not understand, but can the Independent Operators meet people just outside the dock gate? Is is possible for them to have Transport waiting just outside the gate for use? I have never been to Isle de Roaton, do not know how the space is outside the the port/dock is set up or if this is possible. But, if they will allow the local taxi's to be there, why not other transportation? Or the independent operators could contract with local taxi's, they have to up their price a little, but I'm sure it will be a better deal then the cruise ship price.

 

Also, one person said "up a hill", another post said "down a hill". Does anyone know which is correct?

 

Well, that's part of the issue. independent operators will be able to meet you outside the"gate". But the gate is 200 + meters from the pier. And it's up a hill going and down the hill returning. Depending upon the walkway and steepness, this could be a problem for some passengers with limited mobility.

 

Roatan is a very beautiful, rustic island and many of us who have been there love it forits rustic nature. But a majority of cruisers, used to the Eastern Caribbean ports and resorts of Jamaica and Grand Cayman find the rustic nature offputting. Negative comments about how seedy the place is and how scared they were to walk outside the fence in Coxen Hole. Lack of dining and drinking establishments causes the Lido deck buffets to get overwhelmed with hunger and thirsty cruisers embarking in mid afternoon. So Carnival built a facility to meet the needs/demands of the majority of its cruisers.

 

Yes this detracts from the rustic beauty of the island, but onoly in a small way and only in a part of the island between the airport and French Harbor where many cruisers, even those who loved the island, never or rarely ventured. It will benefit the local island economy with jobs for islanders and money spent on the island. Independent tour operators may even see their business grow as you can now get 3 ships on the island at one time versus only one at a time in the past. And those of us who enjoy the other parts of the island to the west and north will find the new facility draws people away from our favorite haunts keeping them relatively uncrowded and relaxed.

[Roatan1]

 

Also, one person said "up a hill", another post said "down a hill". Does anyone know which is correct?

No matter how hard my father tries to convince me, I KNOW, he did not walk to and from school in the snow UPHILL both ways. Up one way, down the other. Either way a hill is tough for some, A hill on Roatan is not mearly a speed bump

[Kerry&LuAnn]

So,to take an excursion from a private operator, it is necessary to walk 5 minutes away from the ship to where they gather. Why is that such a big deal to get so upset about? Are we missing something here?

[gypsygirl]

You will have to walk out of the security gate, down an unpaved road, and up a hill to get to the street where the independants will meet you. The one I had booked with even said that this was too much for people to do. It's supposed to be about 250 yards before you get to the hill.

[brenderlou]

So,to take an excursion from a private operator, it is necessary to walk 5 minutes away from the ship to where they gather. Why is that such a big deal to get so upset about? Are we missing something here?

 

Yes you are....some people who want to do independent tours may not be able to walk up this hill to get to the tour. My mother is going on our cruise and she is 78. I am concerned about this "hill" and how steep it is. She is not use to warm climates and suffers from arthritis flare ups.

Another things that is making me upset about this is that Carnival IS allowing the independent tour operators to drive us DOWN the hill at the end of the hill to drop us off. Isn't that nice.....

If anyone is familar w/ this area and can talk more about the hill and how steep it is, we would appreciate it.

[gypsygirl]

Yes you are....some people who want to do independent tours may not be able to walk up this hill to get to the tour. My mother is going on our cruise and she is 78. I am concerned about this "hill" and how steep it is. She is not use to warm climates and suffers from arthritis flare ups.

Another things that is making me upset about this is that Carnival IS allowing the independent tour operators to drive us DOWN the hill at the end of the hill to drop us off. Isn't that nice.....

If anyone is familar w/ this area and can talk more about the hill and how steep it is, we would appreciate it.

 

Roatan1 post on here often. Maybe he or she could tell us. All they said before was that a hill in Roatan is not merely speed bump. I have an idea it's pretty rough. I canceled our tour because I would be using a walker and my husband has a hard time walking. I'm sure mad about this situation.

[crewsweeper]

Ships will start to dock here next Friday and we'll start seeing reviews by Thanksgiving on how the whole thing works.

 

In the other thread on this board on Mahogany Bay, there is a pdf of the formal presentation of the plans for the new site on the last or next to last page. http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1026755

 

In that presentation are several pictures of building in various stages of construction as well as a couple of maps of the facilities. Page 15 gives a good overview of the topography of the site. On page 57 of the pdf, there is a picture that shows the outside of the facilities with the exit for the pier marked and another marker pointing toward the left that says "Location of Independent Tour Operators Booth". While there does appear to be a slight incline, it's hard to tell how much is really camera lens curvature. The walkway/drive way also looks paved. The hill may be from the pier to the village/shops.

 

I guess we'll have to wait and see and ask questions of the first visitors here.

[chloes_mom]

From the pics, it looks like the new mahogany beach is just as long of a walk as it would be to the independent tour operators. Yes, they have a chair lift, but that wouldn't help wheelchair bound guests. I hope that all the fuss is being blown out of proportion, and that the walk won't be that bad. What I want to know is when is Carnival going to post shore excursion information for the new Mahogany Beach? Some of us like to plan ahead. We will be there on the 12/6 sailing, and can't decide whether to book a tour to West Bay Beach on my own, or just go to the new Mahogany Beach! As soon as anyone has more info, please post!

 

Renee

[jandjfun]

Yep, it's true. Just got this email regarding an independent excursion we have planned in January:

 

"Please note the below important information regarding your Roatan Tour, & the new cruise terminal in Roatan. Almost all Carnival and Princess ships will be using this new terminal from mid to late November 2009.

 

Meeting Instructions for Ships using the new Mahogany Bay Facility, which includes all Carnival and Princess vessels.

 

Please exit the gated cruise terminal area via the covered gangway. Make an immediate left, and follow the paved road past the security gate. Continue down to an assembly area, just at the bottom of hill (paved) . Here, you will find one of our representatives holding a sign for Island Marketing / South Shore Adventures, and they will have a copy of this exact confirmation . Please ensure you match confirmations in order to guarantee you are with the correct driver. This is a 250 yards, 5 minute walk

 

Royal Caribbean and Norwegian Cruise Line ships will continue to use Coxen Hole."

I have underlined in red the things I see that tells me this will not be a problem. If the hill is that big , when I return from my independant tour, I will hire a taxi to drive me up the hill. Yeah!! more local support.

[brenderlou]

I have underlined in red the things I see that tells me this will not be a problem. If the hill is that big , when I return from my independant tour, I will hire a taxi to drive me up the hill. Yeah!! more local support.

 

I think they have the hill part backwards....You need to walk up the hill after leaving the cruise ship to get to the independent tour operators.

But Carnival in their "generosity" is allowing the tour operators to drive thier clients down the hill at the end of the tour.....Gee, thanks :mad:

Nothing like treating your customers w/ kindess.

The hill for us will not be a problem but I'm sure it will be for those with limited mobility. I've also read that the taxi cabs probably aren't going to drive people up a hill that is a very short distance but who knows.

Hoping to read some reviews from those going to Roatan this week on how this works out.

[azkcruizers]

brenderlou....

 

I have also heard that you must walk uphill when you leave the cruiseship not when you return......and can get dropped off when you return...sweet of them. Getting my mother up that hill in a wheelchair to do what we want on what could be her last cruise is what is aggravating. I'm sure there are many other people who cannot make it up that hill just on willpower to get there so the mindset of "I'm going to get there no matter what" isn't working for me. I wouldn't have a problem paying for a taxi to take us there but I agree that this probably isn't going to be an option. I am anxious to see what happens. I assume if this wasn't going to be a big deal the tour operators wouldn't be scrambling to meet with the mayor.

[MDSue]

brenderlou....

 

I have also heard that you must walk uphill when you leave the cruiseship not when you return......and can get dropped off when you return...sweet of them. Getting my mother up that hill in a wheelchair to do what we want on what could be her last cruise is what is aggravating. I'm sure there are many other people who cannot make it up that hill just on willpower to get there so the mindset of "I'm going to get there no matter what" isn't working for me. I wouldn't have a problem paying for a taxi to take us there but I agree that this probably isn't going to be an option. I am anxious to see what happens. I assume if this wasn't going to be a big deal the tour operators wouldn't be scrambling to meet with the mayor.

I really hope that you will take the time to write Carnival execs.[i did]. I think they need to hear first hand what the cruising public feels about this decision, which to me seems greedy and selfish on their part.

I am thinking that if they don't let tour operators pick up customers that they wouldn't allow taxi's either. I'm anxious to hear back from some of the first cruisers to visit this port to hear the facts.