Which of NCL's innovative offerings most appeals?

[Dan Askin]

Last night in Las Vegas, executives from NCL revealed some incredible nightlife options that will be found onboard the as-yet-unnamed F3. So what do you think?

 

vote in the poll

[nancydrew56]

i don't see the poll?

[Host Star]

i don't see the poll?

there was an article which included the poll on our features page.. I have emailed Dan to ask him to include the poll in this thread...

[clarkg]

Last night in Las Vegas, executives from NCL revealed some incredible nightlife options that will be found onboard the as-yet-unnamed F3. So what do you think?

 

vote in the poll

 

Didn't see the poll, but all these 'exclusive' clubs really upset me. I have been on NCL three times with two more booked, but I will never ride on an F3 ship. Not being able to access the exclusive Suite only club and then have to pay extra for the other "members only" club. All you are doing is creating a class system that discriminates against the lower catagory passengers. Who do they think is filling up their ships? You can't fill a ship with only suite passengers unless your silversea or the like. Having areas off limits to the "steerage class" passengers smacks of the Trans-atlantic days. To go on a cruise and be made to feel inferior is unacceptable!

[CanadianTwosome]

Didn't see the poll, but all these 'exclusive' clubs really upset me. I have been on NCL three times with two more booked, but I will never ride on an F3 ship. Not being able to access the exclusive Suite only club and then have to pay extra for the other "members only" club. All you are doing is creating a class system that discriminates against the lower catagory passengers. Who do they think is filling up their ships? You can't fill a ship with only suite passengers unless your silversea or the like. Having areas off limits to the "steerage class" passengers smacks of the Trans-atlantic days. To go on a cruise and be made to feel inferior is unacceptable!

 

I disagree completely. My favourite thing about sailing NCL is the freedom of choice I have in deciding whether or not I want to pay for certain options or not. I definitely do NOT want the premium services added to my overall cruise bill. There are already areas on every cruise ship that are not open to all passengers without a fee - the spa is the best example. I have no interest in using the spa, so I'm very happy that it isn't included, because that would mean that I'm paying for something I don't use. The same goes for the new cover charge nightclubs. If I CHOOSE to go, I'll pay the cover; if not (more likely), then I won't. It's not about 'class' to me, it's about choice. :)

[Susie51]

I agree it's about choice.

[DocJohnB]

I disagree completely. My favourite thing about sailing NCL is the freedom of choice I have in deciding whether or not I want to pay for certain options or not. I definitely do NOT want the premium services added to my overall cruise bill. There are already areas on every cruise ship that are not open to all passengers without a fee - the spa is the best example. I have no interest in using the spa, so I'm very happy that it isn't included, because that would mean that I'm paying for something I don't use. The same goes for the new cover charge nightclubs. If I CHOOSE to go, I'll pay the cover; if not (more likely), then I won't. It's not about 'class' to me, it's about choice. :)

Respectfully disagree.

 

It is about NCL's bottom line. For crying out loud they are taking away from the (dare I even say the word here) traditional fare offered on cruising and turning it into a Las Vegas show, minus the headliners.

 

Just FYI, the traditional cruising included in the price of admission the food and the entertainment and traveling to different ports.

 

So far they are charging for food that they used to serve in the dining rooms, maybe going to charge for "named" entertainment (please, they will be getting acts twice removed from the lounge lizard grouping). Next they will start charging a per port charge to leave the ship.

 

If you want to cruise on NCL and call it 'choice', you can do so. Not me. I totally agree with clarkg:

 

Having areas off limits to the "steerage class" passengers smacks of the Trans-atlantic days. To go on a cruise and be made to feel inferior is unacceptable!

[NoPiratesPlease]

All you are doing is creating a class system that discriminates against the lower catagory passengers. Who do they think is filling up their ships? You can't fill a ship with only suite passengers unless your silversea or the like. Having areas off limits to the "steerage class" passengers smacks of the Trans-atlantic days. To go on a cruise and be made to feel inferior is unacceptable!

 

Yeah? So? You want the better service and not be crowded at the pool the hot tubs, etc, you pay more. If the Courtyard, available to the Courtyard Villas, the Garden Villas and the Owner's suites were open to everyone, they wouldn't be able to sell the CVs, the GVs or the OSs. That's part of what you PAY for.

 

NCL has been able, for 6 or so years now, been able to sell both a mass market and a luxury market on the same ships--and fill both.

 

But you do have an alternative if that offends you: It's called "Carnival".

[Guest Anorak33]

Yeah? So? You want the better service and not be crowded at the pool the hot tubs, etc, you pay more. If the Courtyard, available to the Courtyard Villas, the Garden Villas and the Owner's suites were open to everyone, they wouldn't be able to sell the CVs, the GVs or the OSs. That's part of what you PAY for.

 

NCL has been able, for 6 or so years now, been able to sell both a mass market and a luxury market on the same ships--and fill both.

 

But you do have an alternative if that offends you: It's called "Carnival".

 

And fill both???? Only by upselling at a cheap rate I think you will find.

 

Carnival is a great choice - real mass market towards one end of the company with, say, Holland America - then at the other end of the scale the super luxury all inclusive Seabourn.

 

Something for everyone.

[NoPiratesPlease]

And fill both???? Only by upselling at a cheap rate I think you will find.

 

Carnival is a great choice - real mass market towards one end of the company with, say, Holland America - then at the other end of the scale the super luxury all inclusive Seabourn.

 

Something for everyone.

 

Nope. Not the villas. At least, not on this last cruise. Been on Carnival once. It's not for us. Period.

[CanadianTwosome]

Respectfully disagree.

 

It is about NCL's bottom line. For crying out loud they are taking away from the (dare I even say the word here) traditional fare offered on cruising and turning it into a Las Vegas show, minus the headliners.

 

Just FYI, the traditional cruising included in the price of admission the food and the entertainment and traveling to different ports.

 

So far they are charging for food that they used to serve in the dining rooms, maybe going to charge for "named" entertainment (please, they will be getting acts twice removed from the lounge lizard grouping). Next they will start charging a per port charge to leave the ship.

 

If you want to cruise on NCL and call it 'choice', you can do so. Not me. I totally agree with clarkg:

 

Just FYI, I've been cruising since 1975; I know exactly what traditional cruising is/was all about. Also, NCL still includes food, entertainment and ports of call in their price of admission. I haven't cruised another line for many years, but I have enjoyed all of the food I've had in NCL's included dining venues, and from what I've read from other CC posters, their included food is comparable to other mass market lines. So, perhaps they are charging for food that they used to serve in the dining rooms... but at least they're offering it. :)

 

Yes, I absolutely want to cruise with NCL, and I not only call it 'choice', I have diffculty understanding why someone who is clearly intelligent and well educated (based on your ability to type without grammar, punctuation, and spelling errors) cannot see that it actually IS choice. I'm not going to argue with your perception that NCL has made these decisions based more on their bottom line than on satisfying customers, but the fact remains that they ARE satisfying customers and I am one of them. Regardless of why they actually made their decisions, or what you or I believe, when I sail on NCL, I feel free to make personal decisions about when, where, and on what I spend my money that I do not have on other lines, and that, by definition, is freedom of choice.

 

There are plenty of other choices available. Anyone who prefers a product that is pre-packaged regardless of whether they want all the parts is free to cruise another line... and if they can just ignore the 'anytime dining', surcharge restaurants, and other imitations of NCL's freestyle concept they'll be able to enjoy a 'traditional' choice-free environment. :)

[DocJohnB]

 

Yes, I absolutely want to cruise with NCL, and I not only call it 'choice', I have diffculty understanding why someone who is clearly intelligent and well educated (based on your ability to type without grammar, punctuation, and spelling errors) cannot see that it actually IS choice. Regardless of why they actually made their decisions, or what you or I believe, when I sail on NCL, I feel free to make personal decisions about when, where, and on what I spend my money that I do not have on other lines, and that, by definition, is freedom of choice.

 

There are plenty of other choices available. Anyone who prefers a product that is pre-packaged regardless of whether they want all the parts is free to cruise another line... and if they can just ignore the 'anytime dining', surcharge restaurants, and other imitations of NCL's freestyle concept they'll be able to enjoy a 'traditional' choice-free environment. :)

 

OK, OK, I surrender ;) . . . . . . well, at least to a certain point. Of course, it is by definition, choice. However (you had to know there would be a however ;) ), at one time on NCL (and other lines) we did not have to make choices. As you say they were pre-packaged. A lot of cruisers were more than happy or at least satisfied with that pre-packaging. I daresay there are still a majority of cruisers who think that way. NCL remains the only cruise line that has totally embraced "free-style" cruising.

 

Some cruisers actually prefer NOT having to make "choices". We prefer set dining times, etc. We are OK with the entertainment provided. And, we just don't have to worry about making decisions for the length of the cruise. That is, IMO, what cruising was originally about.

 

Having said all that, it is apparent that other cruise lines are embracing the À la carte concept when it comes to dining. As long as they leave the traditional dining as an option (choice), I don't have a problem.

 

When it comes to À la carte entertainment, I am afraid I draw "my" line. Entertainment has always been included in the "price of admission". It should remain so. If I remember, in the not too distant past, one of the lines made an attempt at "extra pay" entertainment and failed miserably.

 

I guess we will just have to wait and see what happens over the next couple of years or so. Hopefully, the "bean counters" will not drive me away from my favorite type of vacation.

[CanadianTwosome]

OK, OK, I surrender ;) . . . . . . well, at least to a certain point. Of course, it is by definition, choice. However (you had to know there would be a however ;) ), at one time on NCL (and other lines) we did not have to make choices. As you say they were pre-packaged. A lot of cruisers were more than happy or at least satisfied with that pre-packaging. I daresay there are still a majority of cruisers who think that way. NCL remains the only cruise line that has totally embraced "free-style" cruising.

 

Some cruisers actually prefer NOT having to make "choices". We prefer set dining times, etc. We are OK with the entertainment provided. And, we just don't have to worry about making decisions for the length of the cruise. That is, IMO, what cruising was originally about.

 

Having said all that, it is apparent that other cruise lines are embracing the À la carte concept when it comes to dining. As long as they leave the traditional dining as an option (choice), I don't have a problem.

 

When it comes to À la carte entertainment, I am afraid I draw "my" line. Entertainment has always been included in the "price of admission". It should remain so. If I remember, in the not too distant past, one of the lines made an attempt at "extra pay" entertainment and failed miserably.

 

I guess we will just have to wait and see what happens over the next couple of years or so. Hopefully, the "bean counters" will not drive me away from my favorite type of vacation.

 

I think we're in full agreement now! :)

 

I wasn't aware that any line had attempted to charge for the 'regular' entertainment - by which I mean the nightly theatre shows, usually a comedian and/or comedy troupe, and some sort of live music around the ship. I believe that this 'basic' entertainment will always be included, though. In order to maintain the staff needed to perform for the people who DO want to see the shows, I think their salaries (thus the entertainment) really have to be included in the base fare.

 

I understand that a new issue has come up due to the plans for the F3 ships to have paid access venues, but I see these as above and beyond what I actually expect on a cruise ship - and like so many other things, I'm not particularly interested. Again, I feel it's a 'why ask why' situation - it matters not to me whether they're trying to make money or trying to provide me with a 'better product'... I'm being given the choice whether I want to partake or not, and unless there's something spectacular I'm not seeing so far... I believe I'll be choosing 'not'.

 

I want to be clear, too. I don't say all this to suggest that everyone should feel the way I do. My intent is simply to show that there is one individual who prefers the freestyle concept - even if it applies to entertainment, and to explain why. With all of the cruise consumers in the world, it's just really, really unlikely that I'm the only one that feels this way! :) As you noted, NCL is the only line that has totally embraced freestyle, and those of us who like it are quite happy about that! I think there are still a couple of choices out there for those who want (and can afford) all inclusive as well. Oooh, we're back to that choice thing again!! :p I think the cruise industry right now provides more choices than ever before: there are older, smaller ships and HUGE new ones; traditional, freestyle, and various options in between; and there are itineraries that span the globe. It's all good... no, it's all FANTASTIC!!! :)

[AFT_LOVER]

when we read the F3 press release & it stated NO THEATRES, my husband & I just sat with dumb looks that we laughed at. Then 3 months later at Ceasars we hear it is pay for entertainment at lounges. I can see that happending in the ice bar with the frozen surrounding, gloves & parkas for those entering & the ice block with vodka inside ( that you pay for ).

 

But some of the entertainment on ships we would definately not pay additionally for, but you will not know about them in advance. So this will be quite curious when we sail F3 in March 2010. Maybe you just eat & sleep onboard & party with folks with entertainment at ports.

[MrLee]

If they're reaching the point of charging for the night time entertainment, they'll start making land based vacations more attractive. If you have to pay for all your entertainment separately, why not go somewhere that has a lot more variety to choose from?

[CanadianTwosome]

I didn't realize that there was not going to be a 'regular' theatre on the F3s, but I think the Spice H20 will replace it. Bliss and Spice, from what I read on the website, do not have cover charges, and Spice is going to have an ampitheatre with nightly shows. From the sounds of it, the entertainment at Spice might even be something I'd be interested in, too! The two other venues don't interest me in the least, so the cover charges don't bother me. At the very most, I might go up and just look at the ice bar to see what it looks like, but considering I like to travel in the winter to get AWAY from ice, the last thing I want to do is go sit on it by choice. :)

[insidecabin]

As the ships get bigger and bigger the traditional every thing for everyone starts to break down.

 

Look at the main dinning rooms, some ships are now 3 tear to get every one in in two sittings.

 

The theatres are huge to get every one to 2 shows.

 

These spaces are underutilized a lot of the time and getting so big the experience lost for many of the punters

 

The trick is to provide more smaller venues and capacity control when the natural spread of people around the ship does not do it.

 

Three of the ways to do this(there are others).

 

1. Cruise price, Cunard are the masters at this, NCL have the villas, Celebrity have Aqua class other cruise lines are doing similar, along with the cabin comes some other onboard space and features not available to everyone.

 

2. PAYG pricing, most lines now have at least one PAYG eatery, RCI are the master getting people to pay for burgers. Most lines have some activities capacity controlled allready, the common ones are SPA, fitnes(eg:spinning), classes(eg:computer).

 

3. Ticketing, best example I know is the ICE shows on RCI the venue needs quite a few shows to give everyone a chance to see it.

 

If you look around carefully, you can find examples on nearly all lines, the thing is it is only the ones that effect you that you tend to notice, so you think the ship is AI but in fact it is not. NCL stick out because they have enough PAYG options that everyone sees them.

 

Allthough the F3 concept is still getting understood, It looks like they are trying to make better use of spaces, having a venue that provides food, can do shows, be party location can be used all day, provide a few of these and you spread people arround, the trick is getting the demographics right to provide something attractive for everyone, make one place too good and you have capacity problems.

 

If you look at the current larger ships the single buffet concept is breaking down, they just get too busy at peak times, more casual food options are needed to spread people out.

 

RCI with Oasis with the aqua theatre pool by day shows by night have move in this direction, a lot of the other bars etc are small so if a place becomes popular it will get packed , a ship to keep a eye on as the first of the monster ships with some new concepts goes live.

 

As for the exclusive night club options, not sure if this will swing it, not that experienced with all markets but US ships in europe have no night life nearly everyone wants to maximise port time. I guess the "season" in the caribbean might be different.

 

One thing with the PAYG concept is you need to want the option a lot to pay for it, take the Jewel class with Bliss, happy to pop in for a late night drink, sometimes just one or might even stay longer, have to pay won't bother unless there is a group of us wanting to go, low cost full cruise cover might consider it, a bit like the, spa pass a PAYG option the OH gets the value from the pass I don't, so when on NCL I just give up the trips to the sauna that I would have done.

 

As for PAYG acts, yet to be on a ship that had an act I would pay for in advance. I don't think anyone picks a cruise for the entertainment first, there are some acts which do have loyal following but not many. Headliners would need to be announced well in advance to get enough people to want the cruise and be prepared to pay.

 

I think the only way a cruise line can up the talent is on the short cruises where the the act is the "theme" and then you just price the tickets for the act into the cruise fare.

 

To answer the question,

 

I think the ship within a ship concept is good, luxuary cruising with all the facilities of a big ship on hand.

 

It is more than just a suite

[WinnieinWA]

I have not read the whole thread but I, personally, will not cruise any of the mega ships with 3000 plus pax. That is just too large for me

 

I'm sure they have an attraction for younger people and families and that's great.

 

The Dawn was as large a ship as I care to cruise on. It's just too far to get from one end to the other.

 

I travel solo and am 55 so that makes a difference. I don't care to travel a quarter of a mile to get to the dining room..... or the spa.

 

Happy sails. :)

[traveler111]

Hi, Agree with WinnieinWA. I usually sail solo too. The quality of the food served on NCL needs improvement; this is where they should start. Just returned from the Dream. Does anyone consider 1/2 half of an African lobster tail adequate? Fortunately I did not order it. NCL should forget about lobster completely. :)

[gary]

I have not read the whole thread but I, personally, will not cruise any of the mega ships with 3000 plus pax. That is just too large for me

 

I'm sure they have an attraction for younger people and families and that's great.

 

The Dawn was as large a ship as I care to cruise on. It's just too far to get from one end to the other.

 

I travel solo and am 55 so that makes a difference. I don't care to travel a quarter of a mile to get to the dining room..... or the spa.

 

Happy sails. :)

 

Winnie,

 

When I read your post I assumed you were 85. come on now... unless you have mobility problems, 55 is very young and if you are not willing to walk the length of a cruise ship, i feel sorry for you. You have many many good years ahead of you... Some day you will be 85 and then I will agree with you, but until then, get moving!!!

[kontraxed]

The thing I liked about cruising as opposed to a land based vacation was the convenience combined with the "all inclusive" feel of the vacation. Then NCL embraced the free style concept and we liked that. Most things were included but you could choose different restaraunts and pay a little extra.

 

The F3 sounds too ala cart. I doubt if the basic cruise price will be lower to reflect the numerous PAYG activities. I liked the traditional theater shows, even if they weren't always the greatest. I will be on the GEM in February and we were a little disappointed there was no movie theater. Now the F3 has done away with the whole theater idea and thrown in ice bars, other bars, elitist bars - and I'm not impressed. It begins to sound like the whole cruise is one big bar hopping experience.

 

Now I'm sure the NCL cheer leaders will say if you don't like it go somewhere else. I do hope that NCL keeps the Dawn and the Gem and ships like that so we do have a choice. Otherwise, we will have to go somewhere else - and that would be a shame because we have enjoyed NCL.

[cmarrero1014]

It's all about the microtransaction now folks, just like in banking. DW and I have stopped cruising with NCL for this exact reason. Sounds like the new F3 will be the Godfather of bleeding you dry for one "upgrade/premium" at a time.

[valancy1]

Nope. Not the villas. At least, not on this last cruise. Been on Carnival once. It's not for us. Period.

 

But that doesn't mean it's not for others, AND that those others aren't lesser people because they like Carnival, either.

 

I LOVE Carnival and will sail them again and again because everything IS traditional. Heck, if I wanted to pay "ala carte" for everything, I might as well go on a land-based vacation.

 

Their supper club is a fee-based experience, but that is it as far as dining.

 

You're entitled to your opinion, but it isn't the ONLY opinion.

[Cosmopolitan]

The thing I liked about cruising as opposed to a land based vacation was the convenience combined with the "all inclusive" feel of the vacation. Then NCL embraced the free style concept and we liked that. Most things were included but you could choose different restaraunts and pay a little extra.

 

The F3 sounds too ala cart. I doubt if the basic cruise price will be lower to reflect the numerous PAYG activities. I liked the traditional theater shows, even if they weren't always the greatest. I will be on the GEM in February and we were a little disappointed there was no movie theater. Now the F3 has done away with the whole theater idea and thrown in ice bars, other bars, elitist bars - and I'm not impressed. It begins to sound like the whole cruise is one big bar hopping experience.

 

Now I'm sure the NCL cheer leaders will say if you don't like it go somewhere else. I do hope that NCL keeps the Dawn and the Gem and ships like that so we do have a choice. Otherwise, we will have to go somewhere else - and that would be a shame because we have enjoyed NCL.

 

Well stated..I agree:)

[srlafleur]

The idea of re-thinking the traditional room layout is great. Ditto the buffet...I don't generally do the buffet any more than necessary.

The new bars/sunbathing/dancing? Eh! None of them particularly appeal to me - I'm not much of a "lounger". Sounds like they might appeal to a new generation of cruisers, though, which isn't a bad thing. Let them pay for that stuff to supplement the cost of the normal stuff.

And really?:confused: An ice bar? A cruise is where I go to get AWAY from ice! Anyway, some of the public venues on some ships are already so air-conditioned that they might as well be ice bars!