Why so few Americans as crew?

[tonid1980]

In many western European countries 4 weeks is the normal minimum vacation time given to all employees.

 

Wow... Thats usually the maximum in the US... My companies policy is 2 weeks for 0-5 years, 3 weeks 5-10 years... and 4 weeks after ten years of service...

 

I know many companies in this industry do 4 weeks at 5 years though...

 

still, 4 weeks minimum right off the bat?? that is NICE

 

.. No one WANTS to work... but everyone that I know works very hard, and many of them work many hours. My boyfriend works 60 hours a week, has no paid sick days, and only two weeks of paid vacation a year... maybe its a northeast thing...but all I see are business people that work rediculous hours and are 'workaholics' ... but that might just be a result of living within commuting distance of wall street..

[RuthlessBoss]

I think work ethics have changed so much over the years. There was a time when even getting a job was an honor. But, even then, the hours were straight forward and limited. The younger generations are being brought up to think they are "special", have not been exposed to real labor as parents want each generation to have a better life than they did, many don't know hardship, and want to start their career at the "top". I do believe working on a ship is an entity in itself and it takes only dedicated people to endure it.

[shancan911]

Caribbean Dreams, great info on that website. I am by trade a massage therapist. The website states that I could make between $2600 and $3600 a month onboard. This is ALOT more than I make now. That figure includes gratuity. So if we go right down the middle and say $3200, that still trumps what I make by a whole lot. The difference is I work 25 hours a week, and I truly love what I do. Last year on Mariner, I had a facial. The girl who did it alternates her contracts, 13 weeks of massage, 13 weeks of esthetics. She gets one day "off" a week, and that is the embarkation day, during which she still must be in the spa to tour guests and try to sell them on services. The spa is open what, 10-12 hours a day? That's a minimum of 60 hours a week. My math is a little rusty, but that is just over $100/day, maybe $140 max. How much is an hour massage (which by the way actually winds up to be 50-55 minutes + a sales pitch) No thanks. She is burned out, but hooked on the money, because she can't get a job making that much at home and is working on paying down some bills to buy a house. I think I'll keep my menial wages, and my job I love. Please do remember to tip your crew while aboard your next cruise. I know I will:)

[GORDONCHICK]

Customer service is a hard job, and on a cruise ship, it's your life if you are crew. Here in the US, we would put in 8-10 hours a day, and when we go home, we are completely away from work. My job is one where I am a customer to one group, and I am customer serivce internally. Good customer service here is hard to find. Exceptional customer service is nearly extinct (I am talking in generalities)!

 

On the other hand, I've been here just short of 15 years. I get over 7 weeks of paid vacation a year, and when I hit 15, I will get an additional 2 days (and that's where it's capped). The pay is far from great, but I have fantastic benifits!

[Ephraim]

Wow... Thats usually the maximum in the US... My companies policy is 2 weeks for 0-5 years, 3 weeks 5-10 years... and 4 weeks after ten years of service...

 

I know many companies in this industry do 4 weeks at 5 years though...

 

still, 4 weeks minimum right off the bat?? that is NICE

 

Many Canadians negotiate their vacation time above. Vacation pay in Canada is legally set at 4% of salary and depending on the province increases to 6% and one province allows an increase to 8%. In at least one jurisdiction, you can take a third unpaid week, by law.

 

This 4% is equivalent to 2 weeks on an annual salary. If you don't take your vacation, you still get 4% of your entire salary. For example, if your annual salary was 40K and you decided not to take your vacation (why, I don't know, but if you didn't..) you would earn 41.6K a year.

 

One of the problems that American employers have when it comes to trying to hire Canadians to work in the US is the question of vacation pay. We have turned down job offers that pay much more than we currently earn because they only included 2 weeks paid vacation and they expected we would only take 1 week and simply be paid the second week. We already have 3 weeks and I want more vacation, not less.

 

Incidentally, the length of cruises has been a major problem for some of the cruise lines in Europe. Most Europeans want 2 week vacations at a time, not a single week. That is why RCL's Independence of the Seas is slated for 14 day cruises when it starts cruising next year out of the UK. Princess often books people from the UK on back-to-back cruises in the Caribbean out of San Juan, which is why you see alternating weeks.

 

As for customer service (to get back on topic,) it's a very difficult question. Too often the attitude is to pass it off to someone else or when a clear policy doesn't exist to skirt the issue. For example on a cruise on the NCL Spirit a lot of people were asking us what a "Friends of Dorothy" and a "Friends of Bill W." meeting was, they were given no answer when they asked at Customer Service because there was no clear policy.

[Cruisesquatch]

Its my understanding that American workers still put in more hours a year than any other industrialized country. Just thought I'd say that.

[pg.]

I hear the hours are much longer in Japan.

[Sally Forth]

You bring up a good point. I know that most massage therapists in Canada wouldn't work more than 6 hours. It's not because they are lazy, but because it is physically exhausting work and when you get tired, you start to lose the intuition in your fingers. On the other hand, registered massage therapists here have gone through 24 months of massage school, and I don't think that many of the people onboard have that kind of extensive training or would be able to be registered here.

 

Viv

[walkswife]

Americans love to be waited upon.

 

Americans aren't good at waiting on others!

 

Excuse me!! I work as a waitress part time a few nights a week and I make more doing that than sitting at my desk 40 hours a week so I can keep my insurance....

 

Please do not group Americans.... I have never been on assistance and have worked at least part time as a waitress for over 25 years and I am damn good at it....

[KKB]

All Americans speak 2 languages: 1) English, and 2) English louder. They rarely speak any others.

 

Many young Americans are unable to pass the Drug and Alcohol tests required of all new ship employees.

 

Often there are several nationalities living in one crew cabin - often speaking several languages. Past experience proves that Americans have a problem with that.

 

Less than 20% of the American public has a passport. No passport = no job on the ship.

 

But your generalizations are somewhat over the top.

 

ALL Americans do not speak as you share above. Some do, true, but certainly not all.

 

I entirely disagree that "MANY' young people would be unable to pass a Drug/Alcohol test. Just because a young person might have a drink (or on occasion too many drinks...) does not mean they could not abstain for such test/job.

 

I take real offense of the statement the "past experience proves that Americans have problems with that" in regards to rooming w/ those who speak other language is the most outlandish generalization. Yes, SOME do have problems...but some do of all nationalities! Shame on you!

 

So <20% have a passport...gee, if I want a job that requires one, it is a simple, painless process. I wonder what % of citizens of other countries around the world don't have passports....

 

 

I agree that the biggest reason there are few Americans is that the pay/hours are intolerable by American standards. Taxes would hurt that even more. And I do sense a decline in customer service in our country, which would not be tolerated by their superiors on a cruise ship. But to make bold generalizations is simply untrue. Reminds me of other generalizations of other groups, and the prejudice & discrimination that stems from them. Not cool.

 

Compared to wages in many countries in this world, cruise ship wages are wonderful. I have spoken to crew members who said they will earn in 5 years what they would earn in a lifetime at home. I would love to find a job like that, even if the hours were long!

[BruceMuzz]

I worked for quite some time at NCL America's Honolulu Office, processing applicants for the new American Ships. Applicants could not be hired unless they passed a Level 5 Drug Test. This is the same test given to commercial and military pilots.

The US Coast Guard requires this test before issuing them a US Merchant Mariners Card, necessary for everyone working on a US Flag ship.

 

Over 65% of the applicants failed the drug test - and were then forever banned from ever working on an American Flag vessel.

 

International Cruise Lines require that all crew members pass the same test every year.

[jmsevens]

When is the last time you met an American that would work 14 hour days 7 days a week for 7 months straight for maybe $2500 a month? I have met many waiters & cabin stewards who hold degrees as an engineer, accountant and even a lawyer. But, that $2500 is still more than they can make in their country so they leave their family behind and do it.

[wadahoot]

Excuse me!! I work as a waitress part time a few nights a week and I make more doing that than sitting at my desk 40 hours a week so I can keep my insurance....

 

Please do not group Americans.... I have never been on assistance and have worked at least part time as a waitress for over 25 years and I am damn good at it....

 

Renee, no offense to you, and I'm sorry it was taken. All of these comments (obviously) are generalizations. As others have pointed out, Americans (in general) would never stand for the working conditions on a cruise ship.

 

You are absolutely right - there are many, many wonderful servers, and I make a point of calling every manager of a restaurant (or other business) when I come across great service.

 

But I know few who would tolerate being away from their families for months at a time, for (relatively) low pay, to sleep in a teeny-tiny, not air conditioned cabin to work 15+ hour days.

 

In general (there's that word again), the service industries in the US have forgotten the idea of service, whether it's a grocery store cashier, a bar tender at the corner bar or the salesperson at an electronics store. Politeness and manners are just not many people's middle names any more, unfortunately.

[daveco58]

Its not that we have forgotten the idea of service. I am a bartender, and my service skills are excellent. But here in the States I make lots of money doing it. On a ship, I would make peanuts. It is not that a cruise line would not hire me (I have a cousin who worked for Carnival for 10 years), its that they would not pay me what I need to support my family in the United States. You will notice there are also darn few Western Europeans, Aussies or Japanese working on cruise ships. Its all about economics

[BruceMuzz]

daveco58,

 

Actually there are many Western Europeans, Aussies, and Japanese working on cruise ships - but not around the USA.

If you sail on a German or Dutch Cruise line in Europe for example, most of the crew are Europeans. Arguably the highest-rated cruise ship in the world - Europa - has almost exclusively German crew.

If you sail on a Japanese Cruise Ship (Asuka, Asuka II), most of the crew are Japanese.

If you sail on P&O ships around Australia, many of the crew are Aussies.

If you sail on Star Cruises ships in the Far East, you will find many European and Aussie staff working onboard.

 

It isn't just about economics. I manage a large mass market cruise ship. My best bartenders and dining room waiters earn well over $1,000 CASH per week. The smarter ones have figured out how to legally avoid paying taxes on that money. They have no expenses while working onboard. Not a bad deal - for just about anyone who can pass a drug test and is willing to work.

[Scootercruise]

We were talking to the golf pro on one of the Carnival Ships a few years ago, he told us that the reason there is a lot of foreign help is because in quite a few countries, people such as cabin stewards and waiters can earn more in a month on a cruise ship than they can in a year at home. Their family can live a much better life, but unfortunatly, they may be gone for 4-6 months at a time.

[ancldaca]

daveco58,

Arguably the highest-rated cruise ship in the world - Europa - has almost exclusively German crew.

 

 

... and its list price per day per passenger looks to be around 500 Euros a day (roughly some US$650). Even breaking out costs associated with being a luxury ship vs. a mass market (upgraded food, booze, ammenities, etc) a good chunk there goes to Western European Wages.

 

US flagged cruise lines are much more expensive than the foreign flagged ones (Carnivals, RCCL, etc) because US labor laws (plus labor market) demands that in their business model.

 

I'm sure that many more americans would work in that industry IF wages were at least comparable as they were "at home".

 

Of course, that would still leave attitudes toward service and knowledge of proper service. Unfortunately, too many people confuse service with servitude here in the U.S. Also, the generally more casual approach to things in the U.S. doesn't really produce people who have had the proper upbringing to be give proper service. I cringe when I see waitstaffs in restaurants serving the plates from the wrong side, clearing them wrongly, bringing the wrong silverware for the dish being served, being too pushy, not being there at all, unknowing of menus, zero knowledge of appropiate wines, etc. - And then we willingly tip 15-20% when they did their job wrong...

 

Come to think of it, I'd rather not have Americans working cruises. The comments on the Hawaian ships lend them selves to this generalization... Sad.

[CruiseZapper]

I'm an american, i work HARD, and earn little. I LOVE what i do, i have a job that nobody wants, so i don't worry about loosing it, I go to work every weekday, get there by 6:30 and leave at 5:00. i'm tired when i go home, i'm stressed when i go home, but i go out and buy for the people i work with, using what little i earn, i am your PRE-K teacher and i have a total of 18-4 year olds, there's two of us to a class, so i work hard, long hours and very underpaid, and yet on any week-end you will find us spending our hard earned money on the children, because we LOVE our work,we LOVE our children, I'm not lazy, and no, i would not work on a cruise ship, i find the time with my family is very special and i would not want to be gone from them that long.

[kidznp]

Two friends of mine have been working on a "major" cruise line (think Love Boat) for the past year and are thrilled with it. Of course, they are entertainers (sing, guitar, sax, clarinet, harmonica, etc) so they are only required to work a few hours a day. They go on the ship for 5 months at a time and then take 4-6 weeks off. They are never working when the ship is in port and so far they have visited multiple ports in Northern Europe and the Caribbean and are leaving in 2 weeks for 5 months in the Mediterranean.

 

I don't know what they make but they also get free room and board, dry cleaning, health care and transportation to and from their home city. They are seeing the world and having a fantastic time.

 

Needless to say, I am currently taking voice lessons :p

[wadahoot]

I'm an american, i work HARD, and earn little. I LOVE what i do, i have a job that nobody wants, so i don't worry about loosing it, I go to work every weekday, . i'm tired when i go home, i'm stressed when i go home, i work hard, long hours and very underpaid,

 

This part of your quote sounds just like the 20+ years I worked as a travel agent =)

[pg.]

I'm an american, i work HARD, and earn little. I LOVE what i do, i have a job that nobody wants, so i don't worry about loosing it, I go to work every weekday, get there by 6:30 and leave at 5:00. i'm tired when i go home, i'm stressed when i go home, but i go out and buy for the people i work with, using what little i earn, i am your PRE-K teacher and i have a total of 18-4 year olds, there's two of us to a class, so i work hard, long hours and very underpaid, and yet on any week-end you will find us spending our hard earned money on the children, because we LOVE our work,we LOVE our children, I'm not lazy, and no, i would not work on a cruise ship, i find the time with my family is very special and i would not want to be gone from them that long.

 

Here in Canada children the age of four attend classes from 8:30 till 12, or 12:30 till 3, your hours seem very strange. Are pre K teachers not part of a teachers union or association where you live, your hours do seem very long!

 

 

 

Another point, in many of the countries that these workers come from there is no such thing as " welfare" ,,, you work or you don't eat folks. Perhaps if we had that system in place here,( modified somewhat for those who truly couldn't work)we could get some of our lazy freeloaders supporting themselves !!! I am sick of 20 girls with 3 babies from 3 different men , laying around at home and collecting checks,, and even worse is single adults who are not physically or mentally unable to work, yet collect welfare..

In many countries they would HAVE to find work.