Rhine water levels 2022 and similar topics

[suslang]

44 minutes ago, notamermaid said:

Have you joined a roll call? Plenty of info there and you may find some one else has put their name down but prefers not to be on this main river cruising board.

 

notamermaid

 

Yes I have

[tazlover]

46 minutes ago, notamermaid said:

Have you joined a roll call? Plenty of info there and you may find some one else has put their name down but prefers not to be on this main river cruising board.

 

notamermaid

 

How do you find Roll Calls for river cruises. I’m on AMA  Sept 19 and not sure how to find them. Ocean cruises are much easier to find. Thanks

[worldtraveller99]

All Other River Cruise Cruise Roll Calls - Cruise Critic Message Board Forums

 

[gentlemancruiser]

6 hours ago, travellovervic said:

The latest from the Hermod: we didn't make it to Zons for 9:30 am. Programme director announced at the end of breakfast that dangerously low water levels slowed us down so much, all morning excursions are postponed to the afternoon. Important information session at 12 noon about all the changes to be made... Still going positively with the flow. 

Vic

 

let's us know how it goes.   Sounds like everything is being done minute by minute

[Bowler Lady]

4 hours ago, tazlover said:

We are on the AMA Serena, departing Amsterdam to Basel on September 19. One month away. Hoping all things improve by then. I will keep reading and hoping.

We are on the AMA Siena on 9/15 from A to B also. We are crossing our fingers and toes with you!

[Yorkshireoldlad]

On 8/16/2022 at 3:42 AM, RDVIK2016 said:

"Kaub at 31 cm" doesn't mean that the river is 12.2 inches deep in the navigation channel.  When then Pegel scale is at 31cm then the channel is 143 cm deep.  Some ships to have draughts less than 1.4m so can get by depending on a couple of other factors. 

 

Can I ask - is this a straight ratio conversion? What I mean is, if the Kaub doubles to 62cm, does the channel depth also double - to 286cm, or is it more complicated than that?

thanks

[mrsbos]

14 hours ago, floridababa said:

You are lucky. Our scenic cruise from Basel to Amsterdam on August 22 was just canceled. Very sad

 

Was this Viking who cancelled? What ship? We sail on Aug 31st A-B. Haven't heard a word from Viking. 

[notamermaid]

On the radar I see rain over Lake Constance, now having also moved North and West, an almost perfect direction to give water to the Rhine and its tributaries.

 

notamermaid

 

[debster818]

5 minutes ago, notamermaid said:

On the radar I see rain over Lake Constance, now having also moved North and West, an almost perfect direction to give water to the Rhine and its tributaries.

 

notamermaid

 

So Glad to hear this. Thanks for the updates!!

[notamermaid]

12 hours ago, steamboats said:

Now the middle Rhine river valley is closed to traffic between St. Goars and Oberwesel (where the Loreley rock is located). But not because to low water... A freight ship has an engine problem and got stuck there blocking the channel. This happened yesterday afternoon. They now try to get the ship free and get it to a port where they can do the needed repairs.

 

steamboats

By the time this was picked up internationally (Bloomberg being onto it very quickly of course) the ship had already been dealt with and was making the last few kilometres upstream to a safe space. In the evening, i.e. 24 hours ago, shipping had fully resumed. The backlog was likely a few hours more. Here is the report by Deutsche Welle from yesterday for some background and a lot of information on other rivers in Europe - and some lakes. Lake Constance is of course very low. Hopefully by Saturday we will see a couple of centimetres on the gauge at Konstanz, please note that this is the Lake not the city:

 

5cm up would already be a lot of water...

 

notamermaid

 

 

 

[travellovervic]

Update: the Hermod won't sail further beyond Cologne. We stop in a shipyard in an area called Hafen Niehl (according to Google map) and will stay overnight here. It is a 15 minutes drive to the Cathedral. Unfortunately, tomorrow we won't have any of the scenic sailing through the Middle Rhine. this is plan C, I guess, last two weeks they were able to transfer passengers to smaller boats for a scenic sailing. This week, it is no longer possible.  all luggage out in the hallway to be picked up for transfer by 8 am. Breakfast will start before 7 am. We will leave the ship at 8:30 am. Bus to Koblenz for included tour, free time for lunch, with €25 credit for each pax. 1:30 departs Koblenz for scenic coach ride, stop at Loreley, admire it from shore, then coffee and cake break in Bingen. Change bus at 4:30 pm to drive to Strasbourg, arrive to Viking Sigyn for dinner at 7 pm. to continue onto Basel from there as scheduled. it's unfortunate that we miss the most relaxing and scenic part of the cruise.  it will be a hectic day, stressful for some.  All paid optional tours are cancelled for this part.  It is what it is, Viking tries its best, it is not really a matter of doing things last minute, they are assessing what is possible out of very challenging conditions. A sailing we won't go, but bus tour and only one extra packing and unpacking. If you can handle it, don't cancel. but if this inconvenience bothers you, and missing the scenic Middle Rhine on the river is vital, then cancel. However, don't expect the water level to drastically improve for the next month or so. but then again, I'm not the expert on weather and these water levels.  Good night.

Vic

[gentlemancruiser]

Travellovervic  I'm so sorry, that is one VERY VERY long day.   

[notamermaid]

8 minutes ago, travellovervic said:

Good night.

Sleep well. So sorry about that change.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

It is late in the evening for me as well, but I want to elaborate on this, see post #711:

" We stop in a shipyard in an area called Hafen Niehl (according to Google map) and will stay overnight here. It is a 15 minutes drive to the Cathedral."

 

It may be (only) a fifteen minute drive, but if this is the harbour area at Niehl that I had a land day trip to in 2021, it is not scenic staying overnight. Here are the photos of

entrance to the area:

 

train line and fence of Viking:

 

Viking ships dock:

 

and dock of other river cruise ships

 

It is the winter harbour, perhaps there is a slightly more comfortable, inviting area that I did not see.

 

notamermaid

 

 

Edited August 18, 2022 by notamermaid

[Bowler Lady]

2 hours ago, notamermaid said:

On the radar I see rain over Lake Constance, now having also moved North and West, an almost perfect direction to give water to the Rhine and its tributaries.

 

notamermaid

 

I see that it is raining now in Basel. And that it will continue through Saturday. Will this rain benefit the river and flow down where we need it through Rhine?

[Port Power]

13 hours ago, Canal archive said:

Gables, Scenic is a river cruise company definitely not a type of Viking cruise to compare the two would be horrific!

 

Feel so much for the freight Captain it’s his livelihood.

As @floridababa wrote “scenic” instead of “Scenic”, the could easily be confused as just describing a picturesque cruise.  Understandable for many who don’t know all the river cruise companies.

 

I am totally confounded by your response, though.  Why “horrific”?  Is Viking not nearly as good as Scenic?  Having included beverages all day, good food, guided walks at every stop, plus a couple of major included tours does give Scenic the edge, but I thought Viking was pretty well rated too?

[Port Power]

5 hours ago, mrsbos said:

Was this Viking who cancelled? What ship? We sail on Aug 31st A-B. Haven't heard a word from Viking. 

@floridababa meant, I assume, a cruise with Scenic River Cruises.

[sharkster77]

5 minutes ago, Port Power said:

As @floridababa wrote “scenic” instead of “Scenic”, the could easily be confused as just describing a picturesque cruise.  Understandable for many who don’t know all the river cruise companies.

 

I am totally confounded by your response, though.  Why “horrific”?  Is Viking not nearly as good as Scenic?  Having included beverages all day, good food, guided walks at every stop, plus a couple of major included tours does give Scenic the edge, but I thought Viking was pretty well rated too?

We had no complaints about our Viking cruise 3 years ago, then again, we don't need free flowing liquor all day, a butler, a spa, etc.  There are some on these boards that simply do not Viking due to their payment policies, but have this dislike despite never having sailed with them.  We are definitely satisfied Viking customers.  If they aren't someone's cup of tea, so be it--I'm sure other lines are also fine.

[momofthre3]

On 8/17/2022 at 9:00 PM, worldtraveller99 said:

Which ship would you be on in the Greek Islands momofthr3?

Seabourne Encore is the ship we will sail on. We have gone to Mykonos but none of the other islands. Have also gone to Ephesus in Turkey. However the ship is doing a special excursion for guests after hours. We are excited!

[gentlemancruiser]

38 minutes ago, Port Power said:

 

I thought Viking was pretty well rated too?

Scenic is an upscale line and mostly all suites on their ships.  They are truly 'All Inclusive' lines and closer to what Uniworld or Tauck provide.     

Viking ships look very nice and their cabins look nice.   

 

Pricing and service levels are very different when you compare them side by side.

Edited August 18, 2022 by gentlemancruiser

[mozfoz]

1 hour ago, gentlemancruiser said:

Scenic is an upscale line and mostly all suites on their ships.  They are truly 'All Inclusive' lines and closer to what Uniworld or Tauck provide.     

Viking ships look very nice and their cabins look nice.   

 

Pricing and service levels are very different when you compare them side by side.

Interesting in that when I did a side by side comparison of Viking and Uniworld, making an adjustment for drinks (2 per per son per day) it was just under $250, in favor of Viking. Considerations were for a balcony cabin, same date and ports, transfers, gratuities, laundry, etc. Cabins are larger with smaller total occupancy and final payment 120 days on Uniworld. Now I am not trying to highjack this topic, but found it interesting and worth sharing. Both lines are great.

[UDChE89]

Viva has canceled their Picturesque Rhine cruise leaving 21.08.

[RDVIK2016]

9 hours ago, Yorkshireoldlad said:

Can I ask - is this a straight ratio conversion? What I mean is, if the Kaub doubles to 62cm, does the channel depth also double - to 286cm, or is it more complicated than that?

thanks

No, it's linear, one to one. Using your increase in Pegel to 62cm from 31cm, the channel would also ad 31cm, from 143cm to 174cm. 

 

Leave it to the Germans to come up with this system. And to keep things interesting they use a different manner of calculation on the Danube.

 

First of all the placement of the Pegel scale is somewhat arbitrary and depends on the contours it the river bank. The zero mark will usually stay below water.  There also something called a GlW (Gleichwertigerwasserstand). They have taken measurements over a period of several years and determine what is a water level below which the river, on average, does not fall more frequently than 20 ice-free days in the year. This gets recalculated every few years.  At Kaub that level is 78cm on the Pegel scale. 

 

So then you measure the depth of the navigation channel below the GlW level. At Kaub that is 1.9m.  If the Pegel is 31cm that is 47cm below the GlW, so the channel is 47cm below what it would be if the water level was at the 190 when at GlW.  So 190cm less 47cm is 143cm.  At 62cm Pegel subtract 16 from the 190 and you get 174cm. 

 

For every Pegel location the captain has to know the channel depth below the GlW and how much the current Pegel reading differs from that.  He's got other things to consider also.  Is the bottom completely free of debris like gravel that has moved in, how much his boat's draft is effect by his speed, how much has been able to unload weight to sit a bit higher in the water, etc, etc.

 

At Koblenz the GlW happens to also be 78, but the channel is 210cm deep at that point compated to 190 for Kaub.  Today's Pegel is 35. navigation channel you should still have

167cm (35-78+210 = 167)

 

At Cologne the GlW is 139, today's Pegel is 75, and the channel is 250cm below the GlW.  So you have in the navigation channel  75-139+250 =  186cm in the channel.

 

 

[travellovervic]

6 hours ago, notamermaid said:

It is late in the evening for me as well, but I want to elaborate on this, see post #711:

" We stop in a shipyard in an area called Hafen Niehl (according to Google map) and will stay overnight here. It is a 15 minutes drive to the Cathedral."

 

It may be (only) a fifteen minute drive, but if this is the harbour area at Niehl that I had a land day trip to in 2021, it is not scenic staying overnight. Here are the photos of

entrance to the area:

 

train line and fence of Viking:

 

Viking ships dock:

 

and dock of other river cruise ships

 

It is the winter harbour, perhaps there is a slightly more comfortable, inviting area that I did not see.

 

notamermaid

 

 

Yes, that's where we are, nothing to see here!

V

[travellovervic]

our Programme Director Ivan is coming with us to the Sigyn, unfortunately hotel and restaurant staffs won't. V